Don Mattingly Hired as Bench Coach

[Fairview4Life]

I stopped a while ago, just responding to people. If you dont like it, dont read it. But you are really misinformed if you dont think leaving Guasman was the feel play lol. That's a new one.

I am also just responding to people, funny how that works. Bringing in Mayza was entirely a feel call. It is evidenced by the fact that it was the literal worst statistical decision Schneider could have made in that spot. But you know that and just can't accept being wrong.

It entirely wasn't and you know leaving Guasman in was the feel call, you just cant admit you are wrong.

Ah but it was, you see. Since leaving Gausman in was statistically, some would say "using analytics" the much better choice and bringing in Mayza was clearly done because Schneider decided he needed to just do something. So one choice would have been significantly better statistically, and one much worse. You have decided the much worse decision was made due to analytics, which is complete nonsense.

[WuTang_OG]

I am also just responding to people, funny how that works. Bringing in Mayza was entirely a feel call. It is evidenced by the fact that it was the literal worst statistical decision Schneider could have made in that spot. But you know that and just can't accept being wrong.

It entirely wasn't and you know leaving Guasman in was the feel call, you just cant admit you are wrong.

Ah but it was, you see. Since leaving Gausman in was statistically, some would say "using analytics" the much better choice and bringing in Mayza was clearly done because Schneider decided he needed to just do something. So one choice would have been significantly better statistically, and one much worse. You have decided the much worse decision was made due to analytics, which is complete nonsense.

But most would say leaving him in that situation after grinding 2 outs and having a great game, would be the feel approach to let him ride it out for 1 last one rather than knee jerking and going to his bullpen. And if you can't comprehend that, then you really don't understand baseball lol.

[Schad]

But most would say leaving him in that situation after grinding 2 outs and having a great game, would be the feel approach to let him ride it out for 1 last one rather than knee jerking and going to his bullpen. And if you can't comprehend that, then you really don't understand baseball lol.

Why would most say that? Is it because you, in hindsight, say it, and assume that means that everyone would say it?

Also, how can 'knee jerking and going to his bullpen' be based on analytics? Robots don't have knees to jerk!

[Fairview4Life]

It entirely wasn't and you know leaving Guasman in was the feel call, you just cant admit you are wrong.

Ah but it was, you see. Since leaving Gausman in was statistically, some would say "using analytics" the much better choice and bringing in Mayza was clearly done because Schneider decided he needed to just do something. So one choice would have been significantly better statistically, and one much worse. You have decided the much worse decision was made due to analytics, which is complete nonsense.

But most would say leaving him in that situation after grinding 2 outs and having a great game, would be the feel approach to let him ride it out for 1 last one rather than knee jerking and going to his bullpen. And if you can't comprehend that, then you really don't understand baseball lol.

But most have disagreed with you about that. In fact, only one person has agreed with you.

You don't seem to know anything about analytics, or decision making, or even that specific moment in that baseball game. Yet you keep digging.

[SharoneWright]

Hearing Toronto is Mattingly's "dream job".

Take that NYY!!

[WuTang_OG]

But most would say leaving him in that situation after grinding 2 outs and having a great game, would be the feel approach to let him ride it out for 1 last one rather than knee jerking and going to his bullpen. And if you can't comprehend that, then you really don't understand baseball lol.

Why would most say that? Is it because you, in hindsight, say it, and assume that means that everyone would say it?

Also, how can 'knee jerking and going to his bullpen' be based on analytics? Robots don't have knees to jerk!

Well it wasn't even would, they did, since most media members layed it out that way. That isn't left field thinking, it's a pretty common thinking in that situation.

[Schad]

Well it wasn't even would, they did, since most media members layed it out that way. That isn't left field thinking, it's a pretty common thinking in that situation.

Most media members laid it out as a decision driven by the numbers? Can you point me to those media members?

[WuTang_OG]

Ah but it was, you see. Since leaving Gausman in was statistically, some would say "using analytics" the much better choice and bringing in Mayza was clearly done because Schneider decided he needed to just do something. So one choice would have been significantly better statistically, and one much worse. You have decided the much worse decision was made due to analytics, which is complete nonsense.

But most would say leaving him in that situation after grinding 2 outs and having a great game, would be the feel approach to let him ride it out for 1 last one rather than knee jerking and going to his bullpen. And if you can't comprehend that, then you really don't understand baseball lol.

But most have disagreed with you about that. In fact, only one person has agreed with you.

You don't seem to know anything about analytics, or decision making, or even that specific moment in that baseball game. Yet you keep digging.

Here's where you are confused Jim - you are now saying leaving guasman in was analytical and not feel when that is entirely not true and everything would point away from that, when majority of this thread was debating bringing Mayza in was analytical or feel, which you know where I stand. Two different things.

[WuTang_OG]

Well it wasn't even would, they did, since most media members layed it out that way. That isn't left field thinking, it's a pretty common thinking in that situation.

Most media members laid it out as a decision driven by the numbers? Can you point me to those media members?

No, you're confused. Most media members critiqued John's decision of not going with the 'feel' decision of the game in that moment and leaving your starter in.

[Fairview4Life]

But most would say leaving him in that situation after grinding 2 outs and having a great game, would be the feel approach to let him ride it out for 1 last one rather than knee jerking and going to his bullpen. And if you can't comprehend that, then you really don't understand baseball lol.

But most have disagreed with you about that. In fact, only one person has agreed with you.

You don't seem to know anything about analytics, or decision making, or even that specific moment in that baseball game. Yet you keep digging.

Here's where you are confused Jim - you are now saying leaving guasman in was analytical and not feel when that is entirely not true and everything would point away from that, when majority of this thread was debating bringing Mayza in was analytical or feel, which you know where I stand. Two different things.

And here's where you are confused: it was statistically much smarter to leave Gausman in the game. There is literally nothing "analytical" that would lead someone to make the decision to replace Gausman with Mayza in that situation. No statistics support that decision. At all. You can't come up with any, because they don't exist. Analytics would tell you to leave him in over bringing in Tim Mayza to face Santana.

But Mayza had been warming up because the Jays were cruising and up big and Schneider wanted to save his better bullpen options for the next game. The bases were loaded, he felt like he had to do something, and he chose to do the literal worst thing he could have done analytically. You have now decided that means he made a decision based on analytics. That is complete nonsense and it is seemingly where you have gotten incredibly confused.

Bringing in a relief pitcher is not a de facto analytics decision, unless every single decision in baseball is classified as an analytics decision.

[WuTang_OG]

But most have disagreed with you about that. In fact, only one person has agreed with you.

You don't seem to know anything about analytics, or decision making, or even that specific moment in that baseball game. Yet you keep digging.

Here's where you are confused Jim - you are now saying leaving guasman in was analytical and not feel when that is entirely not true and everything would point away from that, when majority of this thread was debating bringing Mayza in was analytical or feel, which you know where I stand. Two different things.

And here's where you are confused: it was statistically much smarter to leave Gausman in the game. There is literally nothing "analytical" that would lead someone to make the decision to replace Gausman with Mayza in that situation. No statistics support that decision. At all. You can't come up with any, because they don't exist. Analytics would tell you to leave him in over bringing in Tim Mayza to face Santana.

But Mayza had been warming up because the Jays were cruising and up big and Schneider wanted to save his better bullpen options for the next game. The bases were loaded, he felt like he had to do something, and he chose to do the literal worst thing he could have done analytically. You have now decided that means he made a decision base don analytics. That is complete nonsense and it is seemingly where you have gotten incredibly confused.

So at least now we are getting somewhere and you can understand how leaving Guasman in was the 'feel' move, entirely seperate from choosing Mayza, that's #1. You just said not everything is anaylytical. If you watched enough baseball, and for that situation, you can understand how leaving him in and stretching him for 1 more out and trusting your dominant starter who was having a great game was more feel that anything.

[Schad]

Well it wasn't even would, they did, since most media members layed it out that way. That isn't left field thinking, it's a pretty common thinking in that situation.

Most media members laid it out as a decision driven by the numbers? Can you point me to those media members?

No, you're confused. Most media members critiqued John's decision of not going with the 'feel' decision of the game in that moment and leaving your starter in.

Ah, I must have missed most of the media saying that Schneider failed to feel. Please link a handful of those comments.

[Fairview4Life]

So at least now we are getting somewhere and you can understand how leaving Guasman in was the 'feel' move, entirely seperate from choosing Mayza, that's #1. You just said not everything is anaylytical. If you watched enough baseball, and for that situation, you can understand how leaving him in and stretching him for 1 more out and trusting your dominant starter who was having a great game was more feel that anything.

Lol, what are you even babbling about at this point? Are the analytics in the room with you right now?

[WuTang_OG]

So at least now we are getting somewhere and you can understand how leaving Guasman in was the 'feel' move, entirely seperate from choosing Mayza, that's #1. You just said not everything is anaylytical. If you watched enough baseball, and for that situation, you can understand how leaving him in and stretching him for 1 more out and trusting your dominant starter who was having a great game was more feel that anything.

Lol, what are you even babbling about at this point? Are the analytics in the room with you right now?

Lol you're the one spinning your wheels on this, I just had to explain the difference on that point.

[SharoneWright]

OBSTINATE
adjective
1. firmly or stubbornly adhering to one's purpose, opinion, etc.; not yielding to argument, persuasion, or entreaty.
2. characterized by inflexible persistence or an unyielding attitude.

[Fairview4Life]

So at least now we are getting somewhere and you can understand how leaving Guasman in was the 'feel' move, entirely seperate from choosing Mayza, that's #1. You just said not everything is anaylytical. If you watched enough baseball, and for that situation, you can understand how leaving him in and stretching him for 1 more out and trusting your dominant starter who was having a great game was more feel that anything.

Lol, what are you even babbling about at this point? Are the analytics in the room with you right now?

Lol you're the one spinning your wheels on this, I just had to explain the difference on that point.

Show us on the doll where the analytics touched you.

[WuTang_OG]

Lol, what are you even babbling about at this point? Are the analytics in the room with you right now?

Lol you're the one spinning your wheels on this, I just had to explain the difference on that point.

Show us on the doll where the analytics touched you.

meet me in person, il show you exactly

[Fairview4Life]

Lol you're the one spinning your wheels on this, I just had to explain the difference on that point.

Show us on the doll where the analytics touched you.

meet me in person, il show you exactly

No, I'm pretty far from Temeculah.

[Aimless Outlook]

I think I've figured it out. You think everyone "Feels" the same, so because you feel that Gausman was the better choice over Mayza (which he was by all statistical measures), you've now associated that as the Feel choice.

And since you felt that Mayza was the bad choice, you've convinced yourself that this could no longer be a "Feel" choice for anyone else, so therefor it is the "Analytical" choice. I mean, it must be, because you feel that it's bad.

The whole point of "Feel" is that people can choose statistically good or statistically bad options at any moment. Their lack of understanding of the statistical data, or their lack of confidence in the data compared to their gut feel, recency bias, or any other emotional influence, can lead them to make their decision.

I actually think "Gut Feel" today compared to 20+ years ago looks very different. The concept of Analytics wasn't in a manager's mind in the 90's, they only trusted tradition and their gut. Managers today have a new "gut feel" based on their understanding of today's analytics. Their gut tells them to replace a starting pitcher early - like in the 3rd time through the order scenario you suggested - because of generalized stats across all scenarios throughout the whole league might say this is a statistically better option. However, the statistics for the actual scenario, and the actual players involved, says otherwise.

The definition of an analytics move is a decision made because of a higher statistical probability of creating a positive impact compared to other moves or non-moves.

Until you can show a statistic for this scenario presented that says a change to Tim Mayza would have a higher likelihood of a better outcome than leaving Gausman in, you cannot claim it as an Analytics move. It is the definition of a Feel move, because the stats that have been presented all say the probability it would create a better outcome is worse than leaving in Gausman or going with an actually good reliever for that scenario.

[s e n s i]

one of the hilarious threads in this board's history. we don't get too many of these howlers.