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I do understand Kyrv's skepticism, management couldn't change its mind after Gordon accepted the offer on the table. Either we need more details or KC needs to lrn2contractlaw.

Coldfish perfectly sums up the feelings and reasons of fellow Bulls fans who miss Gordon. Great job.

coldfish wrote:

HomoSapien wrote:What about Brad Miller and Drew Gooden?

I don't know if that was in reference to me, but I specifically said you need strong guys who can move their feet. Miller can't and Gooden didn't.

It wasn't, it was in response to the Bulls just making defensive moves. I agree that they obviously favor defense, but like Doug I didn't agree with the characterization of Deng and Hinrich being no offense. I mean, Deng leads us in scoring and Hinrich averaged 16 ppg when he was resigned.

As a practical legal matter, if an offer is pending and accepted, you can't "pull it". The only reason the Bulls were able to avoid the Gordon offer was because a set deadline expired. They could have preemptively pulled it, I suppose, but evidently didn't - which seems incongruous with KC's report.


Although I suppose the real point is that the Bulls decided they didn't want Gordon to take the offer. Which we already knew and have discussed thousands of times.

Nothing new here.

dougthonus wrote:

Tyrus(shot blocker, no real offense), Thabo(defensive player no real offense), Noah(defensive player no real offense), Ben Wallace(no offense at all but we gave him 15 mil a year), Hinrich(defensive player, no real offense), Deng(defensive player, no real offense). Now toss in the comment of JR telling D'Antoini that he'd have a problem if the team didn't play good defense and it's as clear as day what's going on.

I don't think that's an accurate depiction of either Hinrich or Deng. They may not be great offensive players, but they clearly aren't the "no offense" type like the other players you mentioned.

You're right, not as bad as no offense like the others were, but in reality... Deng and Hinrich are finishers... as in capable of finishing plays with a midrange shot(at a solid rate) and Deng is solid at hitting lanes and Hinrich is ok at 3pts. To me that's average at best for offense. NEITHER player can create their own shot at a decent rate(and make it) not so much to go one on one in the offense, but to create a decent shot if the offense doesn't create a solid shot for the team.

HomoSapien wrote:What about Brad Miller and Drew Gooden?

Gooden came here because we were looking just to dump Wallace. Miller was a 2010 contract along with Salmons. Plus... Salmons was a short term bandaid to get us from the start of this year to next year with the loss of a good scorer.

It's amazing that with all the defense we've drafted we're horrible on defense with one or 2 players injured.

AirP. wrote:

HomoSapien wrote:What about Brad Miller and Drew Gooden?

Gooden came here because we were looking just to dump Wallace. Miller was a 2010 contract along with Salmons. Plus... Salmons was a short term bandaid to get us from the start of this year to next year with the loss of a good scorer.

It's amazing that with all the defense we've drafted we're horrible on defense with one or 2 players injured.

Actually, I recall us wanting to trade for Gooden a couple times before we actually did, another Pax "target"

Luke NOT Luc wrote:

AirP. wrote:

HomoSapien wrote:What about Brad Miller and Drew Gooden?

Gooden came here because we were looking just to dump Wallace. Miller was a 2010 contract along with Salmons. Plus... Salmons was a short term bandaid to get us from the start of this year to next year with the loss of a good scorer.

It's amazing that with all the defense we've drafted we're horrible on defense with one or 2 players injured.

Actually, I recall us wanting to trade for Gooden a couple times before we actually did, another Pax "target"

Link to any rumored deals?

DuckIII wrote:As a practical legal matter, if an offer is pending and accepted, you can't "pull it". The only reason the Bulls were able to avoid the Gordon offer was because a set deadline expired. They could have preemptively pulled it, I suppose, but evidently didn't - which seems incongruous with KC's report.


Although I suppose the real point is that the Bulls decided they didn't want Gordon to take the offer. Which we already knew and have discussed thousands of times.

Nothing new here.

That was my thought.

If Gordon had signed it, Jerry could not have just voided it, so we should all be glad Gordon didn't sign it, because then he probably would've been traded for a giant pile of crap and we'd be even more pissed off.

When this team had the Rose/Gordon/Salmons backcourt, even with the craptastic frontcourt, they were playing like a 50-win team. It was the best offense since '98. I mean, you just unload Kirk and Deng, and you've got a team that actually has even more cap room and should be, at worst, a .500 team. Instead they get rid of the most important part of what made that offense successful and stuck with the two players we already knew were mediocre at best on offense and had horrible contracts.

This really is probably the dumbest FO in the league now that Isiah's gone. Only Toronto I think is arguable. It's like they're the defensive minded version of Toronto's FO. Except the defense isn't even good, so I suppose that makes them even worse.

What does this say about management? no really. They can' be this blatantly stupid can they?

No, they are this blatantly stupid. Since Paxson has taken over, every single trade has had something to do with the team's finances. It's never been simply about getting better. His smartest move came at Phoenix's incompetence.

Magilla_Gorilla wrote:Link to any rumored deals?

Forgive me for not taking the whole day to try to find an old article that says that we want to trade for Drew Gooden, but I'm almost positive it was in the ESPN rumors? Nevertheless, us making him a team captain doesn't suggest he was a player we wanted just to dump Wallace

For what it's worth, I remember hearing rumors about the Bulls liking Gooden as well. Not that this means anything, but it was a Paxson that brought him to the Cavs as well...

HomoSapien wrote:No, they are this blatantly stupid. Since Paxson has taken over, every single trade has had something to do with the team's finances. It's never been simply about getting better. His smartest move came at Phoenix's incompetence.

It wasn't incompetence on Phoenix's part -- they were making a huge, bold, credible and feasible push to sign Kobe Bryant and needed to clear that incoming draft pick's salary slot at any cost. They chose to sell the pick to the Bulls specifically because they thought the Bulls would be horrible again and the draft pick from the following season would be comparable to the one they were giving up.

Fair enough, Scott ... but I still think that's one of the few examples of Paxson doing something just to make the Bulls better.

I'm not understanding the people invoking a legal defense for the Bulls' actions here. I am pretty sure the offer they made to Gordon was a verbal one, or maybe written down on a scrap of paper or in a memo. That's not the same as handing him an offer sheet or a blank check. If Gordon had accepted the offer, there was still the formal paperwork to sign, and thus a gap wherein the Bulls could have said, no, sorry about that, we've changed our mind.

HomoSapien wrote:Fair enough, Scott ... but I still think that's one of the few examples of Paxson doing something just to make the Bulls better.

True. It's also an offer that a trained monkey could have and would have accepted.

I don't want to speak for Duck, but I think he was saying that if Gordon had signed the contract instantly they couldn't void it once it'd have been signed.

That being said, I don't think that the Bulls are required to honor an offer.

HomoSapien wrote:His smartest move came at Phoenix's incompetence.

Actually, the point of that trade was to get Al Harrington. So even that wouldn't have really been that great a move unless Indiana hadn't screwed up.

Scott May wrote:It wasn't incompetence on Phoenix's part

No, it really was. The chances of getting Kobe were between fat and none. They ended up blowing half of it on Que…Qui…QRich instead, which was what they were always gonna end up doing.