B/R Eric Pincus, CLE MIA PHI WAS

[nate33]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

This makes more sense to me.

[PhillyNj]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

This makes more sense to me.

It makes a lot more sense for Philly to just spend all the cap space and save the draft picks.

[nate33]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

This makes more sense to me.

It makes a lot more sense for Philly to just spend all the cap space and save the draft picks.

Yeah, I don't disagree with that either.

Honestly, the problem here is the timing. Philly might be interested in a deal like this AFTER first striking out in free agency. But the draft takes place before free agency so if Philly is going to use the #16 pick as an asset, they need to do so before knowing how free agency pans out.

[jbk1234]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

Adopting a we'll just waste the capspace anyway mindset is how you end up a lottery team in perpetuity. Lauri was signed to such a bargain contract that the Jazz are going to have to restructure his contract in order to extend him. The Cavs only got Allen because they had capspace midseason and the contract we gave him is considered team-friendly now. Strus, who would start in front Herro, makes half as much as him.

Cherry-picking Altman's one, $8M per, miss and using that as a justification to pay a 6th man $30M per is just seriously misguided IMO.

Setting that aside, do you think there's a chance that Cleveland can do better than Herro with those picks (which are still light) and a giant TPE?

Do you think David Griffin might have some interest in a giant TPE and a pick for Ingram given the the Pels cap problems?

[jbk1234]

This makes more sense to me.

It makes a lot more sense for Philly to just spend all the cap space and save the draft picks.

Yeah, I don't disagree with that either.

Honestly, the problem here is the timing. Philly might be interested in a deal like this AFTER first striking out in free agency. But the draft takes place before free agency so if Philly is going to use the #16 pick as an asset, they need to do so before knowing how free agency pans out.

I don't know that either Philly, or Miami’s picks in this draft hold enough value to make or break the trade. The Cavs already have a pick in this draft.

[tidho]

OP deal does favor WAS at the expense of CLE. Flip Jovic and i think it's something that could legitimately be discussed.

That puts it loosely at Mitchell -4- Herro, Jovic, #15, and two future firsts. I think CLE would have to be happy with that, if they're moving Mitchell.

[DowJones]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

Adopting a we'll just waste the capspace anyway mindset is how you end up a lottery team in perpetuity. Lauri was signed to such a bargain contract that the Jazz are going to have to restructure his contract in order to extend him. The Cavs only got Allen because they had capspace midseason and the contract we gave him is considered team-friendly now. Strus, who would start in front Herro, makes half as much as him.

Cherry-picking Altman's one, $8M per, miss and using that as a justification to pay a 6th man $30M per is just seriously misguided
Setting that aside, do you think there's a chance that Cleveland can do better than Herro with those picks (which are still light) and a giant TPE?

Do you think David Griffin might have some interest in a giant TPE and a pick for Ingram given the the Pels cap problems?

If NO wants to trade Ingram into our cap space with a few of the Miami assets going to the Pelicans, I am all ears. Obviously that would trump Herro. I also want to say that before I take back Herro, I would shop the cap-space and see if there were any takers. What I am saying is that absent anyone better becoming available, I would take Herro.

Herro was 21-5-5 as a 23/24 year old on shooting splits of 44/40/86. That isn't bad. I truly do not think we could go on the free agent market and get a better a better player.

[DowJones]

OP deal does favor WAS at the expense of CLE. Flip Jovic and i think it's something that could legitimately be discussed.

That puts it loosely at Mitchell -4- Herro, Jovic, #15, and two future firsts. I think CLE would have to be happy with that, if they're moving Mitchell.

As long as the future picks are the 2028 LAC unprotected pick and a 2029, 2030, or 2031 unprotected Miami pick, I agree. I still think this offer could be beaten, but I think this is an acceptable offer for Mitchell if he refuses to extend.

[jbk1234]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

Adopting a we'll just waste the capspace anyway mindset is how you end up a lottery team in perpetuity. Lauri was signed to such a bargain contract that the Jazz are going to have to restructure his contract in order to extend him. The Cavs only got Allen because they had capspace midseason and the contract we gave him is considered team-friendly now. Strus, who would start in front Herro, makes half as much as him.

Cherry-picking Altman's one, $8M per, miss and using that as a justification to pay a 6th man $30M per is just seriously misguided
Setting that aside, do you think there's a chance that Cleveland can do better than Herro with those picks (which are still light) and a giant TPE?

Do you think David Griffin might have some interest in a giant TPE and a pick for Ingram given the the Pels cap problems?

If NO wants to trade Ingram into our cap space with a few of the Miami assets going to the Pelicans, I am all ears. Obviously that would trump Herro. I also want to say that before I take back Herro, I would shop the cap-space and see if there were any takers. What I am saying is that absent anyone better becoming available, I would take Herro.

Herro was 21-5-5 as a 23/24 year old on shooting splits of 44/40/86. That isn't bad. I truly do not think we could go on the free agent market and get a better a better player.

I'd rather explore S&Ts and/or RFA signings of players we don't think are maxed out. We have done better and we have done better recently. Frankly, if we're going to pay a sixth man that type of money, we should absorb McCollum into a TPE and get another 1st from the Pelicans for our troubles.

[louc1970]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

I agree with the inclusion of Herro. Worst case - trade him later.

Cleveland trades Mitchell
Cleveland receives Herro and all picks

Miami trades Butler, Herro same picks as above
Miami receives Mitchell, Reed, LeVert
Including Reed/Levert to reduce money on the books for Cleveland and Philly to pursue FAs. Miami could still take on more money to please everyone.

Philly trades Reed, same picks as above
Philly receives Butler

[DowJones]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

I agree with the inclusion of Herro. Worst case - trade him later.

Cleveland trades Mitchell
Cleveland receives Herro and all picks

Miami trades Butler, Herro same picks as above
Miami receives Mitchell, Reed, LeVert
Including Reed/Levert to reduce money on the books for Cleveland and Philly to pursue FAs. Miami could still take on more money to please everyone.

Philly trades Reed, same picks as above
Philly receives Butler

This version isn't enough for me as a Cavs fan. You need to add Jovic or JJJ for it to compete with what the Lakers or Nets are likely to offer.

[louc1970]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

I agree with the inclusion of Herro. Worst case - trade him later.

Cleveland trades Mitchell
Cleveland receives Herro and all picks

Miami trades Butler, Herro same picks as above
Miami receives Mitchell, Reed, LeVert
Including Reed/Levert to reduce money on the books for Cleveland and Philly to pursue FAs. Miami could still take on more money to please everyone.

Philly trades Reed, same picks as above
Philly receives Butler

This version isn't enough for me as a Cavs fan. You need to add Jovic or JJJ for it to compete with what the Lakers or Nets are likely to offer.

Jaquez is not on the table. You can have Jovic or Martin or O. Robinson. Not sure of the need as they will all be backups to backups and eat salary Cleveland could use elsewhere.

[daoneandonly]

I think some people are misreading the format?

Washington gets Reed, 16th and Jovic for Kuzma. Its good. Really good. But not great?

Cavs need another first from Miami, and probably don’t want to end up with Herro. But I don’t think they’d kill the deal over it. They can flip him or Caris after this deal for a wing.

Still too good for a guy with Kuzma's skillset imo

[DowJones]

I agree with the inclusion of Herro. Worst case - trade him later.

Cleveland trades Mitchell
Cleveland receives Herro and all picks

Miami trades Butler, Herro same picks as above
Miami receives Mitchell, Reed, LeVert
Including Reed/Levert to reduce money on the books for Cleveland and Philly to pursue FAs. Miami could still take on more money to please everyone.

Philly trades Reed, same picks as above
Philly receives Butler

This version isn't enough for me as a Cavs fan. You need to add Jovic or JJJ for it to compete with what the Lakers or Nets are likely to offer.

Jaquez is not on the table. You can have Jovic or Martin or O. Robinson. Not sure of the need as they will all be backups to backups and eat salary Cleveland could use elsewhere.

I think Jovic is young enough to be seen as an asset. He had an OK year for a 20 year old. He can also play the 4 next to Mobley long-term and provide spacing. I think Jovic and the 2028 LAC first have enough upside to make this a competitive offer for Mitchell.

[jbk1234]

Washington just complicates things.

Cleveland Trades: Donovan Mitchell
Philly Trades: Draft rights to 16th pick, 2028 LAC unprotected 1st
Miami Trades: Butler, Jovic, 2030 unprotected 1st

-Butler to Philly, Mitchell to Miami, and all the other stuff to Cleveland

That is a trade package for Cleveland that might beat a Brooklyn package that features 2 PHX first rounders or a package of Rui/Reaves/draft rights to #17, and 2029/2031 unprotected 1st rounders.

edit* I would actually push for Herro to be added as a Cavs fan. Cleveland will be in desperate need of scoring if they trade Mitchell and I don't think there is any chance the Cavs do better than Herro for 3 years/$93 million in the free agent market. Heck, we are more likely to end up with another Niang.

I agree with the inclusion of Herro. Worst case - trade him later.

Cleveland trades Mitchell
Cleveland receives Herro and all picks

Miami trades Butler, Herro same picks as above
Miami receives Mitchell, Reed, LeVert
Including Reed/Levert to reduce money on the books for Cleveland and Philly to pursue FAs. Miami could still take on more money to please everyone.

Philly trades Reed, same picks as above
Philly receives Butler

The Cavs aren't in a position where they have to accept that type of worst case. They don't have to deal with the Heat at all. If there are two comparable offers, and Gilbert believes that Riley or Butler tampered with the Cavs best player while under contract, again, guess which team Mitchell is getting traded to?

[JJ_PR]

Cleveland hangs up the phone laughing.

[tidho]

I think Jovic is young enough to be seen as an asset. He had an OK year for a 20 year old. He can also play the 4 next to Mobley long-term and provide spacing. I think Jovic and the 2028 LAC first have enough upside to make this a competitive offer for Mitchell.

I think he should definitely be considered an asset. Herro, Jovic, and picks (especially one this year) is not only decent value, but that's three pieces you'd be seeing this coming year, making it much more palatable for fans, and less likely you take a giant tumble backwards when moving Mitchell.

[nate33]

Cleveland hangs up the phone laughing.

There's no doubt Cleveland is not getting fair value for Mitchell here. But the question is, do they actually have the capability of getting fair value? Cleveland doesn't hang up the phone if the other offers out there are less than this one.

[JJ_PR]

Cleveland hangs up the phone laughing.

There's no doubt Cleveland is not getting fair value for Mitchell here. But the question is, do they actually have the capability of getting fair value? Cleveland doesn't hang up the phone if the other offers out there are less than this one.

If the Cavs do decide to trade him, there will be a desperate team out there, without a doubt.

That said, Mitchell hasn't shown any signs of being unhappy in Cleveland, and they're in the midst of a deep playoff run.

[NYG]

What non-2024 picks go where?

Reed and Mitchell to Miami
Butler to Philly
Herro to Cleveland

That's the deal IMO... just need all 3 fan bases to agree on the picks