Miami Heat Offseason Thread vol. 1: Post Mortem

[Pokuokic]

Here’s why i’m on the fence with Niko. He’s a stretch 4 so that’s definitely a plus next to Bam but don’t feel he’s rugged enough to be a pure compliment to Bam or to get back to Heat physical style of play. Niko is too busy playing like a guard when Bam needs another guy who can do the dirty work like rebound, screen, and give him a break defensively. Crowder and Tucker did a lot of those things and we saw great success with those two. Desperately been missing that element next to Bam.

If Bam's 3 pointer is legit what about Jarred Vanderbuilt trade from the Lakers?

[ZoStrong]

Here’s why i’m on the fence with Niko. He’s a stretch 4 so that’s definitely a plus next to Bam but don’t feel he’s rugged enough to be a pure compliment to Bam or to get back to Heat physical style of play. Niko is too busy playing like a guard when Bam needs another guy who can do the dirty work like rebound, screen, and give him a break defensively. Crowder and Tucker did a lot of those things and we saw great success with those two. Desperately been missing that element next to Bam.

I really wanna see one more year w Jovic. He might break out next year. Hate to develop him for couple years only to see him becoming a star on another team. Takes a few years in this league if u get drafted so young

[contract]

Nance can actually shoot a bit too, or atleast did when he was with the Cavs.

Spo will 100% play him at the 5 though and be allergic to Bam/Larry frontcourt. You know this.

When you hear UD saying Bam might have to play some PF with a Center maybe this a a compromise. When i hear UD saying things like this in the media it could be something he’s heard from the horses mouth which is Riley.

And Spo will file that idea in the trash.

I remember Riley used make statements about playing a more traditional big man game with Whiteside. Instead his ass got benched for not being as versatile as Bam. At the end of the day Spo is the coach and will decide how the team will play.

Spo has his basketball theories that he wants to prove will work no matter what. He will stubbornly stick to them. Like the zone against the Celtics.

Whiteside was out of the NBA for a 2nd time by age 33, and it wasn't due to his health. Whiteside was another example of Pat becoming delusional about a player. He thought Whiteside was Patrick Ewing. He wasn't. And his piss poor attitude made him toxic.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Here’s why i’m on the fence with Niko. He’s a stretch 4 so that’s definitely a plus next to Bam but don’t feel he’s rugged enough to be a pure compliment to Bam or to get back to Heat physical style of play. Niko is too busy playing like a guard when Bam needs another guy who can do the dirty work like rebound, screen, and give him a break defensively. Crowder and Tucker did a lot of those things and we saw great success with those two. Desperately been missing that element next to Bam.

If Bam's 3 pointer is legit what about Jarred Vanderbuilt trade from the Lakers?

Bam’s 3 is not legit and i absolutely love Bam. A few three’s here and there when he’s completely open is fine but playing him with a pure Center who can’t space the floor is asking for trouble when you also have Butler at the 3.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Here’s why i’m on the fence with Niko. He’s a stretch 4 so that’s definitely a plus next to Bam but don’t feel he’s rugged enough to be a pure compliment to Bam or to get back to Heat physical style of play. Niko is too busy playing like a guard when Bam needs another guy who can do the dirty work like rebound, screen, and give him a break defensively. Crowder and Tucker did a lot of those things and we saw great success with those two. Desperately been missing that element next to Bam.

I really wanna see one more year w Jovic. He might break out next year. Hate to develop him for couple years only to see him becoming a star on another team. Takes a few years in this league if u get drafted so young

Potential is there no doubt but with Bam and Butler this team needs to win now. I think we actually did a great job in making Niko desirable around the league that will help us in making a trade that involves Herro, Duncan, or both. Niko is our one true trade sweetener. Even moreso than JJJ or maybe even the 15th pick. If you want to make moves with very little assets sometimes hard decisions like trading Niko need to be made. We did it with Winslow for win now players like Crowder and Iguodala who were not stars but championship level role players.

[contract]

let me ask you a question, does the heat organization owes anything to jimmy butler?
i dont think so. since he hasnt played for free for the organization. last time i checked he still was getting a salary that most of us wont see in our lifetimes

so i dont understand the talk that jimmi owes the org something or that the org owes jimmi anything.

what kind of sacrifices he has done for the heat that hasnt being paid already??

Yes. We owe him $101 million over 2 years ... unless he declines his players option, in which case we owe him $49 million for 1 year. That's it. It would be a mistake to extend Jimmy at $50 million per year. It would be a mistake to extend Jimmy at $40 million per year.

There's a very high probability that Jimmy is already overpaid starting next season. I understand why he wants an extension, but there's no good reason for the Heat to give him one. It would be mismanagement to extend Jimmy.

Everyone supporting an extension now will be disowning it in 2 years.

No one think h'ell be worth his salary at age 37, the front office isn't stupid.

It's about taking care of your superstars, about letting him retire as a Heat, it's the things we **** up with Wade.
It's less about the future play and more about taking care of the person and appreciation his accomplishments.

It's only a 1 year extension, So I don't think it's that big of a deal. I don't think we're contending for a ship in 3 years anyway.

We're taking care of him now. He's not our superstar, he's a merc. He's played most of his career on 3 other teams.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Nance can actually shoot a bit too, or atleast did when he was with the Cavs.

Spo will 100% play him at the 5 though and be allergic to Bam/Larry frontcourt. You know this.

When you hear UD saying Bam might have to play some PF with a Center maybe this a a compromise. When i hear UD saying things like this in the media it could be something he’s heard from the horses mouth which is Riley.

And Spo will file that idea in the trash.

I remember Riley used make statements about playing a more traditional big man game with Whiteside. Instead his ass got benched for not being as versatile as Bam. At the end of the day Spo is the coach and will decide how the team will play.

Spo has his basketball theories that he wants to prove will work no matter what. He will stubbornly stick to them. Like the zone against the Celtics.

I agree it is a trash idea. Spo has always preferred the switch types at the 4 who can shoot 3’s. The problem is finding the perfect fit. I don’t think Niko is that guy. Polarizing opinion to some but for me Spo wants an Anunoby or PJ Washington type at the 4.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Our PF rotation next to Bam this year was probably the worst in the league. That needs to get fixed fast. No more Martin’s and Highsmith’s. No more trash non defensive Centers like Bryant backing up Bam. No more cement footed players like Love protecting the paint.

[jbsays]

The Heat didn't land Lillard last offseason, but both the Bucks and Heat lost in the first round of playoffs and both teams best players were injured. Interesting to me that Lillard didn't really work out for Bucks, although due to injuries it will be one of those "we'll never know/what could have been". Lillard isn't getting any younger though.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Our Power rotation last year behind Bam was bar none probably the worst in the league. No more Martins and Highsmith’s playing PF. No more non defensive Centers like Bryant. No more undersized cement footed aged players like Love trying to protect the paint. Love was supposed to be the perfect 4 next to Bam and he ended up just becoming an out of position backup Center.

[Wiltside]

Debating whether it’s better offering Jovic or the 15th pick with Herro. I think I might like da Silva or Filipowski more than I do Jovic.

Nah you wilin there MWP. Niko >>>>

Don’t discredit the strides he’s made this year. He’s going to have a solid summer with the Serbian national team and come back primed to lock up that 4 spot. Team looks a lot less undersized if you replace Herro with Ingram too.

Rozier
Ingram
Butler
Jovic
Adebayo

I’m on the fence with Niko still. Not sure completely sold yet even though I know he’s young and all. Sensing a little bit of Winslowitis Justice better now when it comes to him among some in the fan base lol

Point Niko could be even better than Point Justise

[MettaWorldPanda]

Nah you wilin there MWP. Niko >>>>

Don’t discredit the strides he’s made this year. He’s going to have a solid summer with the Serbian national team and come back primed to lock up that 4 spot. Team looks a lot less undersized if you replace Herro with Ingram too.

Rozier
Ingram
Butler
Jovic
Adebayo

I’m on the fence with Niko still. Not sure completely sold yet even though I know he’s young and all. Sensing a little bit of Winslowitis Justice better now when it comes to him among some in the fan base lol

Point Niko could be even better than Point Justise

100 percent agree with you on this

[MettaWorldPanda]

Would not mind seeing Jovic on the Pelicans tbh a line up of him/Zion/Herb Jones/Murphy III and a decent to good PG would be interesting, the Pelicans did really lack a stretch 4 all year.

It would be a good fit for sure. Herro would also fit in well at the two though not perfectly with CJ. I don’t see CJ in the long term plans anyway. Pels littered with lengthy defensive wings to protect them.

[DayofMourning]

Yes. We owe him $101 million over 2 years ... unless he declines his players option, in which case we owe him $49 million for 1 year. That's it. It would be a mistake to extend Jimmy at $50 million per year. It would be a mistake to extend Jimmy at $40 million per year.

There's a very high probability that Jimmy is already overpaid starting next season. I understand why he wants an extension, but there's no good reason for the Heat to give him one. It would be mismanagement to extend Jimmy.

Everyone supporting an extension now will be disowning it in 2 years.

No one think h'ell be worth his salary at age 37, the front office isn't stupid.

It's about taking care of your superstars, about letting him retire as a Heat, it's the things we **** up with Wade.
It's less about the future play and more about taking care of the person and appreciation his accomplishments.

It's only a 1 year extension, So I don't think it's that big of a deal. I don't think we're contending for a ship in 3 years anyway.

We're taking care of him now. He's not our superstar, he's a merc. He's played most of his career on 3 other teams.

This is the honest truth. Butler can be a vet min guy for us, but this extend him and pay him an extra $70 mil a year is BS. Its the Miami Heat, not the Miami Butlers. Were not supposed to be donating to charity.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Just say no to sleepy Ingram

The big picture outlook here is that if he continues to be sleepy then you let him walk next year and clear his 36 million off the books. I sense he’ll have a banner year here playing for his next big contract with Spo unlocking full potential. It’s a worthy gamble and at worst you unloaded the contracts of Herro and Robinson.

[Kobewade11]

Just say no to sleepy Ingram

The big picture outlook here is that if he continues to be sleepy then you let him walk next year and clear his 36 million off the books. I sense he’ll have a banner year here playing for his next big contract with Spo unlocking full potential. It’s a worthy gamble and at worst you unloaded the contracts of Herro and Robinson.

One could argue we jumped at the wrong PG with our best moveable asset. Is Ingram the absolute best we could do with the tradeable assets we have left?

[MettaWorldPanda]

Just say no to sleepy Ingram

The big picture outlook here is that if he continues to be sleepy then you let him walk next year and clear his 36 million off the books. I sense he’ll have a banner year here playing for his next big contract with Spo unlocking full potential. It’s a worthy gamble and at worst you unloaded the contracts of Herro and Robinson.

One could argue we jumped at the wrong PG with our best moveable asset. Is Ingram the absolute best we could do with the tradeable assets we have left?

Possibly. It’s a logical one considering all the factors. That’s unless you’re in the camp that we could realistically get Mitchell with Herro, Robinson, and Jovic. I’d like to see a healthy Rozier here after a full camp before making the determination that trading a late first for him was a terrible idea. It only looks terrible due to previous years of piss poor asset management. In particular the KZ Okpala trade in which we didn’t even take advantage of at the time.

[Hoops3355]

I know a lot of folks in here like Jovic and of course I also see a long term vision with him but for some reason I don't think Spo shares those same feelings. Something tells me he was forced to play him a little more then he liked this year and it was pretty telling during the Boston series that he was just not happy with his play. Would not shock me one bit to see him dealt this offseason as a carrot to make a deal work. I could see a complete collapse in here when it happens. Something along the lines of Winslow dealt to the Grizzlies type of emotional outburst lol

This is wild take. Like you made this up in your head then put it out there. Did anyone agree with you on this? If you look at a little deeper you'd remember he had back spams and often times those don't really work out that well once you cool off and then beyond he's had the knee issue. Basically Spo sees how badly he wants it he wouldn't be wasting his GUY Caron on him if that wasn't the case. You guys paint this picture of Spo like the dude's Darth Vader.

What's so wild about this take? That Spo was uncomfortable trusting a 20 year old year old who was clearly in way over his head in these playoffs? He basically trusted Haywood Highsmith alot more then he did Jovic. Jovic's body language also stunk when he would miss easy shots and the moment might have gotten to big for him. That's ok he's only 20 years old. Once again WOULD NOT SHOCK ME if Jovic is included in a deal that brings back a more ready and win now veteran that Spo can trust.

Once again not actually responding to facts of matter and projecting your illusions. At least its a consistent thing with you this season.

[Wiltside]

The big picture outlook here is that if he continues to be sleepy then you let him walk next year and clear his 36 million off the books. I sense he’ll have a banner year here playing for his next big contract with Spo unlocking full potential. It’s a worthy gamble and at worst you unloaded the contracts of Herro and Robinson.

One could argue we jumped at the wrong PG with our best moveable asset. Is Ingram the absolute best we could do with the tradeable assets we have left?

Possibly. It’s a logical one considering all the factors. That’s unless you’re in the camp that we could realistically get Mitchell with Herro, Robinson, and Jovic. I’d like to see a healthy Rozier here after a full camp before making the determination that trading a late first for him was a terrible idea. It only looks terrible due to previous years of piss poor asset management. In particular the KZ Okpala trade in which we didn’t even take advantage of at the time.

I think what’s lost with Ingram is he’s in the right age group for us. He’s a young vet. He’s literally the same age as Bam, despite the fact it feels like he’s been around forever. At 26-27 years of age, he still has probably 5 years of prime before the decline.

[MettaWorldPanda]

This is wild take. Like you made this up in your head then put it out there. Did anyone agree with you on this? If you look at a little deeper you'd remember he had back spams and often times those don't really work out that well once you cool off and then beyond he's had the knee issue. Basically Spo sees how badly he wants it he wouldn't be wasting his GUY Caron on him if that wasn't the case. You guys paint this picture of Spo like the dude's Darth Vader.

What's so wild about this take? That Spo was uncomfortable trusting a 20 year old year old who was clearly in way over his head in these playoffs? He basically trusted Haywood Highsmith alot more then he did Jovic. Jovic's body language also stunk when he would miss easy shots and the moment might have gotten to big for him. That's ok he's only 20 years old. Once again WOULD NOT SHOCK ME if Jovic is included in a deal that brings back a more ready and win now veteran that Spo can trust.

Once again not actually responding to facts of matter and projecting your illusions. At least its a consistent thing with you this season.

Opinions are up for discussion. Whether you agree with them or not. No need to resort to personal attacks because you don’t agree with a projection not to your liking. State your rebuttal and move on.