MikeDC wrote:MrSparkle wrote:MikeDC wrote:
If you want to say they didn't know how great Shai would be, sure. But they knew he would be good and having him was central to the deal.
Which is a fact you guys are not acknowledging, but it very important to understanding why some teams are successful and why others aren't. Timing. Talent evaluation.
OKC keeps coming up good because they do stuff like require guys like Shai as "throw ins". They ask for that extra 2nd rounder and get it. And they understand that timing matters. Trading PG when he's at the height of his value.
Remember when the Bulls traded with OKC? We traded Dog McDogmut and freaking Taj Gibson. And OKC asked for a got a 2nd rounder that turned out to be a high one 2018 #32... Mitchell Freaking Robinson!) to get a backup PG with a broken foot (Cam Payne).
OKC is a smart team. Not every move is going to work out, but they work out more because they're better at talent evaluation, they're better at planning, and they just know how and what to value more than dumbass teams like the Bulls and Pistons.
Smart teams ask for a lot and get it. Smart teams move a year sooner. Teams like the Bulls and Pistons are always moving a year or more too late, and generally compliantly handing over too freaking much.
Now, GarPax can just sit there and talk about, I guess, how it was unforeseeable that their big swing on Cam Payne just didn't work out while nobody could have imagined Shai would be so good. But that's ridiculous loser talk.
I still don't agree with you. Presti entered a job with Durant gifted to him - he helped the Celtics win a chip by sending Ray for a bust Jeff Green - and he ultimately sniffed a ring but lost it all by picking Thabo, Ibaka and Kendrick Perkins over paying Harden the max.
They traded PG because he and FA Kawhi colluded to unite in their hometown LA via the Clippers. I don't think OKC were shopping George; that's why Ballmer signed off on such a bat**** trade offer. He had to pay a premium for a guy who had broken his leg severely the year prior, and was back in ASG shape but chronically injury prone.
The Ibaka/Orlando trade is still one of the most puzzling swaps of all-time. I don't know what the Magic were smoking the night of that trade, but sending Oladipo and Sabonis' draft rights for an expiring Ibaka, coming off a career low season, was one of the most bizarre trades in NBA history. But that gift kept giving as he was able to capitalize on Indiana with that package, and ultimately the Clippers.
Weird how "good luck" just keeps happening over and over to OKC but not to us...But lucky breaks like that happen in the NBA. Was Paxson more genius, or was Isiah more of a buffoon? Cause we never saw the same pattern of ingenious trading after those 2 off-seasons.
Paxson was average and Isaiah was a buffoon working for another buffoon.I'd love to hear about all of Presti's other ingenious trades (future MVP for Kevin Martin, future champ Ray Allen for Jeff Green, Jeff Green for K. Perkins). The CP3/Westbrook swap worked out well; dunno why Houston bothered attaching picks, but it seemed more stupid and desperate on their end.
I doubt it, because it would further undermine the interpretation you're pushing. If you heard the full truth of the Harden deal, you'd understand that it was apparently forced or at least influenced by the owner (the late Aubrey McClendon) being in financial hot water with the Feds, the team being completely out of money, and the structure of a new CBA that hit them at such a key time that the league actually stepped in paid the Thunder back for some of the money they had to fork over for KD's supermax.
I've already said that no team is going to get every move right. But, Presti consistently does a lot better than almost everyone else. And you're left grasping for saying you "don't know" why all the teams that deal with him seem to lose those deals. Well, it's because Presti is a good GM and most of the guys he deals with are not.I like Presti, but I don't know why a guy with multiple HOFs on his roster and zero championships gets held to such a high pedigree by some of you guys. Even Isiah Thomas could've built a contender around Kevin Durant and Eddy Curry.
Actually no. That's kind of the point. Bad GMs pretty regularly outsmart themselves. Presti wasn't gifted KD, he chose to take him. A guy like Isiah would probably have kept Allen (going into his age 32 season!) and Rashard Lewis (also on the roster until Presti let the Magic massively overpay for him) and drafted Mike Conley or Spencer Hawes because they were "ready" to step in and help immediately.
C'mon, you know this. You can hear all the meathead guys bobbing along to Isiah and talking about how KD is nothing but an undeveloped version of Rashard Lewis anyway, and the Sonics will be back in the playoffs with Conley/Allen/Rashard and Nick Collison. That was a dead end team, and Isiah would never pass up the chance to hold on to the aging Allen for too long or overpay the mediocre Lewis too much. I mean, why draft KD? He's just a younger version of Rashard... we'll be rebuilding for years!
That's one reason why I wonder about AK giving up a pick to sign DDR. Yes, they had to give something to make it all work, but who else was bidding on him?
DDR came here because the Bulls offered the best contract and the Spurs did it to get some assets. They already got two second round picks and a decent vet (Thad who was flipped for a first round pick). I know Aminu was a negative, but did he matter that much for the Spurs?
In a similar way I think about the Vucevic trade. Why didn't AK put better protections on the 2021 pick? I'm sure the Bulls did the Vucevic trading thinking that they'd make the playoffs and the Magic probably thought the same thing. With that in mind why not protect the pick just in case things go south? I bet the Magic still do that deal.
It makes me think that AK might not value picks all that much.
