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Jaden Ivey is the 5th overall pick from 2022 and has elite speed, an elite first step, and is extremely strong... He's also pretty horrible at basketball right now. His BBIQ and skill level is just pretty abysmal and didn't improve that much in his second year. Ivey is hated by his coach and Pistons fans are split on him and some Pistons people are floating the idea that Ivey may get traded. What is his current trade value?

Is it still possible for Ivey to grow into a De’Aaron Fox and Malik Monk caliber of player. Also totally possible he’s just Austin Rivers

I still like him. If I were the spurs I would give up one of the ATL picks for him. A PnR combo of Wemby’s size and Ivey’s elite speed would be very fun to watch. I think it’s clear he’s not an off ball guard and needs the ball in his hands more, which he’s not gonna get playing next to Cade

Non lottery pick. Could see a team offering something in the 16-22 range in this draft for him or a future LP 1st. But looking at the current draft order I don't see a trade right now that makes a lot of sense, so likely a future non premium pick from a rebuilding team like the Spurs mentioned above.

Det is likely better riding it out but if they feel compelled to move him that is what I see his value range.

balsamic_ducks wrote:I still like him. If I were the spurs I would give up one of the ATL picks for him. A PnR combo of Wemby’s size and Ivey’s elite speed would be very fun to watch. I think it’s clear he’s not an off ball guard and needs the ball in his hands more, which he’s not gonna get playing next to Cade

I don't see it for San Antonio. If they are going to deal FRP's it will be for a premium youngish PG to run pick and roll with Wemby. Trae obviously comes to mind. I heard Lowe also mention Garland this week for the Spurs depending if Donovan re-ups in Cleveland.

At this point Detroit should probably just keep him and hope he starts to live up to his draft slot. They would get pennies on the dollar. He's been disappointing and his position generally doesn't have alot of value unless you are a Donovan Mitchell type. Not to mention there will be a handful of more proven, smallish scoring guards hitting FA or the trade block this summer.

Special_Puppy wrote:Is it still possible for Ivey to grow into a De’Aaron Fox and Malik Monk caliber of player. Also totally possible he’s just Austin Rivers

A team looking for a small scoring guard could just sign Monk in FA this offseason.

Other teams are going to see Cade, Thompson, Sasser and Grimes then Ivey plus leaving off Flynn. Teams wonder if they should wait to see who DET thinks gets minutes. There's still only have 96 guard minutes, 4 guys to divide them leaves #5 and 6 getting paid to be on the bench and probably not happy. Who can they trade to get the most at the SF/PF ?

Don't think he has lottery pick value in him still. I can see the potencial, but it's a two year contract now... sure he would be a RFA, but all it takes is one team overpaying for him and you could end up with a player that had 1 good year getting pay 20M+?

Unless a player is a complete miss, you really should give him 3 seasons before moving on.

The pistons aren't going to be interested in moving him for draft picks, so I'm not sure that's a great way to gauge his "value" at this point. The franchise can't afford to be horrible again. Fans are already chanting "sell the team" at any games Gores attends.

That's not to say the pistons wouldn't move him, but I would expect that to be for an established player that is a better fit with Cade or in a package. The team has tons of cap space again, so I wouldn't be shocked to see him moved for a guy who may be overpaid but is actually productive.

mg wrote:At this point Detroit should probably just keep him and hope he starts to live up to his draft slot. They would get pennies on the dollar. He's been disappointing and his position generally doesn't have alot of value unless you are a Donovan Mitchell type. Not to mention there will be a handful of more proven, smallish scoring guards hitting FA or the trade block this summer.

I agree he’s been disappointing, but he isn’t a Don Mitchell size guard, either. Mitchell may be listed at 6’3”, but he clearly isn’t — he just has long arms. Ivey is listed at 6’4” and clearly is that tall, with broad shoulders and long arms (though not as long as Mitchell’s). Heck, the only good element of Ivey’s defense is his shot-blocking. He has horrible instincts, gambles too much, and gets lost off-ball way too often. It’s incomprehensible to me that the son of a college coach (his mom) could be this raw as a player.

But that, of course, is the appeal. He has the physical tools of a star. Who knows, really. At this point, some organization has to think it’s possible to extract value out of players the Pistons keep failing to develop. What’s hilarious is that the Pistons keep thinking they can do that to other teams’ failures. Hasn’t worked yet, not even once.

I agree DET shouldn't move him for picks now (or more realistically "pick"). Maybe in a package for a win-now player.

Having said that, I'd love to give him a look in ORL. Wouldn't stop me from going for a proven upgrade like Dejounte Murray, etc at the same time, but, if the price were just a frp or even a frp + a couple of seconds - I'd jump on it for ORL.

How about...

ORL sends WCJ, Cole Anthony, ORL 24 frp, DEN 25 frp
DEN sends Ivey, Duren

I'd say WCJ > Duren at the moment, and plays a much more versatile game (but Duren does ONLY what ORL needs at C-and does it better than WCJ). I could see WCJ, in a more featured role, increasing his points and rebounds considerably. WCJ is even versatile enough to play next to Wiseman sometimes, for a big lineup. I know Duren is a success in DET, but he's a limited role player and DET has a pretty clear frontcourt slate to build on. Cole is basically what Ivey is, but Ivey has (maybe) a higher ceiling. Two FRPs in the next year are valuable, even if used for trade fodder. DET has too many on-ball guys, so moving Ivey out isn't really painful...Ivey wasn't an ideal pick, but clearly BPA for a team starting a rebuild had to be the way. Now, Thompson & Sasser join the list of guys that can play on-ball, along with their designated star-Cade. This trade basically, imo, makes DET better day 1, but also gives a solid return for a quick reset on top of the offensive improvement both incoming players bring immediately.

From ORL side, they actually clear even more cap space (although they face frightening extensions over the next three years. I figure they take a long look at Ivey and hope he works out...but, even if he doesn't, Duren is the kind of physical role player that fits better next to Paolo & Franz (simply banging in the paint, catching lobs, grabbing rebounds, and playing tough D). Duren might be the ideal young, springy piece of Granite that Mosely can turn into a DPOY.

tmorgan wrote:

mg wrote:At this point Detroit should probably just keep him and hope he starts to live up to his draft slot. They would get pennies on the dollar. He's been disappointing and his position generally doesn't have alot of value unless you are a Donovan Mitchell type. Not to mention there will be a handful of more proven, smallish scoring guards hitting FA or the trade block this summer.

I agree he’s been disappointing, but he isn’t a Don Mitchell size guard, either. Mitchell may be listed at 6’3”, but he clearly isn’t — he just has long arms. Ivey is listed at 6’4” and clearly is that tall, with broad shoulders and long arms (though not as long as Mitchell’s). Heck, the only good element of Ivey’s defense is his shot-blocking. He has horrible instincts, gambles too much, and gets lost off-ball way too often. It’s incomprehensible to me that the son of a college coach (his mom) could be this raw as a player.

But that, of course, is the appeal. He has the physical tools of a star. Who knows, really. At this point, some organization has to think it’s possible to extract value out of players the Pistons keep failing to develop. What’s hilarious is that the Pistons keep thinking they can do that to other teams’ failures. Hasn’t worked yet, not even once.

You gotta give Marvin Bagley Jr. another chance.

HadAnEffectHere wrote:You gotta give Marvin Bagley Jr. another chance.

Now there’s a new angle, give the dads of our failed projects a shot, too.

(Bags is Bagley III)

Houston might give #9. And Landale or Tate. Try to fix him like JGreen is looking.

Pg Vleet, Ivey
Sg jgreen, amen
Sf brooks, Whitmore
Pf Jabari, Eason
C. Sengun, Adams

Xman wrote:Houston might give #9. And Landale or Tate. Try to fix him like JGreen is looking.

Pg Vleet, Ivey
Sg jgreen, amen
Sf brooks, Whitmore
Pf Jabari, Eason
C. Sengun, Adams

Seems odd. Is Amen already not a PG in Houston’s eyes?

Skybox wrote:
How about...

ORL sends WCJ, Cole Anthony, ORL 24 frp, DEN 25 frp
DEN sends Ivey, Duren

From ORL side, they actually clear even more cap space (although they face frightening extensions over the next three years. I figure they take a long look at Ivey and hope he works out...but, even if he doesn't, Duren is the kind of physical role player that fits better next to Paolo & Franz (simply banging in the paint, catching lobs, grabbing rebounds, and playing tough D). Duren might be the ideal young, springy piece of Granite that Mosely can turn into a DPOY.

This is a strange misrepresentation of Duren in his current state.

He is limited, yes. We aren’t letting him shoot outside the paint, which is dumb because he clearly has touch. He’s a ferocious rebounder and a good passer with great hands.

What he isn’t, and may never be, is a good defender. Like much of the roster (except Stewart and Thompson), his reads are poor and his commitment on that end is suspect. To be fair, he’s two years into a career that started as the youngest player in the league. I don’t want to trade him, but just wanted everyone to know what he is (and currently isn’t). Don’t see him as a good fit with Paolo and Franz at all.

ChettheJet wrote:Other teams are going to see Cade, Thompson, Sasser and Grimes then Ivey plus leaving off Flynn. Teams wonder if they should wait to see who DET thinks gets minutes. There's still only have 96 guard minutes, 4 guys to divide them leaves #5 and 6 getting paid to be on the bench and probably not happy. Who can they trade to get the most at the SF/PF ?

Ausar played 98% off his minutes at SF/PF this season, Grimes 23% at SF. Despite his 50 point outburst it is doubtful that Flynn has any place in our rotation next season. And then when you factor in injuries/durability, I don't think lack of guard minutes will be that much of an issue.

tmorgan wrote:

Xman wrote:Houston might give #9. And Landale or Tate. Try to fix him like JGreen is looking.

Pg Vleet, Ivey
Sg jgreen, amen
Sf brooks, Whitmore
Pf Jabari, Eason
C. Sengun, Adams

Seems odd. Is Amen already not a PG in Houston’s eyes?

Amen has been so good as a wing that it is hard to see him as a PG now. I think the Rockets will try to find a PG more similar to FVV for the second unit and Amen will eventually be a starting SF/PF.

The Pistons can't "win now". They're awful and their young players (with the possible exception of Cade) aren't bringing that much in return. Maybe move Ivey for another young player that's a better fit. Otherwise, see if he and Cade figure it out in year three.