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Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont

Should we fire Leland

Poll ended at Fri May 18, 2012 2:03 pm

(1)Yes right now, and use my foot
2
100%
(2)Wait till end of season,if he does not win world series
0
No votes
(3)Do not fire him he is old and i feel sorry for him
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 2

TSE
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#41 » by TSE » Sun Sep 9, 2012 10:59 pm

joseph mamah wrote:I think hes got to go, he's either lost interest or his mind. unless we win the world series and even then I think it would be best for both him and the team for him to retire and for the Tigers to make a run at his buddy Tony Larussa.


He seems pretty sharp for an old guy. He hasn't lost anything so much as he just has ignorance when it comes to critical key components of baseball strategy. Imagine yourself as learning math for the very first time and all you knew so far was 2 + 2 = 4. If I were then to ask you to solve what 4 and 4 make, well you understand that well and you would figure out it is 8. But what if I told you the answer I was looking for was 0 because I was thinking of subtracting them? Well your response would be wtf are you talking about, what is subtracting? I would then explain well actually there's also dividing and multiplying you also don't know about, you only know 1 out of 4 things you can do so far! Well Leyland is like a guy that is operating without having been told that nor does he have anybody to give him that wakeup message so that he can see what the problem is and then have a reference point and foundation to having the possibility of figuring it out to solve his own problem. If he had the information and the knowledge and could eliminate his ignorance, then we could finally see what kind of manager he is capable of being. But until then no matter how good of a horse he is, he'll always be a horse with one bum leg.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#42 » by kellmellus50 » Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:46 pm

The most eye-opening move was not just playing Ryan Raburn, but batting him second. Raburn is hitting just .168, with a .221 on-base percentage, and has hit just one home run this season.

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2012 ... z266rfXuWM
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#43 » by TSE » Tue Sep 11, 2012 12:37 am

That doesn't bother me so much as the fact that we should have a superior player in his place on the roster by now. That's the first mistake.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#44 » by kellmellus50 » Tue Sep 11, 2012 12:07 pm

E - R Raburn (4, field) last nite Hummmm i wonder if leland will keep batting him second.1 for 3 raised avg to .171

Tigers corps looks more and more each day as if it is headed for an overly lengthy autumn and winter at home.

If that happens, the front office will be searching for more than a new manager. It will need to re-introduce speed and defense and more reliable hitters to its 2013 roster

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2012 ... z26A8dW3vj
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#45 » by TSE » Tue Sep 11, 2012 5:06 pm

That's easy for Lynn Henning to say that they must tweak the roster. I have been saying that for many years and in the end this is Illitch's team and he is only going to run it his way. And that way isn't very open-minded about tweaking the roster that much, at least not in a way that is going to really attack where we need to attack. We don't need roster tweaks, we need a roster overhaul because we are losing time and future assets with every passing year that we trade away pieces of the future and something has to give at some point, and we can either set up a future to take extra steps forward, or we can set up a future to take steps backward. We seem to be dangerously out of control to protect the downside from happening and to hit the high upside would take a completely different attitude and approach.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#46 » by joseph mamah » Tue Sep 11, 2012 5:16 pm

kellmellus50 wrote:E - R Raburn (4, field) last nite Hummmm i wonder if leland will keep batting him second.1 for 3 raised avg to .171

Tigers corps looks more and more each day as if it is headed for an overly lengthy autumn and winter at home.

If that happens, the front office will be searching for more than a new manager. It will need to re-introduce speed and defense and more reliable hitters to its 2013 roster

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2012 ... z26A8dW3vj

Rayburn has no business being on the field, I dont unsterstand whats going through Leylands head.

if we dont win at least 2 out of the next 3 the seasons over, and Jimmies gone.

I dont think too drastic an overhaul is necessary, a new manager (Larussa,Brenley,Alomar jr.), a healthy V Mart and Fister and an upgrade over Boesch (hopefully either Garcia or Castellanos can be that guy) is all we really need. If we can upgrade at SS, that wouldnt be too bad either, but I think we can roll with jhonny 1 more season. Porcello taking the next step would also help.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#47 » by TSE » Tue Sep 11, 2012 5:36 pm

Yeah under the BP odds link we went from 38.6% to 27.9% from that last game, which represents the biggest proportional percentage drop after any one loss of the season (our odds have been cut in half over the last 7 days). Only 1 of the next 3 would leave us much further handicapped from there, so indeed need 2 out of 3 or better, otherwise we will need to rip one serious win streak being down 5 games to the Sox, which is not a good plan when you don't have a dominant team.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#48 » by kellmellus50 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:31 pm

here we go again tonoghts game guy on 2nd 1 out i was screaming to walk sananta and of coarse leland pitches to him and he hits a tripletie the game in the 9th.next guy hits a singe lose the game 2 back and it looks like the tigers will not make the playoffs and if that happens i would fire leland that day!!!!
Leland is a loser
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#49 » by TSE » Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:46 pm

Yeah Leland is a loser, no doubt about that, but we are ok as long as we win tomorrow, we would be at about 50% to make the playoffs if we win that game. So we still have some time, and we do have a chance to pull off a streak to end the season since we do have some weak opponents in the Twins and Royals yet to go.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#50 » by kellmellus50 » Mon Sep 17, 2012 9:49 pm

TSE wrote:Yeah Leland is a loser, no doubt about that, but we are ok as long as we win tomorrow, we would be at about 50% to make the playoffs if we win that game. So we still have some time, and we do have a chance to pull off a streak to end the season since we do have some weak opponents in the Twins and Royals yet to go.


We lost that game and were 3 back does not look good time is running out for leland,
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#51 » by TSE » Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:01 pm

kellmellus50 wrote:
We lost that game and were 3 back does not look good time is running out for leland,


Yeah our odds from that link I provided are now showing 21.6%. I was expecting 110+ wins this year, obviously not with this assortment of crap players/coaches/management, but that's the minimum benchmark I was looking for. We are going to fall WAY short from my standards.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#52 » by Manocad » Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:12 pm

So since 110 wins has only been achieved six times in MLB history, you're saying that you can assemble and coach a better team than every other organization/coach in the history of MLB save for six.

Yeah, that's believable.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#53 » by TSE » Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:10 pm

Manocad wrote:So since 110 wins has only been achieved six times in MLB history, you're saying that you can assemble and coach a better team than every other organization/coach in the history of MLB save for six.

Yeah, that's believable.


You act like as if that's a giant population. For one, the Tigers spend near the top of the list in payroll each year, so only a small number of teams even have the financial means to build a powerhouse team. Second, I never said I could take any team at any time and turn them into a 110 winner overnight, so I don't know many historical opportunities are eligible to do that in a short time frame. But it's easy when you have an owner willing to spend and a young core of superstar players that you can bank on in the field or as trade options. We happen to have a good nucleus and all of the right ingredients to qualify for building a powerhouse team. You can't win that big on minimum salaries.

So over the history of MLB there hasn't been nearly as many candidates to attempt such a feast as you imply with your statement. The key to my strategy is I wouldn't be copying any of those other strategies that failed to reach 110 wins in a season. Anybody can win less than 110 games per year, that's easy, but what I'm talking about is invoking a strategy set that I've never seen any other team attempt. I have never seen any team in any year in baseball history that had even attempted to build and lockdown a powerhouse team. There's a lot of reasons to explain why they do things the way they do, but for example if the Tigers best move was to trade Verlander or Cabrera, well many GMs would never look at those moves because they are afraid of the social fallout from trading a legendary player that is a fan favorite. We could explore 10 different explanations for why teams so rarely can eclipse a 110 win total, but either way the reasons that explain how each failed don't apply to me if I have a valid plan to avoid those particular reasons.

I see no logic in determining the likelihood of my success based upon what everybody else does that doesn't understand the game at my level, by game I mean the complete game of baseball from roster design and management including the tactics of the game. The game to me isn't playing a baseball game, or scouting a player, or giving a hitting lesson, it's the comprehensive GM role and responsibility to build an uber-dominant team, and that's what I'm the best in the world at and you can't judge me at that without having comparable peers that share my baseball philosophy and approach. Show me a GM that uses my ideas and my strategies for building a team then you will see how easy it is to eclipse 110 wins in a season. Whether you believe me or not that's irrelevant so I don't really see what difference it makes. Nobody believes me nor have I made any irrefutable case to prove as otherwise, so to suggest that you don't believe me goes without saying and would naturally be assumed.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#54 » by Manocad » Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:42 pm

tl;dr

The "population" you're referring to would be every single team from every year of MLB's existence. That's a pretty damn big population.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#55 » by TSE » Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:48 pm

Manocad wrote:tl;dr

The "population" you're referring to would be every single team from every year of MLB's existence. That's a pretty damn big population.


But many of those didn't have a payroll capacity like what the Tigers have. So you have to throw those out. Many of those didn't have a Verlander, a Cabrera, and a Fielder as superstars to work with to win games or use for trades to build up the team in other ways, and the lack of those resources wouldn't make them eligible for the same type of dominance that the Tigers have the opportunity to obtain. So you have to throw those out. That entire population would only have a sliver of candidates that would rival the conditions we meet to qualify for that potential along with the foundation of initial starting resources and assets being significantly large.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#56 » by joseph mamah » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:56 pm

Im getting real tired of Leyland always trying to squeeze an extra inning out of his pitchers, thats my biggest problem with him. he better not have cost us this game.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#57 » by joseph mamah » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:10 pm

Leylands incompetence strikes again.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#58 » by joseph mamah » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:20 pm

Why is he not putting a pinch runner on for fielder?
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#59 » by joseph mamah » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:22 pm

Its almost like this guy doesnt want to make the playoffs.
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Re: Fire Leland & 3rd base Gene Lamont 

Post#60 » by joseph mamah » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:32 pm

Well we pulled it out despite Jimmies idiocy. big win for the Tigs, Leyland owes that third basemen a steak dinner.

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