Redd trade ideas...

[TripleDouble]

I posted a number of possible Redd trades in the trade board, I am wonder how you feel about your teams trade idea (they are supposed to be starting points not final deals). I tried to be fair, but obviously my opinion from Milwaukee may vary greatly from yours.

The topic is here:
http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=750419

[jeremy1215]

I like it

[mizzoupacers]

Redd and Villanueva for Granger, Quis, and Murphy?

HELL YES.

We could find a use for Charlie Villanueva. We have a desperate need for Redd.

Whereas Murphy is a humongous albatross, Quis is nice but overpaid as a bench player, and Granger...well, I'd hate to lose him, but it cleans up the rotation at small forward (Dunleavy gets to play his real position, with minutes available for Williams) while bringing in an honest-to-God shooting guard. I can barely remember what it's like to have one of those, although I dimly recall that until a few seasons ago we had a pretty good one who seemed to have a positive impact on the team's fortunes.

According to hoopshype.com, the salary exchange is almost dead-even through the 2008-09 season. (It would remain even in 2009-10 if we picked up Daniels' option, but I seriously doubt the Pacers would pick it up.) In 2010-11 we'd be paying Redd $18.3 million, which is too much, but it's a lot better than paying Murphy $12 million.

Get Larry Bird on the phone!

[jeremy1215]

So lets see...

Tinsley/Diener
Redd/Rush
Dunleavy/Williams
Villanueva/Diogu
O'Neal/Foster


That is an amazing depth chart

[ajizzle]

While I would absolutely HATE losing Danny, I'd have to do this deal. Our depth chart would be nice, Obie's offense would still flourish, and the Redd/Rush combo would be deadly from the arc.

Plus, I wouldn't mind paying Redd $18 mil. by the time he's what, 32? That's not bad for a 25ppg scorer, which could go up by 3-7ppg in an offense like O'Brien's.

[jeremy1215]

Could you imagine if we had a lineup out there like Diener/Rush/Redd/Williams/Murphy during stretches of games? Thats an amazing shooting lineup we could use against teams like the Warriors and Suns.

[PR07]

I'd do that in a heartbeat, but why would Milwaukee?

[BobbyLight]

I'd do that in a heartbeat, but why would Milwaukee?

Because there are a lot of people (Bucks Fans, no one who matters) who are convinced that the Redd/Mo Williams backcourt can not coexist together. Which is true. On top of that I think the feeling is that we will get more for Redd in a trade than Williams and Williams is a more complete player (younger, cheaper as well). The recent strech of 5 games without Redd we played more like a team and Bogut got really agressive on the O end.

I like this deal for us, as well. We get a starting 3 and 2 decent backups. Right now our backups at the 3, 4 and 5 are Michael Ruffin, Gadzurich and someone fiiling in at the 3 who is way to short.

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

Wow, I love Granger, one of my favorite players ever. But I dunno.

[CableKC]

I just ran the $$$$ going out and coming in and came up with 16.22 mil reasons why I would actually back out of this.

If TPTB are willing to pay an additional $16.22 mil ( in guaranteed $$$) to get Redd and CV.....then I may consider it.

From a talent POV....it's a no-brainer.

But from a financial POV.....this may make it impossible to make any significant ( if not minor ) moves in the near future. I'm guessing that if JONeal isn't moved....that we would likely be going over the Salary cap in the next 2 seasons.

[Scoot McGroot]

I just ran the $$$$ going out and coming in and came up with 16.22 mil reasons why I would actually back out of this.

If TPTB are willing to pay an additional $16.22 mil ( in guaranteed $$$) to get Redd and CV.....then I may consider it.

From a talent POV....it's a no-brainer.

But from a financial POV.....this may make it impossible to make any significant ( if not minor ) moves in the near future. I'm guessing that if JONeal isn't moved....that we would likely be going over the Salary cap in the next 2 seasons.

Hmm? Redd and Villanueva will combine to make $17.2 million this year. Murphy, Daniels and Granger will make $16.5 million. As for long-term dollars over the course of the entire deal, yeah, Indy will pay more over the full term of the deal, but it's much closer to even when you factor in the eventual extensions of Granger and Villanueva.

[CableKC]

-= original quote snipped =-
Hmm? Redd and Villanueva will combine to make $17.2 million this year. Murphy, Daniels and Granger will make $16.5 million. As for long-term dollars over the course of the entire deal, yeah, Indy will pay more over the full term of the deal, but it's much closer to even when you factor in the eventual extensions of Granger and Villanueva.

I'm talking about beyond this season...I understand that the $$$ will work out this season.

Maybe you can help me run the #s. In the 2008/2009 season......the following players would be owed Guaranteed $$:

JONeal - $21.3525 mil
Redd - $15.78 mil
Dunleavy - $9.0 mil
Tinsley - $6.75 mil
Villanueva - $3.448 mil
Ike - $2.912822 mil
Diener - $1.62 mil
Shawne - $1.57296 mil

Guaranteed $$ for 8 players = $62.43 mil

Assuming that Foster will pick up his Player Option ( which I think he won't and will actuall decid to opt out and become a FA ), add in $6.175 mil to that.

Guaranteed $$$ for 8 players and Foster = $68.61133

That is 9 players that will be owed $68.6 mil. I have no clue what Luxury Tax will be set at in the 2008/2009 season....but I am guessing that we are going to be VERY CLOSE to that with ONLY 9 players. Even if Foster doesn't pick up his Player Option ( which I don't think he will so that he can become a FA ), that would leave us with $62mil owed to 8 players.

I would possibly consider this IF we moved JONeal anytime between now and the 2008-2009 trade deadline for some Expiring Contracts.....but I have a feeling that doing this would trade would landlock the Pacers into some very big Long-Term contracts for the next 2 seasons and severely limit the financial flexiblility that TPTB will have.

[Scoot McGroot]

Our current roster for next year would have $68.8 million in guaranteed salaries as well.

Essentially, you're just going to have one extra player for about the same amount of money next year if you don't do the deal (all this has Foster in the same situation, if he opts out, we're at $62.7 million essentially). You'll have a lineup of:
Tinsley/Daniels/Diener
Dunleavy
Granger/Williams
JO/Diogu
Foster/Murphy

Or, if you do the deal, you'll have a likely roster of:

Tinsley/Diener
Redd
Dunleavy/Williams
Diogu/Villanueva (this could go either way)
JO/Foster

Which one do you like better? The money's very close, and doesn't become a huge factor until the 09/10 season when we could get Marquis off the books, but Granger and Villanueva's extensions will have kicked in, thus meaning it could go either way. We could come out even, salarywise, or we could add a lot of salary for that year, we just won't know.

[CableKC]

Our current roster for next year would have $68.8 million in guaranteed salaries as well.

Essentially, you're just going to have one extra player for about the same amount of money next year if you don't do the deal (all this has Foster in the same situation, if he opts out, we're at $62.7 million essentially). You'll have a lineup of:
Tinsley/Daniels/Diener
Dunleavy
Granger/Williams
JO/Diogu
Foster/Murphy

Or, if you do the deal, you'll have a likely roster of:

Tinsley/Diener
Redd
Dunleavy/Williams
Diogu/Villanueva (this could go either way)
JO/Foster

Which one do you like better? The money's very close, and doesn't become a huge factor until the 09/10 season when we could get Marquis off the books, but Granger and Villanueva's extensions will have kicked in, thus meaning it could go either way. We could come out even, salarywise, or we could add a lot of salary for that year, we just won't know.

I have no doubt that the roster would be better...I'm just saying that I can see TPTB backing out due to financial consideratons and a likely luxury tax that they would have to pay in order to get any backup players due to the lack of depth that we have.

I think that this would be more of a "win now and ignore the amount of $$$ that we will pay" move that would help us in the next 2 years.

[Scoot McGroot]

-= original quote snipped =-


I have no doubt that the roster would be better...I'm just saying that I can see TPTB backing out due to financial consideratons and a likely luxury tax that they would have to pay in order to get any backup players due to the lack of depth that we have.

I think that this would be more of a "win now and ignore the amount of $$$ that we will pay" move that would help us in the next 2 years.

Yup, that's valid. However, we'd really only have to go out and sign one extra "depth" player. That's really all we're losing.

This could also be the precursor to another deal or a couple other deals on the way to a full rebuild. You could still move JO for a couple quality pieces and a pick and do a quick rebuild with Murphy's contract swapped for Redd's (who would earn his salary more accordingly). You'd also give guys like Villanueva and Diogu a true shot at proving their PF mettle in the NBA.

[That Nicka]

Would you guys do this trade?

Redd, Mihm, CV --> Indi

JO --> LA

Odom, Murphy, LAL first rounder --> Mil

[Gremz]

Would you guys do this trade?

Redd, Mihm, CV --> Indi

JO --> LA

Odom, Murphy, LAL first rounder --> Mil

The only plausable reason the pacers would have in getting Redd would be to pair him with JO, it also leaves us incredibly thin on the Boards with Murphy leaving aswell

[bravesatl]

Would you guys do this trade?

Redd, Mihm, CV --> Indi

JO --> LA

Odom, Murphy, LAL first rounder --> Mil

the difference in the 2 trades is we give JO for chris mihm?

[bravesatl]

hey for the original trade if you plug in tinsley and mo williams the deal still works ....

granger/murphy/daniels/tinsley/some kinda draft pick -for- redd/mo/villanueva

my god imagine the lineup:
Williams/Diener
Redd/Rush
Dunleavy/Williams
Villanueva/Diogu
JO/Foster

[CableKC]

-= original quote snipped =-
The only plausable reason the pacers would have in getting Redd would be to pair him with JO, it also leaves us incredibly thin on the Boards with Murphy leaving aswell

I agree.