OT: D'Antoni Out in Phoenix

smauss · Post #21 » by **smauss** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:29 pm

Kohl Is A Mome wrote:Wasnt it because he refused to play more guys in his rotation? I mean granted, you dont want to run all your end of the bench garbage out there, but you need to go more than 7 deep to have a chance. (This also really bit them in the ass with Grant Hill. Sure he managed to stay healthy nearly all year miraculously, but in the end he inevitably got injured again from wear and tear).

Great point (IMHO)!

xTitan · Post #22 » by **xTitan** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:40 pm

Avery Johnson should be the first coach fired and I would not be shocked at all if D'Antoni was as well. D'Antoni is your classic regular season coach who plays a fan friendly exciting style......it hasn't, and won't translate to playoff basketball, it is that simple...and with Nash, Shaq, and Grant Hill....they have gotten old in some key areas.

Sigra · Post #23 » by **Sigra** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:11 pm

Kerr denied this:

http://www.theknicksblog.com/2008/04/30 ... dismissal/

Nebula1 · Post #24 » by **Nebula1** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:27 pm

Why would you fire this guy? Have a good upgrade in mind? Seems foolish to me.

Whiteman · Post #25 » by **Whiteman** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:39 pm

xTitan wrote:Avery Johnson should be the first coach fired and I would not be shocked at all if D'Antoni was as well. D'Antoni is your classic regular season coach who plays a fan friendly exciting style......it hasn't, and won't translate to playoff basketball, it is that simple

No it isn't. The Suns were really close to the WC finals last years, might have made it if it wasn't for the Diaw/Amare suspensions. They would have been favorites to win it all.

Main problem with the Suns is that they're only 7 deep, and they effectively played without one of their key players (Hill) against the Spurs.If the Suns had an owner willing to pay luxury tax, they would have had a few useful vets on the bench (Kurt Thomas for example).

Post #26 » by **MickeyDavis** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:26 pm

WEFFPIM wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

He also drove them to a ridiculous amount of success in his time there and change the way pro teams looked at the run-and-gun offense.

Bad move.

Run and gun wins regular season games but not playoff games. And that's where success is determined. In the playoffs the Suns were 26-25 under D'Antoni.

fam3381 · Post #27 » by **fam3381** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:35 pm

xTitan wrote:D'Antoni is your classic regular season coach who plays a fan friendly exciting style......it hasn't, and won't translate to playoff basketball, it is that simple...and with Nash, Shaq, and Grant Hill....they have gotten old in some key areas.

The team that lost in the playoffs wasn't the Suns run-and-gun team though. They were far more successful in recent years when they weren't trying to mimic the Spurs, but they just came up short. Now they tried to play a more traditional style and they got burned.

Plus there are lots of very well-respected coaches who have done as little or less in the playoffs than D'Antoni while playing more of a slug-it-out brand of basketball. A number of them were candidates for our head coaching job this offseason.

smooth 'lil balla · Post #28 » by **smooth 'lil balla** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:44 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

In the playoffs the Suns were 26-25 under D'Antoni.

Is that supposed to be a bad record? I don't think you'll find many current coaches with more games played and a better record.

Suns are crazy to let him go. Chances are however he wants out as rumor is he and Kerr don't see eye to eye.

Rumor also is Dantoni wanted the shaq trade.

Also, i don't think the Suns have an abundance of talent like some of the others here.

Bucks_Revenge · Post #29 » by **Bucks_Revenge** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:54 pm

those former Bulls sure know how to run a team.

Post #30 » by **MickeyDavis** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:14 pm

I'm not saying he isn't a good coach. I'm saying the jury is out on him. I don't think anyone can say he didn't have a lot of talent on his Suns teams. A majority of coaches coach to the level of talent they have on their team. The elite coaches exceed that. I think he coached to the level of talent on the teams he had. We'll see what he does with his next team.

LISTEN2JAZZ · Post #31 » by **LISTEN2JAZZ** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:16 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:Run and gun wins regular season games but not playoff games. And that's where success is determined.

If that's true, why didn't they have greater success when they stopped running this year?

I think the "run and gun doesn't win" thing is just a big myth. The only really important factor in playoff success is whether or not you have an elite top-5 player. Either you've got Garnett/Lebron/Duncan/Kobe/Paul, or you don't. They can run up and down or they can walk it.

Lots of fast paced teams have had playoff success. Magic's Lakers, Webber's Kings, perhaps Paul's Hornets right now.

EastSideBucksFan · Post #32 » by **EastSideBucksFan** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:27 pm

adamcz wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

If that's true, why didn't they have greater success when they stopped running this year?

I think the "run and gun doesn't win" thing is just a big myth. The only really important factor in playoff success is whether or not you have an elite top-5 player. Either you've got Garnett/Lebron/Duncan/Kobe/Paul, or you don't. They can run up and down or they can walk it.

Lots of fast paced teams have had playoff success. Magic's Lakers, Webber's Kings, perhaps Paul's Hornets right now.

So, are you saying that the two years that Nash was MVP you don't even consider him an elite Top 5 player?

crkone · Post #33 » by **crkone** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:00 pm

Run and gun doesn't work in the playoffs because those teams typically play poor defense. The teams that play better defense win, since they get away with more on that end than during the regular season. You still get some bad calls but they usually let the teams play physical.

Post #34 » by **MickeyDavis** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:11 pm

This is a good thread and an interesting debate because there really is no way to objectively know how much of a teams successes (and failures) can be attributed to the coach.

Did Doc Rivers all of a sudden become a better coach before this season? Did Larry Brown forget how to coach when he joined the Knicks?

WEFFPIM · Post #35 » by **WEFFPIM** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:12 pm

So, should someone add a question mark to the thread title?

El Duderino · Post #36 » by **El Duderino** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:13 pm

It's not like the Spurs dominated the Suns this year

In game one, if Duncan doesn't make his only three pointer on the season, the Suns win that game.

Nash choked away the deciding game

Last minute execution in the close games is what decided this series, not style of play.

jerrod · Post #37 » by **jerrod** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:16 pm

EastSideBucksFan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

So, are you saying that the two years that Nash was MVP you don't even consider him an elite Top 5 player?

i probably wouldn't

LISTEN2JAZZ · Post #38 » by **LISTEN2JAZZ** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:30 pm

EastSideBucksFan wrote:So, are you saying that the two years that Nash was MVP you don't even consider him an elite Top 5 player?

So are you saying that if I say you need a top 5 player to win, all 5 top 5 players have to win it each year for that statement to be true?

showtimesam · Post #39 » by **showtimesam** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:36 pm

I view Kerr as more of a problem in Phoenix than D'Antoni.

Andrew34r · Post #40 » by **Andrew34r** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:37 pm

Bad move, IMO. Who in the world could Phoenix bring in at this point that would be a noticeable upgrade? The next coach will have to live up to huge expectations.