RealGM

jbk1234 wrote:

JonFromVA wrote:There's a lot of adjustments that need to be made, but some of them are the same adjustments they were supposed to be working on all season so I don't have my hopes up.

Mosley plays a 10 man rotation and didn't stop just because his players were healthy or it's the playoffs. Bickerstaff prepared an 8 man rotation for the playoffs - that's on him.

A lot of our top 10 guys got plenty of run this season, and in March specifically, and didn't look great against good teams. Those same guys looked pretty awful last night. I'd argue that Wade's injury forcing Niang into the top 8, coupled with Strus missing his threes, have been the biggest problems so far.

I just don't see how playing CPJ and Merrill behind two small guards was ever going to work. Okoro is maybe half as effective defensively at SF as he is at guard. Every time Merrill plays Okoro gets bumped out to forward. All of their guards really got going when Merrill was on the floor last night. I'm just not buying that *preparation* solves for that problem.

Not how I'd characterize that, we went away from groups that were working and jbb exercised his quick hook to quickley undo what was working before the break.

TT's suspension and Mitchell's injury hurt, but that wasn't all of it. Jbb made little effort to see if TT could play when he came back, barely bothered with MM , and was never interested in giving Damian Jones a serious look. 7ft vet rim protector with a 3pt shot .... rotting on the bench while you complain non-stop about Niang.

Alright, turning this off.

jb sucks, Cavs need a new head coach.

Niang has been completely unplayable this series

JonFromVA wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:

JonFromVA wrote:There's a lot of adjustments that need to be made, but some of them are the same adjustments they were supposed to be working on all season so I don't have my hopes up.

Mosley plays a 10 man rotation and didn't stop just because his players were healthy or it's the playoffs. Bickerstaff prepared an 8 man rotation for the playoffs - that's on him.

A lot of our top 10 guys got plenty of run this season, and in March specifically, and didn't look great against good teams. Those same guys looked pretty awful last night. I'd argue that Wade's injury forcing Niang into the top 8, coupled with Strus missing his threes, have been the biggest problems so far.

I just don't see how playing CPJ and Merrill behind two small guards was ever going to work. Okoro is maybe half as effective defensively at SF as he is at guard. Every time Merrill plays Okoro gets bumped out to forward. All of their guards really got going when Merrill was on the floor last night. I'm just not buying that *preparation* solves for that problem.

Not how I'd characterize that, we went away from groups that were working and jbb exercised his quick hook to quickley undo what was working before the break.

TT's suspension and Mitchell's injury hurt, but that wasn't all of it. Jbb made little effort to see if TT could play when he came back, barely bothered with MM , and was never interested in giving Damian Jones a serious look. 7ft vet rim protector with a 3pt shot .... rotting on the bench while you complain non-stop about Niang.

You cited one (Wadeless) group that only played 41 minutes together that had TT in it.

The best analogy I can employ for our bench players is that they were basically mortgage-backed securities. When Wade was healthy, and TT had eaten his spinach, they looked good playing bad teams in the dog days of the middle of the season. Then the rates reset (level of competition), the defaults happened (injuries/suspension), and everything fell apart.

Issac and MO Wagner are just much better players than than Niang, TT, M. Morris, and D. Jones and it's not particularly close. We acquired 3 of those guys for nothing but league-minimum cap space for a reason. TT looked like he found the fountain of youth, after not playing at all the season before, because he actually took PEDs.

I like you. I respect you. That said, it feels like you're still pushing mortgage-back securities after the rates reset and the housing market crashed. The past data you're relying upon is not only irrelevant, it's actually misleading given the more recent data.

Now, I'm fine if we lose this series and JBB gets fired. Things can get bad enough, specifically in regards to Niang, that you revist a TT/Mobley frontcourt against MO and Issac. There's reason to think that might work better.

When Strus hit back to back threes, he should've challenged the call that resulted in the wave off. Then they should've kept feeding Strus regardless of how the challenge worked out. Allen sat for way too long in the 3rd quarter and the game got out of hand. More of an effort should've been made to get Mitchell and Garland good looks from 3 once the Magic started collapsing the paint.

There's lots to complain about, but our bench isn't good. I've seen enough and we're not talking about garbage time minutes here. These guys have gotten real run since February and the results have been bad. No amount of preparation is going to fix the talent/impact disparity of the guys 6-12 on the two rosters.

jbk1234 wrote:

JonFromVA wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:
A lot of our top 10 guys got plenty of run this season, and in March specifically, and didn't look great against good teams. Those same guys looked pretty awful last night. I'd argue that Wade's injury forcing Niang into the top 8, coupled with Strus missing his threes, have been the biggest problems so far.

I just don't see how playing CPJ and Merrill behind two small guards was ever going to work. Okoro is maybe half as effective defensively at SF as he is at guard. Every time Merrill plays Okoro gets bumped out to forward. All of their guards really got going when Merrill was on the floor last night. I'm just not buying that *preparation* solves for that problem.

Not how I'd characterize that, we went away from groups that were working and jbb exercised his quick hook to quickley undo what was working before the break.

TT's suspension and Mitchell's injury hurt, but that wasn't all of it. Jbb made little effort to see if TT could play when he came back, barely bothered with MM , and was never interested in giving Damian Jones a serious look. 7ft vet rim protector with a 3pt shot .... rotting on the bench while you complain non-stop about Niang.

You cited one (Wadeless) group that only played 41 minutes together that had TT in it.

The best analogy I can employ for our bench players is that they were basically mortgage-backed securities. When Wade was healthy, and TT had eaten his spinach, they looked good playing bad teams in the dog days of the middle of the season. Then the rates reset (level of competition), the defaults happened (injuries/suspension), and everything fell apart.

Issac and MO Wagner are just much better players than than Niang, TT, M. Morris, and D. Jones and it's not particularly close. We acquired 3 of those guys for nothing but league-minimum cap space for a reason. TT looked like he found the fountain of youth, after not playing at all the season before, because he actually took PEDs.

I like you. I respect you. That said, it feels like you're still pushing mortgage-back securities after the rates reset and the housing market crashed. The past data you're relying upon is not only irrelevant, it's actually misleading given the more recent data.

Now, I'm fine if we lose this series and JBB gets fired. Things can get bad enough, specifically in regards to Niang, that you revist a TT/Mobley frontcourt against MO and Issac. There's reason to think that might work better.

When Strus hit back to back threes, he should've challenged the call that resulted in the wave off. Then they should've kept feeding Strus regardless of how the challenge worked out. Allen sat for way too long in the 3rd quarter and the game got out of hand. More of an effort should've been made to get Mitchell and Garland good looks from 3 once the Magic started collapsing the paint.

There's lots to complain about, but our bench isn't good. I've seen enough and we're not talking about garbage time minutes here. These guys have gotten real run since February and the results have been bad. No amount of preparation is going to fix the talent/impact disparity of the guys 6-12 on the two rosters.

jb did challenge the 3 they didn't count.

He's still an absolutely terrible head coach though. He's showing it for the 3rd post season in a row. Like i predicted he would.

I wouldn't let him on the plane back to CLE.

jbk1234 wrote:

JonFromVA wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:
A lot of our top 10 guys got plenty of run this season, and in March specifically, and didn't look great against good teams. Those same guys looked pretty awful last night. I'd argue that Wade's injury forcing Niang into the top 8, coupled with Strus missing his threes, have been the biggest problems so far.

I just don't see how playing CPJ and Merrill behind two small guards was ever going to work. Okoro is maybe half as effective defensively at SF as he is at guard. Every time Merrill plays Okoro gets bumped out to forward. All of their guards really got going when Merrill was on the floor last night. I'm just not buying that *preparation* solves for that problem.

Not how I'd characterize that, we went away from groups that were working and jbb exercised his quick hook to quickley undo what was working before the break.

TT's suspension and Mitchell's injury hurt, but that wasn't all of it. Jbb made little effort to see if TT could play when he came back, barely bothered with MM , and was never interested in giving Damian Jones a serious look. 7ft vet rim protector with a 3pt shot .... rotting on the bench while you complain non-stop about Niang.

You cited one (Wadeless) group that only played 41 minutes together that had TT in it.

The best analogy I can employ for our bench players is that they were basically mortgage-backed securities. When Wade was healthy, and TT had eaten his spinach, they looked good playing bad teams in the dog days of the middle of the season. Then the rates reset (level of competition), the defaults happened (injuries/suspension), and everything fell apart.

Issac and MO Wagner are just much better players than than Niang, TT, M. Morris, and D. Jones and it's not particularly close. We acquired 3 of those guys for nothing but league-minimum cap space for a reason. TT looked like he found the fountain of youth, after not playing at all the season before, because he actually took PEDs.

I like you. I respect you. That said, it feels like you're still pushing mortgage-back securities after the rates reset and the housing market crashed. The past data you're relying upon is not only irrelevant, it's actually misleading given the more recent data.

Now, I'm fine if we lose this series and JBB gets fired. Things can get bad enough, specifically in regards to Niang, that you revist a TT/Mobley frontcourt against MO and Issac. There's reason to think that might work better.

When Strus hit back to back threes, he should've challenged the call that resulted in the wave off. Then they should've kept feeding Strus regardless of how the challenge worked out. Allen sat for way too long in the 3rd quarter and the game got out of hand. More of an effort should've been made to get Mitchell and Garland good looks from 3 once the Magic started collapsing the paint.

There's lots to complain about, but our bench isn't good. I've seen enough and we're not talking about garbage time minutes here. These guys have gotten real run since February and the results have been bad. No amount of preparation is going to fix the talent/impact disparity of the guys 6-12 on the two rosters.

Setup to fail by the coach, I pointed it out every step of the way.

He only discovered the "deepest bench in the league" because he had no choice due to injuries.

JonFromVA wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:

JonFromVA wrote:
Not how I'd characterize that, we went away from groups that were working and jbb exercised his quick hook to quickley undo what was working before the break.

TT's suspension and Mitchell's injury hurt, but that wasn't all of it. Jbb made little effort to see if TT could play when he came back, barely bothered with MM , and was never interested in giving Damian Jones a serious look. 7ft vet rim protector with a 3pt shot .... rotting on the bench while you complain non-stop about Niang.

You cited one (Wadeless) group that only played 41 minutes together that had TT in it.

The best analogy I can employ for our bench players is that they were basically mortgage-backed securities. When Wade was healthy, and TT had eaten his spinach, they looked good playing bad teams in the dog days of the middle of the season. Then the rates reset (level of competition), the defaults happened (injuries/suspension), and everything fell apart.

Issac and MO Wagner are just much better players than than Niang, TT, M. Morris, and D. Jones and it's not particularly close. We acquired 3 of those guys for nothing but league-minimum cap space for a reason. TT looked like he found the fountain of youth, after not playing at all the season before, because he actually took PEDs.

I like you. I respect you. That said, it feels like you're still pushing mortgage-back securities after the rates reset and the housing market crashed. The past data you're relying upon is not only irrelevant, it's actually misleading given the more recent data.

Now, I'm fine if we lose this series and JBB gets fired. Things can get bad enough, specifically in regards to Niang, that you revist a TT/Mobley frontcourt against MO and Issac. There's reason to think that might work better.

When Strus hit back to back threes, he should've challenged the call that resulted in the wave off. Then they should've kept feeding Strus regardless of how the challenge worked out. Allen sat for way too long in the 3rd quarter and the game got out of hand. More of an effort should've been made to get Mitchell and Garland good looks from 3 once the Magic started collapsing the paint.

There's lots to complain about, but our bench isn't good. I've seen enough and we're not talking about garbage time minutes here. These guys have gotten real run since February and the results have been bad. No amount of preparation is going to fix the talent/impact disparity of the guys 6-12 on the two rosters.

Setup to fail by the coach, I pointed it out every step of the way.

He only discovered the "deepest bench in the league" because he had no choice due to injuries.

And he had no choice again in March but the level of competition was much, much better, the scouting reports were in, and it quickly became apparent that the Cavs did not, in fact, have the deepest team in the league.

jbk1234 wrote:

JonFromVA wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:
You cited one (Wadeless) group that only played 41 minutes together that had TT in it.

The best analogy I can employ for our bench players is that they were basically mortgage-backed securities. When Wade was healthy, and TT had eaten his spinach, they looked good playing bad teams in the dog days of the middle of the season. Then the rates reset (level of competition), the defaults happened (injuries/suspension), and everything fell apart.

Issac and MO Wagner are just much better players than than Niang, TT, M. Morris, and D. Jones and it's not particularly close. We acquired 3 of those guys for nothing but league-minimum cap space for a reason. TT looked like he found the fountain of youth, after not playing at all the season before, because he actually took PEDs.

I like you. I respect you. That said, it feels like you're still pushing mortgage-back securities after the rates reset and the housing market crashed. The past data you're relying upon is not only irrelevant, it's actually misleading given the more recent data.

Now, I'm fine if we lose this series and JBB gets fired. Things can get bad enough, specifically in regards to Niang, that you revist a TT/Mobley frontcourt against MO and Issac. There's reason to think that might work better.

When Strus hit back to back threes, he should've challenged the call that resulted in the wave off. Then they should've kept feeding Strus regardless of how the challenge worked out. Allen sat for way too long in the 3rd quarter and the game got out of hand. More of an effort should've been made to get Mitchell and Garland good looks from 3 once the Magic started collapsing the paint.

There's lots to complain about, but our bench isn't good. I've seen enough and we're not talking about garbage time minutes here. These guys have gotten real run since February and the results have been bad. No amount of preparation is going to fix the talent/impact disparity of the guys 6-12 on the two rosters.

Setup to fail by the coach, I pointed it out every step of the way.

He only discovered the "deepest bench in the league" because he had no choice due to injuries.

And he had no choice again in March but the level of competition was much, much better, the scouting reports were in, and it quickly became apparent that the Cavs did not, in fact, have the deepest team in the league.

He had some choices, I even pointed them out at the time. He just isn't interested in developing a bench. Much better at setting them up for failure.

On the bright side guys, by turning the game off early when they were down like 40 again. I was able to make it to the horse track for the final race... A $9 W/P/S hit and paid out $87.30, I'll take it lol

ijspeelman wrote:Niang has been completely unplayable this series

He's playable, barely, against WCJ and Banchero, but Mobley and Niang against Mo and Issac are absolutely killing us.

At this point, you've got to try TT or D. Jones with Mobley and I'm pretty sure both of them will be out of the league next season.

jbk1234 wrote:At this point, you've got to try TT or D. Jones with Mobley and I'm pretty sure both of them will be out of the league next season.

Yep... I want to see Damian Jones. Cavs have the same problem they had last season: no frontcourt depth, or at least an unwillingness from JB to try any big man that isn't Evan or Jarrett. We essentially just swapped Robin Lopez for Damian Jones, and I imagine we will get decimated by Robinson and Hartenstein again. But this series also makes no sense, and kind of proves home-court still has value.

Cavs have had size issues stemming back to LeBron's final season: Crowder/Love was an absolutely hideous and small PF/C combo.

We will probably win this series cause of how critical homecourt has been; we match up better against Boston/Miami

cavs4872 wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:At this point, you've got to try TT or D. Jones with Mobley and I'm pretty sure both of them will be out of the league next season.

Yep... I want to see Damian Jones. Cavs have the same problem they had last season: no frontcourt depth, or at least an unwillingness from JB to try any big man that isn't Evan or Jarrett. We essentially just swapped Robin Lopez for Damian Jones, and I imagine we will get decimated by Robinson and Hartenstein again. But this series also makes no sense, and kind of proves home-court still has value.

Cavs have had size issues stemming back to LeBron's final season: Crowder/Love was an absolutely hideous and small PF/C combo.

We will probably win this series cause of how critical homecourt has been; we match up better against Boston/Miami

Once Orlando decided to bring Issac off the bench, Niang's floor time should've been severely limited.

cavs4872 wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:At this point, you've got to try TT or D. Jones with Mobley and I'm pretty sure both of them will be out of the league next season.

Yep... I want to see Damian Jones. Cavs have the same problem they had last season: no frontcourt depth, or at least an unwillingness from JB to try any big man that isn't Evan or Jarrett. We essentially just swapped Robin Lopez for Damian Jones, and I imagine we will get decimated by Robinson and Hartenstein again. But this series also makes no sense, and kind of proves home-court still has value.

Cavs have had size issues stemming back to LeBron's final season: Crowder/Love was an absolutely hideous and small PF/C combo.

We will probably win this series cause of how critical homecourt has been; we match up better against Boston/Miami

Koby just completely mismanaged the back part of the roster.

Spots below should probably belong to different players.

10. Merrill
11. TT
12. Morris
13. CPJ
14. Jones
15. TJ

Kind of moot because jb only plays an 8 man rotation from October until they get eliminated every season but still.

JujitsuFlip wrote:

cavs4872 wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:At this point, you've got to try TT or D. Jones with Mobley and I'm pretty sure both of them will be out of the league next season.

Yep... I want to see Damian Jones. Cavs have the same problem they had last season: no frontcourt depth, or at least an unwillingness from JB to try any big man that isn't Evan or Jarrett. We essentially just swapped Robin Lopez for Damian Jones, and I imagine we will get decimated by Robinson and Hartenstein again. But this series also makes no sense, and kind of proves home-court still has value.

Cavs have had size issues stemming back to LeBron's final season: Crowder/Love was an absolutely hideous and small PF/C combo.

We will probably win this series cause of how critical homecourt has been; we match up better against Boston/Miami

Koby just completely mismanaged the back part of the roster.

Spots below should probably belong to different players.

10. Merrill
11. TT
12. Morris
13. CPJ
14. Jones
15. TJ

Kind of moot because jb only plays an 8 man rotation from October until they get eliminated every season but still.

Its pretty hard to evaluate if those spots should have been given to different players as we have seen the team at full strength with these guys giving minutes in meaningful game (besides Merrill and probably TT).

I do want to see JB switch it up, but am worried about it blowing up in their face. Game 5 is must win so we have to find a way to win

ijspeelman wrote:

JujitsuFlip wrote:

cavs4872 wrote:Yep... I want to see Damian Jones. Cavs have the same problem they had last season: no frontcourt depth, or at least an unwillingness from JB to try any big man that isn't Evan or Jarrett. We essentially just swapped Robin Lopez for Damian Jones, and I imagine we will get decimated by Robinson and Hartenstein again. But this series also makes no sense, and kind of proves home-court still has value.

Cavs have had size issues stemming back to LeBron's final season: Crowder/Love was an absolutely hideous and small PF/C combo.

We will probably win this series cause of how critical homecourt has been; we match up better against Boston/Miami

Koby just completely mismanaged the back part of the roster.

Spots below should probably belong to different players.

10. Merrill
11. TT
12. Morris
13. CPJ
14. Jones
15. TJ

Kind of moot because jb only plays an 8 man rotation from October until they get eliminated every season but still.

Its pretty hard to evaluate if those spots should have been given to different players as we have seen the team at full strength with these guys giving minutes in meaningful game (besides Merrill and probably TT).

I do want to see JB switch it up, but am worried about it blowing up in their face. Game 5 is must win so we have to find a way to win

Mobley/Niang shouldn't see the floor again against Mo/Issac.

ijspeelman wrote:

JujitsuFlip wrote:

cavs4872 wrote:Yep... I want to see Damian Jones. Cavs have the same problem they had last season: no frontcourt depth, or at least an unwillingness from JB to try any big man that isn't Evan or Jarrett. We essentially just swapped Robin Lopez for Damian Jones, and I imagine we will get decimated by Robinson and Hartenstein again. But this series also makes no sense, and kind of proves home-court still has value.

Cavs have had size issues stemming back to LeBron's final season: Crowder/Love was an absolutely hideous and small PF/C combo.

We will probably win this series cause of how critical homecourt has been; we match up better against Boston/Miami

Koby just completely mismanaged the back part of the roster.

Spots below should probably belong to different players.

10. Merrill
11. TT
12. Morris
13. CPJ
14. Jones
15. TJ

Kind of moot because jb only plays an 8 man rotation from October until they get eliminated every season but still.

Its pretty hard to evaluate if those spots should have been given to different players as we have seen the team at full strength with these guys giving minutes in meaningful game (besides Merrill and probably TT).

I do want to see JB switch it up, but am worried about it blowing up in their face. Game 5 is must win so we have to find a way to win

After back to back blowouts, whatever the Cavs are doing isn't working.

Idc if the dude brought one of the core 4 off the bench if it meant a game 5 win. I'm not advocating for that or think it would work in this seires. I'm just saying some big changes need to happen for Tuesday.

They can't just come out with the same rotation and scheme.

Some awful scheduling by the NBA. They have 3 Eastern conference game 5s on the same night. Not sure who they're gonna make the late game, maybe the Bucks. I assume the Cavs are on NBA TV. Long as it's not a 530 tip, idc.

Edit: it has been announced 8pm on NBATV.

Bickerstaff can try some sort of hail mary, albeit I don't know if they can even play someone like Wade, Jerome, of Porter Jr if they weren't activated for the series. It's just that per usual he hasn't prepared a contingency and now has little time to practice one.

His easiest tweak would be the one he's held back on so far - which is to ramp up the minutes on his starters. The training staff might kill him, but what does he got to lose?

JonFromVA wrote:Bickerstaff can try some sort of hail mary, albeit I don't know if they can even play someone like Wade, Jerome, of Porter Jr if they weren't activated for the series. It's just that per usual he hasn't prepared a contingency and now has little time to practice one.

His easiest tweak would be the one he's held back on so far - which is to ramp up the minutes on his starters. The training staff might kill him, but what does he got to lose?

That was my thing, dude runs his guys into the ground all season but now in a series with adequate rest, he's trying to pull the reigns back. I get it, he's playing another deep team in the 1st round again but go with your 6 man rotation, you know you want to. After 2 blowouts ya freaking know ya need to.

I'm expecting no changes, Don is still insisting he's 100% healthy and he can do whatever he wants on the floor because he's figured out how to deal with the pain. Interesting... Darius says everyone is telling him he has to shoot more. Cool? Would help if they go in, though. They plan to feed off the energy of the crowd, because I don't know, it's hard to find energy or something, otherwise?

The series is 2-2, the Cavs still have home court.

Everything is going to plan.

Most teams would think this, and some of them would even be right.