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Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas)

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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#61 » by Clemenza » Fri May 13, 2022 3:27 am

TrueLAfan wrote:I’m more and more convinced that we might be able to save a few $$ and get a young-ish player for our frontcourt. (It's largely about finding a team willing to use a good sized trade exception on Mook.) Now that we’ve resigned RoCo, I can see him playing much of his time—maybe 1500 minutes next year at PF or even C. Add in 1850 from Zu, about 1100 minutes from Batum at PF and spot minutes at C, and another 500-800 from PG or Kawhi at the 4. That’s 5000-5200 frontcourt minutes out of 7900. A 14th/15th man (*cough*BlakeGriffin!*cough*) will eat up 700-1000 more minutes. So, really, we’re looking for a 1900 minute or so player—maybe less. I think there are some low coast options that would be surprisingly good. I mentioned Keita Bates-Diop in another post; he’d be (very) cheap and adequate. There’s a better low cost, totally attainable options IMO—although I think a lot of people would hate it:

Clippers Trade:
Terance Mann

Kings Trade:
Trey Lyles
#37 Pick

Why for the Kings: He’s on a team with Richaun Holmes, Domantas Sabonis, Damian Jones and a couple of other pretty good backup guys in Chimezie Metu, and Alex Len. The Kings are stocked in the front court; overstocked, you could say. OTOH, at the 2/3 positions—and on D in general—the Kings are hurting. Mann gives them a long term answer, on a team where he’ll start and play consistent starter’s minutes, and be giving up a player that would be much lower in their rotation

I get that some people will think Mann is better than Lyles. And, maybe that’s right. But on our team, with so many 2/3s, he’s a luxury. He can get a player that help us at a position(s) we need help at. Lyles, as I’ll indicate, is a better player for our team. I’d love to keep Mann, but I’d trade him for a young-ish player that I think has some potential to be a needle mover for us at a position where we need help.

Why for us: Lyles took a little time for him to get his footing in the league—and still has room to improve. He’s a grade B Bobby Portis that could potentially develop into a very similar player—almost exactly the same size, a lot of the same pluses/minuses. Lyles is a year younger. He’s a little less of a rebounder and isn’t as consistent from deep. Still, what he did last year is pretty indicative of where he is in the league right now; 26 years old, 10.5 and 5 in around 20 minutes per game. He may be better than that; his numbers as a starter are actually better than his overall numbers (i.e. he plays well against starters). Since his rookie year, it looks like this:
93 starts, 23.7 mpg, .464 FG%, .338 3P%, .797 FT%, 8.8 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 1.2 apg, .4 spg, .4 bpg, .8 TO

I’d be down with a guy that gave us 9 and 6 in 23 mpg as a backup 4-5 that could spread the court a little. And I think he’s a rare 26 year old (11 months older than Mann) that has some upside. I really think Trey Lyles could be a decent starting PF or 6th/7th man PF/C.

Mann is the new heart and soul of the team. I've given up on him averaging double digits in scoring but his defense, rebounding, and hustle is greatly appreciated. He's one of the kids that's supposed to be on the team just like SGA was. The basketball gods don't really shine to brightly on teams that continue to trade away team leaders and spark plugs.(see Lakers with Caruso). I can see Kennard and even Norman Powell(not really sold on him) traded before Mann. How do you think the locker room would feel if Mann was traded?
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#62 » by Dynamix » Fri May 13, 2022 4:07 am

Completely agree that Mann brings way more to the table than just some raw stats. He definitely isn't untradable, but if it does happen it better be as part of a package for something significant, not just some minor upgrade.

In all honesty, I just want to see what his role could be with a fully healthy roster. This season was the first time he got significant and consistent minutes, but it was under unusual circumstances, with key guys going in and out of the lineup. Just feels too soon to move on from him.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#63 » by TrueLAfan » Fri May 13, 2022 1:51 pm

Pretty much the reactions I anticipated—and I don’t mean that in a negative way at all. I totally get the love for TMann. But Powell makes him superfluous. Reggie played too much last year because we lack a PG—but Terance isn’t a point, no matter what we try and force into it. He’s a SG/SF, a 3 and D, a good player. He’s also a position where we have Normal Powell playing 25-30 mpg and Powell is better. It’s a position where Paul George gets some minutes too; I give Kawhi and PG’s minutes kind of breakdown 15-70-15. 15% at PF, 70% at SF, 15% at SG. I‘m super hoping for 4500 minutes out of our duo next year—that’s another 700 minutes at SG. Then there’s the requisite sharpshooter—Luke. I’d rather have Mann than Luke, six days a week and twice on Sunday. But Luke has two things—a singular skill and a less tradeable deal. Assuming we get a 22-25 mpg PG, the search for which is (I think) kind of a given, we end up with

New guy! 1800-2000 PG/SG minutes, mainly PG
Reg-gie! 1800-2000 PG/SG minutes, mainly PG
Powell 1800-2000 SG/SF minutes, mainly SG
PG/Kawhi 700 minutes at SG
Since Coffey and Preston are on the roster, capable, and likely to get low rotation minutes, there’s maybe 1200-1500 minutes left at the guard spots. Maybe. That’s one player, and we have two—Mann and Kennard. I like Mann better. He’s also more tradeable.

We’ve kind of got the opposite problem at 4/5. Right now, we don’t have a new guy in the frontcourt. We’ve got Zu, who’s making incremental progress, Batum, who’s a good glue guy but will get almost all of time at the 4, and RoCo, who I think is going to be our starting PF and can play spot minutes at the 5 and 3. Even with 700 minutes at the 4 by Kawhi and PG, we’re (very) light there.

Zu 1800-2000 C minutes
RoCo 1500 PF/C minutes, mainly PF
Batum 1100 PF/C minutes, mainly PF
PG/Kawhi 700 minutes at PF

We need about 7900 minutes at the 4 and 5. We’re close to 3000 short. This is why bringing back Blake wouldn’t be just a victory lap thing—we’re kind of desperate. Guys like Preston and Coffey, who’ll play from 700-1000 minutes between them because that’s what 12th-14th men do—don’t exist on our roster. We have none of those in the frontcourt. Zero. If Blake Griffin could give us 700-900 minutes, mostly garbage time, but still time eating, space eating minutes—it would be huge. And we would still need a 6th-8th man at the 4 and 5 who could capably man both spots for 70 games at around 23-26 mpg. That player could, IMO, be Trey Lyles.

Like I said, I like TMann better. I’d like it a lot of better of we could keep him—I think he and Luke have more or less equal player value, so if we could find a decent 22-25 mpg frontcourt player for around $6-8 million a year on a team that is under the cap and/or has a trade exception for a $4 million plus, I’m all for moving Luke. I just think it’s less likely. And I think we'd lose more by moving Powell, who is a terrific player--an 18-3-2 guy that plays excellent defense at SG (just "pretty good" at Sf) and is Luke-level efficient as a shooter. And he's local. He's a great player and I don't see him being moved. But, maybe if we found a really good $15 million 4/5 on a team with a small trade exception. Still, I (sadly) think the most likely to go is TMann.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#64 » by MartinToVaught » Fri May 13, 2022 3:02 pm

RE: Mann - I think he made a good point a couple weeks ago when he mentioned that this would be his first real offseason as a pro. His career so far has been a whirlwind because of COVID messing up the schedule. I have hope that he will take the leap next season now that he has time to really work on his game.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#65 » by Captain Ballmer » Sat May 14, 2022 6:14 pm

Easy pass on guys like Lyles, Blake etc. especially with the expense of T-Mann

We need athleticism, energy, physicality. T-mann can bring those things.
2023 Clippers W/L Count (51-31)
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without PG13 3-3
Without Kawhi 7-4
Without Russ 6-6
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#66 » by TrueLAfan » Sun May 15, 2022 9:35 pm

Captain Ballmer wrote:Easy pass on guys like Lyles, Blake etc. especially with the expense of T-Mann

We need athleticism, energy, physicality. T-mann can bring those things.


Not at the 4/5 he can't—and that’s where we’ll be light if Mook goes. RoCo can bang up to the PF level—but he’s still undersized for big 4s. He can only get spot minutes at the 5. Same with Batum. Other than Zu, we have nobody over 6’8” on the roster. No toughness at all.

I can see us going after the 4/5 player in free agency, and using Mook and, maybe, some combination of our (too) numerous 2/3 players to get the (badly) needed PG. Maybe Sacramento will choose not to pick Lyles option (which wouldn’t be smart, but you never know). Maybe the Spurs think Collins is healthy and they’ll let Bates-Diop go for a second rounder. Or maybe Collins is a question mark, and we can swap Mook and pick up a second rounder. Regardless, the need at the 4/5 is almost as serious as at the 1—and the position where we’ve got a surplus of players is at SG/SF. It is what it is.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#67 » by KL2 » Wed May 18, 2022 12:33 am

The pick OKC gets from us as part of the PG trade landed at number 12.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#68 » by madmaxmedia » Wed May 18, 2022 11:51 pm

KL2 wrote:The pick OKC gets from us as part of the PG trade landed at number 12.


Could you imagine if we had managed to sneak say just Top 1 or Top 3 protection, and then we win the lottery last night? :lol:

Anyway, with RoCo signing and hopefully Amir signing, it seems imperative we trade Morris. Hopefully to improve the roster construction, at the very least to lighten the luxury tax load.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#69 » by KL2 » Thu May 19, 2022 11:53 pm

https://hoopshype.com/lists/nba-draft-workout-tracker-where-are-prospects-going/

Draft workout tracker. Obviously more names will pop up and some we’ll never know about.

Terquavion Smith, SG, North Carolina St

Izaiah Brockington, SG, Iowa State
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#70 » by Roscoe Sheed » Sun May 22, 2022 5:11 am

Considering the possible need for a point guard, perhaps the Clippers should give Shane Larkin a look. It seems he has thrived in the Euro League. Maybe he could make meaningful contributions to an NBA roster.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#71 » by TrueLAfan » Sun May 22, 2022 11:02 pm

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/whats-next-for-bulls-chicago-is-in-unique-position-but-needs-another-aggressive-summer-to-contend-in-2023/

https://lastwordonsports.com/basketball/2022/05/11/chicago-bulls-two-trades-to-consider/

These are just two of (quite) a few rumors involving the Bulls and Mook that have been published in the last few months. I think it’s an ideal destination for him. They also have a player, Coby White, that I absolutely covet and, if they keep LaVine, is going to be on the block, and a $5 million trade exception. Hmm.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#72 » by ejftw » Mon May 23, 2022 12:59 am

I wouldn't call LWOS a reliable rumor source, but I've been talking about this with a few Bull fan friends, and they are all for it...of course, ownership would be different.

As far as Coby goes, Im with you, I'm sitting on a dozen or so Coby rookie cards, so here's to hoping
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He stay 

Post#73 » by Dynamix » Tue May 24, 2022 6:26 am

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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#74 » by esqtvd » Tue May 24, 2022 9:01 pm

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Image Are We Having Fun Yet?
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Re: He stay 

Post#75 » by madmaxmedia » Tue May 24, 2022 10:18 pm

Dynamix wrote:
Read on Twitter


And cool reply from Ty on what Nico said:

https://clutchpoints.com/clippers-news-tyronn-lue-reacts-to-nicolas-batum-saying-he-saved-his-life/
Clippers head coach Tyronn Lue spoke exclusively with ClutchPoints shortly after Batum’s comments were made public Monday. It was nothing but love and appreciation for his player.

“He said what?!” Lue quickly asked when first told of Batum’s comments.

“Batum essentially said you saved his life and he feels indebted to you and the Clippers,” I repeated in response.

“Wow,” a dumbfounded Lue said, followed by a chuckle and about six seconds of silence.

After gathering his thoughts, Lue explained what those comments meant to him.

“Whenever you have a player speak on you like that, it’s a great feeling because that’s what it’s all about,” Lue told ClutchPoints Monday. “It’s about the players and trying to get the best out of players. A lot of times, the players bring the best out of a coach as well. For Nico, a guy who has been in this league for a long time and a great veteran player, just to have him say those words, that means a lot.”
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He Stay Part 2 

Post#76 » by TrueLAfan » Fri May 27, 2022 12:13 am

Zu talking about his $7.5 million option getting picked up and future: "“I want to stay and I think they want to keep me,” Zubac said. “I think I should be there and they’re going to pick it up. I like Los Angeles a lot and I like the Clippers. It’s like a family to me. Hopefully, everything is going to work out.”

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Re: He stay 

Post#77 » by og15 » Fri May 27, 2022 1:19 am

Dynamix wrote:
Read on Twitter

Yea, this was great to read, glad to hear it
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#78 » by TrueLAfan » Fri May 27, 2022 2:01 pm

A great thing about Batum and Roco—and I think it’s something they know—is that we want to use them properly given their age and experience. Batum got a big contract to be a borderline star, a Robin, which he isn’t. He’s a multifaceted player, a glue guy, a focused player—but not a star. What he wants is to play to his strengths and not overdo it. He’s really not a full time starter at 33—and we don’t want him to be. We want him to be a 20-24 mpg player for 60-70 games. At 33, that’s exactly where he is and can excel at it in his career.

Same with RoCo, who is a couple of years younger. Could he still start and play 33-35 mpg? Probably; great motor. But we want him to play a little less, with less time out of position. He’s a 25-30 mpg player on our team and that’s great. He’ll give us 11 and 6 with great D at multiple positions and good shooting and all floorburn play. He knows he can go all when he's on the court and play where and how he wants to.

When you’ve got a vet, they’re out of the “I want to show people what I can do!” phase of their career. They know their skills, their physical ceilings, their strengths. I’m guessing RoCo and Batum are ecstatic to be on a team that allows them to play the way they know they can play best at this point in their careers.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#79 » by MartinToVaught » Fri May 27, 2022 7:19 pm

Batum chased the money in Charlotte and realized it didn't make him happy. I remember at one point he actually apologized to the Hornets fans for signing that contract (although the blame really belongs more on their front office for ever offering it). I can't think of any other athlete, at least in my lifetime, who's ever done that, even ones with legendarily awful contracts. Batum's a good guy and I'm happy he's found a home again with the Clippers.
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Re: Transaction Discussion Part 4 (Trades, Free-Agency, News, Rumors & Ideas) Offseason Version! 

Post#80 » by TrueLAfan » Thu Jun 2, 2022 3:35 pm

Celtics secret/not-so-secret X factor--Al Horford. He's the prototype for the kind of frontcourt player the league wants and we need. 6'9" 240, plays at mainly at C now but has been a PF/C throughout his career. Great player. If people wonder why I want to make a run at getting Trey Lyles, start with the size and ability to play at both PF and C. From their draft combines:

Al Horford
6’ 8” w/o shoes, 6’ 9.75” w/shoes, 7’ 0.75” wingspan, 8’11” standing reach, 246 pounds
Trey Lyles
6’ 9” w/o shoes, 6’ 10.25” w/shoes, 7’ 1.5” wingspan, 9’0” standing reach, 240 pounds

Virtually a carbon copy, size wise.

Of course, Lyles is not the player Horford is—not close. Horford is a former #3 pick, an all-star level player, a guy who averaged 15-8-3.5 with over a block for a decade while shooting 36% from three. Lyles would be lucky to get 60-70% of that. OTOH—Lyles is a lottery pick who's managed to improve his game as time has passed. And two thirds of Al Horford’s production would be something like 10-5 in 21 mpg while spreading the court and sliding between PF/C depending on matchup. Whoever we get in the frontcourt should be a player like that. It would help us so much.
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