PG Portland: Loss

[msiris]

We have a low bbiq team which makes it harder to win close games.

The Bucks have the most amount of "clutch" wins in the NBA this season, second on win % at 69.2%, with an overall net rating of +20.8.

Why doesn't it feel like it? Is it becaue we have had so may close games? How does it compare to Boston??

[mediocrityrules]

We have a low bbiq team which makes it harder to win close games.

The Bucks have the most amount of "clutch" wins in the NBA this season, second on win % at 69.2%, with an overall net rating of +20.8.

Why doesn't it feel like it? Is it becaue we have had so may close games? How does it compare to Boston??

It's the fact that so many games are that close to begin with is the problem. We shouldn't be fighting and scraping for clutch wins against the likes of Detroit, Spurs and Portland. We're so bad through the first three quarters that we find ourselves in clutch situations that we just shouldn't be in. We win most of these because we have more talent on the floor, but dumb plays and smarter opposition coaching are our kryptonite in these situations against anyone.

Those clutch numbers are misleading.

[mediocrityrules]

I just will not accept that this is the loss that causes half the board to lose it's **** mind lol. Seriously, wtf? This was pretty much the definition of a shooting-variance loss against a bad team that we would occasionally have during the Bud era, and it's like nobody has learned anything.

I won't accept that this loss is just one of those 'bad shooting night' things when our defense looked like it did. Portland is the 29th-best offensive side in the association. Even with a 'shooting variance' night, we should at least be able to hold them to a score below ours. The sloppy defense and turnovers, as well as a complete lack of cohesion in execution of any plays are what lost this one. We can overcome shooting variance if we look like a basketball team in the other areas of the game. Last night we didn't.

[Ron Swanson]

The clutch numbers themselves aren't "misleading" because they are accurately painting what should be obvious to anyone. That this team can straight up run opposing defenses off the court with the best offensive trio in basketball, even when things tighten up in the 4th quarter.

Now, yes, why we're constantly playing down to the competition and letting inferior teams hang around is a valid question/concern (there's also a somewhat valid "it's the regular season" excuse in there somewhere). But again, this was the first game since Griffin was canned that we gave up a 116 Offensive-Rating or worse (our season DRTG is 117.1 lol). You may as well be comparing two completely different teams pre-January 23rd vs. now.

[German Athens]

Giannis is slipping his screens for Dame, because Dame is often getting blitzed on them. At that point slipping a screen functions similarly to a switch gone awry because both players are too high (think the MPJ slip when Giannis and Khris were too high on Jokic).

There’s problems with it though:

1) Dame isn’t big enough to pass over the top, so he has to directly hit the pocket pass which is a much more difficult pass to consistently make since the window is smaller and the defender can bring their arms low in the gap. (Think back to the denver slip, Jokic is big enough to pass over the top where the window is much larger)

2) You need to keep the defense off balance with variety. If they know you slip, they don’t have to worry about getting around the screen, and can just focus on pinching the gap and bringing the arm low.

___

If the results aren’t what you expect from slipping the screen because Dame can’t pass over the top, and you’re doing it too much, so defenses can prepare for it, then you have to add another branch to that algorithm. Set a screen with a wide base and make contact early. Allow Dame a little more space to take advantage of the big who blitzed him.

Giannis does set screens for Khris and Cam. I think Giannis is just trying to read and react to the game, but he needs to realize that he can’t react the same way every time if it’s not yielding great results.

[Baddy Chuck]

The Bucks have the most amount of "clutch" wins in the NBA this season, second on win % at 69.2%, with an overall net rating of +20.8.

Why doesn't it feel like it? Is it becaue we have had so may close games? How does it compare to Boston??

It's the fact that so many games are that close to begin with is the problem. We shouldn't be fighting and scraping for clutch wins against the likes of Detroit, Spurs and Portland. We're so bad through the first three quarters that we find ourselves in clutch situations that we just shouldn't be in. We win most of these because we have more talent on the floor, but dumb plays and smarter opposition coaching are our kryptonite in these situations against anyone.

Those clutch numbers are misleading.

The numbers are the numbers, they aren't misleading anything. Like sure, we shouldn't be in these situations most of the time but we've been pretty good in them when we're there. The idea that we're "too dumb" to execute down the stretch when it's basically the only thing propping up our season right now is dumb.

[Jez2983]

Guys, Horst is terrible. Only constructed the bulk of the roster that won the franchise's first title in 50 years and is consistently at the top of the league. I demand a GM who never makes a move that doesn't work out.

Typical response. You can praise him for making big trades and being active. You can also criticize him for squandering what little assets this team has. Dudes batting about .100 for impactful margins moves

I think this is a typical response from the opposite side. Pat, Brook, Portis, hell Beasley, Forbes, Allen have all been pretty good marginal moves. Has he drafted well? No. Did we stuff up moves like Semi, Pau, Mirotic? Yep. The Jrue move helped win us a championship. I don't think you could consider him anything other than a good GM.

At the moment, do I think the team is well-constructed? Absolutely not. This team needs to be built around Giannis and Dame, and at the moment it still has parts that were to fit with Jrue. He needs to fix it and he's on the clock.

[mediocrityrules]

Why doesn't it feel like it? Is it becaue we have had so may close games? How does it compare to Boston??

It's the fact that so many games are that close to begin with is the problem. We shouldn't be fighting and scraping for clutch wins against the likes of Detroit, Spurs and Portland. We're so bad through the first three quarters that we find ourselves in clutch situations that we just shouldn't be in. We win most of these because we have more talent on the floor, but dumb plays and smarter opposition coaching are our kryptonite in these situations against anyone.

Those clutch numbers are misleading.

The numbers are the numbers, they aren't misleading anything. Like sure, we shouldn't be in these situations most of the time but we've been pretty good in them when we're there. The idea that we're "too dumb" to execute down the stretch when it's basically the only thing propping up our season right now is dumb.

When we've lost clutch games, it's been our lack of BBIQ that's done it, and it's been called out in every PG thread. This is not a misleading statement.

No, the idea that the clutch numbers are something to hang our hat on as a great thing that this team has is dumb. It points to big flaws in this team that we are in this situation so often. We have Detroit x2, Portland x2, and the Spurs (and more) in those clutch numbers. We should win these in the clutch. How is that something to hang our hat on? that we keep managing to get ourselves out of jail because we happen to have more talent at the death than the bottom-feeding clubs, and raw talent usually overcomes our lack of BBIQ on the court?

"At least we're good in the clutch" against teams under .500 is not how you want to define us against those teams. We should play coherent basketball, build a solid lead and maintain it. We seem to struggle with this.

[msiris]

It's the fact that so many games are that close to begin with is the problem. We shouldn't be fighting and scraping for clutch wins against the likes of Detroit, Spurs and Portland. We're so bad through the first three quarters that we find ourselves in clutch situations that we just shouldn't be in. We win most of these because we have more talent on the floor, but dumb plays and smarter opposition coaching are our kryptonite in these situations against anyone.

Those clutch numbers are misleading.

The numbers are the numbers, they aren't misleading anything. Like sure, we shouldn't be in these situations most of the time but we've been pretty good in them when we're there. The idea that we're "too dumb" to execute down the stretch when it's basically the only thing propping up our season right now is dumb.

When we've lost clutch games, it's been our lack of BBIQ that's done it, and it's been called out in every PG thread. This is not a misleading statement.

No, the idea that the clutch numbers are something to hang our hat on as a great thing that this team has is dumb. It points to big flaws in this team that we are in this situation so often. We have Detroit x2, Portland x2, and the Spurs (and more) in those clutch numbers. We should win these in the clutch. How is that something to hang our hat on? that we keep managing to get ourselves out of jail because we happen to have more talent at the death than the bottom-feeding clubs, and raw talent usually overcomes our lack of BBIQ on the court?

"At least we're good in the clutch" against teams under .500 is not how you want to define us against those teams. We should play coherent basketball, build a solid lead and maintain it. We seem to struggle with this.

Well the last two games we have not been clutch for sure.

[fansinceforever]

Swung some amazing deals and has had quite a few head scratchers.

So you're saying he is a professional sports GM.

I mean, I said more than that but i guess you'd thought it'd be best left out.

[msiris]

Why doesn't it feel like it? Is it becaue we have had so may close games? How does it compare to Boston??

It's the fact that so many games are that close to begin with is the problem. We shouldn't be fighting and scraping for clutch wins against the likes of Detroit, Spurs and Portland. We're so bad through the first three quarters that we find ourselves in clutch situations that we just shouldn't be in. We win most of these because we have more talent on the floor, but dumb plays and smarter opposition coaching are our kryptonite in these situations against anyone.

Those clutch numbers are misleading.

The numbers are the numbers, they aren't misleading anything. Like sure, we shouldn't be in these situations most of the time but we've been pretty good in them when we're there. The idea that we're "too dumb" to execute down the stretch when it's basically the only thing propping up our season right now is dumb.

It not dumb. Boston doesn't have to be clutch because they are hardly in posiion to begin with. We had the 2nd easiest schedule in the 1st half and we had to be the clutches to get there.

[Baddy Chuck]

It not dumb. Boston doesn't have to be clutch because they are hardly in posiion to begin with. We had the 2nd easiest schedule in the 1st half and we had to be the clutches to get there.

Boston has literally been in 3 less clutch games than us, their net rating is only 1.2 points higher, their offense slightly better, their defense slightly worse, they have a .4 lower turnover % and a .1% higher TS%. And instead of 18-8, they're actually worse at 15-8.

[msiris]

It not dumb. Boston doesn't have to be clutch because they are hardly in posiion to begin with. We had the 2nd easiest schedule in the 1st half and we had to be the clutches to get there.

Boston has literally been in 3 less clutch games than us, their net rating is only 1.2 points higher, their offense slightly better, their defense slightly worse, they have a .4 lower turnover % and a .1% higher TS%. And instead of 18-8, they're actually worse at 15-8.

So there is hope. I take everything back. There is no great team in the NBA right now.

[blazza18]

At the moment, do I think the team is well-constructed? Absolutely not. This team needs to be built around Giannis and Dame, and at the moment it still has parts that were to fit with Jrue. He needs to fix it and he's on the clock.

Jrue could still be here and the roster would still be poorly constructed. The only difference is we'd have one perimeter defender instead of none.

[Jez2983]

At the moment, do I think the team is well-constructed? Absolutely not. This team needs to be built around Giannis and Dame, and at the moment it still has parts that were to fit with Jrue. He needs to fix it and he's on the clock.

Jrue could still be here and the roster would still be poorly constructed. The only difference is we'd have one perimeter defender instead of none.

Fair enough. I think Dame at least tries on D, he certainly battles, but he's just too small. I'm absolutely ok with trading any non Giannis/Dame players to create a better roster. Maybe we should do a thread of the hypothetical best/realistic roster to put around those guys. Start with ideal best fit and maybe work back to achievable best fit?

[fan230]

Comparing the rosters of last year, and this year, with respect to defense: people keep comparing Jrue vs Dame teams, saying something like we had one point of attack defender versus none now. That is not correct. We had three such good defenders last year. Jrue, Javon and Wes. This year we have zero. Naturally the defense from that perspective, this year is much worse. We are comparing apples versus oranges.

[German Athens]

Comparing the rosters of last year, and this year, with respect to defense: people keep comparing Jrue vs Dame teams, saying something like we had one point of attack defender versus none now. That is not correct. We had three such good defenders last year. Jrue, Javon and Wes. This year we have zero. Naturally the defense from that perspective, this year is much worse. We are comparing apples versus oranges.

Jevon and Wes also represent an opportunity for us. One was a buyout and the other we brought in midway through the season on the min.

The asset used in either case was just a roster spot.

If we could swing our assets right now to bring in an elite defender (Caruso, smart, etc.), and then hunt the buyout market where someone like Wright could become available, we could quickly overhaul this roster to have similar defensive talent as in years past.

[rilamann]

At the moment, do I think the team is well-constructed? Absolutely not. This team needs to be built around Giannis and Dame, and at the moment it still has parts that were to fit with Jrue. He needs to fix it and he's on the clock.

Jrue could still be here and the roster would still be poorly constructed. The only difference is we'd have one perimeter defender instead of none.

Fair enough. I think Dame at least tries on D, he certainly battles, but he's just too small. I'm absolutely ok with trading any non Giannis/Dame players to create a better roster. Maybe we should do a thread of the hypothetical best/realistic roster to put around those guys. Start with ideal best fit and maybe work back to achievable best fit?

Saying that Dame tries & battles defensively is one of those things where you're not totally sure if the person saying it is trolling or being sarcasitc.

[GoldenAntlers]

At the moment, do I think the team is well-constructed? Absolutely not. This team needs to be built around Giannis and Dame, and at the moment it still has parts that were to fit with Jrue. He needs to fix it and he's on the clock.

Jrue could still be here and the roster would still be poorly constructed. The only difference is we'd have one perimeter defender instead of none.

Fair enough. I think Dame at least tries on D, he certainly battles, but he's just too small. I'm absolutely ok with trading any non Giannis/Dame players to create a better roster. Maybe we should do a thread of the hypothetical best/realistic roster to put around those guys. Start with ideal best fit and maybe work back to achievable best fit?

Sounds fun!

[-Jragon-]

Giannis is slipping his screens for Dame, because Dame is often getting blitzed on them. At that point slipping a screen functions similarly to a switch gone awry because both players are too high (think the MPJ slip when Giannis and Khris were too high on Jokic).

There’s problems with it though:

1) Dame isn’t big enough to pass over the top, so he has to directly hit the pocket pass which is a much more difficult pass to consistently make since the window is smaller and the defender can bring their arms low in the gap. (Think back to the denver slip, Jokic is big enough to pass over the top where the window is much larger)

2) You need to keep the defense off balance with variety. If they know you slip, they don’t have to worry about getting around the screen, and can just focus on pinching the gap and bringing the arm low.

___

If the results aren’t what you expect from slipping the screen because Dame can’t pass over the top, and you’re doing it too much, so defenses can prepare for it, then you have to add another branch to that algorithm. Set a screen with a wide base and make contact early. Allow Dame a little more space to take advantage of the big who blitzed him.

Giannis does set screens for Khris and Cam. I think Giannis is just trying to read and react to the game, but he needs to realize that he can’t react the same way every time if it’s not yielding great results.

Right, plus GA needs to turn towards the dribbler right away and shuffle or run to space while keeping some distance and an angle for the pass. His chest should never turn away from the dribbler.. right now he does ..It will always be a little different.. he might trail if Dame bursts in right away or he might stop in the lane if the D collapses.. short jumper or pump fake and create