dirk nowitzki

Bucks_Revenge · Post #21 » by **Bucks_Revenge** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:27 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:Dirk never said he wouldn't come to Milwaukee. He was just a 19-year old who was tentative on coming over to the USA/NBA period.

The only reason he was comfortable with Dallas was because Donn Nelson had been working/recruiting him for years. It was believed Dallas was maybe the only team that had good enough ties with him to get him to make the leap if he was drafted.

Cuban had nothing to do with this either. This was Nelson, Nelson and Ross Perot, Jr, the former owner who cut this deal with Dirk.

then what other place then to come to the place where Nelson started and the team that drafted you.

rilamann · Post #22 » by **rilamann** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:34 pm

I think Dirk would realy like it here in Milwaukee.

And PP is right on the money,Dirk never said he wouldnt come to Milwaukee he just wasnt all that hyped about comming to the NBA period back in 1998 as PP mentioned.

Im more a fan of the bottom out and go into all out rebuild mode for the Bucks but if we could Dirk why not go for it like you guys are saying.

EastSideBucksFan · Post #23 » by **EastSideBucksFan** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:38 pm

Alright, if we're talking a trade without Redd, I'd give them. Mo/Yi/this years 1st and Simmons

That would leave us with

Sessions
Redd
Mason/FA
Dirk
Bogut

Try to move CV for a PG or a SF and let Redd/Dirk/Bogut compete.

I'm betting that would put us top 4 in the east for the next 4-5 years.

I have a feeling that Bogut would love to play next to Dirk and vice versa.

I would also like to have Maders be bought by Dirk and renamed "Nowitzki's". Third Street could be retrofitted and Dirk could have his own little slice of Germany right there for him.

Bucks_Revenge · Post #24 » by **Bucks_Revenge** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:44 pm

why will they take mo they have 2 pgs who are better...we can save mo for an extra pick or whatever.

WEFFPIM · Post #25 » by **WEFFPIM** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:45 pm

rilamann wrote:I think Dirk would realy like it here in Milwaukee.

Why would you say that?

Chapter29 · Post #26 » by **Chapter29** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:49 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:We talked about this one a week ago. Both Phoenix and Dallas are in desparate straights. Their teams are aging and neither as presently constituted will ever catch up to the Lakers, New Orleans, Utah or the Spurs. Houston is a wild card and Portland and Seattle both have the future superstars on their rosters.

Redd/Yi for Dirk. Put the offer on the table.

Or put out there Yi/Simmons/CV or Yi/Simmons/#7

Plenty of options as long as you keep Bogut and one other guy to score in the backcourt (Mo or Redd)

Not sure that they are so deparate that they would liquidate their star talent.

I do agree that both Dallas and Phoenix are in a bit of a predicament for the reasons you state. Where I disagree is that they would be willing to turn a star player into a couple average to good players. I think star power wins and even though I don't care much for Dirk, I would pull the trigger on any of those deals in a heartbeat, Dallas I cannot imagine would.

I didn't like either of the old man trades and it backfired on both teams. They hoped it would put them over the top and it obviously didn't. Not sure what they are going to do, but trading their star is very unlikely.

smauss · Post #27 » by **smauss** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:52 pm

EastSideBucksFan wrote:Alright, if we're talking a trade without Redd, I'd give them. Mo/Yi/this years 1st and Simmons

That would leave us with

Sessions
Redd
Mason/FA
Dirk
Bogut

Try to move CV for a PG or a SF and let Redd/Dirk/Bogut compete.

I'm betting that would put us top 4 in the east for the next 4-5 years.

I have a feeling that Bogut would love to play next to Dirk and vice versa.

I would also like to have Maders be bought by Dirk and renamed "Nowitzki's". Third Street could be retrofitted and Dirk could have his own little slice of Germany right there for him.

I would be pumped for this deal but I simply don't think you get Dirk w/o Redd being involved.

ETA: I also agree in that I think any trading of Dirk to Milwaukee would be a pipe dream. We simply don't have the talent to return....... :nonono:

EastSideBucksFan · Post #28 » by **EastSideBucksFan** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:54 pm

smauss wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

I would be pumped for this deal but I simply don't think you get Dirk w/o Redd being involved.

I don't think it would either and I wouldn't let the inclusion of Redd stop me from acquiring Dirk.

I would make it Redd/Yi for Dirk.

Trade this years first unless we get a top 3 and also trade CV to fill holes at the SG and SF spots.

fam3381 · Post #29 » by **fam3381** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:55 pm

I agree with Chap to some extent...this is far tougher for the Mavs than us.

Thinking about it a bit, I have a hard time seeing Cuban being able to pull the trigger on this kind of deal unless he's head over heels in love with Yi and thinks Redd is much better than we do. We've become kind of jaded about both, but I still don't know if they're enough.

Dirk hasn't been able to carry them in the playoffs the past two seasons, but they are bringing in a new coach and can also move Howard for some fresh talent as well. It's not like Dirk is a cancer or is demanding out or whatever. He's one of the best players in the game and I don't see them getting better by trading him.

rilamann · Post #30 » by **rilamann** » Tue May 6, 2008 9:55 pm

WEFFPIM wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Why would you say that?

Easy,and its already been mentioned by Fam.Dirk is German and Milwaukee is a very German city with a large German population.

smauss · Post #31 » by **smauss** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:02 pm

fam3381 wrote:I agree with Chap to some extent...this is far tougher for the Mavs than us.

Thinking about it a bit, I have a hard time seeing Cuban being able to pull the trigger on this kind of deal unless he's head over heels in love with Yi and thinks Redd is much better than we do. We've become kind of jaded about both, but I still don't know if they're enough.

Dirk hasn't been able to carry them in the playoffs the past two seasons, but they are bringing in a new coach and can also move Howard for some fresh talent as well. It's not like Dirk is a cancer or is demanding out or whatever. He's one of the best players in the game and I don't see them getting better by trading him.

My thoughts exactly, as I edited my previous post! I would love it but I can't see it happening. My guess is that they change some major pieces but not blow it up, especially with a new coach coming in.

Post #32 » by **paulpressey25** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:18 pm

You guys are all looking at this from the perspective of Milwaukee fans and wondering why Dirk would ever be traded by Dallas.

I agree it would be a long-shot, but Dallas is in their own way as bad off as we are. Or at least their fans feel that way.

It all depends on expectations. Dallas has been going for a title now for seven years. And now they are clearly going backwards. You can't even argue against that.

Sometimes teams in that situation just get tired of the status quo, even if the status quo is 54-wins every year. Teams in that situation think about doing desparate things (like trading for Kidd). Players in that situation get tired of playing on the same team with the same guys and never making it year after year.

I'm not saying our package of assets to pick and choose from (Yi, Redd, Mo, #7 plus cap filler) is 100% equal value, but rebuilding teams with young stars (like a Durant or Brandon Roy) or say a top two pick in this draft (Rose/Beasley picks) aren't going to trade those assets for Dirk. They just aren't.

Dallas can either try and rebuild entirely around Dirk while blowing everything else, or they can trade Dirk and blow it up, but with some new assets. And we've actually got ok assets to offer up in the second scenario.

Chapter29 · Post #33 » by **Chapter29** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:25 pm

No Press, I am actually looking at it from Dallas' perspective.

I would not trade Dirk for those players. If Bogut is included maybe.

There are almost certainly better offers and again why move Dirk when you have a valuable asset in Josh Howard that you can move?

fam3381 · Post #34 » by **fam3381** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:27 pm

Chapter29 wrote:There are almost certainly better offers and again why move Dirk when you have a valuable asset in Josh Howard that you can move?

That's what I keep coming back to...if you could essentially get Redd for Howard, wouldn't that be preferable to any of the other deals? I agree that fans are probably cynical about the Dirk era at the moment, but when it comes right down to it I have to think they'd rather change things up around Dirk than try a pseudo-rebuild around Redd/Yi or whatever.

Sigra · Post #35 » by **Sigra** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:31 pm

Dirk for Redd and Yi works on trade checker. Add our pick and that's it. I hate Dirk but I would learn to love him. Lets do it!

europa · Post #36 » by **europa** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:33 pm

I don't think the Mavs go for Redd/Yi for Dirk. That's not enough in my opinion. Maybe they'd consider Redd/Yi/7 for Dirk. Maybe. But even then I'm not sure that's enough. They would have to think Yi has major superstar potential to make that trade - and I'm not sure anybody believes that about Yi at this point.

I still think it's Josh Howard who gets moved. I can't see Cuban trading Dirk unless he gets another superstar back in return (which the Bucks don't have) or he's absolutely backed into a corner and nobody offers him anything of substance for Howard (which wouldn't be the case if the Bucks got into the mix).

Post #37 » by **paulpressey25** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:44 pm

If Cuban can pull a Redd for Josh Howard, he may want to do that. I'm just pointing out that there are limited scenarios we could conjure up right now that make Dallas a serious contender again next season.

At some point you have to deal with the fact you've got an aging PG taking up $20mm of cap room. And no center of any worth. And no shooting guard of any worth. And all your draft picks are going to be in the #20 range where you hope you might luck out and get a Jason Maxiell but you aren't getting Brandon Roy.

For Dallas to get back up there, they'll need to blow up the team but retain Dirk, which means you'll suck and by the time your young guys get good, Dirk might be completely over the hill. There is no easy answer for Dallas right now.

bigkurty · Post #38 » by **bigkurty** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:48 pm

PP is wise. Hell we blew up our big three team pretty quick back in the day. There is no reason to think something like Dirk being dumped for something less than an elite player couldn't happen. Hell something like that happens almost every year in the NBA it seems.

europa · Post #39 » by **europa** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:49 pm

Kidd has a huge expiring deal so that's a big asset the Mavs still have. They can either use that to bring back a big-time player or let it expire and rebuild that way. I just don't see Cuban trading Dirk. I think Howard's dope issues have opened the door for him to be put on the block. The Sporting News had a report about Howard this week and the consensus around the league is people don't care much about Howard's admission and they don't think it will lower his trade value. If that's the case, he's the likely guy to be dealt in my opinion.

Post #40 » by **paulpressey25** » Tue May 6, 2008 10:55 pm

I'll speculate an unprovable fact, but I'd put money on it if I could. Mark Cuban, like all of us on here is an NBA Real GM nut. I'd guarantee right now he's going through every roster in the league and figuring out a plan B rebuild that involves trading Dirk. Just to see what a brainstorming session on it might produce.

I think Hammond needs to at least make the call. See what it would take.

He could do a complete blowup and try to trade Kidd to Miami for say the #2 (Beasley) plus some bad contracts. Trade Dirk for Yi/Sessions/#7/Simmons.

You can rationalize trying something like that.