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DuckIII wrote:

Chi town wrote:Dude just ain’t it.

Not even close.

Some guys just can’t shoot or learn to shoot.
He’s that guy.

Its not even just his shooting. The rest of it isn’t anything special by NBA standards either. It’s just that unlike the shooting, he doesn’t outright suck at the rest of it.

Yep. He doesn’t do anything even NBA average.

Vet min players easily better. Ala all 5 Jovontaes

Bulls love to draft projects with minimal NBA upside.

Jcool0 wrote:Bulls love to draft projects with minimal NBA upside.

That could be, but it's also true that #18 picks aren't worth much. Here are recent picks and this year's PER stat (15 is league average for that figure) -

Jamie Jaquez Jr. - 12.7
Dalen Terry - 9.6
Tre Mann - 12.4
Josh Green - 10.3
Goga Bitadze - 17.9
Lonnie Walker IV - 13.5
TJ Leaf - Out of the league
Henry Ellenson - Out of the league
Sam Dekker - Out of the league
Tyler Ennis - Out of the league

Honestly, I don't pay any attention to later-round 1st round picks until they actually show me that they are worth my attention. The odds are just too low that I will actually ever care.

Ice Man wrote:

Jcool0 wrote:Bulls love to draft projects with minimal NBA upside.

That could be, but it's also true that #18 picks aren't worth much. Here are recent picks and this year's PER stat (15 is league average for that figure) -

Jamie Jaquez Jr. - 12.7
Dalen Terry - 9.6
Tre Mann - 12.4
Josh Green - 10.3
Goga Bitadze - 17.9
Lonnie Walker IV - 13.5
TJ Leaf - Out of the league
Henry Ellenson - Out of the league
Sam Dekker - Out of the league
Tyler Ennis - Out of the league

Honestly, I don't pay any attention to later-round 1st round picks until they actually show me that they are worth my attention. The odds are just too low that I will actually ever care.

If you want to look at the selection, it's better (IMO anyway) to look at the reasonable opportunity cost in the draft

Next players:
Jake LaRavia (seems like a similarly nothing prospect so far but don't know)
Malaki Branham (currently a rotation player)
Christian Braun (currently a rotation player)
Walter Kessler (low end starter and would solve a huge need for us specifically)

3 of the next 4 guys off the board would have helped us, one would have helped us significantly.

Given Terry didn't solve a need on paper even if he delivered on his promise, didn't have any markings of high future upside, wasn't a guy who would step in and contribute right away, and felt like an overall talent reach on draft night, the pick is more representative of completely broken process than it is a massive loss in opportunity.

It wasn't a huge opportunity cost, it was a relatively small one, but the logic behind it was so baffling that it defies logic.

Ice Man wrote:

Jcool0 wrote:Bulls love to draft projects with minimal NBA upside.

That could be, but it's also true that #18 picks aren't worth much. Here are recent picks and this year's PER stat (15 is league average for that figure) -

Jamie Jaquez Jr. - 12.7
Dalen Terry - 9.6
Tre Mann - 12.4
Josh Green - 10.3
Goga Bitadze - 17.9
Lonnie Walker IV - 13.5
TJ Leaf - Out of the league
Henry Ellenson - Out of the league
Sam Dekker - Out of the league
Tyler Ennis - Out of the league

Honestly, I don't pay any attention to later-round 1st round picks until they actually show me that they are worth my attention. The odds are just too low that I will actually ever care.

This said, there’s a difference between getting a Jacquez and a Terry. Very small in the big picture, but on the microscopic level, these things add up. Better to get an Ayo with each pick than a Terry.

A general junk-asset perception begins to form around your franchise. The other GM’s preference is to get AK to give up a future pick sooner than one of his past picks.

Both fair points. Terry looks to be a failure even by #18 pick standards, and that is a check mark against AK, even if not critical in the grand scheme of things.

Jcool0 wrote:Bulls love to draft projects with minimal NBA upside.

Yup total waste of a FRP. You reach for guys like this in the second round or undrafted like Miami does. Get a guy at 18 who has actual NBA skills already.

Andre Drummond and Torey Craig are not NBA Players. They came off the bench for Javonte Green to start.