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WindyCityBorn wrote:RyanJamari wrote:Tough loss Coby did not show up
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We cannot win if Coby plays poorly. Our margin for error is razor thin. 1st truly bad game he has had in a while.
Dan Z wrote:weneeda2guard wrote:Dan Z wrote:
If the Magic trade for Vets they'll still base the team around their two best young players: Wagner and Banchero.
Just like we based our team around our 2 best young players lavine and coby
Point is, their future is nothing but what we did and what all the young teams will do. So praising their position as if they are so far ahead of us makes no sense considering we were just them. Sometimes adding the players work i.e the t wolves , the kings. Sometimes it doesn't i.e Atlanta, Toronto, Charlotte and Houston. I find we get googly eyed over other situations when they really are not that much better than us. Orlando started hot but been falling apart lately. Just like Utah. We get tagged with the worst ran franchise because we don't want to give the Lakers our assets for their trash. Meanwhile if we could pay attention to the full picture, these other franchises are not doing too much better than us.
The Bulls were not built around LaVine and Coby. That's ridiculous. Coming into this season nobody knew that Coby would take the leap forward that he did.
If you mean before the Vucevic trade that's a different story, but it wasn't Coby and LaVine. That was a team trying to figure itself out after the Butler trade. Young players such as LaVine, Coby, WCJ, Markkanen and Chandler Hutchison.
The Magic have two young players to build with and they have a few more with potential. They also own all their own picks plus a 2025 first from Denver and 2nd rounders from other teams.
I agree that they have struggled since the start of the season and they're not amazing, but they have potential going forward. The Bulls ceiling right now is limited.
It's what we do, right? The best player is supposed to carry the team to a championship by themselves. If not, they are bums who need to get traded so we can appoint someone else the next Jordan.WindyCityBorn wrote:chitownsports4ever wrote:WindyCityBorn wrote:
Not worried about Coby at all. This is like his first bad game in the last 10 or so. It’s an indictment of this roster that he is so integral to our success. No one expected it. In a way his great play has allowed our front office to remain delusional about staying the course.
So its an indictment of the roster that the starting PG played well ?
That the starting PG who took 21 shots play well ?
Some of you are deep into your narrative bags tonight
Still a mediocre team with no future no matter what narrative you choose. Everyone will turn on Coby when he gets his next contract and has no help.
Stratmaster wrote:Haven't seen the game yet. We are out of town. But from the looks of it, let me guess...
Bulls fall behind. Fight back to take the lead. Fall apart while being outcoached in q4 relying heavily on Demar ISO.
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Ice Man wrote:Not sure why this was Billy's fault. Coby took his shots down the stretch, as the fans wanted. Miss, miss, miss, miss, miss, miss, make, miss.
Shrug.
chitownsports4ever wrote:Ice Man wrote:Not sure why this was Billy's fault. Coby took his shots down the stretch, as the fans wanted. Miss, miss, miss, miss, miss, miss, make, miss.
Shrug.
Its make or miss league and some nights like last night happens to the best of them. We cant cry for the young players to have more responsibility and then absolve them of all responsibility when they play poorly. This was a great learning lesson for Coby because if nothing else it reenforces his importance to the teams but also that his minutes matter. I expect him to have a solid bounce back next game . One thing to note is that Coby has not played well in any of the 3 Orlando games this season.
Jcool0 wrote:aguifs wrote:Do we have a friggin plan?
If the Bulls do, you would be complaining to much to ever hear it.
The Explorer wrote:Bulls are missing three/fifths and $70m of their starting lineup and still kind of surviving. I don't expect them to move up in the standings for the rest of the season. Not many teams would do well in such circumstances.
Jcool0 wrote:aguifs wrote:Do we have a friggin plan?
If the Bulls do, you would be complaining to much to ever hear it.
weneeda2guard wrote:Dan Z wrote:weneeda2guard wrote:Just like we based our team around our 2 best young players lavine and coby
Point is, their future is nothing but what we did and what all the young teams will do. So praising their position as if they are so far ahead of us makes no sense considering we were just them. Sometimes adding the players work i.e the t wolves , the kings. Sometimes it doesn't i.e Atlanta, Toronto, Charlotte and Houston. I find we get googly eyed over other situations when they really are not that much better than us. Orlando started hot but been falling apart lately. Just like Utah. We get tagged with the worst ran franchise because we don't want to give the Lakers our assets for their trash. Meanwhile if we could pay attention to the full picture, these other franchises are not doing too much better than us.
The Bulls were not built around LaVine and Coby. That's ridiculous. Coming into this season nobody knew that Coby would take the leap forward that he did.
If you mean before the Vucevic trade that's a different story, but it wasn't Coby and LaVine. That was a team trying to figure itself out after the Butler trade. Young players such as LaVine, Coby, WCJ, Markkanen and Chandler Hutchison.
The Magic have two young players to build with and they have a few more with potential. They also own all their own picks plus a 2025 first from Denver and 2nd rounders from other teams.
I agree that they have struggled since the start of the season and they're not amazing, but they have potential going forward. The Bulls ceiling right now is limited.
We flipped everyone else and moved forward with coby and lavine. That is building around 2 young players. Panchero and wagner ceiling is 1st rd exit, just like ours with lavine and coby. They will eventually lose their assets once they begin to make deals, just like we did. BTW we also own all of our picks going forward still except this protected 1 to San Antonio. If you think the magic are somehow going to be more than a 1st rd exit then I again say it's just the results of having Googly eyes for a situation that's not ours. Their ceiling is basically our ceiling. They will eventually consolidate and bring in a Bradley Beal or Zach lavine etc in hopes to climb up because as of right now with all the draft talent they not close to competing for a title and now they too good to get a high draft pick. Their only course is going to be to consolidate. I'm not just saying that cause it's a belief it's what's been proven in the league.
So again sometimes consolidating works in the example of the t wolves, sometimes it doesn't in the example of Atlanta. For us it was working then lonzo went down and it didn't anymore. My main point is trying to insinuate that we need to take the path of the magic is wrong because we already took that path. It landed us here. They will land where we are soon. Its just the cycle of the nba until you luck up and nab a franchise superstar that can raise your ceiling. Orlando doesn't have that. We don't have that either. Giannis comes and joins us then all of a sudden this team will make sense. Giannis joins the magic all of a sudden they contend. That's my point.
weneeda2guard wrote:Dan Z wrote:weneeda2guard wrote:Just like we based our team around our 2 best young players lavine and coby
Point is, their future is nothing but what we did and what all the young teams will do. So praising their position as if they are so far ahead of us makes no sense considering we were just them. Sometimes adding the players work i.e the t wolves , the kings. Sometimes it doesn't i.e Atlanta, Toronto, Charlotte and Houston. I find we get googly eyed over other situations when they really are not that much better than us. Orlando started hot but been falling apart lately. Just like Utah. We get tagged with the worst ran franchise because we don't want to give the Lakers our assets for their trash. Meanwhile if we could pay attention to the full picture, these other franchises are not doing too much better than us.
The Bulls were not built around LaVine and Coby. That's ridiculous. Coming into this season nobody knew that Coby would take the leap forward that he did.
If you mean before the Vucevic trade that's a different story, but it wasn't Coby and LaVine. That was a team trying to figure itself out after the Butler trade. Young players such as LaVine, Coby, WCJ, Markkanen and Chandler Hutchison.
The Magic have two young players to build with and they have a few more with potential. They also own all their own picks plus a 2025 first from Denver and 2nd rounders from other teams.
I agree that they have struggled since the start of the season and they're not amazing, but they have potential going forward. The Bulls ceiling right now is limited.
We flipped everyone else and moved forward with coby and lavine. That is building around 2 young players. Panchero and wagner ceiling is 1st rd exit, just like ours with lavine and coby. They will eventually lose their assets once they begin to make deals, just like we did. BTW we also own all of our picks going forward still except this protected 1 to San Antonio. If you think the magic are somehow going to be more than a 1st rd exit then I again say it's just the results of having Googly eyes for a situation that's not ours. Their ceiling is basically our ceiling. They will eventually consolidate and bring in a Bradley Beal or Zach lavine etc in hopes to climb up because as of right now with all the draft talent they not close to competing for a title and now they too good to get a high draft pick. Their only course is going to be to consolidate. I'm not just saying that cause it's a belief it's what's been proven in the league.
So again sometimes consolidating works in the example of the t wolves, sometimes it doesn't in the example of Atlanta. For us it was working then lonzo went down and it didn't anymore. My main point is trying to insinuate that we need to take the path of the magic is wrong because we already took that path. It landed us here. They will land where we are soon. Its just the cycle of the nba until you luck up and nab a franchise superstar that can raise your ceiling. Orlando doesn't have that. We don't have that either. Giannis comes and joins us then all of a sudden this team will make sense. Giannis joins the magic all of a sudden they contend. That's my point.
Dan Z wrote:weneeda2guard wrote:Dan Z wrote:
The Bulls were not built around LaVine and Coby. That's ridiculous. Coming into this season nobody knew that Coby would take the leap forward that he did.
If you mean before the Vucevic trade that's a different story, but it wasn't Coby and LaVine. That was a team trying to figure itself out after the Butler trade. Young players such as LaVine, Coby, WCJ, Markkanen and Chandler Hutchison.
The Magic have two young players to build with and they have a few more with potential. They also own all their own picks plus a 2025 first from Denver and 2nd rounders from other teams.
I agree that they have struggled since the start of the season and they're not amazing, but they have potential going forward. The Bulls ceiling right now is limited.
We flipped everyone else and moved forward with coby and lavine. That is building around 2 young players. Panchero and wagner ceiling is 1st rd exit, just like ours with lavine and coby. They will eventually lose their assets once they begin to make deals, just like we did. BTW we also own all of our picks going forward still except this protected 1 to San Antonio. If you think the magic are somehow going to be more than a 1st rd exit then I again say it's just the results of having Googly eyes for a situation that's not ours. Their ceiling is basically our ceiling. They will eventually consolidate and bring in a Bradley Beal or Zach lavine etc in hopes to climb up because as of right now with all the draft talent they not close to competing for a title and now they too good to get a high draft pick. Their only course is going to be to consolidate. I'm not just saying that cause it's a belief it's what's been proven in the league.
So again sometimes consolidating works in the example of the t wolves, sometimes it doesn't in the example of Atlanta. For us it was working then lonzo went down and it didn't anymore. My main point is trying to insinuate that we need to take the path of the magic is wrong because we already took that path. It landed us here. They will land where we are soon. Its just the cycle of the nba until you luck up and nab a franchise superstar that can raise your ceiling. Orlando doesn't have that. We don't have that either. Giannis comes and joins us then all of a sudden this team will make sense. Giannis joins the magic all of a sudden they contend. That's my point.
Coby was never a player that the team was building around.
When AK got the job he drafted Patrick Williams and then during his first season he traded for Vucevic. In the off season he made the moves for DDR and Lonzo.
The team was built around the "Big Three" (DDR, Vucevic, LaVine). That's two aging vets and one player in his prime.
The Magic traded their best player in Vucevic for two lottery picks. They also got the number 1 overall pick in the 2022 draft. What they're doing is building around Franz Wagner and Paolo Banchero. Both players are young (22 and 21) with upside and are learning how to win in the NBA. Banchero is an all-star this year. They have other young players with potential.
The Bulls never built around a good young player or two and opted to jump right into a "win now" strategy by trading away future assets to do it.
Guru wrote:Dan Z wrote:weneeda2guard wrote:We flipped everyone else and moved forward with coby and lavine. That is building around 2 young players. Panchero and wagner ceiling is 1st rd exit, just like ours with lavine and coby. They will eventually lose their assets once they begin to make deals, just like we did. BTW we also own all of our picks going forward still except this protected 1 to San Antonio. If you think the magic are somehow going to be more than a 1st rd exit then I again say it's just the results of having Googly eyes for a situation that's not ours. Their ceiling is basically our ceiling. They will eventually consolidate and bring in a Bradley Beal or Zach lavine etc in hopes to climb up because as of right now with all the draft talent they not close to competing for a title and now they too good to get a high draft pick. Their only course is going to be to consolidate. I'm not just saying that cause it's a belief it's what's been proven in the league.
So again sometimes consolidating works in the example of the t wolves, sometimes it doesn't in the example of Atlanta. For us it was working then lonzo went down and it didn't anymore. My main point is trying to insinuate that we need to take the path of the magic is wrong because we already took that path. It landed us here. They will land where we are soon. Its just the cycle of the nba until you luck up and nab a franchise superstar that can raise your ceiling. Orlando doesn't have that. We don't have that either. Giannis comes and joins us then all of a sudden this team will make sense. Giannis joins the magic all of a sudden they contend. That's my point.
Coby was never a player that the team was building around.
When AK got the job he drafted Patrick Williams and then during his first season he traded for Vucevic. In the off season he made the moves for DDR and Lonzo.
The team was built around the "Big Three" (DDR, Vucevic, LaVine). That's two aging vets and one player in his prime.
The Magic traded their best player in Vucevic for two lottery picks. They also got the number 1 overall pick in the 2022 draft. What they're doing is building around Franz Wagner and Paolo Banchero. Both players are young (22 and 21) with upside and are learning how to win in the NBA. Banchero is an all-star this year. They have other young players with potential.
The Bulls never built around a good young player or two and opted to jump right into a "win now" strategy by trading away future assets to do it.
They are now
Dan Z wrote:Guru wrote:Dan Z wrote:
Coby was never a player that the team was building around.
When AK got the job he drafted Patrick Williams and then during his first season he traded for Vucevic. In the off season he made the moves for DDR and Lonzo.
The team was built around the "Big Three" (DDR, Vucevic, LaVine). That's two aging vets and one player in his prime.
The Magic traded their best player in Vucevic for two lottery picks. They also got the number 1 overall pick in the 2022 draft. What they're doing is building around Franz Wagner and Paolo Banchero. Both players are young (22 and 21) with upside and are learning how to win in the NBA. Banchero is an all-star this year. They have other young players with potential.
The Bulls never built around a good young player or two and opted to jump right into a "win now" strategy by trading away future assets to do it.
They are now
You mean Coby? He's a key piece right now because he took a leap forward, but nobody saw that coming.
There's a big difference between a team rebuilding to look for foundational pieces to build with (which is what the Magic have done) and the Bulls who went in a "win now" direction (by trading future assets for vets).
The Bulls were never building around Coby and right now they're not even doing that. Next year the team will basically be the same and maybe even worse (will Drummond stay?).
Guru wrote:Dan Z wrote:Guru wrote:
They are now
You mean Coby? He's a key piece right now because he took a leap forward, but nobody saw that coming.
There's a big difference between a team rebuilding to look for foundational pieces to build with (which is what the Magic have done) and the Bulls who went in a "win now" direction (by trading future assets for vets).
The Bulls were never building around Coby and right now they're not even doing that. Next year the team will basically be the same and maybe even worse (will Drummond stay?).
They created the scaffolding for White to become what he is. That was absolutely the plan.....and they will have PAW, a top 15 pick and whatever we get for LaVine or LaVine....It will be much improved.
Stratmaster wrote:Haven't seen the game yet. We are out of town. But from the looks of it, let me guess...
Bulls fall behind. Fight back to take the lead. Fall apart while being outcoached in q4 relying heavily on Demar ISO.
Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app
Dan Z wrote:Guru wrote:Dan Z wrote:
You mean Coby? He's a key piece right now because he took a leap forward, but nobody saw that coming.
There's a big difference between a team rebuilding to look for foundational pieces to build with (which is what the Magic have done) and the Bulls who went in a "win now" direction (by trading future assets for vets).
The Bulls were never building around Coby and right now they're not even doing that. Next year the team will basically be the same and maybe even worse (will Drummond stay?).
They created the scaffolding for White to become what he is. That was absolutely the plan.....and they will have PAW, a top 15 pick and whatever we get for LaVine or LaVine....It will be much improved.
Nobody expected Coby to take the leap that he's done this year. Ask anyone here.
They weren't building with that in mind and if you think so that's revisionist history.
Going into next year they'll have to figure out contracts for DDR, PW and Drummond. They won't have any room to get anyone new and might lose Drummond.
The 2024 pick I hope is a good one, but any rookie they get will probably take some time. Zach will be showcased and eventually traded. For what....who knows?
Guru wrote:Dan Z wrote:Guru wrote:
They created the scaffolding for White to become what he is. That was absolutely the plan.....and they will have PAW, a top 15 pick and whatever we get for LaVine or LaVine....It will be much improved.
Nobody expected Coby to take the leap that he's done this year. Ask anyone here.
They weren't building with that in mind and if you think so that's revisionist history.
Going into next year they'll have to figure out contracts for DDR, PW and Drummond. They won't have any room to get anyone new and might lose Drummond.
The 2024 pick I hope is a good one, but any rookie they get will probably take some time. Zach will be showcased and eventually traded. For what....who knows?
Lots of foreclosed thinking when in fact we face a see of unknown.
Of course they assumed White would improve. And PAW for that matter.
