Instant Reaction: What Do The Heat Do This Off-Season?

[jbk1234]

I really don't see a way that Mitchell ends up in Miami. That strikes me as straight wishcasting. Maybe the Heat can enlist 3rd teams to dump Duncan and Herro on, but if fans are assigning them real trade value, they didn't watch the same series I just did. Herro wouldn't start in front of Strus, Duncan can't start due to his defensive limitations. Including them in a Mitchell trade is just a nonstarter. The Cavs aren't going to inherit another team's cap problems in a Mitchell trade.

Even JJJ as a centerpiece is underwhelming. Yes he's only 23, but he can't shoot (Mobley is only 22 and Garland is only 24). The only non-shooting SF I've seen work on a contending team was Iggy on the Warriors and they had two of best shooters of all time plus Draymond. I actually like Jovic as a prospect more than JJJ.

So you're basically talking about a couple of picks from a team whose window you just extended. When it's a player of Mitchell's caliber, you can probably get that in a S&T in 2025.

[drosestruts]

I think they mostly run it back - some tweaks that could be good for them


Trade 1 w/ Chicago:

Miami in: Ayo Dosunmu

Chicago in: Jamie Jaquez Jr and Nikola Jovic

Bulls have a crowded backcourt and a serious lack of size/depth w/ size. 2:1 deal gives Miami a, in my eyes, perfectly complimentary point guard for what they do. Ayo can defend, shoot, and playmaker. Post all-star break Ayo was scoring 17 points per game, with 5 assists and a TS% of 60.


Trade 2 w/ Orlando

Miami in: Jonathan Isaac, ORL 2024 2nd, and 2026 DET 2nd

Orlando in: Tyler Herro

Magic are looking for a young guard. Isaac while oft not available would fit Miami's frontcourt great when he is healthy. He does become a free agent after a season so the seconds are offered as some value if he bolts. Deal also saves Miami a good chunk of cap.


Heat:

Dosunmu/Rozier/Wright
Martin/Richardson
Butler/Robinson
Isaac/HighSmith
Adebayo/Bryant/Love/Robinson

Have fun playing against that team.

I don't get either of these trades.

First, why is Miami trading Jaquez and Jovic for Ayo? He's a nice player but I don't see his value is so great that it gets both those guys from Miami. I mean, Jaime Jaquez put up virtually identical stats as a rookie, is younger, and has more years as a cost controlled asset. I'm not sure I'd trade him, alone for Ayo, much less include our 20 year old starting power forward who also has more years of team control.

As for the second, why is Orlando trading their starting power forward who happens to be a phenomenal defender for Tyler Herro? Herro isn't more durable. I would think the oft mentioned Herro for WCJ and an asset like Denver's first next year is the deal worth doing for both teams.

I would encourage you to look at Ayo's stats as a starter this year - especially in the second half of the season. He started the year a bit buried due to Chicago glut of guards and admittingly a bad year 2 last season. He was great in the second half of the season.

For the second trade - the Magic are currently starting Gary Harris in the playoffs - Harris is scoring 4 points a game with horrible efficiency.

Jonathan Issaac is a phenomenal defender - he does not start for the Magic. Banchero and Wagner start at the forward spots. Over the past five years Isaac has played in 103 games, Tyler Herro has played in 284. Please don't tell me Herro isn't more durable.

The Magic have a much greater need for a starting scoring guard than they do for a backup forward

[BBallFreak]

I think they mostly run it back - some tweaks that could be good for them


Trade 1 w/ Chicago:

Miami in: Ayo Dosunmu

Chicago in: Jamie Jaquez Jr and Nikola Jovic

Bulls have a crowded backcourt and a serious lack of size/depth w/ size. 2:1 deal gives Miami a, in my eyes, perfectly complimentary point guard for what they do. Ayo can defend, shoot, and playmaker. Post all-star break Ayo was scoring 17 points per game, with 5 assists and a TS% of 60.


Trade 2 w/ Orlando

Miami in: Jonathan Isaac, ORL 2024 2nd, and 2026 DET 2nd

Orlando in: Tyler Herro

Magic are looking for a young guard. Isaac while oft not available would fit Miami's frontcourt great when he is healthy. He does become a free agent after a season so the seconds are offered as some value if he bolts. Deal also saves Miami a good chunk of cap.


Heat:

Dosunmu/Rozier/Wright
Martin/Richardson
Butler/Robinson
Isaac/HighSmith
Adebayo/Bryant/Love/Robinson

Have fun playing against that team.

I don't get either of these trades.

First, why is Miami trading Jaquez and Jovic for Ayo? He's a nice player but I don't see his value is so great that it gets both those guys from Miami. I mean, Jaime Jaquez put up virtually identical stats as a rookie, is younger, and has more years as a cost controlled asset. I'm not sure I'd trade him, alone for Ayo, much less include our 20 year old starting power forward who also has more years of team control.

As for the second, why is Orlando trading their starting power forward who happens to be a phenomenal defender for Tyler Herro? Herro isn't more durable. I would think the oft mentioned Herro for WCJ and an asset like Denver's first next year is the deal worth doing for both teams.

I would encourage you to look at Ayo's stats as a starter this year - especially in the second half of the season. He started the year a bit buried due to Chicago glut of guards and admittingly a bad year 2 last season. He was great in the second half of the season.

For the second trade - the Magic are currently starting Gary Harris in the playoffs - Harris is scoring 4 points a game with horrible efficiency.

Jonathan Issaac is a phenomenal defender - he does not start for the Magic. Banchero and Wagner start at the forward spots. Over the past five years Isaac has played in 103 games, Tyler Herro has played in 284. Please don't tell me Herro isn't more durable.

The Magic have a much greater need for a starting scoring guard than they do for a backup forward

I don't care about his numbers as a starter. Small sample sizes are a thing. Good for him for playing well when given the opportunity. That doesn't increase his value to the point you have him at. EDIT: I suggest you look at Jamie Jaquez's Numbers as a starter. Eerily similar to Dosunmu's

As for Herro, just because they need a guy like him doesn't mean they have to trade for him, specifically, and doesn't mean they need to overpay. Why give up Isaac if WCJ and a virtual second round pick will do? That trade would be huge for Miami. Aside from gaining a ton of salary cap flexibility they'd also gain the opportunity to trade another first. For a team like Miami, that's massive.

[drosestruts]

I don't get either of these trades.

First, why is Miami trading Jaquez and Jovic for Ayo? He's a nice player but I don't see his value is so great that it gets both those guys from Miami. I mean, Jaime Jaquez put up virtually identical stats as a rookie, is younger, and has more years as a cost controlled asset. I'm not sure I'd trade him, alone for Ayo, much less include our 20 year old starting power forward who also has more years of team control.

As for the second, why is Orlando trading their starting power forward who happens to be a phenomenal defender for Tyler Herro? Herro isn't more durable. I would think the oft mentioned Herro for WCJ and an asset like Denver's first next year is the deal worth doing for both teams.

I would encourage you to look at Ayo's stats as a starter this year - especially in the second half of the season. He started the year a bit buried due to Chicago glut of guards and admittingly a bad year 2 last season. He was great in the second half of the season.

For the second trade - the Magic are currently starting Gary Harris in the playoffs - Harris is scoring 4 points a game with horrible efficiency.

Jonathan Issaac is a phenomenal defender - he does not start for the Magic. Banchero and Wagner start at the forward spots. Over the past five years Isaac has played in 103 games, Tyler Herro has played in 284. Please don't tell me Herro isn't more durable.

The Magic have a much greater need for a starting scoring guard than they do for a backup forward

I don't care about his numbers as a starter. Small sample sizes are a thing. Good for him for playing well when given the opportunity. That doesn't increase his value to the point you have him at. EDIT: I suggest you look at Jamie Jaquez's Numbers as a starter. Eerily similar to Dosunmu's

As for Herro, just because they need a guy like him doesn't mean they have to trade for him, specifically, and doesn't mean they need to overpay. Why give up Isaac if WCJ and a virtual second round pick will do? That trade would be huge for Miami. Aside from gaining a ton of salary cap flexibility they'd also gain the opportunity to trade another first. For a team like Miami, that's massive.

Ok I looked at the stats and I don't find them to be similar.

Ayo - 17 points, 5 assists, 59.6% TS% and 38% 3P% on 5 3PA/game

JJJ - 15 points, 3 assist, 57% TS%, 30% 3P% on 3 3PA/game

Ayo is about 10 percentage points better from 3 than JJJ. He scores more efficiently. He generates more assists. He records more STOCKS.

I think Ayo is good - I just think Chicago has too many guards and that Miami didn't have a starting-level point guard the fit their team. I felt the trade balanced out the rosters.

You clearly don't think that and that's fine. I feel like you keep moving the goal posts - first it's Ayo isn't even better than JJJ. Than it was just a small sample size. Than you claim JJJ's numbers when he starts are the same, they are not.

It is difficult to discuss hypothetical trades of players when we can't come to a shared understanding on said players despite having access to lots of stats on these players.

You look at these numbers and say "they're the same". How you're drawing that conclusion I do not know.

[Hoops23]

I think they mostly run it back - some tweaks that could be good for them


Trade 1 w/ Chicago:

Miami in: Ayo Dosunmu

Chicago in: Jamie Jaquez Jr and Nikola Jovic

Bulls have a crowded backcourt and a serious lack of size/depth w/ size. 2:1 deal gives Miami a, in my eyes, perfectly complimentary point guard for what they do. Ayo can defend, shoot, and playmaker. Post all-star break Ayo was scoring 17 points per game, with 5 assists and a TS% of 60.


Trade 2 w/ Orlando

Miami in: Jonathan Isaac, ORL 2024 2nd, and 2026 DET 2nd

Orlando in: Tyler Herro

Magic are looking for a young guard. Isaac while oft not available would fit Miami's frontcourt great when he is healthy. He does become a free agent after a season so the seconds are offered as some value if he bolts. Deal also saves Miami a good chunk of cap.


Heat:

Dosunmu/Rozier/Wright
Martin/Richardson
Butler/Robinson
Isaac/HighSmith
Adebayo/Bryant/Love/Robinson

Have fun playing against that team.

So you’re telling us the slight difference in Ayo’s advantage over Jaquez is worth Jovic? Wow

[BBallFreak]

I would encourage you to look at Ayo's stats as a starter this year - especially in the second half of the season. He started the year a bit buried due to Chicago glut of guards and admittingly a bad year 2 last season. He was great in the second half of the season.

For the second trade - the Magic are currently starting Gary Harris in the playoffs - Harris is scoring 4 points a game with horrible efficiency.

Jonathan Issaac is a phenomenal defender - he does not start for the Magic. Banchero and Wagner start at the forward spots. Over the past five years Isaac has played in 103 games, Tyler Herro has played in 284. Please don't tell me Herro isn't more durable.

The Magic have a much greater need for a starting scoring guard than they do for a backup forward

I don't care about his numbers as a starter. Small sample sizes are a thing. Good for him for playing well when given the opportunity. That doesn't increase his value to the point you have him at. EDIT: I suggest you look at Jamie Jaquez's Numbers as a starter. Eerily similar to Dosunmu's

As for Herro, just because they need a guy like him doesn't mean they have to trade for him, specifically, and doesn't mean they need to overpay. Why give up Isaac if WCJ and a virtual second round pick will do? That trade would be huge for Miami. Aside from gaining a ton of salary cap flexibility they'd also gain the opportunity to trade another first. For a team like Miami, that's massive.

Ok I looked at the stats and I don't find them to be similar.

Ayo - 17 points, 5 assists, 59.6% TS% and 38% 3P% on 5 3PA/game

JJJ - 15 points, 3 assist, 57% TS%, 30% 3P% on 3 3PA/game

Ayo is about 10 percentage points better from 3 than JJJ. He scores more efficiently. He generates more assists. He records more STOCKS.

I think Ayo is good - I just think Chicago has too many guards and that Miami didn't have a starting-level point guard the fit their team. I felt the trade balanced out the rosters.

You clearly don't think that and that's fine. I feel like you keep moving the goal posts - first it's Ayo isn't even better than JJJ. Than it was just a small sample size. Than you claim JJJ's numbers when he starts are the same, they are not.

It is difficult to discuss hypothetical trades of players when we can't come to a shared understanding on said players despite having access to lots of stats on these players.

You look at these numbers and say "they're the same". How you're drawing that conclusion I do not know.

I'm not seeing the same numbers you are:

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/ayo-dosunmu-stats-when-starts

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/jaime-jaquez-stats-when-starts

According to statmuse, Ayo Dosunmu averaged 15.4 points, 4.5 assists and 3.5 rebounds in 37 games as a starter this season. Jaime Jaquez Jr. averaged 15.1 points, 4.5 rebounds and 2.7 assists in 20 games as a starter this season. Those numbers are very similar.

If you could provide a link to your numbers I feel like we could have an actual discussion, but you telling me I'm moving the goalposts when my link says the numbers are virtually identical, both at a small sample size, doesn't suggest that. I don't see Ayo as better than Jaquez, I don't see Ayo's contract situation (twice the money JJJ makes) as worth it even if he is slightly better, and I don't see us including Jovic.

[gom]

My perspective is that the Heat will mostly run it back, and it's not going to have a better outcome. The FO erred in the Lowry for Rozier trade, which cost them a badly-needed future pick. Now the cap sheet (which would have been minus Lowry's salary) is horrid, and the team is play-in level (two seasons in a row). They have to decide on Butler's extension (the answer should be yes) and Bam's (also yes) and prepare to pay massive tax next season for a team that won't be much better. As for trades, everyone but Butler and Bam should be on the block, but Herro & co. isn't going to bring much back. The main target, though, should be trading their complacency for a sense of urgency. There aren't enough first round picks to add for that.

[Smooth32]

I really don't see a way that Mitchell ends up in Miami. That strikes me as straight wishcasting. Maybe the Heat can enlist 3rd teams to dump Duncan and Herro on, but if fans are assigning them real trade value, they didn't watch the same series I just did. Herro wouldn't start in front of Strus, Duncan can't start due to his defensive limitations. Including them in a Mitchell trade is just a nonstarter. The Cavs aren't going to inherit another team's cap problems in a Mitchell trade.

Even JJJ as a centerpiece is underwhelming. Yes he's only 23, but he can't shoot (Mobley is only 22 and Garland is only 24). The only non-shooting SF I've seen work on a contending team was Iggy on the Warriors and they had two of best shooters of all time plus Draymond. I actually like Jovic as a prospect more than JJJ.

So you're basically talking about a couple of picks from a team whose window you just extended. When it's a player of Mitchell's caliber, you can probably get that in a S&T in 2025.

Don’t disagree from a Cas perspective, however, it should be noted. Miami was one of the three or four teams Mitchell had on his initial trade list.

Out of Los Angeles, New York, and Brooklyn, Miami makes a lot of sense of being able to return some viable assets to the Cavs while not completely stripping the cupboard and leaving a competitive roster for Mitchell to play on.

Return as an ideal, but it seems like a possible possible middle ground for both parties should’ve come to that over the other alternatives mentioned.

The wildcard is Miami lowballing teams when it comes to star trades.

[Mr Swagtastic]

Short answer try to find another star to play with Bam and Butler. I don't know if they have the realistic assets to get a Durant, Ingram or Lauri or Mitchell.

[jbk1234]

I really don't see a way that Mitchell ends up in Miami. That strikes me as straight wishcasting. Maybe the Heat can enlist 3rd teams to dump Duncan and Herro on, but if fans are assigning them real trade value, they didn't watch the same series I just did. Herro wouldn't start in front of Strus, Duncan can't start due to his defensive limitations. Including them in a Mitchell trade is just a nonstarter. The Cavs aren't going to inherit another team's cap problems in a Mitchell trade.

Even JJJ as a centerpiece is underwhelming. Yes he's only 23, but he can't shoot (Mobley is only 22 and Garland is only 24). The only non-shooting SF I've seen work on a contending team was Iggy on the Warriors and they had two of best shooters of all time plus Draymond. I actually like Jovic as a prospect more than JJJ.

So you're basically talking about a couple of picks from a team whose window you just extended. When it's a player of Mitchell's caliber, you can probably get that in a S&T in 2025.

Don’t disagree from a Cas perspective, however, it should be noted. Miami was one of the three or four teams Mitchell had on his initial trade list.

Out of Los Angeles, New York, and Brooklyn, Miami makes a lot of sense of being able to return some viable assets to the Cavs while not completely stripping the cupboard and leaving a competitive roster for Mitchell to play on.

Return as an ideal, but it seems like a possible possible middle ground for both parties should’ve come to that over the other alternatives mentioned.

The wildcard is Miami lowballing teams when it comes to star trades.

The thing about being on a list is that team still needs to be able to beat the best rental offer (which includes at least the hope of being able to change his mind and that would apply to the Cavs themselves). Once you start including undesirable contracts, that's pretty easy to do.

Of the teams you listed, only the Nets will have the cap space to sign him outright in 25. Unless Mitchell is willing to just walk to a Brooklyn team that will likely be bad again in 24-25, he'll need the Cavs help to get to wherever he wants to go.

The other thing is that lists change. It now seems likely that the Celtics will be the *old* team in the ECF.

[drosestruts]

I don't care about his numbers as a starter. Small sample sizes are a thing. Good for him for playing well when given the opportunity. That doesn't increase his value to the point you have him at. EDIT: I suggest you look at Jamie Jaquez's Numbers as a starter. Eerily similar to Dosunmu's

As for Herro, just because they need a guy like him doesn't mean they have to trade for him, specifically, and doesn't mean they need to overpay. Why give up Isaac if WCJ and a virtual second round pick will do? That trade would be huge for Miami. Aside from gaining a ton of salary cap flexibility they'd also gain the opportunity to trade another first. For a team like Miami, that's massive.

Ok I looked at the stats and I don't find them to be similar.

Ayo - 17 points, 5 assists, 59.6% TS% and 38% 3P% on 5 3PA/game

JJJ - 15 points, 3 assist, 57% TS%, 30% 3P% on 3 3PA/game

Ayo is about 10 percentage points better from 3 than JJJ. He scores more efficiently. He generates more assists. He records more STOCKS.

I think Ayo is good - I just think Chicago has too many guards and that Miami didn't have a starting-level point guard the fit their team. I felt the trade balanced out the rosters.

You clearly don't think that and that's fine. I feel like you keep moving the goal posts - first it's Ayo isn't even better than JJJ. Than it was just a small sample size. Than you claim JJJ's numbers when he starts are the same, they are not.

It is difficult to discuss hypothetical trades of players when we can't come to a shared understanding on said players despite having access to lots of stats on these players.

You look at these numbers and say "they're the same". How you're drawing that conclusion I do not know.

I'm not seeing the same numbers you are:

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/ayo-dosunmu-stats-when-starts

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/jaime-jaquez-stats-when-starts

According to statmuse, Ayo Dosunmu averaged 15.4 points, 4.5 assists and 3.5 rebounds in 37 games as a starter this season. Jaime Jaquez Jr. averaged 15.1 points, 4.5 rebounds and 2.7 assists in 20 games as a starter this season. Those numbers are very similar.

If you could provide a link to your numbers I feel like we could have an actual discussion, but you telling me I'm moving the goalposts when my link says the numbers are virtually identical, both at a small sample size, doesn't suggest that. I don't see Ayo as better than Jaquez, I don't see Ayo's contract situation (twice the money JJJ makes) as worth it even if he is slightly better, and I don't see us including Jovic.

Ah I see - I was looking at Ayo's numbers post all-star break due to my earlier comment of "particularly in the second half of the season"

Output, and how they get that - in Ayo's case being a more volume and better accuracy 3-point shooter.

Ayo will also score several buckets a game as a one-man fast break. I honestly think he's one of the fastest players in the league with the ball in his hands.

So I do think how they produce their points and how that fits with the team at large - are important factors to consider as well.

[BBallFreak]

Ok I looked at the stats and I don't find them to be similar.

Ayo - 17 points, 5 assists, 59.6% TS% and 38% 3P% on 5 3PA/game

JJJ - 15 points, 3 assist, 57% TS%, 30% 3P% on 3 3PA/game

Ayo is about 10 percentage points better from 3 than JJJ. He scores more efficiently. He generates more assists. He records more STOCKS.

I think Ayo is good - I just think Chicago has too many guards and that Miami didn't have a starting-level point guard the fit their team. I felt the trade balanced out the rosters.

You clearly don't think that and that's fine. I feel like you keep moving the goal posts - first it's Ayo isn't even better than JJJ. Than it was just a small sample size. Than you claim JJJ's numbers when he starts are the same, they are not.

It is difficult to discuss hypothetical trades of players when we can't come to a shared understanding on said players despite having access to lots of stats on these players.

You look at these numbers and say "they're the same". How you're drawing that conclusion I do not know.

I'm not seeing the same numbers you are:

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/ayo-dosunmu-stats-when-starts

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/jaime-jaquez-stats-when-starts

According to statmuse, Ayo Dosunmu averaged 15.4 points, 4.5 assists and 3.5 rebounds in 37 games as a starter this season. Jaime Jaquez Jr. averaged 15.1 points, 4.5 rebounds and 2.7 assists in 20 games as a starter this season. Those numbers are very similar.

If you could provide a link to your numbers I feel like we could have an actual discussion, but you telling me I'm moving the goalposts when my link says the numbers are virtually identical, both at a small sample size, doesn't suggest that. I don't see Ayo as better than Jaquez, I don't see Ayo's contract situation (twice the money JJJ makes) as worth it even if he is slightly better, and I don't see us including Jovic.

Ah I see - I was looking at Ayo's numbers post all-star break due to my earlier comment of "particularly in the second half of the season"

Output, and how they get that - in Ayo's case being a more volume and better accuracy 3-point shooter.

Ayo will also score several buckets a game as a one-man fast break. I honestly think he's one of the fastest players in the league with the ball in his hands.

So I do think how they produce their points and how that fits with the team at large - are important factors to consider as well.

Not arguing that, but it's pretty clear that we feel the same way about Jaquez. Our feelings on the fit of each player in their particular systems don't matter.

The fact is, Jaquez is younger and cheaper and the difference in value (if any) isn't Jovic. Their numbers are essentially identical, or at least close enough that - contracts being equal - you wouldn't put one far ahead of the other in terms of value. So, we're not including Jovic. If we were to do a trade like this you'd get a Thomas Bryant or an Orlando Robinson and that would be all you're entitled to, but we're not even doing that trade. We love Jaquez and Jovic. If we trade them out won't be for a lateral move.

[NYG]

John Collins and Jordan Clarkson to Miami
Tyler Herro and Duncan Robinson to Chicago
Zach LaVine to Utah

[BBallFreak]

John Collins and Jordan Clarkson to Miami
Tyler Herro and Duncan Robinson to Chicago
Zach LaVine to Utah

I don't see the point for Miami. I like Collins but not enough for this.

[jayjaysee]

John Collins and Jordan Clarkson to Miami
Tyler Herro and Duncan Robinson to Chicago
Zach LaVine to Utah

This has to be terrible value for Miami right? Herro has to be worth a lot (relatively) more than Collins.

[NYG]

How does everyone feel about Jett Howard and WCJ for Tyler Herro that was brought up in another thread?

[Devilanche]

I'm not seeing the same numbers you are:

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/ayo-dosunmu-stats-when-starts

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/jaime-jaquez-stats-when-starts

According to statmuse, Ayo Dosunmu averaged 15.4 points, 4.5 assists and 3.5 rebounds in 37 games as a starter this season. Jaime Jaquez Jr. averaged 15.1 points, 4.5 rebounds and 2.7 assists in 20 games as a starter this season. Those numbers are very similar.

If you could provide a link to your numbers I feel like we could have an actual discussion, but you telling me I'm moving the goalposts when my link says the numbers are virtually identical, both at a small sample size, doesn't suggest that. I don't see Ayo as better than Jaquez, I don't see Ayo's contract situation (twice the money JJJ makes) as worth it even if he is slightly better, and I don't see us including Jovic.

Ah I see - I was looking at Ayo's numbers post all-star break due to my earlier comment of "particularly in the second half of the season"

Output, and how they get that - in Ayo's case being a more volume and better accuracy 3-point shooter.

Ayo will also score several buckets a game as a one-man fast break. I honestly think he's one of the fastest players in the league with the ball in his hands.

So I do think how they produce their points and how that fits with the team at large - are important factors to consider as well.

Not arguing that, but it's pretty clear that we feel the same way about Jaquez. Our feelings on the fit of each player in their particular systems don't matter.

The fact is, Jaquez is younger and cheaper and the difference in value (if any) isn't Jovic. Their numbers are essentially identical, or at least close enough that - contracts being equal - you wouldn't put one far ahead of the other in terms of value. So, we're not including Jovic. If we were to do a trade like this you'd get a Thomas Bryant or an Orlando Robinson and that would be all you're entitled to, but we're not even doing that trade. We love Jaquez and Jovic. If we trade them out won't be for a lateral move.

Yea , you can argue Ayo is marginally win now better than JJJ . Tough but possible.

But there’s no way he’s a jovic value apart from JJJ. Probably at best a late second rounder apart in value.

[wegotthabeet]

I think Bam Adebayo is capable of being the 2nd best player on a title team but it would require a better #1 option or upgrading Herro/Rozier for more size while maintaining offensive spacing and talent.

Brandon Ingram is an interesting option.

A lower-end targer is Jerami Grant, but I don't think he really shifts the odds drastically in Miami's favor for a championship.

I'm a big believer in getting rid of players 1 year early rather than 1 year late, which moves Jimmy Butler up to the front of the line as a trade candidate.

Finding that number 1 is literally the hardest thing in basketball for a team to do. Even Jimmy is more of a 2.

[BBallFreak]

How does everyone feel about Jett Howard and WCJ for Tyler Herro that was brought up in another thread?

I'd rather they keep Jett and give us a first.

[VaDe255]

Trade Jimmy to OKC and get the FRP back
Trade Bam for a haul
Let Herro be the tank commander and bottom out
Hit on some draft picks over the next few years you get for Bam

Just kidding, we already know they extend Jimmy and run it back...