2023 Pacers offseason

[Scoot McGroot]

Thought it’s time to put out a general transaction catch all. Think of this as signings, trades, rumors, and free agent talk.

Probably best to Keep general draft prospect talk in the other existing draft thread.

[Scoot McGroot]

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[8305]

I think Trey Lyles is a free agent. He’s looked good against the Warriors.
Probably better than anyone we have at the 4 now and a likely upgrade to anyone getting backup 5 minutes.

[Scoot McGroot]

I just added some CBA stuff onto the Trades forum, but most important regarding Indy:
* 3 2 way players goes into effect starting with the 2023 season
* Any team under the minimum salary on the first day of the regular season must pay the difference, and it will be assigned as a penalty onto that team's salary cap the remainder of the season. Also, the payment will be distributed to ALL players in the NBA, and not just players on that team, so it can't be a loophole to try and pay your own players more salary
* Any team under the minimum salary on opening night also doesn't get any luxury tax distribution payments (in 2023/24, they will get 50% of the tax distribution)
* Room Exception will jump from $5.4m to $7.6m for next season, so if the Pacers use their cap space fully, they can then have a slightly larger Room Exception to sign a player with.... the Room Exception CANNOT be used to absorb a contract via trade


So, expect the Pacers to ABSOLUTELY get to the salary floor by opening night, even if it means a larger than expected contract to a George Hill/James Johnson, or a R&E of Buddy Hield, or whatnot.

[8305]

Even more incentive to move one of the late FRPs and a rookie contract for a vet.
John Collins or DFS?

[Scoot McGroot]

Even more incentive to move one of the late FRPs and a rookie contract for a vet.
John Collins or DFS?

26 might not be enough for DFS. I don’t know that Indy management would consider taking on Collins and his contract with all their talk of valuing locker room chemistry.

[Wizop]

3 2 way players goes into effect starting with the 2023 season

K Brown and two more. we have two seconds but if we get the Houston pick, 32 might be too high to expect the player to accept a two way. now if the pick goes to the Spurs, and we have 50 and 55, there are the two ways.

Any team under the minimum salary on the first day of the regular season must pay the difference, and it will be assigned as a penalty onto that team's salary cap the remainder of the season. Also, the payment will be distributed to ALL players in the NBA, and not just players on that team, so it can't be a loophole to try and pay your own players more salary

this deprives us of a lot of flexibility. it probably forces us to take on a starter's money contract.

[Scoot McGroot]

3 2 way players goes into effect starting with the 2023 season

K Brown and two more. we have two seconds but if we get the Houston pick, 32 might be too high to expect the player to accept a two way. now if the pick goes to the Spurs, and we have 50 and 55, there are the two ways.

Any team under the minimum salary on the first day of the regular season must pay the difference, and it will be assigned as a penalty onto that team's salary cap the remainder of the season. Also, the payment will be distributed to ALL players in the NBA, and not just players on that team, so it can't be a loophole to try and pay your own players more salary

this deprives us of a lot of flexibility. it probably forces us to take on a starter's money contract.

To the first, yup. 50/55 competing with other players undrafted would probably fill out the 3 spots. There’s a chance they might let a Gabe York compete for one of them, too. But I don’t remember the last player drafted earlier than 40 who took a 2 way, barring a season ending injury and it being a planned recovery year. If we keep and draft 32, plan on then taking an active roster spot.


To the second, I think it pushes any midseason stuff to before the season. But remember, this isn’t cap space. It’s just the total to the salary floor.

[Wizop]

3 2 way players goes into effect starting with the 2023 season

K Brown and two more. we have two seconds but if we get the Houston pick, 32 might be too high to expect the player to accept a two way. now if the pick goes to the Spurs, and we have 50 and 55, there are the two ways.

Any team under the minimum salary on the first day of the regular season must pay the difference, and it will be assigned as a penalty onto that team's salary cap the remainder of the season. Also, the payment will be distributed to ALL players in the NBA, and not just players on that team, so it can't be a loophole to try and pay your own players more salary

this deprives us of a lot of flexibility. it probably forces us to take on a starter's money contract.

To the first, yup. 50/55 competing with other players undrafted would probably fill out the 3 spots. There’s a chance they might let a Gabe York compete for one of them, too. But I don’t remember the last player drafted earlier than 40 who took a 2 way, barring a season ending injury and it being a planned recovery year. If we keep and draft 32, plan on then taking an active roster spot.


To the second, I think it pushes any midseason stuff to before the season. But remember, this isn’t cap space. It’s just the total to the salary floor.

Isn't that 90% of the cap? I don't think we can get there with Hill, 2 firsts, and 2 seconds. I foresee trading a player and a first for a substantial but short contract.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using RealGM mobile app

[Scoot McGroot]

K Brown and two more. we have two seconds but if we get the Houston pick, 32 might be too high to expect the player to accept a two way. now if the pick goes to the Spurs, and we have 50 and 55, there are the two ways.



this deprives us of a lot of flexibility. it probably forces us to take on a starter's money contract.

To the first, yup. 50/55 competing with other players undrafted would probably fill out the 3 spots. There’s a chance they might let a Gabe York compete for one of them, too. But I don’t remember the last player drafted earlier than 40 who took a 2 way, barring a season ending injury and it being a planned recovery year. If we keep and draft 32, plan on then taking an active roster spot.


To the second, I think it pushes any midseason stuff to before the season. But remember, this isn’t cap space. It’s just the total to the salary floor.

Isn't that 90% of the cap? I don't think we can get there with Hill, 2 firsts, and 2 seconds. I foresee trading a player and a first for a substantial but short contract.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using RealGM mobile app

About $15m more to the salary floor after accounting for the 1sts, as now.

Hypothetically, you could see George Hill not signed until camp and maybe he even gets a huge non guaranteed contract. Or Buddy gets an R&E much like Myles had. Who knows. Could also sign someone, trade for someone, etc.

[Wizop]

About $15m more to the salary floor after accounting for the 1sts, as now.

So to get to the floor via trade, we'd need to acquire someone making 15 more than the player we send out. Via free agency could require creating a roster spot

[8305]

Even more incentive to move one of the late FRPs and a rookie contract for a vet.
John Collins or DFS?

26 might not be enough for DFS. I don’t know that Indy management would consider taking on Collins and his contract with all their talk of valuing locker room chemistry.

Agree, if the Pacers actually had interest in Collins that deal would have probably been done by now?
Pick 26 plus one of Jalen Smith, Isaiah Jackson or Chris Duarte for DFS?

[basketballwacko2]

Agree, if the Pacers actually had interest in Collins that deal would have probably been done by now?
Pick 26 plus one of Jalen Smith, Isaiah Jackson or Chris Duarte for DFS?

I'm calling Collins a bad contract at this point the Hawks need to pay to move him. I can really see Rick wanting DFS and I'd think the Nets would want to get something for him since he was part of the Kyrie Irving trade.

[Wizop]

Agree, if the Pacers actually had interest in Collins that deal would have probably been done by now?

perhaps the Hawks wanted more than the Pacers were willing to offer at the deadline. we're told they made two offers and some think they were Collins and OG.

[Topofthekey]

Agree with everyone that Collins probably isn't the best target now

I wonder what's the price for Cam Johnson

[Scoot McGroot]

Agree, if the Pacers actually had interest in Collins that deal would have probably been done by now?

perhaps the Hawks wanted more than the Pacers were willing to offer at the deadline. we're told they made two offers and some think they were Collins and OG.

Oh, I read that as Bridges and OG, at the time.

[Wizop]

Podcasters are starting to say fewer players will return than I've been projecting. I have no idea whether they are basing that on inside sources or are just personally projecting bigger changes than I've been expecting.

[Scoot McGroot]

Podcasters are starting to say fewer players will return than I've been projecting. I have no idea whether they are basing that on inside sources or are just personally projecting bigger changes than I've been expecting.

Some of it is just the sheer roster crunch. Like, trades of picks inevitably also include other players too, and right now, Indy doesn’t have roster spots for even all their picks, if they end up with Houston’s 2nd. If they want to bring ANY free agent back, there’s one guy that needs to be cleared. And if they want to bring in an outside free agent, there’s another roster spot that needs to be cleared.

Turnover, after a year in the lottery, should be expected.

[Wizop]

Turnover, after a year in the lottery, should be expected.

I had Oshae and Johnson gone and serious efforts made to trade Theis and Smith or Jackson. That brings 11 back. Agness set over under at 9.5. that suggests Duarte and Nwora being shopped too.

[Scoot McGroot]

Turnover, after a year in the lottery, should be expected.

I had Oshae and Johnson gone and serious efforts made to trade Theis and Smith or Jackson. That brings 11 back. Agness set over under at 9.5. that suggests Duarte and Nwora being shopped too.

Or Buddy, Nesmith, etc.

I’d say Hali and Mathurin are the only definite to return. Myles, Nembhard, and McConnell are very, very likely to return. The rest is all very up in the air depending on what’s available? Sure, we’d like to keep a bunch of them like Jalen or Jackson, Buddy, Nesmith, Duarte, etc, but who knows.