Lakers Roster & Rotations

[TylersLakers]

Lakers Roster:

Guards- Reaves, D-Lo, Vincent, JHS
Wings- Rui, Vando, Prince, Reddish, Christie, Lewis
Bigs- AD, LeBron, Wood, Hayes

So - who plays? A typical rotation in the regular season usually only has 9-10 guys. Players are going to get squeezed. I'll first post who I THINK Darvin will go with to start the season.

PG- Russell/Vincent
SG- Reaves/Reddish/
SF- Rui/Prince/
PF- LeBron/Vando/
C- AD/Wood/

I think it'll last a couple weeks before eventually we switch it out once our record is 12-12 and we're giving him a ton of points.

If I was Darvin, here would be my rotation:

Reaves, Prince, LeBron, AD, Wood with Rui, Vincent, D-Lo, Vando off the bench.

9 guys to start. If foul trouble occurs or injuries occur, Christie will be the first one with an opportunity. Or if he comes out in training camp and pre-season and looks amazing while someone like Prince looks meh, he would take that spot.

- LeBron, Reaves handle playmaking duties
- Prince, Reaves and Wood all create space and have shooting gravity. Lots of driving opportunities for AD/LeBron. More space.
- Wood and AD can be pretty interchangeable. If Wood is closest to the basket on D, AD can be a roamer/perimeter defender. AD can run out and contest shots and then leak out for length of the court passes. We haven't seen that while AD has been the closest player to the rim the last 2 years.

For LeBron (no AD) line-ups, I'd love to see Vincent, Russell, Vando, LeBron, Wood. Surround LeBron with tough defenders (Vando, Vincent) and shooting (Wood, Russell).

For AD (no LeBron) line-ups, I'd want to prioritize playmaking around him: Russell, Reaves, Prince, Rui, AD.

For the closing line-up, it'll totally depend on who's playing well. Who's having the better game between Vincent and Russell? It'll be one of them. Are we playing a team with a dominant perimeter guy (Shai, Doncic, George/Leonard, Curry, Tatum, Booker/KD)? If we are, Vando is most likely playing big minutes whereas someone like D-Lo, Rui or Prince might play less than other match-ups.

Who do you think plays? Who do you want to play?

[stan francisco]

See Phil Jackson and Tex Winter’s philosophies for starting lineup: if you have a size advantage in basketball, you have an advantage. Also, defense wins rings.

I agree with keeping a tight rotation to start off but as long as it doesn’t kill competition opportunities for Lewis, Reddish, Vincent, Prince who are all going to be unhappy without enough PT.

I’d let defensive performance dictate the starting lineup, an la Tex’ theory, except for one position (C). I think this is how it will play out if defense decides who starts, which it should.

Starting PG: Reaves. Out of the guards who play both ends, he’s our best combo of ball handler and defender. It’s not even close on the defensive end, and he’s by far our best foul drawer on the other end. Arguably our best distributor next to LBJ. Ceiling yet to be determined as he’s improving as we speak. He’s already an elite PG and he’s getting better at all of the above. Reserves based on defense:
Hodge / Fino / D Lo

Starting SG: Christie will have his breakout year. I’m all in, banking on Christie establishing his name as a dangerous two-way player this year. Ceiling: if he builds muscle, I see his max potential as a Scottie Pippen, but with a scoring knack. For real. Reserves based on defense:
Vincent / Reddish / D Lo

Starting SF: Davis is a wing in a 6’11” body. Let’s let him have a season of not banging with Centers in the paint 42 minutes x 82. There’s not a wing he can’t defend and he can easily hold his own on offense against any wing. Obviously, lots of his PT will be at the 4 and the 5, but I want to explore the mismatches he’d create for opposing coaches as a starting 6’11” SF.
Reserves based on defense:
Vando, Prince, Lewis, Reddish

Starting PF: James is too old to play any other position on offense if we want to keep him uninjured. Needs to pass the ball more and faster, hog less, delegate more. Post up!
Reserves based on defense:
Hachimura, Vando, Prince

Starting C: Wood, despite his defensive fallacies (need to be coached by Handy and AD) should start at C so that we can mismatch AD at the SF spot. AD will have to double cover on defense when Woods plays C. On offense, playing AD, LBJ and Wood as our starting frontline should intimidate any offense. Reserves based on defense:
Davis, Hachimura, Hayes


EDIT: If all teams are healthy, chances are we’ll have to go through the Suns to get to the Finals. I like how we match up with them with AD at the three to mess up Durant’s offense and to make Durant play defense and get him in foul trouble. Same with Giannis and Jason Potatum. They’re 6’11” wings. AD can’t stop them as a C, but if he has a C covering the paint? Durant and Giannis and PoTatum will hate life with AD guarding them one-on-one for seven games.

[Godfather13]

I got three simple rules. Will adapt as the season rolls on and we get to learn more about the combos / players -
- minimize DLo + Wood line ups
- No one but Lebron, AD, Austin should have guaranteed starter role / minutes guarantees
- No more Lebron @ Center please

PG - DLo | Gabe (because I have Wood as the back up C) | JHS
SG - Reaves | Max | Lewis
SF - Prince | Vando | Cam
PF - Bron | Rui
C - AD | Wood | Hayes

Prince > Rui as starting SF is no indictment on Rui. I think Rui's is a better player than Prince, who might end more games than Prince, but I just like Prince as a better fit to the starting line up and Rui to the bench lineups because -
- Prince, Reaves & DLo buys a lot of spacing for our two big guys who aren't great shooters, to attack a less crowded paint >>> simultaneously creating more kick out opportunities for those 3 to get open 3s.

I expect the starters to be borderline shoddy on defense, mostly because of what AD & Lebron regress to in regular season + DLo & Austin being fairly limited in their defensive ability. I've just learnt to turn a blind eye towards it over the years.

Bench - Rui's & Wood's iso shot creation & Gabe's savvy playmaking from the point gives a nice floor to the bench squad offense. Gabe, Max, Vando & Rui are easily the better defenders at their positions than the starters, which should go some way in covering for Wood's faults on that end.


On paper, I expect a top 7-15 defense, because Ham will get the guys to give a ****, despite some obvious weak links, we also have some great defenders in here. Offensively, if Ham figures things out & of course health-willing, this could be a top 3ish offense with exceptional quality of interior rim attack(Lebron, AD, Austin, Rui, Cam, Prince), great shooting depth & individual shot creation all around. I was impressed by Ham's offensive schematics last year too, which bodes well for this team with better peices this time.

[TylersLakers]

See Phil Jackson and Tex Winter’s philosophies for starting lineup: if you have a size advantage in basketball, you have an advantage. Also, defense wins rings.

I agree with keeping a tight rotation to start off but as long as it doesn’t kill competition opportunities for Lewis, Reddish, Vincent, Prince who are all going to be unhappy without enough PT.

I’d let defensive performance dictate the starting lineup, an la Tex’ theory, except for one position (C). I think this is how it will play out if defense decides who starts, which it should.

Starting PG: Reaves. Out of the guards who play both ends, he’s our best combo of ball handler and defender. It’s not even close on the defensive end, and he’s by far our best foul drawer on the other end. Arguably our best distributor next to LBJ. Ceiling yet to be determined as he’s improving as we speak. He’s already an elite PG and he’s getting better at all of the above. Reserves based on defense:
Hodge / Fino / D Lo

Starting SG: Christie will have his breakout year. I’m all in, banking on Christie establishing his name as a dangerous two-way player this year. Ceiling: if he builds muscle, I see his max potential as a Scottie Pippen, but with a scoring knack. For real. Reserves based on defense:
Vincent / Reddish / D Lo

Starting SF: Davis is a wing in a 6’11” body. Let’s let him have a season of not banging with Centers in the paint 42 minutes x 82. There’s not a wing he can’t defend and he can easily hold his own on offense against any wing. Obviously, lots of his PT will be at the 4 and the 5, but I want to explore the mismatches he’d create for opposing coaches as a starting 6’11” SF.
Reserves based on defense:
Vando, Prince, Lewis, Reddish

Starting PF: James is too old to play any other position on offense if we want to keep him uninjured. Needs to pass the ball more and faster, hog less, delegate more. Post up!
Reserves based on defense:
Hachimura, Vando, Prince

Starting C: Wood, despite his defensive fallacies (need to be coached by Handy and AD) should start at C so that we can mismatch AD at the SF spot. AD will have to double cover on defense when Woods plays C. On offense, playing AD, LBJ and Wood as our starting frontline should intimidate any offense. Reserves based on defense:
Davis, Hachimura, Hayes


EDIT: If all teams are healthy, chances are we’ll have to go through the Suns to get to the Finals. I like how we match up with them with AD at the three to mess up Durant’s offense and to make Durant play defense and get him in foul trouble. Same with Giannis and Jason Potatum. They’re 6’11” wings. AD can’t stop them as a C, but if he has a C covering the paint? Durant and Giannis and PoTatum will hate life with AD guarding them one-on-one for seven games.

Yup, I'd love to see AD defending the wing a lot more. In my line-up, I basically him in the role you do. A help defender coming down or him in rotations and sprinting out to three point shooters, forcing a miss (contest or block) and then sprinting to the other end for a cheap bucket. That was so dominant in 2019-20.

I could absolutely see Christie winning the starting spot. If Prince and Vando want minutes, they have to bring it in training camp and pre-season.

[DanishLakerFan]

A few thoughts.

PG D'Lo / Vincent / (JHS)
SG Reaves / Christie
SF Vando / Prince / (Reddish)
PF Lebron / Rui
C AD / Wood / (Hayes)

Guards
D'Lo and Reaves will start at the 1 and 2 with Vincent being the main backup. They can all switch between the 1 and 2, so who plays most on a given night might be matchup-dependant. Christie was fantastic in SL so i expect him to crack the rotation.
JHS and Reddish will get opportunities as well, but might not make the rotation.

Wings and bigs
Theres a lot of guys that can play multiple positions and in order to balance lineups with regards to shooting and defense we might see Darwin Ham try a bunch of different lineups.

I expect AD to get his non-Lebron mins at the PF-spot alongside Wood or Hayes.

[ROballer]

To be fair, some of the takes here are wack.

But I'm here for another thing. The NBA Board of Governors approved the star load management rule.
Meaning, no team can rest two stars(All-Star or All NBA in the past 3 seasons) in the same game.

This affects us directly, both Lebron and Davis qualify.

Without an official injury report, one of them must play in every game, we can't rest both in the same game without getting fined.

This will affect the rotations a little bit.

[Godfather13]

To be fair, some of the takes here are wack.

But I'm here for another thing. The NBA Board of Governors approved the star load management rule.
Meaning, no team can rest two stars(All-Star or All NBA in the past 3 seasons) in the same game.

This affects us directly, both Lebron and Davis qualify.

Without an official injury report, one of them must play in every game, we can't rest both in the same game without getting fined.

This will affect the rotations a little bit.

We're good then, since AD made none of those last year

[ROballer]

To be fair, some of the takes here are wack.

But I'm here for another thing. The NBA Board of Governors approved the star load management rule.
Meaning, no team can rest two stars(All-Star or All NBA in the past 3 seasons) in the same game.

This affects us directly, both Lebron and Davis qualify.

Without an official injury report, one of them must play in every game, we can't rest both in the same game without getting fined.

This will affect the rotations a little bit.

We're good then, since AD made none of those last year

Last 3 years are taken into account. I think he made an All star game at least during this stretch.

[Godfather13]

To be fair, some of the takes here are wack.

But I'm here for another thing. The NBA Board of Governors approved the star load management rule.
Meaning, no team can rest two stars(All-Star or All NBA in the past 3 seasons) in the same game.

This affects us directly, both Lebron and Davis qualify.

Without an official injury report, one of them must play in every game, we can't rest both in the same game without getting fined.

This will affect the rotations a little bit.

We're good then, since AD made none of those last year

Last 3 years are taken into account. I think he made an All star game at least during this stretch.

Ouch.. Oh well. Guess they don't get to skip the same games then.

I honestly don't mind both of them skipping alternative b2b games, given how well our roster is constructed this year. It'll only give more minutes to some of the deserving role players who are about to get squeezed out of minutes.

[Godfather13]

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This may not be such a burden. AD rarely load manages, he's out with injuries more often than not. When he does need to do it, I guess they get a pre approval for LeBron or rest them on different nights.

[PedroFlu]

A few thoughts.

PG D'Lo / Vincent / (JHS)
SG Reaves / Christie
SF Vando / Prince / (Reddish)
PF Lebron / Rui
C AD / Wood / (Hayes)

Guards
D'Lo and Reaves will start at the 1 and 2 with Vincent being the main backup. They can all switch between the 1 and 2, so who plays most on a given night might be matchup-dependant. Christie was fantastic in SL so i expect him to crack the rotation.
JHS and Reddish will get opportunities as well, but might not make the rotation.

Wings and bigs
Theres a lot of guys that can play multiple positions and in order to balance lineups with regards to shooting and defense we might see Darwin Ham try a bunch of different lineups.

I expect AD to get his non-Lebron mins at the PF-spot alongside Wood or Hayes.

I agree with the expected rotation and with all you said.

It looks like a good place to start the season.

Just a few add ons:

(i) I hope Ham doesn't try to reward Rui's fantastic playoffs with the starting position and insists on it, playing him instead of Vando.

Rui has shown, to me, he is much better suited defensively as a PF/C, as he's too slow to guard the perimeter as a main job. As are LeBron and AD (AD does it fantastically well in spurts, but doing it primarily would absolutely burn him)

(ii) Considering DLO's bound to start, and LBJ and AD will be coasting on defense, you absolutely need an active perimeter defender along with Reaves in that starting lineup.

Prince is also slow. This leaves the job between Vando and Max.That's why I truly believe any choice apart from starting Vando or Max on that 5th available position will bring poor results in the first part of the season.

(iii) Actually, the big weird fit in this team is LBJ and AD together on the court.

They both can't shoot the ball on offense, and coast on defense on regular season as a rule. AD can turn it up, sure, but LeBron is defensively hopeless during the regular season. So, the principle should be: stack them as most as possible during games.

And I think specially now with the Wood signing, the team is very, very well equiped to do it. Wood would be great subbing any of them, the fit of the team would improve drastically. I actually expect the team to have a similar record without any of LBJ and AD than with both of them starting games.

In the playoffs, when both are focused, they obviously can play pretty damn well together.

(iv) I'm expecting Hayes, Reddish, JHS and Lewis to be fringe players during the regular season. Possibly also Prince, if Max confirms his development.

I hope Ham doesn't get too caught on trying to give all 12 vetereran players real opportunities from the get go (specially Hayes and Reddish), I think it could get too confusing and not enough minutes for players to get confidence. 10 guys is the most a rotation can be played during the regular season (actually I think Ham roled with it after the trades last season).

(v) Expect Vincent to be overplayed by Ham, precisely as Schroeder was. And along with it, a lot of 3 guard teams.

It's crazy, but i do think that, despite so many forwards and big sized players available, Ham will tend to fall back to his 3 guard lineup, with Vincent, Dlo and Reaves closing a lot of games. He simply loves dogs and high activity perimeter defenders, and Vincent will probably fill the exact void Schroder left.

(vi) All in all, team is very well equiped to be a 45 + win, comfortably top5 or top4 in the West during regular season (considering there are 10 or 12 good or great teams in the Conference, and the best of them, Denver, should coast a little), even considering LBJ and AD will each miss around 25 games.

(vii) The top6 guys to be trusted in the playoffs are already set: AD, LBJ, Rui, Reaves, DLo, Vincent.

It's quite similar to last season. There's a decent chance, however, one of Max, Wood and Vando are able to contribute heavily depending on matchups. Max becoming a trustworthy rotation player would be decisive for the team chances. LBJ could decline or actually be better than the last one, since I do think he was a bit slower due to that recent injury. AD has to be healthy, sure. Rui and Reaves could continue to progress, maybe DLo, after that horrid Nuggets series, could improve.

(viii) As currently set, this team is as well placed as any to beat the Nuggets in the West (who are the clear cut best team for now). Gotta see how Suns will do also. I see the Lakers in the 2-6 mix in the West to challenge Denver as a black horse.

(ix) Above all, I think this team still needs a closer in the toughest times. That's what would put them over the top.

They absolutely lacked it last playoffs - Reaves, Rui and LW4 actually kept the team afloat. LBJ obviously can't do it at this point. Denver really, really needed Murray's heroics to do it.

(x) Sure, they gotta see how the team does till the ASG. But they probably should really consider a trade during midseason, IF the opportunity arises. A DLO + Vando or Rui for Kyrie shouldn't be completely off play, IF Max consolidates as a starting caliber wing who can defend the perimeter. Reaves is a non starter for any trade, probably Max too.

(xi) A starting team of Kyrie, Reaves, Christie, LBJ, AD would possibly be the best in the entire League, and comparable to Nuggets. If you get a solid contribution from Vincent + Vando/Rui and maybe Prince/Wood to eat minutes, I think there's a bigger chance the team wins it all.

Anyway, I'd be more than glad to see them rolling with the current guys till the end, this is a very likeable group. Looking forward to the season!

Edit: just saw that Vando got an extention. That means they really intend to play him now. And also, he eats more salary in a possible trade. Good move IMO! I do think he complements well the starting team.

[jehosafats]

I don't know that Ham himself shouldn't slowly be rotated out of his position. His rotations were a big problem, before and after the All-Star break. He won't let a solid roster get in the way of his janky rotations.

[Godfather13]

I don't know that Ham himself shouldn't slowly be rotated out of his position. His rotations were a big problem, before and after the All-Star break. He won't let a solid roster get in the way of his janky rotations.

He does like to play favorites, regardless of what the situation demands, and it aggravating to watch sometimes

Hopefully it was a result of not having many great choices last season, and turns out to be different this season, since we have a better roster.

[PedroFlu]

Ham strikes as developing Doc Rivers, a "player's coach"; an emotional guy that has good relationship skills, leads by developing personal relations with his players and so typically when a guy manages to get into his circle of trust, he's loyal to him.

I.E., he should be a bit stubborn and also can't react in real time. Probably relies on assistants for adjustments game to game. Good news is, they were great adjusting in last playoffs.

But yep, I don't fully trust him to extract the very best of players. But he also doesn't try to be the smartest guy in the room, which is good. I'd say he's average.

[Godfather13]

Ham strikes as developing Doc Rivers, a "player's coach"; an emotional guy that has good relationship skills, leads by developing personal relations with his players and so typically when a guy manages to get into his circle of trust, he's loyal to him.

I.E., he should be a bit stubborn and also can't react in real time. Probably relies on assistants for adjustments game to game. Good news is, they were great adjusting in last playoffs.

But yep, I don't fully trust him to extract the very best of players. But he also doesn't try to be the smartest guy in the room, which is good. I'd say he's average.

Yeah. I see it as a huge weakness when he prioritizes loyalties over skill/form/fit/merit. Vogel had the same problems. Avery Bradley Flashbacks anyone? lol..

It's possible some of it is dictated by the Front Office(read: Kurt Rambis), who does fancy himself to be Jeanie's Jerry West. Whose gonna tell the buffoon that he is in fact a buffoon, who is not even fit to breathe the same air as Jerry.


Aside from that, I rate Ham as a solid B-. There are definitely more than 15 coaches in the league, I'd choose Ham over.

Strengths -
- Offensive Scheme - A+(given the resources last year. I enjoyed the double drags & help beaters in the regular season + customized offensive game plans to exploit other team's weaknesses)
- Playoff Adjustments - B-(came a game or two too late, but at least he isn't {yet} as brain dead as Doc/Bud)
- Player buy in / Motivation - A+

Weaknesses -
- Player Rotations / Line Ups planning - F(I wish there was a worse grade out there, cos he would deserve it. I cut him a little leeway because of the roster he inherited, which wasn't great even after the deadline)
- Defensive scheme - D(Doesn't pick up what casual fans like us can so easily during games. Needed to drop games to realize problems that could've been fixed much earlier)


All that said, it's hard to draw a line between Ham & his assistants, specially Jent. We really don't know where one begins & the other ends, until they part ways & Jent showcases his arsenal as a HC. It's entirely possible that Ham runs the entire show, with little inputs from the assistants here and there OR Jent/another assistant is the brains behind the operation, a'la Wozniak.

[TylersLakers]

I don't know that Ham himself shouldn't slowly be rotated out of his position. His rotations were a big problem, before and after the All-Star break. He won't let a solid roster get in the way of his janky rotations.

I thought he was much, much better when he didn't have Westbrook on the team. He settled into a starting line-up for the remainder of the season - Reaves/D-Lo/Vando/LeBron/AD and adjusted well in the first two rounds against Memphis and Golden State. I thought he was terrible against the Nuggets though.

Can't blame him totally - if our stars would have played like stars of some of those fourth quarters - we could've won every game. AD and LeBron were badly outplayed by Jokic and Murray.

[jehosafats]

I don't know that Ham himself shouldn't slowly be rotated out of his position. His rotations were a big problem, before and after the All-Star break. He won't let a solid roster get in the way of his janky rotations.

I thought he was much, much better when he didn't have Westbrook on the team. He settled into a starting line-up for the remainder of the season - Reaves/D-Lo/Vando/LeBron/AD and adjusted well in the first two rounds against Memphis and Golden State. I thought he was terrible against the Nuggets though.

Can't blame him totally - if our stars would have played like stars of some of those fourth quarters - we could've won every game. AD and LeBron were badly outplayed by Jokic and Murray.

They entered the playoffs lucky losers, which wasn't entirely his fault. I feel like their pace covered up a lot of coaching mistakes. He would let them meander down the floor in the the final minutes of winnable games,. They would have no game plan on either end of the floor, just playing isolation, taking low percentage shots, and with some seriously mismatched personnel. There's some cleaning up to do.

[PedroFlu]

I think coaches matter less than it seems in the NBA. What they basically have to do is simply refrain from **** it up and have common sense.

LeBron can't take over real games for a while now, AD is not that guy. The team simply lacks a leading player who can score in the toughest times - Murray was that guy for the other team. Had Murray choked and DLO balled, Lakers would have won it. It's as simple as that.

Point being, Ham is probably fine. What they lack is that last touch in personnel, a guy who can take over.

[stan francisco]

I think Ham is okay. A player’s coach. Listens to his assistants between games but can’t adjust for $#!t during a game. He got completely out-coached by Malone. Player development is good with this staff. Vibe and culture also seems good on the team, but we lost to Denver because he was unable to adjust, unable to bench D Lo for the series when he was being attacked every possession.

To me, coaching matters greatly in the playoffs which is about making adjustments to adjustments. Phil Jackson won us many series we shouldn’t have won, especially post Shaq.

Scoring will probably happen by committee with this roster. We won’t need that go-to guy. Reaves is the engine that gets us going late in games. I’m fine with it, actually prefer it that way. He’s efficient sharing, as well as getting to the stripe. We have five or six players who can put up 20 on any given night with enough PT. And three or four players who can put up 25 plus.

Defense and coaching adjustments will be the most likely determining factors keeping us away from a championship. Not worried about our offense one bit.

[TylersLakers]

I don't know that Ham himself shouldn't slowly be rotated out of his position. His rotations were a big problem, before and after the All-Star break. He won't let a solid roster get in the way of his janky rotations.

I thought he was much, much better when he didn't have Westbrook on the team. He settled into a starting line-up for the remainder of the season - Reaves/D-Lo/Vando/LeBron/AD and adjusted well in the first two rounds against Memphis and Golden State. I thought he was terrible against the Nuggets though.

Can't blame him totally - if our stars would have played like stars of some of those fourth quarters - we could've won every game. AD and LeBron were badly outplayed by Jokic and Murray.

They entered the playoffs lucky losers, which wasn't entirely his fault. I feel like their pace covered up a lot of coaching mistakes. He would let them meander down the floor in the the final minutes of winnable games,. They would have no game plan on either end of the floor, just playing isolation, taking low percentage shots, and with some seriously mismatched personnel. There's some cleaning up to do.

Westbrook also voluntarily killed us down the stretch in so many 4th quarters earlier in the season. There was a Portland game that we lost at home that was especially terrible. 4 months ago, I could've told you every single game he single handedly murdered us. I'm glad that is over and I can enjoy basketball again.