**The Official Karl-Anthony Towns Thread: Part Two**

[shangrila]

That’s not an opinion bro. It’s backed up by stats…

I read it as just best "shooting" big man, which is debatable. Best 3pt shooter specifically...yeah, ok, sure. I can't really be bothered to go through history to see if there was anyone better so I'll give you all that.

Still doesn't make him worth the supermax or an all time great. But hey, you guys won the technicality. Congratulations.

Do you not understand facts?

Why do you keep bringing up "all time great"? I don't get it. What does that have to do with the super max? There are plenty of players eligible for the supermax that aren't all time greats.

Is it really that hard of a concept for people to grasp?

The only players worth a supermax are in those in that Curry, Lebron, Giannis, etc tier. Future all time greats, basically. Towns isn't one of them. I know he's eligible but being eligible doesn't mean he's worth that kind of money. Or does anyone want to argue DLo is worth a max because he can technically sign one?

[jscott]

I read it as just best "shooting" big man, which is debatable. Best 3pt shooter specifically...yeah, ok, sure. I can't really be bothered to go through history to see if there was anyone better so I'll give you all that.

Still doesn't make him worth the supermax or an all time great. But hey, you guys won the technicality. Congratulations.

Why do you keep bringing up "all time great"? I don't get it. What does that have to do with the super max? There are plenty of players eligible for the supermax that aren't all time greats.

Is it really that hard of a concept for people to grasp?

The only players worth a supermax are in those in that Curry, Lebron, Giannis, etc tier. Future all time greats, basically. Towns isn't one of them. I know he's eligible but being eligible doesn't mean he's worth that kind of money. Or does anyone want to argue DLo is worth a max because he can technically sign one?

Your arguments have nothing to do with each other. You also don’t understand economics.

[shangrila]

Why do you keep bringing up "all time great"? I don't get it. What does that have to do with the super max? There are plenty of players eligible for the supermax that aren't all time greats.

Is it really that hard of a concept for people to grasp?

The only players worth a supermax are in those in that Curry, Lebron, Giannis, etc tier. Future all time greats, basically. Towns isn't one of them. I know he's eligible but being eligible doesn't mean he's worth that kind of money. Or does anyone want to argue DLo is worth a max because he can technically sign one?

Your arguments have nothing to do with each other. You also don’t understand economics.

Yeah, I'm done with this.

[shrink]

Karl Anthony-Towns was the only player this season to shoot 55% or better on at least 400 2-point attempts and 40% or better on at least 100 3-point attempts.

[old school 34]

Is it really that hard of a concept for people to grasp?

The only players worth a supermax are in those in that Curry, Lebron, Giannis, etc tier. Future all time greats, basically. Towns isn't one of them. I know he's eligible but being eligible doesn't mean he's worth that kind of money. Or does anyone want to argue DLo is worth a max because he can technically sign one?

Your arguments have nothing to do with each other. You also don’t understand economics.

Yeah, I'm done with this.

Hey, little late to the party....but Shangrila, I believe I get your argument as that's best practice on only giving that tier the super-max....which sure from a theory standpoint makes a ton of sense. But that's not current marketplace right & if I'm going to have a championship caliber roster....don't I have to play ball? In the fast food industry, difficult to make a profit paying employees $20/hr right now, but if I don't the alternative is joint is open less making less revenue because I lack staff to run it? Now, KAT still needs to still be in next tier to be worth the overpay, whereas one could argue DLo is too many tiers (not sure if that's exactly the right way to explain it?)...but that would be the counter right on why yes for KAT & no for DLo...no?

I mean, I get getting squishy on the end of the KAT deal, but we can move him if needed after that fact? If you want to deal him now...then for who do you have in mind?

Or if you low ball him....aren't you going against everything Arod & Lore are trying to say is different now with the organization...that we're 1st class & no longer cheap? Even if your trying to do it for basketball reasons...that's how it will be perceived? Or maybe you can thread some crazy line...where you extend KAT for less than supermax...in exchange to keep DLo & extend him at some absurd #? Which okay...you may be closer on KAT, but now stuck on a overpay on DLo?

I think I understand the principle your trying to stand on, just don't think because of us being a smaller market that also lacks a fair amount of credibility...it just isn't a reality at this time.

Sent from my SM-G973U using RealGM mobile app

[Klomp]

A little thought experiment.

Two teams each have four players they paid $20 mil for, and together they give each team $80 mil in production.

Team A buys a fifth player for $20 mil that provides $20 mil in production .. they produce 100 units each game
Team B buys a fifth player for $40 mil that provides $30 mil in production .. they produce 110 units, and beat Team A.

My point is that the winning team isn’t the one with the best contracts. The winning team is the one that can get the most production for their overall money, vs their opponents. Wins come from production.

Max deals are scary, but they allow a team to consolidate a lot of production into a single player on the floor. If Team A spends its $40 mil on two $20 mil players, Team B still wins, because Team A can’t play six men. Giannis, Jokic etc are worth super-max deals .. probably more. They need to be supported by cost-effective production from other positions. KAT does not need to produce $45 mil in production to be worth a $45 mil contract, but he better be closer to Giannis and not John Wall for that money to lead to wins for the Wolves.

I want to go back and look this. Building a team isn't just about collecting the most talent, but how that talent fits together. I mean you can take one of those "Build a team for $15" social media posts and run out a lineup of Westbrook / Wade / Leonard / Gasol / Shaq. Very talented, but could they win? Defense could probably just pack the paint all day against them because you're not looking at roster dynamics.

Similarly, you can put players together and the sum could end up better than what they were individually. The early 2000s Pistons are a great example of this. Ben Wallace's impact was greater once he was paired with Rasheed Wallace while individually he might not have been as good as other centers of the era.

This is the same in the modern era. Antetokounmpo and Middleton = good pairing. James and Westbrook = not good pairing.

This is what I'm seeing at the top of our roster. Towns isn't the best center in the league. Edwards isn't the best shooting guard in the league. But together, I'd argue the value together is better than what they are individually (especially Towns). They both understand that they need each other to maximize their own games and as a result the team's success. Are they the perfect pairing? Of course not, and that's why there are 15 roster spots in the NBA and not just 2.

Read on Twitter

[shrink]

Amid rumors that Minnesota is exploring the trade market for veteran centers, including Clint Capela, Michael Rand of The Star Tribune wonders if one of the team’s biggest offseason moves might be a position change for Towns. Rand notes that sliding Towns down to the power forward spot would improve the Wolves’ rebounding woes, and he’d likely feast on smaller players in the post, but there are some possible drawbacks. Towns is quicker than most centers, so he might lose the ability to pump-fake and drive past slower-footed defenders, and it would take him time to adjust defensively. Ultimately, Rand believes utilizing a bigger lineup could work in certain matchups.

So, a bigger lineup “COULD work in CERTAIN MATCHUPS?”

Way to go out on a limb there, Rando.

[wolves_89]

Amid rumors that Minnesota is exploring the trade market for veteran centers, including Clint Capela, Michael Rand of The Star Tribune wonders if one of the team’s biggest offseason moves might be a position change for Towns. Rand notes that sliding Towns down to the power forward spot would improve the Wolves’ rebounding woes, and he’d likely feast on smaller players in the post, but there are some possible drawbacks. Towns is quicker than most centers, so he might lose the ability to pump-fake and drive past slower-footed defenders, and it would take him time to adjust defensively. Ultimately, Rand believes utilizing a bigger lineup could work in certain matchups.

So, a bigger lineup “COULD work in CERTAIN MATCHUPS?”

Way to go out on a limb there, Rando.

I don't think Towns playing next to a bigger center will have any effect on his driving abilities. Towns is already guarded by the opposing PF the vast majority of the time.

[Domejandro]

You can tell when a local reporter doesn't watch your favourite team so quickly....

Teams already hid immobile defensive players on Jarred Vanderbilt. We already know what that looks like.

[D1SGRUNTL3D]

What’s the list of 4s outside of Giannis that towns would struggle to defend? Maybe lebron? Durant? They aren’t true power forwards. Hell there really isn’t true 1-5s any more like 30 years ago

[Klomp]

Left-field thought:

A lot of us have questioned if we can afford to lose the shooting gravity of Malik Beasley, but I wonder if a possible solution is to use Towns more on the perimeter, and that's fueling the idea of adding a big man. It will keep him out of foul trouble because not only is he not banging against the top posts on the opponent on defense but also spending less time in the post on offense will eliminate a lot of charges for hooking and bullying in the post.

[winforlose]

Left-field thought:

A lot of us have questioned if we can afford to lose the shooting gravity of Malik Beasley, but I wonder if a possible solution is to use Towns more on the perimeter, and that's fueling the idea of adding a big man. It will keep him out of foul trouble because not only is he not banging against the top posts on the opponent on defense but also spending less time in the post on offense will eliminate a lot of charges for hooking and bullying in the post.

Not left field, center field, dead center. In other words, RIGHT ON.

[Baseline81]

Is Towns hinting at the supermax?

Read on Twitter

[Klomp]

Is Towns hinting at the supermax?

Read on Twitter

Clearly. He knows he is about to get a bag.

[D1SGRUNTL3D]

Woj just tweeted KAT got that bag.

Read on Twitter

?s=21&t=vHssBJofZ9cNo1noWZnSTA

Well he’s here for his prime.

[King Malta]

Pleased.

It's a lot of money, and really, very few players outside of perhaps the top 3-4 guys in the league are worth supermaxes. But you're not going to keep your elite talent without offering them to the guys that qualify. KAT's coming off the best year of his career and we're coming off probably our most promising one as a franchise since 2004, decent time to be a Timberwolves fan.

[KGdaBom]

Woj just tweeted KAT got that bag.

Read on Twitter

?s=21&t=vHssBJofZ9cNo1noWZnSTA

Well he’s here for his prime.

Karl-Anthony Towns. Wolf for life.

[shangrila]

He’s not worth it but it’s the cost of doing business so…fine.

[MN7725]

the extension begins in 2024-25 season

it looks like now next cap spike from new tv deal will likely be the 2025-26 season, need to keep that context
% of cap

[minimus]

Okay, numbers are fine. Both on-court (Towns stats) and off-court (Towns contract). Now I want to ask Karl one simple thing: please DONT care about numbers now!

Take last difficult shots in the clutch even if they will ruin your shooting stats. You are already one of the greatest shooters in NBA history.
Don't try to impress anyone with these sling over head, behind the back, no look passes. You are NOT Jokic! Execute within offense, take your shots.

With all respect, love and support,
Max