What does full potential Kuminga look like?

[clyde21]

So for OG we needed to add multiple firsts on top of JK. I think we had a deal for JK and Caruso straight up this year. So those are examples of where the league is valuing JK. Do you think Mobley has the same value as that?

and OG ended up getting traded for RJ Barrett (on a huge contract), Quickley, and a 2nd rounder.

Ok so og didn’t have a lot of value. And we supposedly had to add more value on top of jk? Meaning jk wasn’t highly valued.

the stupidity of the Raptors is not my concern, guarantee you they would take Kuminga for RJ/Quickley today and every day.

[Onus]

Kuminga is only a year older than several top 10 projected picks THIS year btw, he's 21, Reed Sheppard is 20, Jared McCain is 20, Donovan Clingan is 20

and is already averaging 22/7/3 per 36 in the league and is entering his fourth year, and is one of the best physical specimens in the NBA.

put Kuminga in this class and he's going #1 overall

it's so weird seeing this board overrate guys like Jordan Poole for years but refuse to understand Kuminga's true value on the open market. guarantee you teams would be lining up to get Kuminga and I would only trade him if we get a blue chipper back like Mobley.

This is a bad draft class. I’m sure every team would love to trade this pick for something else. The warriors value jk as a blue chipper, not sure the rest of the league does as the reported trades for jk aren’t very high and which we’ve declined.

[Onus]

and OG ended up getting traded for RJ Barrett (on a huge contract), Quickley, and a 2nd rounder.

Ok so og didn’t have a lot of value. And we supposedly had to add more value on top of jk? Meaning jk wasn’t highly valued.

the stupidity of the Raptors is not my concern, guarantee you they would take Kuminga for RJ/Quickley today and every day.

But the stupidity of the league is your concern if you’re trying to trade jk as a blue chipper as it’s their valuations that matter, not yours.

[HiRez]

I'm a big fan of Kuminga and think he's come along pretty nicely after a rocky start, and believe he has not nearly reached his peak, but if there's some way to get Mobley for him, even sending extra assets, I'd do it. Hell, I'd even do Kuminga + Moody for Mobley since Kerr isn't playing him anyway (of course, would Kerr even play Mobley? who knows.) Mobley doesn't solve all their problems but he solves some of their biggest ones: size, youth, and versatility at the C spot [edit: and rim protection]. Dude is even shooting 37% from 3 this year, albeit on low volume. If he develops that shot a bit more, Kerr would definitely be inclined to play the hell out of him. If they could keep TJD that makes it easier to let Looney go in another trade, then they're set at C for the next decade+.

Does Cleveland want to get rid of Mobley for some reason though? I know they have Jarrett Allen and there's some overlap there, but I would be surprised if they gave up on Mobley like that.

[Onus]

I'm a big fan of Kuminga and think he's come along pretty nicely after a rocky start, and believe he has not nearly reached his peak, but if there's some way to get Mobley for him, even sending extra assets, I'd do it. Hell, I'd even do Kuminga + Moody for Mobley since Kerr isn't playing him anyway (of course, would Kerr even play Mobley? who knows.) Mobley doesn't solve all their problems but he solves some of their biggest ones: size, youth, and versatility at the C spot. Dude is even shooting 37% from 3 this year, albeit on low volume. If he develops that shot a bit more, Kerr would definitely be inclined to play the hell out of him. If they could keep TJD that makes it easier to let Looney go in another trade, then they're set at C for the next decade+.

Does Cleveland want to get rid of Mobley for some reason though? I know they have Jarrett Allen and there's some overlap there, but I would be surprised if they gave up on Mobley like that.

I believe the Cavs thinking is that they play better with a single big, Mobley in theory should have more value so they want to trade him to keep Mitchell. But if Mitchell is gone there's no way they trade Mobley and most likely Allen would be the one traded. Then they just start over with young guys in Garland and Mobley.

It's highly unlikely since I think Mitchell leaves anyway.

[clyde21]

Ok so og didn’t have a lot of value. And we supposedly had to add more value on top of jk? Meaning jk wasn’t highly valued.

the stupidity of the Raptors is not my concern, guarantee you they would take Kuminga for RJ/Quickley today and every day.

But the stupidity of the league is your concern if you’re trying to trade jk as a blue chipper as it’s their valuations that matter, not yours.

how do you know the league doesn't view JK as a blue chipper other than an unsubstantiated report that may or may not have happened with a single team

[clyde21]

I'm a big fan of Kuminga and think he's come along pretty nicely after a rocky start, and believe he has not nearly reached his peak, but if there's some way to get Mobley for him, even sending extra assets, I'd do it. Hell, I'd even do Kuminga + Moody for Mobley since Kerr isn't playing him anyway (of course, would Kerr even play Mobley? who knows.) Mobley doesn't solve all their problems but he solves some of their biggest ones: size, youth, and versatility at the C spot. Dude is even shooting 37% from 3 this year, albeit on low volume. If he develops that shot a bit more, Kerr would definitely be inclined to play the hell out of him. If they could keep TJD that makes it easier to let Looney go in another trade, then they're set at C for the next decade+.

Does Cleveland want to get rid of Mobley for some reason though? I know they have Jarrett Allen and there's some overlap there, but I would be surprised if they gave up on Mobley like that.

the idea is that the Cavs have a huge hole at the pivot, and Mobley/Allen are not a great fit next to each other, JK is from the same draft class so no change in time line or rookie scale issues, and fits their need next to DG/Mitchell at the 3 perfectly.

maybe they take it, maybe the don't, but i don't think it's that crazy of a deal.

[Onus]

the stupidity of the Raptors is not my concern, guarantee you they would take Kuminga for RJ/Quickley today and every day.

But the stupidity of the league is your concern if you’re trying to trade jk as a blue chipper as it’s their valuations that matter, not yours.

how do you know the league doesn't view JK as a blue chipper other than an unsubstantiated report that may or may not have happened with a single team

based on the foundational trade offers for him from 2 separate teams. We may not know the full details of the trade but we know who we were trying to get OG and Caruso. Those teams asked for JK and we declined. Those teams asked which means they felt like they could build a trade around JK for either.

[vvoland]

But the stupidity of the league is your concern if you’re trying to trade jk as a blue chipper as it’s their valuations that matter, not yours.

how do you know the league doesn't view JK as a blue chipper other than an unsubstantiated report that may or may not have happened with a single team

based on the foundational trade offers for him from 2 separate teams. We may not know the full details of the trade but we know who we were trying to get OG and Caruso. Those teams asked for JK and we declined. Those teams asked which means they felt like they could build a trade around JK for either.

This is where you went wrong. No idea what was discussed and if they asked for JK, doesn't mean they or the league values JK at that level. Unlike, for example, wiggins who we were clearly shopping at the deadline and the prevailing sentiment was "he's a negative or, at best, neutral contract" and the warriors aren't getting anything useful for him. But even that inference hinges on the assumption that the people reporting that at least talked to the dubs FO and weren't making stuff up (not guaranteed).

What we do 'know,' in theory, is that the warriors turned down caruso and og trades centered around JK. We don't know if there were picks involved, the matching money going out, any of that. The only thing we can infer is that the dubs value(d) JK more than either of those players but even that hinges on the assumptions there wasn't anything else of value in those trades and/or we weren't getting anything of value back other than OG or Caruso.

The Siakam trade was a bigger possibility but, if I recall correctly, that fell through once we established that he didn't want to resign here and/or we didn't' want to give him all the money he wanted. In both cases, I'm very curious to see what the pacers and knicks offer pascal and OG.

[clyde21]

But the stupidity of the league is your concern if you’re trying to trade jk as a blue chipper as it’s their valuations that matter, not yours.

how do you know the league doesn't view JK as a blue chipper other than an unsubstantiated report that may or may not have happened with a single team

based on the foundational trade offers for him from 2 separate teams. We may not know the full details of the trade but we know who we were trying to get OG and Caruso. Those teams asked for JK and we declined. Those teams asked which means they felt like they could build a trade around JK for either.

lol?

[Crazy-Canuck]

In no universe does jk get you Mobley straight up.

[Onus]

how do you know the league doesn't view JK as a blue chipper other than an unsubstantiated report that may or may not have happened with a single team

based on the foundational trade offers for him from 2 separate teams. We may not know the full details of the trade but we know who we were trying to get OG and Caruso. Those teams asked for JK and we declined. Those teams asked which means they felt like they could build a trade around JK for either.

This is where you went wrong. No idea what was discussed and if they asked for JK, doesn't mean they or the league values JK at that level. Unlike, for example, wiggins who we were clearly shopping at the deadline and the prevailing sentiment was "he's a negative or, at best, neutral contract" and the warriors aren't getting anything useful for him. But even that inference hinges on the assumption that the people reporting that at least talked to the dubs FO and weren't making stuff up (not guaranteed).

What we do 'know,' in theory, is that the warriors turned down caruso and og trades centered around JK. We don't know if there were picks involved, the matching money going out, any of that. The only thing we can infer is that the dubs value(d) JK more than either of those players but even that hinges on the assumptions there wasn't anything else of value in those trades and/or we weren't getting anything of value back other than OG or Caruso.

The Siakam trade was a bigger possibility but, if I recall correctly, that fell through once we established that he didn't want to resign here and/or we didn't' want to give him all the money he wanted. In both cases, I'm very curious to see what the pacers and knicks offer pascal and OG.

So you agree the foundation of the discussion was based on og/caruso for jk.

Also you believe the Wiggins rumors but not the jk rumors. Talk about bias.

Thank god we didn’t go with pascal. That dude is a fraud.

[clyde21]

that notion that a rando **** trade proposal means the market for JK has been made is ridiculous

[Nvnervous45]

Fp: Kahlil leonard
Floor: Jamaal mashburn

[vvoland]

based on the foundational trade offers for him from 2 separate teams. We may not know the full details of the trade but we know who we were trying to get OG and Caruso. Those teams asked for JK and we declined. Those teams asked which means they felt like they could build a trade around JK for either.

This is where you went wrong. No idea what was discussed and if they asked for JK, doesn't mean they or the league values JK at that level. Unlike, for example, wiggins who we were clearly shopping at the deadline and the prevailing sentiment was "he's a negative or, at best, neutral contract" and the warriors aren't getting anything useful for him. But even that inference hinges on the assumption that the people reporting that at least talked to the dubs FO and weren't making stuff up (not guaranteed).

What we do 'know,' in theory, is that the warriors turned down caruso and og trades centered around JK. We don't know if there were picks involved, the matching money going out, any of that. The only thing we can infer is that the dubs value(d) JK more than either of those players but even that hinges on the assumptions there wasn't anything else of value in those trades and/or we weren't getting anything of value back other than OG or Caruso.

The Siakam trade was a bigger possibility but, if I recall correctly, that fell through once we established that he didn't want to resign here and/or we didn't' want to give him all the money he wanted. In both cases, I'm very curious to see what the pacers and knicks offer pascal and OG.

So you agree the foundation of the discussion was based on og/caruso for jk.

Also you believe the Wiggins rumors but not the jk rumors. Talk about bias.

Thank god we didn’t go with pascal. That dude is a fraud.

I believe they were shopping wiggins because pretty much everyone, local and national, reported that. I have never heard anyone say they're shopping JK or that JK is available. So if they call Chi, ask for Caruso and the Bulls say, 'sure, for JK.' That doesn't mean, necessarily, that the league values JK at the Caruso level. It means Chicago asked. Maybe Chi is delusional about what Caruso can bring back. Maybe I'm underrating Caruso's value around the league. Maybe I'm overrating JK's value. We just don't know. If they were shopping JK around the deadline and couldn't get JK, Pascal, or Caruso, THEN we could say 3 teams value JK around that level (GSW, Tor, and Chi) and since that would be GSW's eval, I'd expect them to shop JK around the league to gauge the value (like they probably did w/ Wiggins).

Not sure I agree on Siakam. I don't think he's as good as his next contract will imply. He can struggle with his shot and it's probably more mental than anything else. He's a above average on both ends of the court and, in one package, that makes him a very above average player - like a fringe all star. Like the best of andrew wiggins. With a banged up Hali, he's miscast as the no1 option but as a 2/3rd option, he's really, really good. I'm mostly glad we stayed away because I think JK can give us 75% of Siakam at 25% of the cost. Def don't want to max Pascal out after trading assets to get him.

[Onus]

[/b]

This is where you went wrong. No idea what was discussed and if they asked for JK, doesn't mean they or the league values JK at that level. Unlike, for example, wiggins who we were clearly shopping at the deadline and the prevailing sentiment was "he's a negative or, at best, neutral contract" and the warriors aren't getting anything useful for him. But even that inference hinges on the assumption that the people reporting that at least talked to the dubs FO and weren't making stuff up (not guaranteed).

What we do 'know,' in theory, is that the warriors turned down caruso and og trades centered around JK. We don't know if there were picks involved, the matching money going out, any of that. The only thing we can infer is that the dubs value(d) JK more than either of those players but even that hinges on the assumptions there wasn't anything else of value in those trades and/or we weren't getting anything of value back other than OG or Caruso.

The Siakam trade was a bigger possibility but, if I recall correctly, that fell through once we established that he didn't want to resign here and/or we didn't' want to give him all the money he wanted. In both cases, I'm very curious to see what the pacers and knicks offer pascal and OG.

So you agree the foundation of the discussion was based on og/caruso for jk.

Also you believe the Wiggins rumors but not the jk rumors. Talk about bias.

Thank god we didn’t go with pascal. That dude is a fraud.

I believe they were shopping wiggins because pretty much everyone, local and national, reported that. I have never heard anyone say they're shopping JK or that JK is available. So if they call Chi, ask for Caruso and the Bulls say, 'sure, for JK.' That doesn't mean, necessarily, that the league values JK at the Caruso level. It means Chicago asked.

I agree this is what happened.

I also think we went to Toronto and we asked for OG and they asked for JK. We said no once again.

Not sure I agree on Siakam. I don't think he's as good as his next contract will imply. He can struggle with his shot and it's probably more mental than anything else. He's a above average on both ends of the court and, in one package, that makes him a very above average player - like a fringe all star. Like the best of andrew wiggins. With a banged up Hali, he's miscast as the no1 option but as a 2/3rd option, he's really, really good. I'm mostly glad we stayed away because I think JK can give us 75% of Siakam at 25% of the cost. Def don't want to max Pascal out after trading assets to get him.

Pascal is not worth any type of max that he wants.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Top 10 scoring machine who may play good on ball man defense but will not rebound and will be below average basketball IQ.

[Warriorfan]

Lower IQ harder working Wiggins.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Kumininga, Trayce, Looney, (option picked up Chris Paul cash and draft picks so we can take salary in) Moody, and Payton

For a starting center, a back up center, a starting off guard, a small fast defensive back up point guard.

[cpower]

full potential JK would still not be able to make a jump shot...so poor mans Giannis without passing and defense..