Bulls Ring of Honor 1/12/2024

[MikeDC]

but booing him? WHY? You either are or are not clueless. If you booed him you are clueless and buying into someone else's narrative.

I’m not saying its right, and Im not saying I would have booed if I were there, but I think the “WHY” has a straightforward explanation.

Talking about buying a narrative, everyone is selling one. Jerry Reinsdorf was, if anyone is being honest with themselves, selling a narrative with this whole dog and pony show. It was another celebration of Team “Organizations Win Championships”, not the entirety of the Chicago Bulls dynasty.

Booing Jerry Krause was fans saying “we see through your BS”. Thats why. Again… its not what I think most people would do, but most people would also not be so defiantly belligerent as both Krause and Reinsdorf were, both then and now.

Cynically, Krause has literally been booed pretty much every time hes been mentioned. They knew this was coming. Trotting out Krause’s wife was kind of akin to using a human shield. “they wont boo him if we put his widow up there”.

It was, in short, the kind of bs manipulation that politicians, companies, and people in power do all the time to get what they want. Most of the time, the crowd goes along with the Potemkin Village version of reality the powerful build for themselves because, well, most of the time people arent total dicks and dont want to torment little old ladies. But, sometimes, theyve had enough and they just arent gonna put up with the charade.

Question. Are GMs usually included in these ring of honor things? If not, this was clearly not well conceived as a Jerry Reinsdorf production. Michael Reinsdorf nonetheless. It just dawned on me. Did MJ know about the Krause part, and that was the reason for the video level participation? At some point as a franchise, if you want the thing to come off properly, you need to make do with the people involved, and act accordingly.

As best I can tell in @ 10 minutes of googling, the Phoenix Suns (where Reinsdorf lives most of the time) are the only other team that actually has a "Ring of Honor". Jerry Colangelo is in it, but he actually owned the freaking team too.

Also worth mentioning:
1. It doesn't seem like most people actually saw or knew Mrs. Krause was there when they started booing, so I don't think it's even fair to scold people for that in particular.

2. Also Reinsdorf primed the pump a bit the night before by saying the only way things could have been better was to have Krause there. Not, you know, the guys who actually were the face of the Bulls (and NBA basketball) during that time.

Read on Twitter

I mean, you say this, which pretty much everyone took as either a shot against MJ at worst or the dumbness of an old guy who's always been told he's the greatest at best. Then, a day later, people want to show you what they think of your statement.

[WindyCityBorn]

but booing him? WHY? You either are or are not clueless. If you booed him you are clueless and buying into someone else's narrative.

I’m not saying its right, and Im not saying I would have booed if I were there, but I think the “WHY” has a straightforward explanation.

Talking about buying a narrative, everyone is selling one. Jerry Reinsdorf was, if anyone is being honest with themselves, selling a narrative with this whole dog and pony show. It was another celebration of Team “Organizations Win Championships”, not the entirety of the Chicago Bulls dynasty.

Booing Jerry Krause was fans saying “we see through your BS”. Thats why. Again… its not what I think most people would do, but most people would also not be so defiantly belligerent as both Krause and Reinsdorf were, both then and now.

Cynically, Krause has literally been booed pretty much every time hes been mentioned. They knew this was coming. Trotting out Krause’s wife was kind of akin to using a human shield. “they wont boo him if we put his widow up there”.

It was, in short, the kind of bs manipulation that politicians, companies, and people in power do all the time to get what they want. Most of the time, the crowd goes along with the Potemkin Village version of reality the powerful build for themselves because, well, most of the time people arent total dicks and dont want to torment little old ladies. But, sometimes, theyve had enough and they just arent gonna put up with the charade.

Yet these same people are still buying tickets to games 25 years. Cut the BS. Speak with your wallet if you are really tired of Reinsdorf.

[WindyCityBorn]

Good comment about CJ Stroud manipulating the pocket. Does it as a rookie. They got that or they don’t. I want me one of those, like Alex Brown wants one of those (Love)

Wrong topic.

[MikeDC]

but booing him? WHY? You either are or are not clueless. If you booed him you are clueless and buying into someone else's narrative.

I’m not saying its right, and Im not saying I would have booed if I were there, but I think the “WHY” has a straightforward explanation.

Talking about buying a narrative, everyone is selling one. Jerry Reinsdorf was, if anyone is being honest with themselves, selling a narrative with this whole dog and pony show. It was another celebration of Team “Organizations Win Championships”, not the entirety of the Chicago Bulls dynasty.

Booing Jerry Krause was fans saying “we see through your BS”. Thats why. Again… its not what I think most people would do, but most people would also not be so defiantly belligerent as both Krause and Reinsdorf were, both then and now.

Cynically, Krause has literally been booed pretty much every time hes been mentioned. They knew this was coming. Trotting out Krause’s wife was kind of akin to using a human shield. “they wont boo him if we put his widow up there”.

It was, in short, the kind of bs manipulation that politicians, companies, and people in power do all the time to get what they want. Most of the time, the crowd goes along with the Potemkin Village version of reality the powerful build for themselves because, well, most of the time people arent total dicks and dont want to torment little old ladies. But, sometimes, theyve had enough and they just arent gonna put up with the charade.

Yet these same people are still buying tickets to games 25 years. Cut the BS. Speak with your wallet if you are really tired of Reinsdorf.

Nah, that's BS. People don't have to be totally aligned in their opinions about things. You can like the Bulls without liking Reinsdorf. Most owners aren't very popular, I would guess. But most of them have the good sense to not be quite so belligerent in pushing things and detracting from their products. It's true that, unlike most teams, being a Bulls fan comes with a definite downside in this respect, and I know it does turn people off. But even so, it's not black and white. Fortunately for Jerry Reinsdorf

[Mk0]

I just can't understand the "I get it" crowd. Holding disdain for Krause is just basketball stupidity. Let's look at the things Krause did:

Traded for Scottie
Drafted Horace
Found and hired Phil as an assistant from the Albany Patrons of the CBA
Fired Doug Collins and promoting Phil
Trading Oakley for Cartwright
Trading Will Perdue for Rodman
Signing Kerr and Harper
Drafting Kukoc

Look at that damn list. Are you kidding me? Those moves are dynamite. It's possible the Bulls win ZERO championships without him. The fact that fans harp on him for "breaking up" the team is so ridiculous. Rodman was toast, Scottie was old and getting paid, MJ severed a finger tendon in the Offseason. They weren't going to beat the Spurs team. Most of all, cheap ass Jerry Reinsdorf probably wouldn't have paid for an aging squad that would miss MJ for a significant amount of time. Reinsdorf said HIMSELF that the Bulls couldn't have won in 1999 due to MJ's injury.

* He also hired Tex Winter.

For all the sour grapes over the Dynasty breaking up, 99 was looking like a sh#%show on paper. We would have needed to replace Dennis and Longley, while losing Kerr, Jud and finding a way to pay MJ and Scottie.

* Rodman only managed to play 35 more games before physically breaking down.

* Scottie only played 44 games in 98 and there were health concerns. He played all 50 games in the 99 shortened season but there were legit questions.

* Longley got paid by Phoenix and wouldn't even finish his contract there. He had no ankles and they dumped him to the Knicks where he played 25 games.

Ironically the guy who could have managed to retool around Jordan (again) was Krause.

[fleet]

Good comment about CJ Stroud manipulating the pocket. Does it as a rookie. They got that or they don’t. I want me one of those, like Alex Brown wants one of those (Love)

Wrong topic.

Watch yer tongue my friend!

[prolific passer]

Jerry recognized the talent he had and made the correct adjustments to maximize it.

Chicago bulls would still been good for a while if MJ didn’t block the T-Mac for Scottie trade.

AKME now here trades away the future all-star for an aging vet and allowing a players coach partner who clearly doesn’t keep players accountable to same standards.

Appreciate having GM who recognizes what they inherited and when it’s time to shift those assets for something more productive.

Idk about Tmac but Krause just drafted horribly during most his tenure. Passed up on PJ Brown and Michael Finley.

[fleet]

I just can't understand the "I get it" crowd. Holding disdain for Krause is just basketball stupidity. Let's look at the things Krause did:

Traded for Scottie
Drafted Horace
Found and hired Phil as an assistant from the Albany Patrons of the CBA
Fired Doug Collins and promoting Phil
Trading Oakley for Cartwright
Trading Will Perdue for Rodman
Signing Kerr and Harper
Drafting Kukoc

Look at that damn list. Are you kidding me? Those moves are dynamite. It's possible the Bulls win ZERO championships without him. The fact that fans harp on him for "breaking up" the team is so ridiculous. Rodman was toast, Scottie was old and getting paid, MJ severed a finger tendon in the Offseason. They weren't going to beat the Spurs team. Most of all, cheap ass Jerry Reinsdorf probably wouldn't have paid for an aging squad that would miss MJ for a significant amount of time. Reinsdorf said HIMSELF that the Bulls couldn't have won in 1999 due to MJ's injury.

* He also hired Tex Winter.

For all the sour grapes over the Dynasty breaking up, 99 was looking like a sh#%show on paper. We would have needed to replace Dennis and Longley, while losing Kerr, Jud and finding a way to pay MJ and Scottie.

* Rodman only managed to play 35 more games before physically breaking down.

* Scottie only played 44 games in 98 and there were health concerns. He played all 50 games in the 99 shortened season but there were legit questions.

* Longley got paid by Phoenix and wouldn't even finish his contract there. He had no ankles and they dumped him to the Knicks where he played 25 games.

Ironically the guy who could have managed to retool around Jordan (again) was Krause.

Krause the on;ly GM who could build a multi-championship team around Michael Jordan? doubtful. His work post Jordan was pretty bad. Yes, he needed another MJ.

[Mk0]

I just can't understand the "I get it" crowd. Holding disdain for Krause is just basketball stupidity. Let's look at the things Krause did:

Traded for Scottie
Drafted Horace
Found and hired Phil as an assistant from the Albany Patrons of the CBA
Fired Doug Collins and promoting Phil
Trading Oakley for Cartwright
Trading Will Perdue for Rodman
Signing Kerr and Harper
Drafting Kukoc

Look at that damn list. Are you kidding me? Those moves are dynamite. It's possible the Bulls win ZERO championships without him. The fact that fans harp on him for "breaking up" the team is so ridiculous. Rodman was toast, Scottie was old and getting paid, MJ severed a finger tendon in the Offseason. They weren't going to beat the Spurs team. Most of all, cheap ass Jerry Reinsdorf probably wouldn't have paid for an aging squad that would miss MJ for a significant amount of time. Reinsdorf said HIMSELF that the Bulls couldn't have won in 1999 due to MJ's injury.

* He also hired Tex Winter.

For all the sour grapes over the Dynasty breaking up, 99 was looking like a sh#%show on paper. We would have needed to replace Dennis and Longley, while losing Kerr, Jud and finding a way to pay MJ and Scottie.

* Rodman only managed to play 35 more games before physically breaking down.

* Scottie only played 44 games in 98 and there were health concerns. He played all 50 games in the 99 shortened season but there were legit questions.

* Longley got paid by Phoenix and wouldn't even finish his contract there. He had no ankles and they dumped him to the Knicks where he played 25 games.

Ironically the guy who could have managed to retool around Jordan (again) was Krause.

Krause the on;ly GM who could build a multi-championship team around Michael Jordan? doubtful. His work post Jordan was pretty bad. Yes, he needed another MJ.

I meant it more of a compliment to his ability to have done it twice already but if you want to read it the way you did.. whatever man. I am just done with people being petty over this guy. He is dead. it is over. I have no idea why it is still so polarizing.

EDIT: And I never said he was the only GM who could build around MJ. I don't know where you got that from.

[FriedRise]

Read on Twitter

[fleet]

* He also hired Tex Winter.

For all the sour grapes over the Dynasty breaking up, 99 was looking like a sh#%show on paper. We would have needed to replace Dennis and Longley, while losing Kerr, Jud and finding a way to pay MJ and Scottie.

* Rodman only managed to play 35 more games before physically breaking down.

* Scottie only played 44 games in 98 and there were health concerns. He played all 50 games in the 99 shortened season but there were legit questions.

* Longley got paid by Phoenix and wouldn't even finish his contract there. He had no ankles and they dumped him to the Knicks where he played 25 games.

Ironically the guy who could have managed to retool around Jordan (again) was Krause.

Krause the on;ly GM who could build a multi-championship team around Michael Jordan? doubtful. His work post Jordan was pretty bad. Yes, he needed another MJ.

I meant it more of a compliment to his ability to have done it twice already but if you want to read it the way you did.. whatever man. I am just done with people being petty over this guy. He is dead. it is over. I have no idea why it is still so polarizing.

EDIT: And I never said he was the only GM who could build around MJ. I don't know where you got that from.

Scranton Bulls, and your last sentence

[ScrantonBulls]

Krause the on;ly GM who could build a multi-championship team around Michael Jordan? doubtful. His work post Jordan was pretty bad. Yes, he needed another MJ.

I meant it more of a compliment to his ability to have done it twice already but if you want to read it the way you did.. whatever man. I am just done with people being petty over this guy. He is dead. it is over. I have no idea why it is still so polarizing.

EDIT: And I never said he was the only GM who could build around MJ. I don't know where you got that from.

Scranton Bulls, and your last sentence

Seriously? I didn't say that at all. I said it's possible that Jordan wins zero championships without Krause. Phil, Pippen, Horace, Rodman, Kukoc are all Krause picks/moves. No matter how great a player is, they need good teammates. Look at LeBron in Cleveland during his first stint. If MJ has a comparabley bad front office, then he may have never won or would likely have left the Bulls.

[fleet]

I meant it more of a compliment to his ability to have done it twice already but if you want to read it the way you did.. whatever man. I am just done with people being petty over this guy. He is dead. it is over. I have no idea why it is still so polarizing.

EDIT: And I never said he was the only GM who could build around MJ. I don't know where you got that from.

Scranton Bulls, and your last sentence

Seriously? I didn't say that at all. I said it's possible that Jordan wins zero championships without Krause. Phil, Pippen, Horace, Rodman, Kukoc are all Krause picks/moves. No matter how great a player is, they need good teammates. Look at LeBron in Cleveland during his first stint. If MJ has a comparabley bad front office, then he may have never won or would likely have left the Bulls.

You pretty much said just that. Nobody says Krause didn't do his job. He did it well. You OTOH said MJ might have zero titles without Krause. That's **** insulting.

So was Stacey King a Krause pick instead of Shawn Kemp and Tim Hardaway. Lets throw in Nick Anderson. If Krause was such a genius, that should be impossible. Krause wanted Joe Wolfe instead of Horace until Jerry talked him out of it. His work post Dynasty was Manuro. He isn't some unicorn of a man. Building championships around the GOAT in basketball is the easiest job in sports. Any number of good GMs would have put players around MJ, they don't have to be the same exact players. It isn't a rare Krause skillset

[ScrantonBulls]

Scranton Bulls, and your last sentence

Seriously? I didn't say that at all. I said it's possible that Jordan wins zero championships without Krause. Phil, Pippen, Horace, Rodman, Kukoc are all Krause picks/moves. No matter how great a player is, they need good teammates. Look at LeBron in Cleveland during his first stint. If MJ has a comparabley bad front office, then he may have never won or would likely have left the Bulls.

You pretty much said just that. Nobody says Krause didn't do his job. He did it well. You OTOH said MJ might have zero titles without Krause. That's **** insulting.

So was Stacey King a Krause pick instead of Shawn Kemp and Tim Hardaway. Lets throw in Nick Anderson. If Krause was such a genius, that should be impossible. Krause wanted Joe Wolfe instead of Horace until Jerry talked him out of it. His work post Dynasty was Manuro. He isn't some unicorn of a man. Building championships around the GOAT in basketball is the easiest job in sports. Any number of good GMs would have put players around MJ, they don't have to be the same exact players. It isn't a rare Krause skillset

That's such a stretch that it is ridiculous. You are putting words into my mouth. All of MJs most important teammates and coaches were Krause moves. Are you seriously saying it's impossible to see scenario where MJ doesn't win a title with the Bulls? It's very possible if he has an absolutely awful front office, he leaves the Bulls and maybe wins elsewhere. We literally saw that with LeBron.

[fleet]

Seriously? I didn't say that at all. I said it's possible that Jordan wins zero championships without Krause. Phil, Pippen, Horace, Rodman, Kukoc are all Krause picks/moves. No matter how great a player is, they need good teammates. Look at LeBron in Cleveland during his first stint. If MJ has a comparabley bad front office, then he may have never won or would likely have left the Bulls.

You pretty much said just that. Nobody says Krause didn't do his job. He did it well. You OTOH said MJ might have zero titles without Krause. That's **** insulting.

So was Stacey King a Krause pick instead of Shawn Kemp and Tim Hardaway. Lets throw in Nick Anderson. If Krause was such a genius, that should be impossible. Krause wanted Joe Wolfe instead of Horace until Jerry talked him out of it. His work post Dynasty was Manuro. He isn't some unicorn of a man. Building championships around the GOAT in basketball is the easiest job in sports. Any number of good GMs would have put players around MJ, they don't have to be the same exact players. It isn't a rare Krause skillset

That's such a stretch that it is ridiculous. You are putting words into my mouth. All of MJs most important teammates and coaches were Krause moves. Are you seriously saying it's impossible to see scenario where MJ doesn't win a title with the Bulls? It's very possible if he has an absolutely awful front office, he leaves the Bulls and maybe wins elsewhere. We literally saw that with LeBron.

I'll just let you add up the rings here, and tell me who doesn't have one


Michael
LeBron
Kareem
Magic
Shaq
Kobe
Wilt
Bird
Bill
TD
Steph

[The Evidence]

Chicagoans are some of the lowest IQ sports fans for a major sports market.

[ScrantonBulls]

You pretty much said just that. Nobody says Krause didn't do his job. He did it well. You OTOH said MJ might have zero titles without Krause. That's **** insulting.

So was Stacey King a Krause pick instead of Shawn Kemp and Tim Hardaway. Lets throw in Nick Anderson. If Krause was such a genius, that should be impossible. Krause wanted Joe Wolfe instead of Horace until Jerry talked him out of it. His work post Dynasty was Manuro. He isn't some unicorn of a man. Building championships around the GOAT in basketball is the easiest job in sports. Any number of good GMs would have put players around MJ, they don't have to be the same exact players. It isn't a rare Krause skillset

That's such a stretch that it is ridiculous. You are putting words into my mouth. All of MJs most important teammates and coaches were Krause moves. Are you seriously saying it's impossible to see scenario where MJ doesn't win a title with the Bulls? It's very possible if he has an absolutely awful front office, he leaves the Bulls and maybe wins elsewhere. We literally saw that with LeBron.

I'll just let you add up the rings here, and tell me who doesn't have one


Michael
LeBron
Kareem
Magic
Shaq
Kobe
Wilt
Bird
Bill
TD
Steph

You're right. It's impossible to imagine a scenario where a front office is so bad that they surround an all time great with such bad players that they don't win and he leaves. That's never happened before, right?

[fleet]

that's not what either of us originally meant.

[greenwing]

Chicagoans are some of the lowest IQ sports fans for a major sports market.

Nope. What happened at the United Center last night was truly awful, but it wasn’t typical for Chicago sports fans. There are plenty of cities who have been known for booing and Chicago usually isn’t one of them.

[The Evidence]

Chicagoans are some of the lowest IQ sports fans for a major sports market.

Nope. What happened at the United Center last night was truly awful, but it wasn’t typical for Chicago sports fans. There are plenty of cities who have been known for booing and Chicago usually isn’t one of them.

Which further proves my point.

Of all times to boo, decades after the fact, low IQ fans booed a dead person because of how stupid they were.