Chicago Cubs (55-73) @ Toronto Blue Jays (68-58) - August 29-31

[SharoneWright]

I haven't played a game of organized baseball in 20+ years, and even I could bunt better than Espinal showed there. It's simple physics - you want the ball to go left, tilt the bat head out. You want it go to the first - which you don't in that situation - then you tilt the head back, which Espy did.

I know bunting is a lost art, but surely these pro baseball players have to at least know that much. And surely they at least bunt in spring training, if not once in a blue moon during the season. This is peewee level stuff. Just brutal. They have to be better than that.

I am right there with you in terms of recent baseball action… But it’s even more simple. Look again. Stick your head in there. Stay in there. He pulled his body back. Cardinal Sin #1.

[vaff87]

Am I the only one who noticed that Chapman didnt touch 3rd base when rounding it? Oh well, that's why you don't waste a challenge when it was obvious and your player knew he was out.

I don’t know for sure, but I think he touched the inside of the bag.

[SharoneWright]

I guess Gausman will have to pitch 9 innings tomorrow.

(Credit to the pen tonight though.)

[johanliebert]

Jays win ya negative nancies

[Parataxis]

Goddam it, Chapman is a really good baseball player.

We need to start getting hits with RISP again. Seems pretty important in terms of scoring.

[SharoneWright]

Goddam it, Chapman is a really good baseball player.

We need to start getting hits with RISP again. Seems pretty important in terms of scoring.

Now that Groshans flamed out and is traded... maybe management needs to begin considering an extension.

(Wasn't my initial vision. Was hoping for cheaper sustainable talent to backfill after using Chapman for a couple years,, but he now seems like a more important bird in the hand...)

[vaff87]

Goddam it, Chapman is a really good baseball player.

We need to start getting hits with RISP again. Seems pretty important in terms of scoring.

Now that Groshans flamed out and is traded... maybe management needs to begin considering an extension.

(Wasn't my initial vision. Was hoping for cheaper sustainable talent to backfill while using Chapman for a couple years,, but he now seems like a more important bird in the hand...)

Groshans is actually doing really well since the trade.

The other thing is Orelvis Martinez has taken a step back this season. Power is there, but the contact ability is very concerning.

[SharoneWright]

Montoyo would obviously rest Jansen tomorrow... what will Schneider doooo!?!?

[Kinger95]

Been listening to the games on the radio so it’s hard to visualize bo’s good plays when the errors stand out so much more and maybe he has had some terrific defensive gems but I had to look up his defense on fangraphs to see where they rank him defensively. 14th is pretty much as close as you can get to middle of the pack. Just wondering if anyone else thinks he’s more valuable to the team at 2nd if the bad throws and errors continue

[polo007]

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[SharoneWright]

Let's all remember, heart doesn't measure height!!! Gausman >>>>

Jays gonna kick butt tomorrow. Time to bring the ego down to a corresponding size!!

[vaff87]

Been listening to the games on the radio so it’s hard to visualize bo’s good plays when the errors stand out so much more and maybe he has had some terrific defensive gems but I had to look up his defense on fangraphs to see where they rank him defensively. 14th is pretty much as close as you can get to middle of the pack. Just wondering if anyone else thinks he’s more valuable to the team at 2nd if the bad throws and errors continue

Maybe after this season. Because right now Espinal has kinda turned back into a platoon player. So Bo would be shifting back and forth between SS and 2B depending on if Espinal is in the line up.

It seems Bo is a “streaky” defender. I remember earlier in the season his OAA on baseball savant was pretty good. But now he’s down in the 21st percentile.

[Schad]

Been listening to the games on the radio so it’s hard to visualize bo’s good plays when the errors stand out so much more and maybe he has had some terrific defensive gems but I had to look up his defense on fangraphs to see where they rank him defensively. 14th is pretty much as close as you can get to middle of the pack. Just wondering if anyone else thinks he’s more valuable to the team at 2nd if the bad throws and errors continue

It depends on who is replacing him. There's a general belief here that Espinal is a much superior shortstop, and that might be true. We also basically have no evidence to work from; Espinal has very little history of actually playing shortstop in high-level competition. He has played 206 innings there as a major leaguer (so, like, 20ish games), and he played it sparingly in the upper minors as well (about 10 games worth of SS in AAA, about 30 games worth in AA).

Prior to this season, while basically all of the defensive metrics disagreed on individual seasons, Bichette rated anywhere from slightly below average (OAA and UZR) to slightly above average (DRS) as a shortstop. This year, he grades out badly.

The question then becomes: which is more likely, that Espinal is a well above-average defensive shortstop, or that Bichette rebounds to his 2019-2021 defensive performance? If we had enough data to suggest that Espi was a really good defensive SS, you'd probably lean that way. But that also means playing Espinal full-time, and Espinal has an OPS of .574 over the past two and a half months, so shoehorning him into the lineup nightly only to find out that he's not really all that good at SS would be a major net negative.

[SharoneWright]

OR,, we could convince another team that Bo remains an ELITE asset!! That opinion still has currency. It’s going to take some serious assessment and bitter pill swallowing…

BUT could return a juicy haul, when we retain Espinal, Biggio, Orelvis, and others to handle the middle of the diamond. This tack also but ensures a less risky and perhaps more sensible extension of Chapman.

[Schad]

Orelvis is never going to be a middle of the diamond player in the majors. He's almost certainly a 3B (and given that he's hitting below .200, it's up in the air whether he even makes it). Biggio's a solid platoon 2B but that's about it.

I'm also pretty leery about giving Chapman a large extension. High-K players tend to age really, really poorly. Chapman probably commands a contract from age 31-35 or thereabouts, and a lot of that contract could be iffy.

[GoRapstheoriginal]

JAYS WIN JAYS WIN! WOOHOO! HOORAY! ! ! !

[SharoneWright]

Orelvis is never going to be a middle of the diamond player in the majors. He's almost certainly a 3B (and given that he's hitting below .200, it's up in the air whether he even makes it). Biggio's a solid platoon 2B but that's about it.

I'm also pretty leery about giving Chapman a large extension. High-K players tend to age really, really poorly. Chapman probably commands a contract from age 31-35 or thereabouts, and a lot of that contract could be iffy.

A "sensible" contract to Chapman implies something reasonable. A known commodity for way fewer dollars and way less risk. Not blindly opening the purse strings for anything too "large".

Just a safer bet than an exorbitant wish and prayer gamble on long hair at SS.

1. Speculating about what we could get in return for Bo.

2. Safeguarding the team against a massive financial blunder.

3. Also, Chapman becomes a valuable asset if his contract is done well... on a smaller scale of course. Could even be traded. I'd be thrilled if Orelvis becomes anything plus on the left side at either spot and it seems you do too. So why not sign Chappy? (now that the Groshans plan is null and void). Our options have shrunk. And will shrink more if you commit all those dolla bills to BoBi.

[Asianiac_24]

OR,, we could convince another team that Bo remains an ELITE asset!! That opinion still has currency. It’s going to take some serious assessment and bitter pill swallowing…

BUT could return a juicy haul, when we retain Espinal, Biggio, Orelvis, and others to handle the middle of the diamond. This tack also but ensures a less risky and perhaps more sensible extension of Chapman.

I’m all for trading Bo as well if he is still considered an elite asset. If I want to throw 20-25mil at a player, I’d much rather throw that to a number of players on this team than Bo (namely, Teoscar/Kirk/Gurriel)

[Schad]

Chapman, past two years: 7.5 fWAR.

Bichette, past two years: 7.6 fWAR.

Bichette's also five years younger, and two years further from free agency.

And what Chapman will sign for will be reasonable in the context of what other players such as him sign for. If he has a good 2023, it'll likely be somewhere in the range of 5 years/$140m to 7 years/$200m, based on what the likes of Castellanos, Bryant and Semien signed for this past offseason.

Bichette's having a down season. He's also still a very valuable player (his 2021 was the best statistical season of any Jays shortstop in our history), at a position for which we have only the struggling Espinal to replace him, no prospects of any real note above A ball expected to remain there, and which is notoriously difficult to fill in free agency or trade. Trading him only to open up a gaping hole that we have no easy means to fill just doesn't strike me as sound asset management.

[Parataxis]

Been listening to the games on the radio so it’s hard to visualize bo’s good plays when the errors stand out so much more and maybe he has had some terrific defensive gems but I had to look up his defense on fangraphs to see where they rank him defensively. 14th is pretty much as close as you can get to middle of the pack. Just wondering if anyone else thinks he’s more valuable to the team at 2nd if the bad throws and errors continue

The thing that really stands out to me this season, is that I so rarely see Bo dive for the ball. Lots of run and misses, some run and catches, but even when it's bouncing into the shallow outfield (and the CF/LF is handling it) I don't often see him put his body on the ground to try to catch it or keep it in the infield.

Not sure if that's something that the coaches are telling him, or if there's something else, but it's really stood out to me.