Official Trade Thread (all trade ideas here. No exceptions)

[Danny Darko]

I merged the ongoing trade suggestions. Sorry but a few posts were lost due to the adds that cover the selection boxes. Can't get them to go away even in alternative browsers. I hate those ads.

[That Nicka]

Jesus H. Christ

The season isnt over yet

[Verbal]

Looks like my offseason trade thread got deleted and this got stickied.

What a turn of events.

[Verbal]

And I happened to make that offseason thread weeks before this.

Go figure.

[snaquille oatmeal]

The Kings have no incentive to do an Artest/Odom swap (as proposed a few times in this thread already). Odom isn't a legitimate 4, there's no age significant difference between Artest & Odom (Odom is actually a few days older), and there's no contract difference as both are expiring.

ok so what if Artest opts out then the Kings lose him for nothing? in a sign and trade deal the Kings would get Odoms hefty expiring contract (which is twice as valuble as Artest) to get what they need. is that insentive enough?

[snaquille oatmeal]

just wait till ariza gets a better j in the offseason... odom shouldnt be traded imo... yall laker fans dont realize what you have.

yes we do. Odom has been inconsistant for the past 4 seasons. when he is on he is great, but you never know when you will get that Odom. maybe it's the system that he can't grasp, but I would rather down grade Odoms inconsistance awsomeness for defensive and offensive consistance.

[Danny Darko]

The Kings have no incentive to do an Artest/Odom swap (as proposed a few times in this thread already). Odom isn't a legitimate 4, there's no age significant difference between Artest & Odom (Odom is actually a few days older), and there's no contract difference as both are expiring.

Odom is a legit 4 otherwise we wouldn't have made it to the finals... look at his numbers, he's better than most 4's in the league. Don't let ball handling fool you.

His contract is faaaaar more attractive than Artest's as well... not to mention artest can opt out like right now and say later to the kings for nothing.

The thing with Odom, isn't his inconsistencies.. it's that he'd be a 3 next year. He does have that skill set, perhaps, but not for a team with Bynum and Gasol in the paint. It's a must that we find a lockdown D guy who hits the 3ball when Drew is back.

[rpa]

-= original quote snipped =-

ok so what if Artest opts out then the Kings lose him for nothing? in a sign and trade deal the Kings would get Odoms hefty expiring contract (which is twice as valuble as Artest) to get what they need. is that insentive enough?

Expiring contracts aren't valuable to rebuilding teams. The entire point of having an expiring contract to trade is so you can pick up another team's disgruntled star--but a rebuilding team wants young pieces they can develop.

Further, the theory that an expiring contract is more valuable than Artest is beyond ludicrous on so many levels.

Lastly, Artest can't be traded unless he declines the opt out. The rule is simply that you can't trade a player who will be or may be a free agent.

[Danny Darko]

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Expiring contracts aren't valuable to rebuilding teams. The entire point of having an expiring contract to trade is so you can pick up another team's disgruntled star--but a rebuilding team wants young pieces they can develop.

Further, the theory that an expiring contract is more valuable than Artest is beyond ludicrous on so many levels.

Lastly, Artest can't be traded unless he declines the opt out. The rule is simply that you can't trade a player who will be or may be a free agent.

Ok, so Lamar is better than Shareef Abdur-Rahim and he's far younger. Young enough to still rebuild. His contract is in fact far more attractive than Artests because he's slightly overpaid and that is good for an expiring. You could trade him later for young players or a needed part, or make room to rebuild via free agency.

You can trade Ron either way... he opts out and sign and trade, when was the last time that happened? Rashard Lewis last year, same scenario.

[Danny Darko]

come to think of it... why trade Odom for Artest? He will likely opt out, says he doesn't care about the money but rather a ring... So sign him to the mle, then when Odom expires he will have established his value to us and we would have more funds to extend him if both sides want.

[rpa]

Odom is a legit 4 otherwise we wouldn't have made it to the finals... look at his numbers, he's better than most 4's in the league. Don't let ball handling fool you.

The Lakers made the finals because of Kobe and legitimate big men (Bynum for the 1st half of the year and Gasol for the 2nd half) along with a good coach and a capable bench.

His contract is faaaaar more attractive than Artest's as well

Same number of years at twice the cost. How is that more attractive?

... not to mention artest can opt out like right now and say later to the kings for nothing.

However:
a) That's unlikely as Artest would be forced to accept a MLE deal for the final big pay day of his career
b) He can't be traded until deciding on that option (to decline it that is)--see last post for reasoning.

[rpa]

Ok, so Lamar is better than Shareef Abdur-Rahim and he's far younger. Young enough to still rebuild. His contract is in fact far more attractive than Artests because he's slightly overpaid and that is good for an expiring. You could trade him later for young players or a needed part, or make room to rebuild via free agency.

When was the last time a team traded good young players suitable for a rebuilding team for expiring contracts. Your scenario doesn't make the least bit of sense.

You can trade Ron either way... he opts out and sign and trade, when was the last time that happened? Rashard Lewis last year, same scenario.

Lewis' scenario was vastly different in that the team that went after him was under the cap. Lewis knew he could get a big pay day regardless of the situation with his current (at the time) team. There really isn't a team out there that Artest would get more than the MLE from.

come to think of it... why trade Odom for Artest? He will likely opt out, says he doesn't care about the money but rather a ring... So sign him to the mle, then when Odom expires he will have established his value to us and we would have more funds to extend him if both sides want.

He's also said that it's up to his AGENT whether or not he opts out. If you're Artest's agent do you take an MLE contract for his last big payday? Roughly HALF of what Artest is worth? Of course not.

[LLcoleJ]

I recall some Sac fans claiming that Artest was a good as opt out. That he was an expiring deal this past year so there is no need for cap relief.

[snaquille oatmeal]

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Expiring contracts aren't valuable to rebuilding teams. The entire point of having an expiring contract to trade is so you can pick up another team's disgruntled star--but a rebuilding team wants young pieces they can develop.

expiring crontracts are what rebuilding teams use to to get what they need becuse it gives them salary room to get what they need.

just an example, if the Kings wanted Baron Davis, the Warriors don't need anybody that the Kings have, but they do want somebody like Odom they trade Artest for Odom who is leaving anyway would make sense.

another example is the Kings could trade Odom for a bunch of young players etc. the more expensive the contract the more young players they can get.

or they can just let Odoms contract expire which would give then a hella lot more cap room than Artests contract would.

Further, the theory that an expiring contract is more valuable than Artest is beyond ludicrous on so many levels.

even on the level that Artest decides to leave the Kings and the Kings get nothing out of it? if Artest does decide to leave would the Kings just let him walk or would they try to get something first? a Lamar Odom and his expiring contract would be a lot better than nothing.

Lastly, Artest can't be traded unless he declines the opt out. The rule is simply that you can't trade a player who will be or may be a free agent.

this is just wrong, the Kings can trade him straight up or if Ron decides to opt out on a sign and trade.

understand that what we are doing is just talk and is not something that will happen for sure. the possibility is there, the avenues are there to make it happen and we do understand that it may not happen.

just because we would like to see it happen doesn't mean that it will happen, but like I said the possibility and the means are there.

[rpa]

expiring crontracts are what rebuilding teams use to to get what they need becuse it gives them salary room to get what they need.

You mean cap space? If that's the case then why not just tell Artest to opt out and leave--the Kings get instant salary cap relief.

this is just wrong, the Kings can trade him straight up or if Ron decides to opt out on a sign and trade.

Do I need to link you to the salary cap FAQ? Until Artest accepts or declines the opt out he CANNOT be traded. Teams CANNOT trade would be or might be free agents after the trade deadline.

even on the level that Artest decides to leave the Kings and the Kings get nothing out of it? if Artest does decide to leave would the Kings just let him walk or would they try to get something first? a Lamar Odom and his expiring contract would be a lot better than nothing.

The Kings would want Odom solely for his expiring contract (and even that's a stretch)--what's the point in having that expiring contract when you already have the majority of that salary OFF the books (with Artest opting out)?

The whole notion that expiring contracts, for rebuilding teams, are this incredibly valuable commodity is absolutely ridiculous. In my mind there hasn't been a trade in years (as a matter of fact I can't think of the last one) where a REBUILDING team used an expiring contract to acquire pieces that:
a) Helped them rebuild
&
b) Didn't put them worse off salary cap wise.

Even if you think that the Kings could turn around and trade Odom for rebuilding pieces the question would be simple: why not do that RIGHT NOW with Artest?

Odom may be a good player but at his age and contract he doesn't make one bit of sense on the Kings. They're a rebuilding team; they want rebuilding pieces NOW; they aren't going to move Artest for a player that MAY get them rebuilding pieces sometime in the near future--and thinking they'd do that (and put the onus on THEMSELVES to find another deal where they'd get what they want) is just dumb.

[Danny Darko]

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When was the last time a team traded good young players suitable for a rebuilding team for expiring contracts. Your scenario doesn't make the least bit of sense.

It does if you perpetually have lottery picks but never winning, or need a specific piece to the puzzle.. The Grizz have 3 young pg's for instance.

Corvus Crow wrote:
come to think of it... why trade Odom for Artest? He will likely opt out, says he doesn't care about the money but rather a ring... So sign him to the mle, then when Odom expires he will have established his value to us and we would have more funds to extend him if both sides want.


He's also said that it's up to his AGENT whether or not he opts out. If you're Artest's agent do you take an MLE contract for his last big payday? Roughly HALF of what Artest is worth? Of course not.

true you never know what's gonna happen with Ron Ron.


Same number of years at twice the cost. How is that more attractive? -

that is actually exactly how it works... it means they would either have the ability to make more cap room and bid higher for free agents, or other teams could, thus making the larger contract the best expiring. I thought that was pretty common knowledge.

Snaq is right... it's not like it must happen we know it's just speculation. I think the Maloofs also said something about never trading with LA, so probably they wouldn't. He's one of 3 players that fill our needs in my opinion.

[Danny Darko]

Odom is 28.... how long do you intend on building for? 6-8 years?

[rpa]

It does if you perpetually have lottery picks but never winning, or need a specific piece to the puzzle.. The Grizz have 3 young pg's for instance.

Go ask Grizz fans if they'd even consider unloading any 1 of those 3 for an expiring contract. You'll probably get 2 answers:
1) Hell No
2) Sure, but you have to take all our bad contracts (which falls in line w/ what I said in my last post: it would make the team getting that young player worse off salary wise)

that is actually exactly how it works... it means they would either have the ability to make more cap room and bid higher for free agents, or other teams could, thus making the larger contract the best expiring. I thought that was pretty common knowledge.

And again, the whole point of team X trading their expiring to team Y would be so team Y can dump a player they don't want for whatever reason. The most common reasons (that are especially applicable here):
1) Team Y wants to go into rebuilding mode and is shedding salary
2) Team Y thinks the player is way overpaid

In either of those 2 likely cases the player in question wouldn't benefit a rebuilding team like the Kings (who would be playing team X in the hypothetical)

Odom is 28.... how long do you intend on building for? 6-8 years?

a) He'll be 29 at the start of next season. Give the Kings 2 years to rebuild and Odom is already 31. How long of a window does that leave the team to win? 1 year, maybe 2 (if that)?
b) He's actually OLDER than Artest. If the Kings were content having a 28-29 year old in their rebuilding plans then they'd keep Artest (the more talented of the 2 IMO).

[rpa]

And yes, this scenario is a complete hypothetical that depends on so many different facts (not the least of which, as you mentioned, is getting around the Maloofs' hatred for your franchise) but my point is merely that it's naive to assume that the Kings would be willing to deal Artest in a trade for a player that would put the onus on them to find ANOTHER trade in order to get pieces that help them.

I mean, if you're the Kings and you have the option of moving Artest to the Lakers for Odom or moving Artest to (examples here):

1) The Warriors for their TPE and 1st rounder
or
2) The Suns for their TPE and 1st rounder
or
3) The Raps for Ford and a pick now or in the future (as has been proposed on the trade board for over a month now)

It's pretty obvious to me that the Kings would take any of those 3 hypothetical deals hands down before a deal for Odom.

[tkb]

Odom + Farmar for Billups
Artest for MLE

Bynum / Mbenga / Mihm
Gasol / Turiaf / Radmanovic
Artest / Ariza / Walton
Bryant / Vujacic / Karl or Newble
Billups / Fisher / Yue

One can dream right? That line-up KILLS defensively.