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jump wrote:Ok. This is an Ayo thread. I don’t give a shot that the Wiz’ defense sucks. Ayo scored 34 points! And one of you is sloughing it off as it it’s Washington’s fault? Are you a fan of this team or just a troll? Give Ayo some respect and quit being a bitter”fan.”

Are you talking about my post? I’m one of the biggest Ayo fans on this entire board.

You asked why people weren’t talking about it more, and I said maybe they weren’t surprised he did it, which is a compliment. And then I noted another factor for people not talking about it could be because it came against Washington’s defense. Had he done it against the Clippers I suspect it would have generated more buzz around here.

DuckIII wrote:

jump wrote:Ok. This is an Ayo thread. I don’t give a shot that the Wiz’ defense sucks. Ayo scored 34 points! And one of you is sloughing it off as it it’s Washington’s fault? Are you a fan of this team or just a troll? Give Ayo some respect and quit being a bitter”fan.”

Are you talking about my post? I’m one of the biggest Ayo fans on this entire board.

You asked what people weren’t talking about, and I said maybe they weren’t surprised, which is a compliment. And then I noted another factor for people not talking about it could be because it came against Washington’s defense. Had he done it against the Clippers I suspect it would have generated more buzz around here.

I was not talking about your post. But 34 pts is still 34 pts.

jump wrote:

DuckIII wrote:

jump wrote:Ok. This is an Ayo thread. I don’t give a shot that the Wiz’ defense sucks. Ayo scored 34 points! And one of you is sloughing it off as it it’s Washington’s fault? Are you a fan of this team or just a troll? Give Ayo some respect and quit being a bitter”fan.”

Are you talking about my post? I’m one of the biggest Ayo fans on this entire board.

You asked what people weren’t talking about, and I said maybe they weren’t surprised, which is a compliment. And then I noted another factor for people not talking about it could be because it came against Washington’s defense. Had he done it against the Clippers I suspect it would have generated more buzz around here.

I was not talking about your post. But 34 pts is still 34 pts.

I agree. I was trying to explain fan commentary, not his game. He’s starting to push his role, expand his game, and grow towards his ceiling. And he has more game he’s still not using. He’s using more, but he’s taking his time with it and it’s working out real well for him. Smart approach from a smart guy.

DuckIII wrote:

jump wrote:

DuckIII wrote:
Are you talking about my post? I’m one of the biggest Ayo fans on this entire board.

You asked what people weren’t talking about, and I said maybe they weren’t surprised, which is a compliment. And then I noted another factor for people not talking about it could be because it came against Washington’s defense. Had he done it against the Clippers I suspect it would have generated more buzz around here.

I was not talking about your post. But 34 pts is still 34 pts.

I agree. I was trying to explain fan commentary, not his game. He’s starting to push his role, expand his game, and grow towards his ceiling. And he has more game he’s still not using. He’s using more, but he’s taking his time with it and it’s working out real well for him. Smart approach from a smart guy.

Duck, I know you and I are team Ayo, but I also feel Ayo has not even show the killer crossover to mid-range game yet either. That was there in college. Probably hard to do unless DeMar is off the floor, but would like to see it again.

othawhitemeat wrote:

DuckIII wrote:

jump wrote:
I was not talking about your post. But 34 pts is still 34 pts.

I agree. I was trying to explain fan commentary, not his game. He’s starting to push his role, expand his game, and grow towards his ceiling. And he has more game he’s still not using. He’s using more, but he’s taking his time with it and it’s working out real well for him. Smart approach from a smart guy.

Duck, I know you and I are team Ayo, but I also feel Ayo has not even show the killer crossover to mid-range game yet either. That was there in college. Probably hard to do unless DeMar is off the floor, but would like to see it again.

Exactly. I think Ayo has another step he can take. The mid range game was his bread and butter and his finishing/3pt shooting a question mark. He's improved on his hinge skills. Now he has to unleash the mid range

Back to back big games.

Ayo leveling up. Coby and him look like a promising duo. Not because they have overwhelming skill. But because they are both hard workers, versatile and tough. The question is how do you build with those two. Certainly a lot of room for upgrades at forward and center. Should the Bulls make a run at Siakam? Trade for Brandon Ingram? KAT? Lauri?

How does this team get better when you have them on cheap, affordable contracts?

PaKii94 wrote:

othawhitemeat wrote:

DuckIII wrote:
I agree. I was trying to explain fan commentary, not his game. He’s starting to push his role, expand his game, and grow towards his ceiling. And he has more game he’s still not using. He’s using more, but he’s taking his time with it and it’s working out real well for him. Smart approach from a smart guy.

Duck, I know you and I are team Ayo, but I also feel Ayo has not even show the killer crossover to mid-range game yet either. That was there in college. Probably hard to do unless DeMar is off the floor, but would like to see it again.

Exactly. I think Ayo has another step he can take. The mid range game was his bread and butter and his finishing/3pt shooting a question mark. He's improved on his hinge skills. Now he has to unleash the mid range

He can also get on whatever that ball-handling program that Coby's been on. Coby is still better in changing speed and direction with the ball. Ayo currently is more of a straight line driver. If he can also improve this, then won't be surprised to see him make similar jump to Coby in scoring production. Although Coby is naturally a more explosive scorer than Ayo. But Ayo I feel can be a more steady scorer. Regardless, Coby and Ayo backcourt have been huge surprise.

burlydee wrote:Ayo leveling up. Coby and him look like a promising duo. Not because they have overwhelming skill. But because they are both hard workers, versatile and tough. The question is how do you build with those two. Certainly a lot of room for upgrades at forward and center. Should the Bulls make a run at Siakam? Trade for Brandon Ingram? KAT? Lauri?

How does this team get better when you have them on cheap, affordable contracts?

I think the Bulls have two more seasons until Coby and Ayo are up for contract extensions....? In the meanwhile (this off season) they have to make a decision on new deals for DDR, PW and Drummond.

Unfortunately, the Bulls don't have enough assets to go after the players you mention. Maybe they get lucky in the draft lottery?

burlydee wrote:Ayo leveling up. Coby and him look like a promising duo. Not because they have overwhelming skill. But because they are both hard workers, versatile and tough. The question is how do you build with those two. Certainly a lot of room for upgrades at forward and center. Should the Bulls make a run at Siakam? Trade for Brandon Ingram? KAT? Lauri?

How does this team get better when you have them on cheap, affordable contracts?

I think Coby actually does have overwhelming skill. The only thing he lacks on offense is great court vision. His handle, outside shooting and ability to finish at rim though contact are all approaching elite level.

Ayo is less gifted, but Hell might just work himself into being a star two-way player like Butler did. We still a player significantly better than either of them to be a serious contender though.

burlydee wrote:Ayo leveling up. Coby and him look like a promising duo. Not because they have overwhelming skill. But because they are both hard workers, versatile and tough. The question is how do you build with those two. Certainly a lot of room for upgrades at forward and center. Should the Bulls make a run at Siakam? Trade for Brandon Ingram? KAT? Lauri?

How does this team get better when you have them on cheap, affordable contracts?

The problem is lacking assets to make any potential upgrades, the Bulls are locked into Vuc at close to 20m for the next 2 years, LaVine at 45m per the next 4 years and will likely extend DeRozan at (I think) around 25-30m a year for the next 2-3 years.

I just don't see any avenues in which the Bulls can improve further unless Pat has some sort of ridiculous jump or they get extremely lucky in the draft and get a diamond in the rough.

I'm hopeful, but doubtful at the same time.

Muzbar wrote:

burlydee wrote:Ayo leveling up. Coby and him look like a promising duo. Not because they have overwhelming skill. But because they are both hard workers, versatile and tough. The question is how do you build with those two. Certainly a lot of room for upgrades at forward and center. Should the Bulls make a run at Siakam? Trade for Brandon Ingram? KAT? Lauri?

How does this team get better when you have them on cheap, affordable contracts?

The problem is lacking assets to make any potential upgrades, the Bulls are locked into Vuc at close to 20m for the next 2 years, LaVine at 45m per the next 4 years and will likely extend DeRozan at (I think) around 25-30m a year for the next 2-3 years.

I just don't see any avenues in which the Bulls can improve further unless Pat has some sort of ridiculous jump or they get extremely lucky in the draft and get a diamond in the rough.

I'm hopeful, but doubtful at the same time.

Yep. What a way to waste Coby and Ayo on their cheap years. At least when Gar/pax had young Rose and Noah on cheap rookie deals, they swung for the fences. They missed of course and ended up with Boozer, but still put themselves in position to add big fish to their young duo.

Mad respect for the left handed floater vs Portland. Also for knocking down a 3 after getting one blocked.

I like to watch Ayo in games like last night where he is the 3rd option guy with nobody to pass to. He is forced to shoot more (and not stop when his confidence wanes after missing a 3 or getting blocked). Like Pat (but nowhere as problematic) he needs to develop more of a scorer's mentality. He and Vuc are the ones who benefit most when we play poor rim protecting teams, said another way, those two have very blockable shots.

Kid is fun to watch.

Confidence in his 3 ball seems to grow with every game.

Dominator83 wrote:

Muzbar wrote:

burlydee wrote:Ayo leveling up. Coby and him look like a promising duo. Not because they have overwhelming skill. But because they are both hard workers, versatile and tough. The question is how do you build with those two. Certainly a lot of room for upgrades at forward and center. Should the Bulls make a run at Siakam? Trade for Brandon Ingram? KAT? Lauri?

How does this team get better when you have them on cheap, affordable contracts?

The problem is lacking assets to make any potential upgrades, the Bulls are locked into Vuc at close to 20m for the next 2 years, LaVine at 45m per the next 4 years and will likely extend DeRozan at (I think) around 25-30m a year for the next 2-3 years.

I just don't see any avenues in which the Bulls can improve further unless Pat has some sort of ridiculous jump or they get extremely lucky in the draft and get a diamond in the rough.

I'm hopeful, but doubtful at the same time.

Yep. What a way to waste Coby and Ayo on their cheap years. At least when Gar/pax had young Rose and Noah on cheap rookie deals, they swung for the fences. They missed of course and ended up with Boozer, but still put themselves in position to add big fish to their young duo.

I hated that Boozer deal. We should’ve started Taj that whole time and used that money at the 2 spot.

Would you say we have a legit starting backcourt with Ayo and Coby?

Guru wrote:Would you say we have a legit starting backcourt with Ayo and Coby?

They're more than enough, and honestly, we have a pretty nice squad:

Starters:
It's nice to have a solid scoring threat at the PG position like Coby, which is something we've been lacking since Derrick Rose. That's crazy.
Ayo as a 3&D + transition demon SG fits any lineup.
DeMar obviously does his thing at the 3.
If we can get some size and shooting at the 4 position, we can be cooking with gas. I like Torrey Craig and what he brings, but at 6'5 he's still too undersized. Pat has the size and shooting, but has been too inconsistent and obviously out injured again now.
Vooch has had a tough season, but if you pair him with a legit 3&D PF with size, he'll be more than fine.

Bench:
Caruso is your 6th man getting your bench organized fueling the second unit.
Bitim has performed way better than I anticipated. I think with enough playing time, he can be a regular contributor. I think what stood out to me is his IQ is off the charts for a rookie, which probably is why Billy has been going to him to close clutch games lol.
Terry is still a mixed bag, but he has played better since being in the regular rotation.
I'm still intrigued by Phillips' upside. If he can take a step in becoming a consistent shooter, he'll have a role.
Drummond is and will remain the best backup center in the league.

Guru wrote:Would you say we have a legit starting backcourt with Ayo and Coby?

In a vacuum, yes. But it’s not the “backcourt of a contending team” without at least one superstar in the front court and a logical, well balanced, two way roster.

Regardless, the rise of Ayo and Coby is one of the best things to happen to the Bulls in quite some time. It’s very encouraging, especially if we capitalize on their extremely below-market deals.

FriedRise wrote:

Guru wrote:Would you say we have a legit starting backcourt with Ayo and Coby?

They're more than enough, and honestly, we have a pretty nice squad:

Starters:
It's nice to have a solid scoring threat at the PG position like Coby, which is something we've been lacking since Derrick Rose. That's crazy.
Ayo as a 3&D + transition demon SG fits any lineup.
DeMar obviously does his thing at the 3.
If we can get some size and shooting at the 4 position, we can be cooking with gas. I like Torrey Craig and what he brings, but at 6'5 he's still too undersized. Pat has the size and shooting, but has been too inconsistent and obviously out injured again now.
Vooch has had a tough season, but if you pair him with a legit 3&D PF with size, he'll be more than fine.

Bench:
Caruso is your 6th man getting your bench organized fueling the second unit.
Bitim has performed way better than I anticipated. I think with enough playing time, he can be a regular contributor. I think what stood out to me is his IQ is off the charts for a rookie, which probably is why Billy has been going to him to close clutch games lol.
Terry is still a mixed bag, but he has played better since being in the regular rotation.
I'm still intrigued by Phillips' upside. If he can take a step in becoming a consistent shooter, he'll have a role.
Drummond is and will remain the best backup center in the league.

Good points. The pairing has possibilities; however, they both need to improve their consistency. That said, it is putting the cart before the horse to a certain extent. While Demar has been outstanding, we'll need to build around a new #1 next or the following year and I'm not sure how to find that guy. There is also the problem of needing a viable starting C with defensive ability.