Re: Instant Reaction: What Does Golden State Do This Off-Season?
Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2024 10:39 pm
Hit the lotto and get the first pick. Trade everyone not on a rookie contract.
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NYG wrote:What do the Warriors do this off-season?
Do they keep Klay? Do they just run it back mostly? Do they keep CP3 or renounce his salary to get below the tax? If they keep Paul, do they trade him? Do they trade any of the young guys?
gswhoops wrote:Wolveswin wrote:How about Randle? Warriors kind of have resources Wolves need for Towns. But no way do Wolves trade Towns to West/Warriors. And no way Warriors want Towns 50M. Enter Knicks and Randle…
To Knicks: Towns + Wiggins + Wolves Filler
To Warriors: Randle + DDV or Hart + Wolves Filler
To Wolves: Kuminga + Moody + Bogdanovic + Picks from Warriors and Knicks
No way the Warriors pay for Towns and settle for Randle.
gswhoops wrote:My two cents as a Warriors fan, in no particular order:
-Steph isn't getting traded unless he asks for it, full stop. He means too much to the franchise. He's still good enough to be the #1 guy on a contender so you build around him.
-I have a hard time seeing Dray return anything that helps us more than he does, so he probably stays.
-The team needs to have a hard convo with Klay. He's not consistent enough to be a starter or to play 30+ minutes a night or close games regularly. If he's ok taking slightly north of MLE money to be a 6th/7th man then re-sign him. Otherwise thank him for the memories and let him chase another ring/paycheck elsewhere.
-CP3 is getting cut and the team is realizing the cap savings unless a true star becomes available, which isn't likely. We have a slim window to get out of the repeater tax and that requires getting under the tax line this year. Warriors aren't going to keep paying the repeater tax for a Lavine or Grant type player.
-Kuminga needs to be penciled into a starting role next year. Barring a massive trade he's the most likely player we have to be able to fill the #2 option role we desperately need. Moody, Podz, and TJD need to be given as many minutes as they can handle so we can see if they're worth re-signing (especially Moody).
-I expect that Looney will be stretch-waived (only $3M of his $8.5M for next year is guaranteed). He's simply not an effective player anymore. I would hope we use some or all of the MLE to sign a legitimate 5 who will split time with TJD next year. Dray should play as few minutes as possible at the 5 during the regular season.
-Try and move Wiggins and/or GP2 for salary relief or expiring contracts. Honestly, I'd take that THJ/Maxi deal right now. Maybe use the 2nd from that deal and/or some of our own to move GP2 to a cap space team for a TPE (he's expiring).
Roll into next year with something like:
(MLE Big) / TJD
Draymond / Maxi
Kuminga / THJ
Moody / Klay
Curry / Podz
Is it a contender? No. But it's at least an interesting squad with some upward growth potential that's not paying an insane luxury tax bill.
Wolveswin wrote:To Raptors: Wiggins + 2nds or more?
To Pelicans: Poeltl + Moody + GSW 1st or two
To Warriors: Ingram
Pels can cut bait getting assets for expiring Ingram.
Raps get hometown kid.
Warriors risk Ingram expiring/fitting.
Green
Kuminga
Ingram
Klay
Curry
eminence wrote:The absolute ideal outcome for the Warriors (non-Steph asks out timeline) imo is Ainge accepting something like Looney/Kuminga/picks deal for Lauri.
Going into the season with
Curry
Podz/Payton
Wiggins/Moody
Lauri
Dray/TJD
With MLE money still available and under the tax would be great.
R-DAWG wrote:gswhoops wrote:My two cents as a Warriors fan, in no particular order:
-Steph isn't getting traded unless he asks for it, full stop. He means too much to the franchise. He's still good enough to be the #1 guy on a contender so you build around him.
-I have a hard time seeing Dray return anything that helps us more than he does, so he probably stays.
-The team needs to have a hard convo with Klay. He's not consistent enough to be a starter or to play 30+ minutes a night or close games regularly. If he's ok taking slightly north of MLE money to be a 6th/7th man then re-sign him. Otherwise thank him for the memories and let him chase another ring/paycheck elsewhere.
-CP3 is getting cut and the team is realizing the cap savings unless a true star becomes available, which isn't likely. We have a slim window to get out of the repeater tax and that requires getting under the tax line this year. Warriors aren't going to keep paying the repeater tax for a Lavine or Grant type player.
-Kuminga needs to be penciled into a starting role next year. Barring a massive trade he's the most likely player we have to be able to fill the #2 option role we desperately need. Moody, Podz, and TJD need to be given as many minutes as they can handle so we can see if they're worth re-signing (especially Moody).
-I expect that Looney will be stretch-waived (only $3M of his $8.5M for next year is guaranteed). He's simply not an effective player anymore. I would hope we use some or all of the MLE to sign a legitimate 5 who will split time with TJD next year. Dray should play as few minutes as possible at the 5 during the regular season.
-Try and move Wiggins and/or GP2 for salary relief or expiring contracts. Honestly, I'd take that THJ/Maxi deal right now. Maybe use the 2nd from that deal and/or some of our own to move GP2 to a cap space team for a TPE (he's expiring).
Roll into next year with something like:
(MLE Big) / TJD
Draymond / Maxi
Kuminga / THJ
Moody / Klay
Curry / Podz
Is it a contender? No. But it's at least an interesting squad with some upward growth potential that's not paying an insane luxury tax bill.
I think the Looney point is interesting - less so on Looney and more so on going back to having a legit center in the lineup. Clint Capela could be an interesting target here (potentially using the Looney/Payton expiring contracts to facilitate the deal with a protected 2025 1st).
Curry/Moody/Kuminga/Draymond/Capela
Biggest concern here is floor spacing and it almost makes more sense, IMO, to run it back with Wiggins and shift Draymond to a bench role:
Curry/Moody/Kuminga/Wiggins/Capela
Ben of Podz/Klay/Green/TJD
This isn't a contending type of team, but it's recalibrating working the young guys in with Steph
jayjaysee wrote:What would be the top bid if Kuminga was made available? I know I’m too high on him..
jayjaysee wrote:What would be the top bid if Kuminga was made available? I know I’m too high on him..
gswhoops wrote:jayjaysee wrote:What would be the top bid if Kuminga was made available? I know I’m too high on him..
I don’t see us trading Kuminga unless it’s part of a package for a star player
jayjaysee wrote:gswhoops wrote:jayjaysee wrote:What would be the top bid if Kuminga was made available? I know I’m too high on him..
I don’t see us trading Kuminga unless it’s part of a package for a star player
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
Wolveswin wrote:jayjaysee wrote:gswhoops wrote:I don’t see us trading Kuminga unless it’s part of a package for a star player
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
I think you over value Kuminga. If we look at previous star trades as our comps, picks are valued most - without a doubt. Kuminga would be lucky to be the Sexton/Markkanen (at time of trade) or Kessler ‘filler’ that were sent out in previous star trades. 100% the side dish to multiple picks as the main course.
Warriors getting their 2030 pick has major future trade value. Frees up 2x picks - of their own which would have most value in league. Way more than what Kuminga equals.
4x GSW 1sts >> 2x GSW + meh 1st from Kuminga trade (or Kuminga himself)
If Warriors are all in, for a star that makes a chip run realistic, they need all their draft capital which has considerable more value than their meh youth.
jayjaysee wrote:gswhoops wrote:jayjaysee wrote:What would be the top bid if Kuminga was made available? I know I’m too high on him..
I don’t see us trading Kuminga unless it’s part of a package for a star player
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
Lenneth wrote:jayjaysee wrote:gswhoops wrote:I don’t see us trading Kuminga unless it’s part of a package for a star player
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
Why would Warriors trade Kuminga if Curry is here? Neither has a problem playing with the other, and his 20 pts in 2024 were a big booster for the Warriors.
Wolveswin wrote:jayjaysee wrote:gswhoops wrote:I don’t see us trading Kuminga unless it’s part of a package for a star player
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
I think you over value Kuminga. If we look at previous star trades as our comps, picks are valued most - without a doubt. Kuminga would be lucky to be the Sexton/Markkanen (at time of trade) or Kessler ‘filler’ that were sent out in previous star trades. 100% the side dish to multiple picks as the main course.
Warriors getting their 2030 pick has major future trade value. Frees up 2x picks - of their own which would have most value in league. Way more than what Kuminga equals.
4x GSW 1sts >> 2x GSW + meh 1st from Kuminga trade (or Kuminga himself)
If Warriors are all in, for a star that makes a chip run realistic, they need all their draft capital which has considerable more value than their meh youth.
giberish wrote:Wolveswin wrote:jayjaysee wrote:
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
I think you over value Kuminga. If we look at previous star trades as our comps, picks are valued most - without a doubt. Kuminga would be lucky to be the Sexton/Markkanen (at time of trade) or Kessler ‘filler’ that were sent out in previous star trades. 100% the side dish to multiple picks as the main course.
Warriors getting their 2030 pick has major future trade value. Frees up 2x picks - of their own which would have most value in league. Way more than what Kuminga equals.
4x GSW 1sts >> 2x GSW + meh 1st from Kuminga trade (or Kuminga himself)
If Warriors are all in, for a star that makes a chip run realistic, they need all their draft capital which has considerable more value than their meh youth.
Gutting out the Warriors future that much for a 1 or 2 year run of being a secondary title contender is completely nuts. I don't see a scenario where GS is trading more than 2 future 1sts anyways so the Washington pick is irrelevant.
Looking at the general types of stars that might be traded, I'd put them into 4 types:
1) The young or youngish long-term guys. While great to get, in the unlikely event one is on the market OKC or SA or someone will outbid what GS can offer.
2) The flight risks. While GS is a relatively desirable market it's tough to see someone sticking around as Curry fades and the team has no youth/picks. (also Mitchell - the most obvious guy in this group - is a bad fit anyways).
3) The older guys where you're hoping to milk the last 1-3 years of high-level play. This is the market GS would be looking at (more asset-rich but younger teams like OKC wouldn't be interested). GS's competition would be LAL and perhaps Philly (Phoenix an LAC might be interested but have nothing to trade). GS can make competitive offers without going more than 2 1sts out.
4) The quasi-stars. Guys with some combination of contract/fame/PPG to look like a star without making a star impact. Obviously shouldn't offer too much for these guys.
jayjaysee wrote:Wolveswin wrote:jayjaysee wrote:
Yeah, I still think he’s going to really break out. Entering fourth year, but only 21..
But think if you’re building around Curry, you really should be moving him.
Not for Kuzma or the ability to trade multiple firsts post-Curry, that’s just setting up future problems.. But I think teams would trade “2 firsts” or a really good first for him.. and you combine that with CP and whatever else. Or just straight Kuminga+first+? And still reset the repeater tax..
I think you over value Kuminga. If we look at previous star trades as our comps, picks are valued most - without a doubt. Kuminga would be lucky to be the Sexton/Markkanen (at time of trade) or Kessler ‘filler’ that were sent out in previous star trades. 100% the side dish to multiple picks as the main course.
Warriors getting their 2030 pick has major future trade value. Frees up 2x picks - of their own which would have most value in league. Way more than what Kuminga equals.
4x GSW 1sts >> 2x GSW + meh 1st from Kuminga trade (or Kuminga himself)
If Warriors are all in, for a star that makes a chip run realistic, they need all their draft capital which has considerable more value than their meh youth.
That might be the case if you were opening a long window. But Curry has what 3 years left maybe?
Not worth giving up your pick debt through 2031 and not being able to rebuild.
But worth giving up Kuninga, who will be maybe a secondary star/“third best player” type stuck on a rebuilding team in 3 years with no assets. Or he won’t develop and he will just be a meh starter.
So definitely disagree.
Kessler was an unknown at the time of the trade. Sexton was a bad fit with Garland who signed the contact he is on for a reason.. Lauri was a breakout..
I don’t really think any of that compares to Kuminga being a 21 year old who has shown so much..