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Just curious what people think are our best to worst trade pieces in terms of general desirability to other teams. I'm ignoring all guys not under contract so no Demar, Patrick, Drummond, Craig, Taylor, but yes to Lonzo. This is my ranking:

1. Coby
2. Caruso
3. Zach
4. Ayo
5. Vuc
6. Phillips
7. Bitim
8. Carter
9. Terry
10. Ball

Obviously it's comparing apples and oranges due to their wildly varying contracts, but this attempts to bake that in. That's why Caruso is ranked over Zach for example. But matching rules complicate the role of salary value in trade appeal.

Coby, Caruso and Ayo are the only positive assets.

I think it's:

Caruso
Ayo
Coby
Demar S&T
Pat S&T

There's our 1st and the POR 1st too.

IMO we should (but won't) trade Demar and Caruso (and POR 1st) for upgrades at PF and C. Then roll with a 3 guard rotation of Zach, Coby and Ayo. Move Pat to SF (where Ayo can back-him up too), and the new PF and C. Have Vuc off the bench. Revive Zach's value and try again to trade him at the deadline.

Supposed value is one thing, valuable to another team is probably what matters most.

The Bulls question to factor in is, if you trade somebody where does that leave the Bulls?

to me
Caruso has the most value to another team so he would brig back the best return and if he's the only one to go they can replace his minutes with Ayo, Javonte, Carter, Bitiim
Vucevic is next, a team with a an undersized center like MEM or maybe a team that drafted a skinny kid last year or this summer needs somebody to hold the position and school the young guy
Those two are most likely to bring back NBA ready players who join the rotation.

Carter could be a backup PG good on defense streaky shooter

Zach can score the basketball, a team that lacks scoring in the back court might want him but who has the salaries to match? And face it, he's never been a part of a winning team so are potential contenders going to ignore that? The Bulls' best bet with Zach is to join a 3 or 4 team trade and take back one or two shorter smaller hopefully expiring contracts to help swing that trade.

Coby and Ayo are in the same category, they aren't unique any team could get or already has someone similar, so why would you give up anything to get either of them?
Phillips is a 2nd round pick who hardly played 100 minutes, nobody is giving up anything for him. Bitim the same. Terry will be lucky to stay with the Bulls if they make trades.

Look at how many players have been injured in the last 2 weeks and are out for the year, or internally how the Bulls have a pair done for the year. Nobody is going to take Lonzo's $20M contract on a gamble, there are 20 healthy guys to pick up.

What they could get back for DeRozan in a S&T would be their biggest gain. I doubt too many teams outbid the Bulls for Williams, it would be smart to keep Drummond, a role player like Craig wouldn't even bring back a 2nd round pick

1. Coby
2. Ayo
3. Caruso (1 year left on his contract, old, injury risk)
4. Zach
5. Ball (20M expiring contract)
6. Philips
7. Vuc
8. Carter
9. Terry
10. Bitim

Coby, Ayo, and Caruso are the only players with positive value. With Zach, you'd get 40M in role players back. Ball could be traded for assets if you're willing to take a bad contract. Everyone else is salary matching at best.

Well, I know that Vuc is not fetching jack **** anymore. Ship sailed a while ago, but at this point, it’s either highway robbery or a deep cavity search- pick your poison. Problem is, I think keeping him is even worse, but AK won’t admit that. Guess we need to watch another two years of sub500 ball with bad defense and mediocre offense.

Caruso, Demar (s&t) ought to fetch a decent chip from the right partner.

If Zach has a full recovery in the summer, maybe on draft night he can surprise us and bring back a half-respectable haul. Like a pair of late 1sts and Bogdanovic. Or maybe Atlanta, Sacramento cough up something. Zach’s value might be OK on draft night- season emotions cool off and fringe teams just try to find available upgrades in a tight market. Combined with the mediocrity in the draft, Zach might actually fetch a mid1st.

What trade assets? We have none

Caruso
DDR(S&T)
Lavine

I agree w/ the list but Coby vs Caruso will vary greatly by team. Playoff teams will highly value Caruso, and not be that interested in another on-ball scorer who scores at below league efficiency. There's a pretty big disparity of opinion on Coby's defense, I personally think he's a bad defender, he's always not rotating over and even Drummond has been arguing with him lately and Andre is about as friendly as you get. I think playoff teams will value both Caruso & Ayo as much more efficient scorers and AC is 1st team defense and Ayo has defensive potential.

I think rebuilding teams will value Coby more as a wildcard kid with potential. If he loses you some games as your lead guard (no Derozan to save the game in the 4th), that's all part of the plan.

Lavine is going to have to show he's healthy before he can be moved. And also AK has to be willing to accept the typical "a bunch of roleplayers + future assets" type of package and all reports is that his expectations are unrealistic. And that wasn't just for Lavine, it also applies to AC and everyone. We supposedly refused 3 2nd rounders for Drummond...that's basically a 1st rounder in value. And Drummond can walk this summer for nothing.

Dominator83 wrote:What trade assets? We have none

statue outside the UC?

This summer? Caruso. By next trade deadline, hopefully Lavine, Ball, Coby, Ayo, Vuc in that order.

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Zero assets Bulls have.

1. Caruso
2. 2024 draft pick
3. Coby
4. Ayo
5. Demar S&T
6. PWill S&T
7. Oblivion

If he wasn't #1 for most other teams before, Caruso shot up to #1 after that Minny win. Pretty much hand delivered the W on both offense & defense.

ChettheJet wrote:Caruso has the most value to another team so he would brig back the best return

Quite the opposite. Now I'm not saying he isn't highly desired... but his limited salary makes it hard for respective teams to send anything substantial in return. And when you factor in that he'll be an expiring deal too... which again has limited appeal given the size of his contract.

On his own, Caruso won't get us much. Oddly, his market value will drop come the off season.

step wrote:

ChettheJet wrote:Caruso has the most value to another team so he would brig back the best return

Quite the opposite. Now I'm not saying he isn't highly desired... but his limited salary makes it hard for respective teams to send anything substantial in return. And when you factor in that he'll be an expiring deal too... which again has limited appeal given the size of his contract.

On his own, Caruso won't get us much. Oddly, his market value will drop come the off season.

I'll flip it around on you. We want a pick and a good young player on a rookie deal back, or someone to attach to Vuc's deal to bring back a positive asset. That said, I still think AK won't tank (whether he should tank is another matter) and the only way to avoid tanking is keeping both of Demar and AC.

step wrote:

ChettheJet wrote:Caruso has the most value to another team so he would brig back the best return

Quite the opposite. Now I'm not saying he isn't highly desired... but his limited salary makes it hard for respective teams to send anything substantial in return. And when you factor in that he'll be an expiring deal too... which again has limited appeal given the size of his contract.

On his own, Caruso won't get us much. Oddly, his market value will drop come the off season.

Caruso is basically an all-nba defense 1st team version of Marcus Smart, vet defensive PG. Smart shot 33% from 3, AC is shooting 41%. When Boston traded Smart they got 2x 1st round picks (one with only top 4 protection) + Kristaps Porzingis.

There are less than 5 elite point of attack defenders in the entire league, most are close to untouchable (Jrue, Derrick White) and AC is the best of them on the lowest contract. AC has been the Bull that's been getting the most trade inquiries from other teams consistently last 2 years.

I do agree his value declines w/ age, more injuries, and contract getting shorter. He & the rest of the vets should have been maximized in trade 2 deadlines ago when AC would have returned Kuminga, but just beating a dead horse at this point.

sco wrote:I'll flip it around on you. We want a pick and a good young player on a rookie deal back, or someone to attach to Vuc's deal to bring back a positive asset.

Nobody bit on the 2 FRP asking price earlier ... I just argue that it be highly unlikely that someone would essentially give it now this coming off season. That good young player would have to have shown quite some promise for 'us' to even entertain the idea given how good Caruso is.

Also not many true contenders have that young piece to trade in return ... basically that's limited to recent lottery teams, so you've halved the trade pool already. And those that are left that aren't already contenders are probably weighing up does Caruso really push us over the edge into contention alone? The answer has obviously been no.

As for packaging him with Vuc, Caruso only goes so far to push to scales back to neutral, let alone in our favour. I won't rehash that debate ... however, it is plausible. I just also think how hamstrung we are in making other moves that they won't truly entertain that idea. You'd almost have to plug those very holes we'd be creating in the returning pieces.

kodo wrote:Caruso is basically an all-nba defense 1st team version of Marcus Smart, vet defensive PG. Smart shot 33% from 3, AC is shooting 41%. When Boston traded Smart they got 2x 1st round picks (one with only top 4 protection) + Kristaps Porzingis.

The good and bad thing with Smart ... was that he was paid significantly more. There are too many troubled/injured players with talent earning $9M to exchange for Caruso. And nobody has been willing to pay the 2 FRP asking price as it is.

kodo wrote:There are less than 5 elite point of attack defenders in the entire league, most are close to untouchable (Jrue, Derrick White) and AC is the best of them on the lowest contract. AC has been the Bull that's been getting the most trade inquiries from other teams consistently last 2 years.

Oh don't get me wrong, he's actual on the court value is superb. It's somewhat illogical that given how cheap of a deal his on that more teams haven't been willing... but we also know a reason there was that management were largely unwilling to even consider it. They set the unrealistic threshold value for him and then when other teams came close... quickly yanked him back off the table.

kodo wrote:I do agree his value declines w/ age, more injuries, and contract getting shorter. He & the rest of the vets should have been maximized in trade 2 deadlines ago when AC would have returned Kuminga, but just beating a dead horse at this point.

I agree too... I was more just trying to paint/put out a more realistic take on Caruso's actual trade value out there. It's odd that a DPOY candidate on a fantastic deal isn't getting more attention. However, I think that's partly down to how the trade market functions (salary matching, trade thresholds, caps etc) and also management's unwillingness. And given the restrictions on FRPs in trades, teams are more reluctant to throw them around on non-star players if ever another star player demands out.

kodo wrote:If he wasn't #1 for most other teams before, Caruso shot up to #1 after that Minny win. Pretty much hand delivered the W on both offense & defense.

He’s easily been their top trade asset for a while now.

My ranking:

1. Unprotected firsts/pick swaps the Bulls can trade
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2. Caruso (now expiring and in for a raise, which probably hurts)
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3. Coby
4. Ayo
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5. Maybe Zach if you find the one team that wants to try him out.
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The rest has either no value (Phillips, Terry, Bitim) or negative value (Carter, Vuc, Lonzo)