Early discussion on the 2023 offseason

[JoseRizal]

With the Harden "liar" statement and Embiid removing the Sixers in his Twitter bio, that 2027 76ers FRP is looking better by the day...

[Netaman]

With the Harden "liar" statement and Embiid removing the Sixers in his Twitter bio, that 2027 76ers FRP is looking better by the day...

it looks good until it hits top 8 and turns into 2nd round picks.

there is a very small goldilocks zone for that one to hit.

[HotShots]

[

Read on Twitter

Ky and Harden should have signed and won a couple of Championships with KD.....they ain't going to see that money again.

[ChuckS]

With the Harden "liar" statement and Embiid removing the Sixers in his Twitter bio, that 2027 76ers FRP is looking better by the day...

This isn't actually within the realm, but your post reminded me of why I so want to see Simmons bounce back and stick it to a few. Well before the Harden "liar" claim, and after Embid and Doc threw Ben under the bus, Morey, more subtly, did worse:

https://www.netsdaily.com/2022/9/17/23358335/was-daryl-morey-trashing-ben-simmons-in-talking-about-phillys-special-mindset-duh

“I’d say the biggest surprise are the players who can’t play here. It’s actually not helpful to me. The more options I have, the better. But I do think I’m starting to learn and I do love it about Philadelphia, ‘cause I do think it gets the best out of our team. And I’ve seen it with not only our team, the Eagles, and the Phillies.

And I never understood this, being in Houston when people would say, ‘Oh, you need to have a special mindset to play in Philly. You need to have a special mindset to play in, maybe, New York.’ Although I think that’s less true. Honestly, I can only speak to Philadelphia because I’ve been here now. I do think, I really do pay attention to the mindset of the players. Can they handle playing in Philadelphia? Because I do think it’s a different thing.”

There is not a person living within 50 miles of Billy Penn’s statue atop the Philadelphia City Hall who doesn’t believe Morey was talking about Ben Simmons. Sorry for the double negative. To be clear, everyone believes the Philly GM was talking about the player who held out last season, citing mental health issues (which Morey said post-trade he believed were real.) - - - - - - - -


He must have forgotten what Ben really had already accomplished in Philly:

3× NBA All-Star (2019–2021)
All-NBA Third Team (2020)
2× NBA All-Defensive First Team (2020, 2021)
NBA Rookie of the Year (2018)
NBA All-Rookie First Team (2018)
NBA steals leader (2020)

Harden may be a victim, but he made his decisions and will have to live with them. Simmons is another matter.

[Papi_swav]

We dodged a missile getting rid of the divas. Imagine we signed them for those ridiculous contracts with the way they act smh I'm glad.

Now, let's not get ahead of ourselves guys. Just because Philly is imploding now, 2027 is a long time away and it doesn't mean they'll be horrible by then.

[vincecarter4pres]

We dodged a missile getting rid of the divas. Imagine we signed them for those ridiculous contracts with the way they act smh I'm glad.

Now, let's not get ahead of ourselves guys. Just because Philly is imploding now, 2027 is a long time away and it doesn't mean they'll be horrible by then.

Pick is permanently top 8 protected, it’s almost worse if they bottom out.

Pick has even more risk now.

[Papi_swav]

We dodged a missile getting rid of the divas. Imagine we signed them for those ridiculous contracts with the way they act smh I'm glad.

Now, let's not get ahead of ourselves guys. Just because Philly is imploding now, 2027 is a long time away and it doesn't mean they'll be horrible by then.

Pick is permanently top 8 protected, it’s almost worse if they bottom out.

Pick has even more risk now.

the thing is that 2027 is so far out, they can be the best team in the NBA at that time or the worst, we won't know until then. We're a whole 4 years early and alot of things can happen.

[Paradise]

We dodged a missile getting rid of the divas. Imagine we signed them for those ridiculous contracts with the way they act smh I'm glad.

Now, let's not get ahead of ourselves guys. Just because Philly is imploding now, 2027 is a long time away and it doesn't mean they'll be horrible by then.

Pick is permanently top 8 protected, it’s almost worse if they bottom out.

Pick has even more risk now.

At this rate, we could offer it back to land Embiid ourselves.

[Netaman]

We dodged a missile getting rid of the divas. Imagine we signed them for those ridiculous contracts with the way they act smh I'm glad.

Now, let's not get ahead of ourselves guys. Just because Philly is imploding now, 2027 is a long time away and it doesn't mean they'll be horrible by then.

Pick is permanently top 8 protected, it’s almost worse if they bottom out.

Pick has even more risk now.

the thing is that 2027 is so far out, they can be the best team in the NBA at that time or the worst, we won't know until then. We're a whole 4 years early and alot of things can happen.

if they are the best team the pick sucks, if they are the worst team the pick sucks.

that's kind of the point. they need to be a bad middle team for that pick to be good, which is a pretty tight window. especially for a team willing to spend $.

[Netaman]

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royce and dfs in the 2023 marketing stuff and royce mentioned mentoring ben in miami would make it seem like this is the group.

guess dsj, walker, bazley are your 8-9-10 in the rotation with cam, sharpe and rookies competing for whatever's left?

[ChuckS]

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royce and dfs in the 2023 marketing stuff and royce mentioned mentoring ben in miami would make it seem like this is the group.

guess dsj, walker, bazley are your 8-9-10 in the rotation with cam, sharpe and rookies competing for whatever's left?

Good find. I think I could like DSJ, and maybe even the others, but have to see something before I put them ahead of CamT and Sharpe, or even a couple of the rookies (because of shooting). And Sharpe is still our only true backup center. What you "said" makes sense, though.

[vincecarter4pres]

So here’s a shower thought…

If the NBA takes a bunch of 1st round picks from Philly because of the Harden/Morey investigation, and one of them is the pick we own, does it effectively remove the protections on the pick, figuring they’d lose it entirely no matter what?

That would be a crazy byproduct bonus of this whole thing for us if so.

[Netaman]

So here’s a shower thought…

If the NBA takes a bunch of 1st round picks from Philly because of the Harden/Morey investigation, and one of them is the pick we own, does it effectively remove the protections on the pick, figuring they’d lose it entirely no matter what?

That would be a crazy byproduct bonus of this whole thing for us if so.

i doubt it and i doubt they penalize philly. harden opting into his option year kills most of his basis for complaint. if anyone else wanted him this would be a non-issue and he would have just opted out.

[Tha King]

Read on Twitter

royce and dfs in the 2023 marketing stuff and royce mentioned mentoring ben in miami would make it seem like this is the group.

guess dsj, walker, bazley are your 8-9-10 in the rotation with cam, sharpe and rookies competing for whatever's left?

Good find. I think I could like DSJ, and maybe even the others, but have to see something before I put them ahead of CamT and Sharpe, or even a couple of the rookies (because of shooting). And Sharpe is still our only true backup center. What you "said" makes sense, though.

if the team doesn't bring in Herro or similar, I think Cam Thomas is going to be an important part of the rotation. This team needs scoring, especially individual created scoring. He also gets fouls, which is an underrated component to scoring/good offense.

I can understand the rationale of playing Curry/Harris over him last season with a limited number of games left and a need to push for playoffs, especially Curry. Both Curry and Thomas can get you buckets but Curry can do it playing off ball, with elite efficiency.

[vincecarter4pres]

Read on Twitter

royce and dfs in the 2023 marketing stuff and royce mentioned mentoring ben in miami would make it seem like this is the group.

guess dsj, walker, bazley are your 8-9-10 in the rotation with cam, sharpe and rookies competing for whatever's left?

Good find. I think I could like DSJ, and maybe even the others, but have to see something before I put them ahead of CamT and Sharpe, or even a couple of the rookies (because of shooting). And Sharpe is still our only true backup center. What you "said" makes sense, though.

if the team doesn't bring in Herro or similar, I think Cam Thomas is going to be an important part of the rotation. This team needs scoring, especially individual created scoring. He also gets fouls, which is an underrated component to scoring/good offense.

I can understand the rationale of playing Curry/Harris over him last season with a limited number of games left and a need to push for playoffs, especially Curry. Both Curry and Thomas can get you buckets but Curry can do it playing off ball, with elite efficiency.

I’m just not a Cam T believer. Fully hope he proves me wrong, but I think he won’t be a useful NBA player until his 2nd or 3rd team in 3 or 4 seasons.

I’d rather guys like Walker, Whitehead, DSJ, and Wilson get those minutes.

[Netaman]

I’m just not a Cam T believer. Fully hope he proves me wrong, but I think he won’t be a useful NBA player until his 2nd or 3rd team in 3 or 4 seasons.

I’d rather guys like Walker, Whitehead, DSJ, and Wilson get those minutes.

same here, i would have kept him starting post-deadline bc nothing mattered, and i hope he figures something out, but i have very little belief that will happen.

[Riconet]

BTW, for those who haven't been watching the FIBA World Cup, Mikal has locked in a spot in the starting 5 for Team USA and is playing an important, do-everything role. It reminds me of the role Iguodala played for the early-dynasty Warriors teams (which I mention because Steve Kerr is the coach of Team USA).

In yesterday's win over Germany -- which was a very entertaining game that Team USA was losing by 16 in the 3rd quarter -- Mikal played the 2nd-most minutes, took the 2nd-most shots, hit a huge 3 with a few minutes to go to give Team USA the lead (after missing 2 3s shortly before then -- so he wasn't scared to shoot another one in crunch time), followed that up with a steal, and tied a few others for the team lead in assists.

Cam J has also had a number of nice moments for Team USA off the bench, although he didn't do much yesterday.

I really like Bridges' game. He's not a true #1 star on a title contender, but he's a really good player who contributes a lot of different elements towards winning.

[vincecarter4pres]

BTW, for those who haven't been watching the FIBA World Cup, Mikal has locked in a spot in the starting 5 for Team USA and is playing an important, do-everything role. It reminds me of the role Iguodala played for the early-dynasty Warriors teams (which I mention because Steve Kerr is the coach of Team USA).

In yesterday's win over Germany -- which was a very entertaining game that Team USA was losing by 16 in the 3rd quarter -- Mikal played the 2nd-most minutes, took the 2nd-most shots, hit a huge 3 with a few minutes to go to give Team USA the lead (after missing 2 3s shortly before then -- so he wasn't scared to shoot another one in crunch time), followed that up with a steal, and tied a few others for the team lead in assists.

Cam J has also had a number of nice moments for Team USA off the bench, although he didn't do much yesterday.

I really like Bridges' game. He's not a true #1 star on a title contender, but he's a really good player who contributes a lot of different elements towards winning.

And to add, it’s not like there are truly many of those in the league, so it’s certainly not like that’s an unfair negative, just an honest observation.

[Papi_swav]

I’m just not a Cam T believer. Fully hope he proves me wrong, but I think he won’t be a useful NBA player until his 2nd or 3rd team in 3 or 4 seasons.

I’d rather guys like Walker, Whitehead, DSJ, and Wilson get those minutes.

same here, i would have kept him starting post-deadline bc nothing mattered, and i hope he figures something out, but i have very little belief that will happen.

I'm a big Cam T believer, the guy has a gift of scoring, he just knows how to put the ball in the basket. if he was on a trash team playing 35 mins a game it's no doubt he would be dropping 20 plus a game easily on decent not great efficiency. The only thing is the other parts of his game hasn't grown yet. Passing, off ball, defense etc.. and he's kind of short for a 2 guard

[ecuhus1981]

I’m just not a Cam T believer. Fully hope he proves me wrong, but I think he won’t be a useful NBA player until his 2nd or 3rd team in 3 or 4 seasons.

I’d rather guys like Walker, Whitehead, DSJ, and Wilson get those minutes.

same here, i would have kept him starting post-deadline bc nothing mattered, and i hope he figures something out, but i have very little belief that will happen.

I'm a big Cam T believer, the guy has a gift of scoring, he just knows how to put the ball in the basket. if he was on a trash team playing 35 mins a game it's no doubt he would be dropping 20 plus a game easily on decent not great efficiency. The only thing is the other parts of his game hasn't grown yet. Passing, off ball, defense etc.. and he's kind of short for a 2 guard

I mean, can you name a ton of other teams where he would have a clearer path to starting or having a significant (>25mpg) role? Because I can't. Let's flesh out this idea:

ATL - NO, Young, Murray, Bogdanovic, Griffin and even Bufkin are better time investments
BOS - NO, even w/o Smart, White/Brogdon/Brown soak up all the guard minutes, and Pritchard would eat before CT
CHA - MAYBE, Ball and Rozier are the only ones clearly better, but Bouknight, Smith and Bailey are similar and could all be as good as Cam, IDK why they would give anything to acquire him
CHI - NO, Caruso and Lavine will get heavy minutes, they just re-signed Jevon and Coby, and Ayo remains an RFA that they likely retain
CLE - NO, their 3-guard rotations are weird but they have Spyda, Darius, Caris, Max and Isaac at those 3 spots. Plus, whenever Rubio returns from his mental health break, he's been a great bench guard for them.
DAL - NO, Luka/KAI/Green/Hardy/Exum (who played amazing overseas last year)
DEN - MAYBE, Michael Malone rarely trusts newcomers with rotation roles, but they only have Jamal, KCP and Braun. Could Cam beat out Reggie Jackson? I think so.
DET - NO, Cade/Ivey/Morris/Burks/Hayes
GSW - NO - they only really have Steph, Klay and CP3. But, Podziemski and Moody are heir apparents to the vacant Poole role.
HOU - NO, too many other kids to develop
IND - NO Haliburton, Hield, Mathurin, Nemhard and McConnell
LAC - NO, Russ, PG13, Mann, Bones and Powell
LAL - NO, they may only have D'Angelo, Austin and Vincent, but I can't see the shots or usage available for Cam in their system.
MEM - NO, Morant/Bane/Smart/Kennard/Rose
MIA - NO, Herro, Butler, Lowry and Richardson are surplus to requirements in
MIL - YES, one of Allen or Connaughton will start opposite Jrue, and they only have Beasley behind them. Thomas could really break out on this roster, I would love it for Cam's sake but hate it because it's the Bucks.
MIN - NO, Edwards/Conley/NAW/McLaughlin
NOP - NO, Ingram/McCollum/Hawkins/Alvarado
NYK - NO, Brunson/Grimes/Quickley/DiVincenzo
OKC - NO, they already have so many solid young guards that they cut TyTy Washington
ORL - NO, Anthony/Harris/Black/Suggs/Fultz
PHI - ???, if Harden plays, Maxey, Beverly and Melton round out their rotation. If he doesn't, who know where their season will go.
PHX - NO, Booker/Beal/Okogie/Gordon is enough, they can't afford to trade anyway
POR - NO, even if a Lillard trade returns zero guards, they have Scoot, Anfernee and Shaedon to develop
SAC - NO, Fox/Huerter/Monk/Duarte/Davion
SAS - MAYBE, Jones and Vassell are their only good guards to start the season, now that Graham is suspended. But Popp seems invested in developing Wesley and Branham.
TOR - YES, Schroeder and Trent do not a competent NBA guard rotation make. They might play Dick at the 2, they might play bully ball with Scottie at the 1. But still, they could use Cam's scoring. Will Masai give anything of value though? Likely not.
UTA - NO - zero great guards, but all of Sexton/Clarkson/George/Tucker/Dunn duplicate Cam's skill set.
WAS - NO, JOnes/Poole/Shamet/Wright


I'm with you on the Thomas optimism, he won me over last season with his improved off-ball efficiency and his increased assist rate. However, the idea that he's cursed with the misfortune of being stuck behind a glut of amazing guards, or hopelessly hitched to a coach and front office that hate him, is misguided. His best chance of turning into more than a 1-trick pony is here.