Clemenza wrote:Harden wasn't that bad of a move at all
Clemenza wrote:madmaxmedia wrote:MartinToVaught wrote:Ishbia at least has the excuse that he's new to this. Ballmer has owned this team for a decade and is repeating the same mistakes he made with Lob City. Screwing up the exact same way a second time is a sign of a bad owner.
I'd say they both doubled down and lost- Clippers with Harden and Suns with Beal.
Harden wasn't that bad of a move at all plus he plays the point for us which is something we desperately needed. Suns owe Beal $150 million over the next three years and he's the exact same player as Booker. And the too needed a pg in the worst way possible.
On Jan. 10, 2024, Kawhi Leonard and the Clippers agreed to a three-year, $152 million contract extension that would keep him in Los Angeles through the 2026-27 season. That deal was less than the four-year, $220 million deal Leonard could've gotten.
Translation: The team's best player took one fewer year and about $10 million less than the max he could've gotten, in part to help the team build a contender over the next few years.
There have been rumblings that George, 34 years of age and entering his last big contract, wants the fourth year as part of extension talks. The Clippers, according to sources not authorized to speak publicly on the matter, have been reluctant to add that fourth year and are certainly not offering him the max as of right now.
If the team's best player in Kawhi Leonard took less than the max, then it'd be surprising to see George, who is more than a year older than Leonard, get a similar or better deal.
Ballings7 wrote:Gotta make some changes and allow certain people to go.
I don't see Kawhi going anywhere, but still lean towards PG not being here.
If not PG or Harden, they'll still need another third guy.
Russ' may end up staying if he can't get on elsewhere, but can see someone else wanting him in a fresh environment, and maybe even getting moved again if he does.
Would like to see Bones get a chance and really solidfiy himself at backup PG.
Keep T-Mann, Keep Powell, barring something really good.
Harden I think is going to stay and would b surprised if he leaves. I also kind of don't think he has a choice unless he went to Miami maybe and they accepted him (which I doubt would happen).
Need more size and agility upfront past Zubac.
I would keep Theis as a backup big.
Will be interesting to see how stubborn the org. is and if they can see through the lines of what the issues are, and whats feasible to fix.
Are We Having Fun Yet? 
esqtvd wrote:I think Beard will want back in too, but I'm not sure he makes sense at any price, and he will want more than the near-minimum Russ is taking. He still wants to be PAID. Does Ballmer really want to run back the agony of the last 5 years all over again?
Losing Beard and PG's salary gives Ballmer almost a clean slate. If you look at the guys the Sixers rounded up off the scrap pile and are now FAs--Kelly Oubre, Cam Payne, Mo Bamba, Buddy Hield, maybe even Nic Batum--and multiply that by 30, there are plenty of guys out there to fill up a roster.
This is what Ballmer was counting on when he went all-in. Even without PG and Beard, LAC is a destination.
NickP wrote:All this discussion about players and players movement and trades and who plays what role is really great stuff. But, after the said trades and role reassignment, do we let Ty Lue drive this car off a cliff? Over and over and over?
esqtvd wrote:If you look at the guys the Sixers rounded up off the scrap pile and are now FAs--Kelly Oubre, Cam Payne, Mo Bamba, Buddy Hield, maybe even Nic Batum--and multiply that by 30, there are plenty of guys out there to fill up a roster.
og15 wrote:Ballings7 wrote:Gotta make some changes and allow certain people to go.
I don't see Kawhi going anywhere, but still lean towards PG not being here.
If not PG or Harden, they'll still need another third guy.
Russ' may end up staying if he can't get on elsewhere, but can see someone else wanting him in a fresh environment, and maybe even getting moved again if he does.
Would like to see Bones get a chance and really solidfiy himself at backup PG.
Keep T-Mann, Keep Powell, barring something really good.
Harden I think is going to stay and would b surprised if he leaves. I also kind of don't think he has a choice unless he went to Miami maybe and they accepted him (which I doubt would happen).
Need more size and agility upfront past Zubac.
I would keep Theis as a backup big.
Will be interesting to see how stubborn the org. is and if they can see through the lines of what the issues are, and whats feasible to fix.
Clippers don't have the cap or the assets to get a third guy if either of PG or Harden go. The third guy would need to be whomever steps up on the roster, or just not really having a third guy. It's most likely to be Powell as a 6th man being the third guy scoring wise in that situation. In terms of overall, probably won't be any guy to pinpoint as that.
Westbrook can't be back on this team. You just can't play him in the post-season, it simply doesn't make sense to keep him around, and even more so if Harden is around. Just not the right fit because his game was never built for being a role player. Too difficult unless you have specific roster set ups to have a PG who can't shoot and is off the ball a lot.
Kidd for example became a shooter late in his career to extend his positive life on the court, and shooting wasn't even as prioritized when he played as it is now.
Bones should be allowed to have that backup PG spot and do what he can.
In terms of the young guys, let's just be fair to them. Boston has done pretty well for being a 51st pick. The fact that he's still in the league is good for him, but so far he's also not a rotation player at this level, but he could be if he changed his focus to being more of a role player on offense and totally focus on defense and glue guy stuff. Not sure he's capable of that, easier said than done, but with 1000+ minutes, not efficient enough to be a scoring option in the league. Maybe he makes a big jump over the off-season, but just based on so far.
Kobe could get himself into the rotation as a 2nd year guy. He's got a lot of good role player type skills.
Moussa hasn't played enough minutes to really know, but in the few he's played, he's had a lot of good signs, doesn't foul a lot for a big in those minutes, great energy, active on the offensive glass, but a poor defensive rebounder. Sample size still very small.
We will definitely have to wait and see what happens.
madmaxmedia wrote:esqtvd wrote:I think Beard will want back in too, but I'm not sure he makes sense at any price, and he will want more than the near-minimum Russ is taking. He still wants to be PAID. Does Ballmer really want to run back the agony of the last 5 years all over again?
Losing Beard and PG's salary gives Ballmer almost a clean slate. If you look at the guys the Sixers rounded up off the scrap pile and are now FAs--Kelly Oubre, Cam Payne, Mo Bamba, Buddy Hield, maybe even Nic Batum--and multiply that by 30, there are plenty of guys out there to fill up a roster.
This is what Ballmer was counting on when he went all-in. Even without PG and Beard, LAC is a destination.
I think this is well worth remembering, even if it’s much easier to have a lottery pick or 2 to give you a shot at a young starter or star.
But yeah, we’d have to lose both huge salaries to start clearing room. I’d like Harden back but if clearing salary is the goal then there’s not going to be a middle ground where they can meet on the money.
I’m not surprised to see the report that PG wants 4 years but underwhelming in the playoffs certainly puts a damper on things for him, here or anywhere. I think if he would be willing to sign the same contract as Kawhi, Clips would do it and then bring Beard back too. But looking at where these guys are now vs. two years ago, we’ve definitely reached the point of declining returns. Kawhi has held up the best, but only when he is actually playing.
I’m not over the world with most of our young guys, but it may be a requirement to put 1 or 2 in the starting lineup and regular rotation if we run 213 back- sink or swim. The buyout guys only make us even older and slower, and it feels like subtraction by addition at this point.
Ballings7 wrote:The organization can't be stubborn and rest on the names and then just "accept" the obvious flaws and not talk about them. I want to see that come up over the coming year.
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