What does full potential Kuminga look like?

[Kuya]

... and can that guy help slow down Anthony Edwards over the next 10 years out in the West?

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[KevinMcreynolds]

His BBIQ needs to drastically improve. I’ve always said he could be a rich man’s Aaron Gordon but Gordon is a far superior defender and plays within his skillset on offense. JK is a wildly inconsistent defender and forces things on offense. Gordon didn’t really come into his own until he got to Denver at age 25, JK is still only 21.

[billinder33]

Peak Kuminga would look like something in between a Wiggins and an Igudala.

Not sure we'll ever get to Peak Kuminga, but it's an enticing thought for sure.

[HiRez]

That's the pressing question because it affects a lot of things they need to make decisions on really soon, and I think it's hard to answer. On the good side, Kuminga clearly had a huge leap this year, so much so that he's clearly a player with more positive impact than negative most of the time. Offensively, he's doing almost everything better: driving, passing, rebounding, shooting, drawing fouls and hitting his free throws. And generally staying away from low-percentage long 2s, working inside more, passing out when he's jammed up. At times, when locked in and moving downhill or in transition, JK is an unstoppable force unmatched by very few in the league.

On the other hand, some questions are still lingering, including BBIQ/awareness, rebounding while improved could still be better, hands and handle still suspect. And I think he took a bit of a step back this year defensively. For whatever reason (positioning? timing?), players of all sizes and types seem to get their shot off over or around him too easily. That should not happen with his quickness and athleticism.

In addition, consistency is still a problem for him, although he has some nice extended stretches of positive play this year. But inside a single game, there's some Jekyll vs. Hyde going on. He still tends to start games badly much of the time. Often, he will turn it around and come back with a cleaner and stronger performance later in the game (if given a chance), but it would be nice if he would not have those awful 5-minute stretches (again, usually at the beginning of games) where he's like 0-4 with 3 turnovers and 2 fouls.

I have no idea what the Warriors grand plan is, but through the statements of the coaches and front office, it sure feels like they're leaning into another vet-heavy season trying to chase another ring. I don't think it's going to work out well, especially if they are bringing in more aging vets like KD or whatever, but Kuminga is surely the best trade chip they have right now and will bring them the best return on whoever they want to bring in. In that sense, I guess Kuminga is still a success story already since his trade value last year was seemingly low.

I think you could look just at the Celtics, and I see "full potential" Kuminga somewhere in between Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum. Also agree with Kevin that Aaron Gordon is a pretty good comp to make. I think Kuminga has the potential to be even better but whether he'll get there is not a sure thing. Offensively the sky's the limit for him if he can get his handle under control and keep incrementally improving his shooting %s, but I doubt he'll ever approach elite as a defender. The physical tools are there but the awareness and mindset are not.

[lars_rosenberg]

Peak Kuminga would look like something in between a Wiggins and an Igudala.

Not sure we'll ever get to Peak Kuminga, but it's an enticing thought for sure.

Iguodala had supreme BBIQ and he was an extremely good and smart defender. I don't see that in Kuminga tbh.
Wiggins is a better comparison even if they obviously have their differences.

[vvoland]

On the other hand, some questions are still lingering, including BBIQ/awareness, rebounding while improved could still be better, hands and handle still suspect. And I think he took a bit of a step back this year defensively. For whatever reason (positioning? timing?), players of all sizes and types seem to get their shot off over or around him too easily. That should not happen with his quickness and athleticism.

I keep hearing this but the numbers don't really bear this out. The dubs gave up 117.2 points per 100 possession w/o JK on the court and 114 with JK on the court (almost an even split of around 4000 minutes in both cases). Individually, players shoot 1.7% below their averages when defended by JK in the 19.4 FGs he defended per game (or maybe it's per 100 poss but it'll be closer either way). Last year, for example, with JK off, the defense gave up 113.2 pp100, with him on it was 116.3pp100. He was better individually, it seems, since the opponent fg% dropped by 2.4% when JK was the defender.

I think that narrative persists because his peaks and valleys on defense are wild. On one possession, he may lock up tatum, on another he may lose the only shooter on the opposing team 3 times in a row resulting in 9 points given up. On the whole, his defense doesn't seem to be a huge issue and may, in fact, be improving (but it think it's more noise than signal, at this point).

[HiRez]

On the other hand, some questions are still lingering, including BBIQ/awareness, rebounding while improved could still be better, hands and handle still suspect. And I think he took a bit of a step back this year defensively. For whatever reason (positioning? timing?), players of all sizes and types seem to get their shot off over or around him too easily. That should not happen with his quickness and athleticism.

I keep hearing this but the numbers don't really bear this out. The dubs gave up 117.2 points per 100 possession w/o JK on the court and 114 with JK on the court (almost an even split of around 4000 minutes in both cases). Individually, players shoot 1.7% below their averages when defended by JK in the 19.4 FGs he defended per game (or maybe it's per 100 poss but it'll be closer either way). Last year, for example, with JK off, the defense gave up 113.2 pp100, with him on it was 116.3pp100. He was better individually, it seems, since the opponent fg% dropped by 2.4% when JK was the defender.

I think that narrative persists because his peaks and valleys on defense are wild. On one possession, he may lock up tatum, on another he may lose the only shooter on the opposing team 3 times in a row resulting in 9 points given up. On the whole, his defense doesn't seem to be a huge issue and may, in fact, be improving (but it think it's more noise than signal, at this point).

That's interesting and maybe my perception is just wrong, but it didn't feel like he was really ever "stopping" anyone this year. I do feel like he played more physical this year and fought through screens more, which is good. But his block rate is also down from last year (-18% p100p), which wasn't that great to begin with, while steals rate is the same as last year. Rebounding rate is up from last year, but down from his rookie season, when he was regularly raked over the coals for being a poor rebounder.

[CDM_Stats]

I think defensively and rebounding is where he still has credible room to grow. Offensively, I think its far less likely there's much growth there. The shooting could get better to where he's a 35-40% 3pt shooter on low-medium volume, but I think anything beyond that is hoping for a unicorn

Defensively, he's been below average on-ball and off, but the off-ball trended up more this year than ever before. He also played more with Draymond than before, so the key here is to see sustained growth even if Dray's not there. On-ball, man he started off so good, and its just slowly petered away. But that also means it should be in his toolset to get back to his rookie level of man defense. Much easier to find a skill you once had than to learn it new

Rebounding is mostly awareness and effort, so its the most achievable. But based on 3 years of watching him, it seems clear to me that Kuminga wants to be a 3, not a 4. And that means less contact, less dirty work, more flash, etc etc.. but unless that shot comes around, he's a 4/3 in the NBA, not a 3/4, so he's gotta get to work. Stuff like being aware when the shot goes up, and from there finding the biggest uncovered threat to rebound the ball, and cover them. He has all the physical tools to be good, its all between the ears here. Admittedly a big part of why I dont see much more than he is, is that the rebounding has been poor despite the physical gifts

So I think his ceiling looks a lot like a combo of Harrison Barnes/Andrew Wiggins, to use Warriors examples. Realistically, I see a guy who's somewhat similar offensively to what we saw the past year, hopefully with a few more counters to combat shot-blockers inside. I think he can be an above average man defender and average off-ball defender. And I think he can get to being an above average rebounder, at least. A player like that is a starter in the league, maybe even a fringe all-star if he finds a niche fit like Wiggins did. But the two biggest things he needs to work on are all about doing the work and having heart, and I'd really like to have seen improvement in those facets. And because of that, if a deal comes along that makes sense, wouldn't hesitate on moving him. Because the other side of that story could be giving a guy 30m a year who isn't concerned with the hustle aspects of the game, and that could be our highest paid player in 2-3 years

[watch1958]

His sophomore season there were stretches where ball handlers didn’t want to go at him. Didn’t see much of that this season, but the basic skill is there.

[ILOVEIT]

Mini Giannis who attempts to bully others with a more sophisticated set of moves and better range. Less dominant because of size, but more skilled. I think he becomes more consistently dominant offensively.

IMO he MUST develop a consistent 3 point threat. If he does, watch out league.

[DevinVassell]

Kumingas potential!

It's already the offseason for bored dubs fans while the rest of the NBA world worries about the playoffs. (or atleast the draft)

[billinder33]

After watching Ant Edwards a bit this offseason, I'd like to see Kuminga enroll in Steph Curry's Point Guard Skillz Training Course(TM).

Would benefit his game a lot to have a reliable set of face up moves from the perimeter, rather than resorting to the high post back-down all the time. That over-reliance on the back-down usually grinds the offense to a halt, and I'd like to see that minimized.

[Onus]

I think in order for JK to reach his full potential you need to build around him. He's an awkward fit because he's a 4 on offense (can't really handle or shoot) but a 2 on defense (doesn't rebound or understand rotations but should be able to hand POA duties similarly to Klay). I think that's why it was actually detrimental to play Klay and JK together since they both could only play one role on defense and they really couldn't even do that this year. I think that if you can get enough shooters around him like 4 shooters and spread the court, it would open up his offensive game. He's really good at attacking smaller defenders and amazing in transition. So if you can find a way to get him to match up on the perimeter and get him out in transition and able to attack smaller guards I think you can get a lot more value out of him. I'd like to see a lineup of Curry, JK, Moody, Wiggins, Dray. Really I think his potential is as a power guard and poa defender.

[clyde21]

i think he can be really good in system tailored around him, just because he's such a freak athletically with baseline skill across the board, but I still don't think he's necessarily a great fit here, and I'd explore a trade with Cleveland for Mobley, who would be an incredible fit here and is the same timescale/rookie deal as Minga.

[Onus]

i think he can be really good in system tailored around him, just because he's such a freak athletically with baseline skill across the board, but I still don't think he's necessarily a great fit here, and I'd explore a trade with Cleveland for Mobley, who would be an incredible fit here and is the same timescale/rookie deal as Minga.

Why do you think the values on these 2 players would be remotely close?

[clyde21]

i think he can be really good in system tailored around him, just because he's such a freak athletically with baseline skill across the board, but I still don't think he's necessarily a great fit here, and I'd explore a trade with Cleveland for Mobley, who would be an incredible fit here and is the same timescale/rookie deal as Minga.

Why do you think the values on these 2 players would be remotely close?

why wouldn't there value be close im confused, why are we underrating how Kuminga is viewed across the league?

[Onus]

i think he can be really good in system tailored around him, just because he's such a freak athletically with baseline skill across the board, but I still don't think he's necessarily a great fit here, and I'd explore a trade with Cleveland for Mobley, who would be an incredible fit here and is the same timescale/rookie deal as Minga.

Why do you think the values on these 2 players would be remotely close?

why wouldn't there value be close im confused, why are we underrating how Kuminga is viewed across the league?

So for OG we needed to add multiple firsts on top of JK. I think we had a deal for JK and Caruso straight up this year. So those are examples of where the league is valuing JK. Do you think Mobley has the same value as that?

[clyde21]

Kuminga is only a year older than several top 10 projected picks THIS year btw, he's 21, Reed Sheppard is 20, Jared McCain is 20, Donovan Clingan is 20

and is already averaging 22/7/3 per 36 in the league and is entering his fourth year, and is one of the best physical specimens in the NBA.

put Kuminga in this class and he's going #1 overall

it's so weird seeing this board overrate guys like Jordan Poole for years but refuse to understand Kuminga's true value on the open market. guarantee you teams would be lining up to get Kuminga and I would only trade him if we get a blue chipper back like Mobley.

[clyde21]

Why do you think the values on these 2 players would be remotely close?

why wouldn't there value be close im confused, why are we underrating how Kuminga is viewed across the league?

So for OG we needed to add multiple firsts on top of JK. I think we had a deal for JK and Caruso straight up this year. So those are examples of where the league is valuing JK. Do you think Mobley has the same value as that?

and OG ended up getting traded for RJ Barrett (on a huge contract), Quickley, and a 2nd rounder.

[Onus]

why wouldn't there value be close im confused, why are we underrating how Kuminga is viewed across the league?

So for OG we needed to add multiple firsts on top of JK. I think we had a deal for JK and Caruso straight up this year. So those are examples of where the league is valuing JK. Do you think Mobley has the same value as that?

and OG ended up getting traded for RJ Barrett (on a huge contract), Quickley, and a 2nd rounder.

Ok so og didn’t have a lot of value. And we supposedly had to add more value on top of jk? Meaning jk wasn’t highly valued.