Game 29 Wolves at Thunder 12-26-23 Record 22-6

[winforlose]

The defense was the problem yesterday. They scored 130+ points. We couldn’t stop them. They shot 60 percent from the field and 45% from 3.

Disagree. The problem is that we didn’t rebound well, or control the ball well. If you give them extra shots they will score more. Also live ball turnovers speed things up, and we win by slowing teams down. We lost the game on the offensive end, it just showed up on the OKC side of the scoreboard.

I don’t agree at all. They shot 60 percent. There weren’t many rebounds to be had. We couldn’t stop them if they were going fast or slow. Aside from the turnovers we played relatively well on offense. We got to the free throw line and shot over 40 percent from three. We just didn’t slow them down at all.

They shot 60% on 81 shots. We took 73. Hard to make a basket if you don’t have the ball. If we offensive rebound that is 14 more seconds on the shot clock. We had plenty of missed shots where we could and should grab the rebound. It is also true that defense costs more energy. When you are constantly playing defense you get more tired. Constant turnovers (end of the 3rd was 3 or 4 plays out of the last 5,) raise the pace and tire us out. Tired legs are lazy legs. Controlling the ball means controlling the pace, giving them fewer shot attempts, and us making more shots. We didn’t do enough things right to make up for all we did wrong.

[winforlose]

I saw someone say our offense is ranked 17th. I've been telling you, if you want to win a title, we have to get better there. 17 is just too low. We need to improve the offense by a fair margin.

The problem is how?

Can't expect more offence from Gobert or Anderson. Shake was meant to contribute in that respect but hasn't. McDaniels hasn't made the strides on that end that we'd like to see so while he's capable of 20pt nights it's not reliable. Reid is more of a finisher than a creator and he's arguably not as good in the Twin Towers as he is offensively when he's the only big in the lineup. Anderson isn't a scorer even if his efficiency improves, neither is NAW. TBJ is, like Reid, a finisher not a creator.

We don't have much to work with in trades either, especially if we can't go into the lux.

So where is this extra offence coming from?

You won’t like the answer, but bench Kyle, play Miller. Miller will improve floor spacing, and Kyle is a killer of both spacing and points per 100 possessions. Miller might have some growing pains, but teams will actually guard him.

[winforlose]

The defense was the problem yesterday. They scored 130+ points. We couldn’t stop them. They shot 60 percent from the field and 45% from 3.

Disagree. The problem is that we didn’t rebound well, or control the ball well. If you give them extra shots they will score more. Also live ball turnovers speed things up, and we win by slowing teams down. We lost the game on the offensive end, it just showed up on the OKC side of the scoreboard.

Don't know where you are getting rebounding was a problem, we had 8 offensive boards to their 3.
The turnovers were the story of the game, they took care of the ball and we were extra sloppy.

The shooting numbers were actually pretty similar until garbage time started.
To be honest the refs kept us somewhat in the game with the free throw disparity.
Both teams were better than usual from deep.

8-3 is terrible with our size advantage. Turnovers were absolutely part of the problem. When the other team takes 8 more shots than you, that is a very bad sign. But, controlling the ball, controlling the pace, and controlling time of possession makes games like this much easier to win. Also, doing the little things like off ball screens, rotating to give the driver an easy pass out, ect… didn’t happen either.

[Calinks]

Read on Twitter

People are saying KAT extends the arm though.

[KGdaBom]

Read on Twitter

People are saying KAT extends the arm though.

The contact by Embiid was far more egregious than that of KAT. No foul on Embiid and a charge on KAT. Great find.

[winforlose]

Read on Twitter

People are saying KAT extends the arm though.

The contact by Embiid was far more egregious than that of KAT. No foul on Embiid and a charge on KAT. Great find.

All I hear about these days is AI this and AI that. AI doing legal research, AI mapping surgeries, AI cheating on kids homework, AI catfishing dating websites, ect… is it really so hard to develop an AI referee. Give it access to all camera angles and have the human refs run the court wearing go pro cameras. Let the human refs call the games but the AI has veto power. I know we probably aren’t there yet, but the superstar era will either be much more disgusting or much less disgusting with an impartial machine making the calls.

[FrenchMinnyFan]

If any AI can fix Slomo shooting, i'm all in

[Zonarosa]

I saw someone say our offense is ranked 17th. I've been telling you, if you want to win a title, we have to get better there. 17 is just too low. We need to improve the offense by a fair margin.

The defense was the problem yesterday. They scored 130+ points. We couldn’t stop them. They shot 60 percent from the field and 45% from 3.

Disagree. The problem is that we didn’t rebound well, or control the ball well. If you give them extra shots they will score more. Also live ball turnovers speed things up, and we win by slowing teams down. We lost the game on the offensive end, it just showed up on the OKC side of the scoreboard.

we outrebounded them overall and on the offensive end. we turned the ball over a lot more, but it only led to a net difference of 3 extra shots for them - 12 to 9.

yep, our offense is entirely to blame because we couldn't hit 60% from the field too.

[winforlose]

The defense was the problem yesterday. They scored 130+ points. We couldn’t stop them. They shot 60 percent from the field and 45% from 3.

Disagree. The problem is that we didn’t rebound well, or control the ball well. If you give them extra shots they will score more. Also live ball turnovers speed things up, and we win by slowing teams down. We lost the game on the offensive end, it just showed up on the OKC side of the scoreboard.

we outrebounded them overall and on the offensive end. we turned the ball over a lot more, but it only led to a net difference of 3 extra shots for them - 12 to 9.

yep, our offense is entirely to blame because we couldn't hit 60% from the field too.

Since this an actual post and not just an emoji I will respond. We gave them 81 shots and took 73. That by itself is a huge problem, but not the only one. They are faster team, we are a slower one. Whoever dictates pace has the advantage. Offense is a good way to slow things down. You control the ball, run the clock down, make a shot they have to inbounds. Miss a shot and get a rebound you get a fresh 14. Live ball turnover and they are off and running. Against a team having a hot shooting night (bit of an understatement,) you want to control time of possession, lower the pace, and give them fewer shots. Turning it over, not offensive rebounding enough (with our size advantage it needs to be better, 8-3 is just not good enough,) and not slowing it down more hurt a lot. It was a 6 point game at the half and 11 point game going into the 4th. Can you guys honestly tell me at either juncture you thought we were doomed? They shot well and scored well, but if our offense does the things it needs to do, we never get to garbage time, and I think we either lose small or win small.

[Worm Guts]

Can you compensate for playing bad defense by playing better offense? Sure you can, but we are a defensive team a that didn’t play good defense.

[winforlose]

Can you compensate for playing bad defense by playing better offense? Sure you can, but we are a defensive team a that didn’t play good defense.

True. But you compensate for bad defense by not turning the ball over and by draining some clock so they get fewer offensive possessions. Hard for the Thunder to score when we have the ball. Run 18 seconds a possession and take a shot instead of turning the ball over 9-10 seconds in and that time of possession will add up.

[Worm Guts]

Can you compensate for playing bad defense by playing better offense? Sure you can, but we are a defensive team a that didn’t play good defense.

True. But you compensate for bad defense by not turning the ball over and by draining some clock so they get fewer offensive possessions. Hard for the Thunder to score when we have the ball. Run 18 seconds a possession and take a shot instead of turning the ball over 9-10 seconds in and that time of possession will add up.

Sure, but that doesn’t change the fact that when a defensive team plays bad defense that I’m going to put the blame on the defense. Defense is our identity and if we don’t play it well we will lose to good teams.

[winforlose]

Can you compensate for playing bad defense by playing better offense? Sure you can, but we are a defensive team a that didn’t play good defense.

True. But you compensate for bad defense by not turning the ball over and by draining some clock so they get fewer offensive possessions. Hard for the Thunder to score when we have the ball. Run 18 seconds a possession and take a shot instead of turning the ball over 9-10 seconds in and that time of possession will add up.

Sure, but that doesn’t change the fact that when a defensive team plays bad defense that I’m going to put the blame on the defense. Defense is our identity and if we don’t play it well we will lose to good teams.

Fair. But how often is OKC gonna shoot like that. SGA hit 14 of 16 from 2 point range. They hit 18 of 39 3s. Good defense forces low percentage shots, sometimes they are gonna make those. When they are taking what you are giving them and beating you with those shots, you need to adjust. Scoring with them is huge, but lowering their number of shots and keeping them off the boards when they do miss is huge. Also using your size advantage to give yourself 2 or 3 attempts and taking that time off the clock with those extra shots is huge.

If we make 4 more shots (instead of turnovers,) that is 8-10 points. If they take 4 less shots that is 6-10 points. The margin of their victory was 23. Take garbage time out that number is smaller. Sometimes good defense is denying them ball on offense.

[Zonarosa]

Since this an actual post and not just an emoji I will respond. We gave them 81 shots and took 73. That by itself is a huge problem, but not the only one. They are faster team, we are a slower one. Whoever dictates pace has the advantage. Offense is a good way to slow things down. You control the ball....

blah blah blah...

they had an efg% over 71. the worst since the loss against phx. i'm not doing the math there, but i'd guess our average was right around 50% between the top and bottom. if someone's punishing you to the tune of a 40% increase over that average, your offense isn't the issue.

[Zonarosa]

by the way, there've been 12 games this season in which a team allowed over 70% eFG.

they all lost by an average of 22 points.

[BlacJacMac]

Can you compensate for playing bad defense by playing better offense? Sure you can, but we are a defensive team a that didn’t play good defense.

True. But you compensate for bad defense by not turning the ball over and by draining some clock so they get fewer offensive possessions. Hard for the Thunder to score when we have the ball. Run 18 seconds a possession and take a shot instead of turning the ball over 9-10 seconds in and that time of possession will add up.

Maybe we score even less by essentially limiting ourselves to 6 second possessions?

[winforlose]

Can you compensate for playing bad defense by playing better offense? Sure you can, but we are a defensive team a that didn’t play good defense.

True. But you compensate for bad defense by not turning the ball over and by draining some clock so they get fewer offensive possessions. Hard for the Thunder to score when we have the ball. Run 18 seconds a possession and take a shot instead of turning the ball over 9-10 seconds in and that time of possession will add up.

Maybe we score even less by essentially limiting ourselves to 6 second possessions?

That is a reasonable counter argument. At the same time, if you take what the defense is giving you and use your size to rebound it isn’t as much of a problem. Also, I am not advocating starting at 6 second left, I am saying there should be no more than 6 seconds left when you take the shot. Sometimes it will be less, but with enough ball movement and off ball movement by the players open 3s and decent looks in the midrange are not unreasonable. Just like in football, when the opposing team is just too dialed in control time of possession and deny them the chance to score.

[BlacJacMac]

True. But you compensate for bad defense by not turning the ball over and by draining some clock so they get fewer offensive possessions. Hard for the Thunder to score when we have the ball. Run 18 seconds a possession and take a shot instead of turning the ball over 9-10 seconds in and that time of possession will add up.

Maybe we score even less by essentially limiting ourselves to 6 second possessions?

That is a reasonable counter argument. At the same time, if you take what the defense is giving you and use your size to rebound it isn’t as much of a problem. Also, I am not advocating starting at 6 second left, I am saying there should be no more than 6 seconds left when you take the shot. Sometimes it will be less, but with enough ball movement and off ball movement by the players open 3s and decent looks in the midrange are not unreasonable. Just like in football, when the opposing team is just too dialed in control time of possession and deny them the chance to score.

I don't think that's feasible in real life.

[winforlose]

Maybe we score even less by essentially limiting ourselves to 6 second possessions?

That is a reasonable counter argument. At the same time, if you take what the defense is giving you and use your size to rebound it isn’t as much of a problem. Also, I am not advocating starting at 6 second left, I am saying there should be no more than 6 seconds left when you take the shot. Sometimes it will be less, but with enough ball movement and off ball movement by the players open 3s and decent looks in the midrange are not unreasonable. Just like in football, when the opposing team is just too dialed in control time of possession and deny them the chance to score.

I don't think that's feasible in real life.

It happens in real life. Teams take shots late into the clock, teams let the ball roll without touching it to run time off the clock, teams take an extra second or two with the clock running before getting the ball for the inbound, teams don’t hustle to bring the ball back into play when it rolls away. All these little things to shorten the game. Because like it or not, good defense cannot take away everything. You can make less good shooters shoot or make players take low percentage mid range shots. But, when they are hitting 60% and 46% from deep your best bet is to protect the ball and do whatever it takes to limit their shots.

[BlacJacMac]

Those happen on a very small handful of plays.

Not entire games.