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RingtheBell wrote:

Maybe, maybe not. The rumor involving the Mavs indicated Thomas, James and 5 is what the Wizards would deal for Howard or Terry.

And this was where?

http://www.draftexpress.com/blog/Jonathan-Givony/"

Dallas can offer either the non-guaranteed contract of Jerry Stackhouse to help the Wizards reduce payroll next year (while taking someone like Mike James or Etan Thomas off their hands) or they can help the Wizards by providing a veteran like Josh Howard or Jason Terry if it’s experience and scoring punch they are after. Either move would allow the Mavericks to stay flexible from a financial standpoint as they look towards the free agent class of 2010. They can also dangle their first round pick (#22).

LUKE23 wrote:I don't care if it's coming from the Washington media until a legit rumor is mentioned about the two teams. One writer's speculation doesn't not count as that. When I see Redd or RJ's names mentioned in a rumor piece, then I will get excited.

I stated quite clearly this may just be one writer's opinion and that it may ultimately be meaningless. But all we have right now is rumors and speculation. We have the Milwaukee media speculating about Flynn. The Washington media has been speculating about RJ and to a lesser extent Redd. On draft day, maybe some of that comes true. Maybe none of it does. But right now, all we have are rumors and speculation. You're free to evaluate this info however you want. For me, given the amount of speculation coming out of Washington that Grunfeld wants to trade the pick and that he's targeting a proven wing scorer in return I think Hammond needs to be working the phones with Ernie to see if a deal involving Redd or RJ for the fifth pick (assuming Harden's on the board) can get done.

europa wrote:Don't forget the Bucks don't have to be under the tax when the season begins. They could go over it to re-sign Sessions and then (if this trade happened) dangle two expirings of quality value (James and Thomas) at the deadline to get under the tax.

True but then you are looking to take on a longer contract that is less money from a team that is under the cap. I was thinking about that yesterday with Detroit dangling #15 + Amir, but who is rumored to be available that we would actually want?

paul wrote:
if we have to take back equal long term salary to get the #5 then I'm not particularly interested unless it is then used in another dea

If Hammond was able to deal RJ for 5/James/Thomas, he could try and combine Ridnour or Alexander with the 10th and move back if need be to shave some salary that way. Best-case scenario (though I don't think it happens) would be Ridnour/Alexander to Minnesota for 18. Again, I don't see that happening but it would shave off a good amount of salary and it leaves the Bucks with three first-round picks. That's pretty much the pie in the sky scenario in my opinion.

I think a better option would be offering Ridnour/cash for one of the several teams who need a backup PG and have multiple seconds to offer in return. The Blazers (who know Ridnour by virtue of McMillan) would be the top team I'd target.

Trade values aside, the Wizards understand that their window is nearing an end with the core they have and are in a "win-now" mode; I also think Grunfeld is fighting for his GM life here. Taking all that into account, I can't see them even considering Redd with all the health related question marks. I think trading Redd to anyone this year is a pipe-dream. RJ, on the other hand, I would be very interested in trading for some salary relief and #5. I'm not sure Kohl allows it however.......

You guys should take this over to the Wizards board. There are more informed people over there than the local DC journalists IMO. See what they say.

I'm fine with RJ for #5. If we have to take back Songalia back with Mike James, so be it. That guy can bang at least.

I fully expect RJ to be put on the trade block this summer. I think Kohl is fine with trading him. Whether a trade gets done depends on what is offered in return. But I see at least two teams (San Antonio and Cleveland) and now possibly a third (Washington) being interested.

I would bet anything there's no way we get #5 for Jefferson no matter what contracts we get back.

RingtheBell wrote:I would bet anything there's no way we get #5 for Jefferson no matter what contracts we get back.

I would agree. There will be better players available than RJ.

Im not sure why everyone is so gloom and doom about Redd's health.

I understand that few teams, if any, would trade for a guy coming off a serious knee injury.

But as far as his contributions to our team next year, word is his rehab is on track and he will be in camp 100% on opening day. The biggest thing for me that is being overlooked is that we are not talking about a high flyer like Wade or Carter who loses tremendous value/efficency when health concerns take away their explosiveness. We are talking about Michael Redd. Like him or hate him, he is like Reggie Miller in the sense that he is still going to be hoisting his shots and doing his thing at age 32, 33, 34. His prime is not as high as those other guys, but it is longer. Its not like he suddenly won't be dunking over people. Mike will still come off screens, shoot his weird lefty knuckleball jumper, get 20 a night, and get pounded by everyone here for everything he doesn't do. But as far as his knee and his health... I think people are over reacting.

But as far as his contributions to our team next year, word is his rehab is on track and he will be in camp 100% on opening day

I don't think I need to remind everyone of our training staff's track record with predictions on players being back. I will believe Redd is back AND 100% when I see it. I'm sure other teams agree.

europa wrote:I fully expect RJ to be put on the trade block this summer. I think Kohl is fine with trading him. Whether a trade gets done depends on what is offered in return. But I see at least two teams (San Antonio and Cleveland) and now possibly a third (Washington) being interested.

I don't think Kohls trades RJ for a pick and cap relief. That would be as if to say they aren't going to make the playoffs. I think Kohl is still fixated on that goal especially from a marketing perspective. He would be concerned it would have an air of "rebuild" to it IMHO.

smauss wrote:

europa wrote:I fully expect RJ to be put on the trade block this summer. I think Kohl is fine with trading him. Whether a trade gets done depends on what is offered in return. But I see at least two teams (San Antonio and Cleveland) and now possibly a third (Washington) being interested.

I don't think Kohls trades RJ for a pick and cap relief. That would be as if to say they aren't going to make the playoffs. I think Kohl is still fixated on that goal especially from a marketing perspective. He would be concerned it would have an air of "rebuild" to it IMHO.

It depends on the return and what subsequent moves are made. You can't just isolate the RJ trade if it happened and say that's the only move that determines if the Bucks will make the playoffs. And if this trade with the Wizards happened, I'd say getting James Harden is a sweet return and does nothing to weaken the Bucks' chances to make the playoffs next season.

Will Perdude wrote:Im not sure why everyone is so gloom and doom about Redd's health.

I understand that few teams, if any, would trade for a guy coming off a serious knee injury.

But as far as his contributions to our team next year, word is his rehab is on track and he will be in camp 100% on opening day. The biggest thing for me that is being overlooked is that we are not talking about a high flyer like Wade or Carter who loses tremendous value/efficency when health concerns take away their explosiveness. We are talking about Michael Redd. Like him or hate him, he is like Reggie Miller in the sense that he is still going to be hoisting his shots and doing his thing at age 32, 33, 34. His prime is not as high as those other guys, but it is longer. Its not like he suddenly won't be dunking over people. Mike will still come off screens, shoot his weird lefty knuckleball jumper, get 20 a night, and get pounded by everyone here for everything he doesn't do. But as far as his knee and his health... I think people are over reacting.

I don't disagree with you Will, but I was looking at Redd's health being a liability from a trade standpoint. In context, specifically a team looking to win-now. I simply don't think a team in that situation trades for a guy just coming off a major knee surgery that hasn't proven he can still play and be as productive.

I don't think Kohls trades RJ for a pick and cap relief. That would be as if to say they aren't going to make the playoffs. I think Kohl is still fixated on that goal especially from a marketing perspective. He would be concerned it would have an air of "rebuild" to it IMHO.

I agree smauss. That is why I don't think either Redd or RJ is moved. If we were going to move them they would have been moved last season.

I also think that if Washington is dangling the #5 pick and expirings, they can and will do better than either Redd or RJ.

LUKE23 wrote:

RingtheBell wrote:I would bet anything there's no way we get #5 for Jefferson no matter what contracts we get back.

I would agree. There will be better players available than RJ.

Who?
Carter, but he has one more year on his deal then RJ
Richardson?
AK?
Miller? expiring deal is probably a better draw
G.Wallace, also has one more year on his deal
Am I forgetting anyone?
I think the draw of RJ is playoff experience and experience playing the Wiz offense.

From a talent perspective, RJ and a healthy Redd are, in my opinion, better than any proven wing likely to be available. From a contract perspective, not so much. But if price isn't an object - and based on the current rumors it might not be - then Grunfeld should go for the talent and I believe he will. If he does that, RJ and Redd (if Grunfeld wants him) become very viable. Given his firsthand knowledge of Redd, that could push him toward the top of the list if Grunfeld believes Redd will be healthy when the season begins.

europa wrote:

smauss wrote:

europa wrote:I fully expect RJ to be put on the trade block this summer. I think Kohl is fine with trading him. Whether a trade gets done depends on what is offered in return. But I see at least two teams (San Antonio and Cleveland) and now possibly a third (Washington) being interested.

I don't think Kohls trades RJ for a pick and cap relief. That would be as if to say they aren't going to make the playoffs. I think Kohl is still fixated on that goal especially from a marketing perspective. He would be concerned it would have an air of "rebuild" to it IMHO.

It depends on the return and what subsequent moves are made. You can't just isolate the RJ trade if it happened and say that's the only move that determines if the Bucks will make the playoffs. And if this trade with the Wizards happened, I'd say getting James Harden is a sweet return and does nothing to weaken the Bucks' chances to make the playoffs next season.

First off, I'm taking what I think Kohls perspective would be on the trade discussed with the Wizards in context. How many subsequent trades do you think we will make; especially involving a core piece of the team? I'm not saying I wouldn't do it, heaven knows I would in a heart beat but I don't think Kohl does.

Carter was better than either Redd or RJ last year, and I believe he is available as well.

smauss wrote:
First off, I'm taking what I think Kohls perspective would be on the trade discussed with the Wizards in context. How many subsequent trades do you think we will make; especially involving a core piece of the team? I'm not saying I wouldn't do it, heaven knows I would in a heart beat but I don't think Kohl does.

If the RJ to the Wizards trade would be made, Ridnour goes for sure since James is a veteran reserve PG. I don't see why Kohl wouldn't make the trade. Hammond hasn't wanted to trade RJ or Redd for expirings only. He wants to bring back talent. This trade does that in a big way assuming Hammond likes Harden. If he does, I see nothing stopping this trade from happening.