Early discussion on the 2023 offseason

[Papi_swav]

I don't think anybody said he would start on a ton of other teams but he would of got alot more mins on other teams especially with the way he was dropping buckets last year. You have to remember it's a long season and injuries happen, also risk management etc.. he would of definitely got the mins last year.

Look at Detroit, Cade went down he would of been along side with Ivey for sure. Charlotte Ball was hurt he would of gotten the minutes there and probably chicago too. Caruso plays good defense but not much else. The Rockets last year? yes it was a ish show there. Miami yes especially when half their roster was hurt throughout the year and Lowry is old now. Lakers yes. Memphis yes, with Bane being hurt and Ja with his gun play he would of found minutes there. Wizards yes etc..

I'm talking about last year, this year you can't really bring up because he's already on the Nets roster and teams are already pretty much set now. But still, injuries happen and some guys show signs of aging, risk management, fights with coaches and staff etc.. things happen. I would of played him over Curry last year for sure in some of the games but it is what it is. Either way Cam can score and some teams value that more than others.

[Netaman]

Seems like it's almost time for a 2023-2024 nets rotation thread. Rumors out of Miami have Portland's asks still being unreasonable so with camps opening in a few weeks would have to think the odds are probably on 'no deal'.

this interview with simmons seems pretty notable in terms of the depth chart heading into camp and especially his relationship with jv:

Read on Twitter

if Simmons is the starting PG i would imagine Dinwiddie is probably starting as the other guard, which is probably a better fit for his skill set if he can shoot the ball like he did in Dallas.

Royce, DFS, DSJ can bring some defense off the bench.

I'm still fascinated by whatever role they pitched Lonnie Walker. Is it possible he gets a shot to win the 2 guard spot with Dinwiddie playing more of a 6th man role?

[vincecarter4pres]

Believe they want to start Bridges at the 2, he’s been more successful there.

[Netaman]

Believe they want to start Bridges at the 2, he’s been more successful there.

i'd rather not need him to handle the ball so much at the beginning of the game. if he's at the 2 then it would mean either DFS or Royce at the other spot, I'd prefer Royce since he's got the better ability to distribute and create.

[vincecarter4pres]

Believe they want to start Bridges at the 2, he’s been more successful there.

i'd rather not need him to handle the ball so much at the beginning of the game. if he's at the 2 then it would mean either DFS or Royce at the other spot, I'd prefer Royce since he's got the better ability to distribute and create.

I’m thinking they run Simmons at the 3 or 4 for defensive purposes, but the one on offense.

Maybe they’ll have something like:

Dinwiddie
Bridges
Cam J
Simmons
Clax

Or

Simmons
Bridges
Cam J
Royce
Clax

There really isn’t a totally ideal lineup with the limitations this roster has tbh, so they might just let Simmons do his thing with all off-ball players and bring Dinwiddie and the microwaves as the second unit(with Walker, DFS, rookies).

And I still think a very solid shot there’s a consolidation move by the deadline, or a blockbuster.

I wouldn’t be completely shocked to see us deal for Morant, Mitchell, or even Siakim(on the cheap, relatively speaking), at the deadline.

Lastly, they might force Bridges out of his comfort zone for some late development, wins/losses be damned.

[Netaman]

agree those are 2 most likely starting 5's. they need whichever of dinwiddie/oneale start to shoot well from deep and handle the ball. that's where i think herro would be an upgrade on either one, though it seems like portland is motivated to try to emulate the nets last year and try to convince lillard to stay.

defensively the positions dont matter as much, that's going to be dictated by whoever other teams have on the floor.

if ben is sixers ben starting running point that shakes things up in a way im not sure we can understand until we see it.

[Decipher]

Read on Twitter

[vincecarter4pres]

I’m guessing at this point we’re going into the season with this lineup.

Buckle up butterdicks, we’re blazing a brazen 34 win barn burner!

[Karate Diop]

I'm just looking forward to seeing how Claxton develops and if Ben is ready to join the Bridges Good Vibes club...

[Claud]

8 men rotation: Simmons/Din/Mikal/CJ/Clax + DFS/O'neal/a guard(cam/dsjr?)

Unless Simmons is really back, Clax + others really took a step forward in development I dont see us cracking 40 wins.

Problems:

- Go to scorer? Bridges is more of a finisher, not a ball handler/Decision Maker.
Which means Dinwiddie ISO ball in clutch situations = limited ceiling.

- Rebounding. We can be elite at defending, but it means nothing if we are bottom of the league in rebounding.
I don't buy Sharpe will magically fix that issue. It honestly makes no sense why we are so bad considering Clax/Ben/CJ/Bridges all have good size and athletism.

- Coaching. JV is a good dude and motivator, but we've been outcoached multiple times. It def. makes a difference in big games + playoffs = limited ceiling.

I have no expectations this season. At least we won't be disappointed how we were with KD/Ky/Harden era. We know we ain't good.

[vincecarter4pres]

8 men rotation: Simmons/Din/Mikal/CJ/Clax + DFS/O'neal/a guard(cam/dsjr?)

Unless Simmons is really back, Clax + others really took a step forward in development I dont see us cracking 40 wins.

Problems:

- Go to scorer? Bridges is more of a finisher, not a ball handler/Decision Maker.
Which means Dinwiddie ISO ball in clutch situations = limited ceiling.

- Rebounding. We can be elite at defending, but it means nothing if we are bottom of the league in rebounding.
I don't buy Sharpe will magically fix that issue. It honestly makes no sense why we are so bad considering Clax/Ben/CJ/Bridges all have good size and athletism.

- Coaching. JV is a good dude and motivator, but we've been outcoached multiple times. It def. makes a difference in big games + playoffs = limited ceiling.

I have no expectations this season. At least we won't be disappointed how we were with KD/Ky/Harden era. We know we ain't good.

It’s going to be soul crushing when we ship Houston the 4th overall pick…

[Papi_swav]

8 men rotation: Simmons/Din/Mikal/CJ/Clax + DFS/O'neal/a guard(cam/dsjr?)

Unless Simmons is really back, Clax + others really took a step forward in development I dont see us cracking 40 wins.

Problems:

- Go to scorer? Bridges is more of a finisher, not a ball handler/Decision Maker.
Which means Dinwiddie ISO ball in clutch situations = limited ceiling.

- Rebounding. We can be elite at defending, but it means nothing if we are bottom of the league in rebounding.
I don't buy Sharpe will magically fix that issue. It honestly makes no sense why we are so bad considering Clax/Ben/CJ/Bridges all have good size and athletism.

- Coaching. JV is a good dude and motivator, but we've been outcoached multiple times. It def. makes a difference in big games + playoffs = limited ceiling.

I have no expectations this season. At least we won't be disappointed how we were with KD/Ky/Harden era. We know we ain't good.

It’s going to be soul crushing when we ship Houston the 4th overall pick…

I highly doubt we'll be that bad and I don't think the lottery balls will fall down that far. I think we'll be in the 10-14 range in the lottery tho. But this team will put up a fight and we'll have some fun games. Atleast we don't have high expectations and disappointment of not winning a chip like the KD/Kyrie era.

[vincecarter4pres]

8 men rotation: Simmons/Din/Mikal/CJ/Clax + DFS/O'neal/a guard(cam/dsjr?)

Unless Simmons is really back, Clax + others really took a step forward in development I dont see us cracking 40 wins.

Problems:

- Go to scorer? Bridges is more of a finisher, not a ball handler/Decision Maker.
Which means Dinwiddie ISO ball in clutch situations = limited ceiling.

- Rebounding. We can be elite at defending, but it means nothing if we are bottom of the league in rebounding.
I don't buy Sharpe will magically fix that issue. It honestly makes no sense why we are so bad considering Clax/Ben/CJ/Bridges all have good size and athletism.

- Coaching. JV is a good dude and motivator, but we've been outcoached multiple times. It def. makes a difference in big games + playoffs = limited ceiling.

I have no expectations this season. At least we won't be disappointed how we were with KD/Ky/Harden era. We know we ain't good.

It’s going to be soul crushing when we ship Houston the 4th overall pick…

I highly doubt we'll be that bad and I don't think the lottery balls will fall down that far. I think we'll be in the 10-14 range in the lottery tho. But this team will put up a fight and we'll have some fun games. Atleast we don't have high expectations and disappointment of not winning a chip like the KD/Kyrie era.

The product on the floor won’t bother me and I was exaggerating a bit for satire, but just for reference, the last few years teams with wins in the low to mid 30’s have wound up with 5th to 9th worst records, which is exactly where I expect we land unless Ben Simmons is legit All NBA again, or we make a big midseason trade.

It will definitely be soul crushing to deliver a high lotto pick to Houston, especially if we make a jump.

[Tha King]

8 men rotation: Simmons/Din/Mikal/CJ/Clax + DFS/O'neal/a guard(cam/dsjr?)

Unless Simmons is really back, Clax + others really took a step forward in development I dont see us cracking 40 wins.

Problems:

- Go to scorer? Bridges is more of a finisher, not a ball handler/Decision Maker.
Which means Dinwiddie ISO ball in clutch situations = limited ceiling.

- Rebounding. We can be elite at defending, but it means nothing if we are bottom of the league in rebounding.
I don't buy Sharpe will magically fix that issue. It honestly makes no sense why we are so bad considering Clax/Ben/CJ/Bridges all have good size and athletism.

- Coaching. JV is a good dude and motivator, but we've been outcoached multiple times. It def. makes a difference in big games + playoffs = limited ceiling.

I have no expectations this season. At least we won't be disappointed how we were with KD/Ky/Harden era. We know we ain't good.

If Simmons can just be starting caliber (not even start), the thing about that eight player rotation is you have basically 7 starting level players. And not just randoms. You're talking players that would be major minute starters on title teams.

That's not factoring any improvement from Claxton or Thomas/Sharpe. Or production from Smith Jr. and Walker.

So I think the team could surprise because that level of depth and defensive potential should be able to get some wins in the RS. The playoffs/play-in would be a different story but regular season, depth, defensive effort, athleticism, etc. get can you wins.

[Papi_swav]

It’s going to be soul crushing when we ship Houston the 4th overall pick…

I highly doubt we'll be that bad and I don't think the lottery balls will fall down that far. I think we'll be in the 10-14 range in the lottery tho. But this team will put up a fight and we'll have some fun games. Atleast we don't have high expectations and disappointment of not winning a chip like the KD/Kyrie era.

The product on the floor won’t bother me and I was exaggerating a bit for satire, but just for reference, the last few years teams with wins in the low to mid 30’s have wound up with 5th to 9th worst records, which is exactly where I expect we land unless Ben Simmons is legit All NBA again, or we make a big midseason trade.

It will definitely be soul crushing to deliver a high lotto pick to Houston, especially if we make a jump.

I get you lol but yea I agree. I think on paper we'll be better than the Wiz, Magics, Hornets, Pistons, Portland, Spurs for now. Oh boy now that I look at it we're closer to being a bottom 5 team than a play in team. Tickets better be cheap this season

[vincecarter4pres]

I highly doubt we'll be that bad and I don't think the lottery balls will fall down that far. I think we'll be in the 10-14 range in the lottery tho. But this team will put up a fight and we'll have some fun games. Atleast we don't have high expectations and disappointment of not winning a chip like the KD/Kyrie era.

The product on the floor won’t bother me and I was exaggerating a bit for satire, but just for reference, the last few years teams with wins in the low to mid 30’s have wound up with 5th to 9th worst records, which is exactly where I expect we land unless Ben Simmons is legit All NBA again, or we make a big midseason trade.

It will definitely be soul crushing to deliver a high lotto pick to Houston, especially if we make a jump.

I get you lol but yea I agree. I think on paper we'll be better than the Wiz, Magics, Hornets, Pistons, Portland, Spurs for now. Oh boy now that I look at it we're closer to being a bottom 5 team than a play in team. Tickets better be cheap this season

I don’t mean to be doom and gloom, really don’t, and as others like King have said, we can easily be better than the sum of our parts kind of team that well exceeds expectations regular season wins-wise… but looking at the empty standings right now, that’s what I’m looking at too… what teams on paper are we actually realistically better than?

For sure (on paper):
Detroit
Houston
Washington
Portland

Maybe:
San An
Memphis pre Ja return
Charlotte
Toronto
Orlando
Chicago

Possibly:
Team or two with rampant injuries and then tank


This is probably going to be a long season lol.

[Netaman]

For sure (on paper):
Detroit
Houston
Washington
Portland

Maybe:
San An
Memphis pre Ja return
Charlotte
Toronto
Orlando
Chicago

Possibly:
Team or two with rampant injuries and then tank

this is an interesting list - i think they are better than SAS, Toronto, and probably Charlotte too. Out of those 3 plus the 4 you mentioned, I'd feel safe in saying it would take something pretty crazy for them to end up bottom 5. I'd be close to putting Orlando, Utah, Indy in that group too, so I think 10 is a reasonable low end for the season. I think this roster is generally better defensively with better depth, and none of them have a leading scorer dramatically better than bridges. if NBA teams could select 1 of bridges, markanen, haliburton, banchero, siakam, wemby, lamelo for just this year, i think you'd get a lot of different answers.

on the upper band i could see them being competitive with the knicks, hawks, bulls, heat in the play in range though i think right now brunson, trae, lavine/ddr, jimmy b are all more known quantities.

Simmons is obviously a huge variable. if he's Philly Ben, the duo with him and Bridges can compete with the 4 teams in the play in range.

at the moment i'd probably bet they send houston a top 15 pick. but if they are in that range around the deadline i think we'll see the nets either:

a) add a player if there's one they like on the market or
b) sell royce or dfs to a playoff team for a FRP that's probably within 15 slots of whatever they give houston

[vincecarter4pres]

For sure (on paper):
Detroit
Houston
Washington
Portland

Maybe:
San An
Memphis pre Ja return
Charlotte
Toronto
Orlando
Chicago

Possibly:
Team or two with rampant injuries and then tank

this is an interesting list - i think they are better than SAS, Toronto, and probably Charlotte too. Out of those 3 plus the 4 you mentioned, I'd feel safe in saying it would take something pretty crazy for them to end up bottom 5. I'd be close to putting Orlando, Utah, Indy in that group too, so I think 10 is a reasonable low end for the season. I think this roster is generally better defensively with better depth, and none of them have a leading scorer dramatically better than bridges. if NBA teams could select 1 of bridges, markanen, haliburton, banchero, siakam, wemby, lamelo for just this year, i think you'd get a lot of different answers.

on the upper band i could see them being competitive with the knicks, hawks, bulls, heat in the play in range though i think right now brunson, trae, lavine/ddr, jimmy b are all more known quantities.

Simmons is obviously a huge variable. if he's Philly Ben, the duo with him and Bridges can compete with the 4 teams in the play in range.

at the moment i'd probably bet they send houston a top 15 pick. but if they are in that range around the deadline i think we'll see the nets either:

a) add a player if there's one they like on the market or
b) sell royce or dfs to a playoff team for a FRP that's probably within 15 slots of whatever they give houston

I think given the current Vegas win totals, they’re fully expecting the Nets to make some kind of improvement trade by the deadline. That is probably our most likely path to saving grace. Maybe a blockbuster, maybe a midrange move on the cheap for a position of weakness.

But I’m expecting 32-40 wins and a pick in the 7-12 range shipped to Houston, barring significant games missed to injury, or a lottery jump from further back.

Although Marks did good in the Kyrie trade and excellent in the KD deal, he went equally opposite polar in the Houston trade.

Crippling trade and it’s not only in hindsight when he’s the guy speaking to the players, their agents, the coaching staff, friends and family of, etc., leading up to the eventual breakup.

He got absolutely bent over a barrel in the Harden trade.

[Netaman]

For sure (on paper):
Detroit
Houston
Washington
Portland

Maybe:
San An
Memphis pre Ja return
Charlotte
Toronto
Orlando
Chicago

Possibly:
Team or two with rampant injuries and then tank

this is an interesting list - i think they are better than SAS, Toronto, and probably Charlotte too. Out of those 3 plus the 4 you mentioned, I'd feel safe in saying it would take something pretty crazy for them to end up bottom 5. I'd be close to putting Orlando, Utah, Indy in that group too, so I think 10 is a reasonable low end for the season. I think this roster is generally better defensively with better depth, and none of them have a leading scorer dramatically better than bridges. if NBA teams could select 1 of bridges, markanen, haliburton, banchero, siakam, wemby, lamelo for just this year, i think you'd get a lot of different answers.

on the upper band i could see them being competitive with the knicks, hawks, bulls, heat in the play in range though i think right now brunson, trae, lavine/ddr, jimmy b are all more known quantities.

Simmons is obviously a huge variable. if he's Philly Ben, the duo with him and Bridges can compete with the 4 teams in the play in range.

at the moment i'd probably bet they send houston a top 15 pick. but if they are in that range around the deadline i think we'll see the nets either:

a) add a player if there's one they like on the market or
b) sell royce or dfs to a playoff team for a FRP that's probably within 15 slots of whatever they give houston

I think given the current Vegas win totals, they’re fully expecting the Nets to make some kind of improvement trade by the deadline. That is probably our most likely path to saving grace. Maybe a blockbuster, maybe a midrange move on the cheap for a position of weakness.

But I’m expecting 32-40 wins and a pick in the 7-12 range shipped to Houston, barring significant games missed to injury, or a lottery jump from further back.

Although Marks did good in the Kyrie trade and excellent in the KD deal, he went equally opposite polar in the Houston trade.

Crippling trade and it’s not only in hindsight when he’s the guy speaking to the players, their agents, the coaching staff, friends and family of, etc., leading up to the eventual breakup.

He got absolutely bent over a barrel in the Harden trade.

7-12 is a reasonable range if nothing changes. or if they just sell at the deadline because there isnt an adding move to make.

im surprised they didnt do more this summer to be honest. i dont mind it or think they did anything wrong, nobody got moved i can think of that i think they should have been more aggressive on except maybe dame, but i get why they chose not to do that.

i hadnt thought of it, but slotting the nets into the return the bucks gave up is pretty simple. they could easily match the 1 FRP and swaps so it's just valuing Jrue.

dinwiddie and dfs = jrue in terms of $. maybe they need 1 extra FRP to make up the difference with 2 years of jrue? id have pushed for that to be the philly pick but more likely they probably want another unprotected pick but even still they'd have 3 FRP's from other teams to deal with at least 2 of the unprotected (prob Dallas, 1 Pho, Philly). On top of their own.

Lillard / DSJ
Simmons / Walker / Whitehead
Bridges / Royce / Wilson
Cam J / Bazley / Clowney
Claxton / Sharpe / Watford / Giles

that team would have been top 4 in the east with assets left to trade. pretty sure id have pulled the trigger.

[vincecarter4pres]

this is an interesting list - i think they are better than SAS, Toronto, and probably Charlotte too. Out of those 3 plus the 4 you mentioned, I'd feel safe in saying it would take something pretty crazy for them to end up bottom 5. I'd be close to putting Orlando, Utah, Indy in that group too, so I think 10 is a reasonable low end for the season. I think this roster is generally better defensively with better depth, and none of them have a leading scorer dramatically better than bridges. if NBA teams could select 1 of bridges, markanen, haliburton, banchero, siakam, wemby, lamelo for just this year, i think you'd get a lot of different answers.

on the upper band i could see them being competitive with the knicks, hawks, bulls, heat in the play in range though i think right now brunson, trae, lavine/ddr, jimmy b are all more known quantities.

Simmons is obviously a huge variable. if he's Philly Ben, the duo with him and Bridges can compete with the 4 teams in the play in range.

at the moment i'd probably bet they send houston a top 15 pick. but if they are in that range around the deadline i think we'll see the nets either:

a) add a player if there's one they like on the market or
b) sell royce or dfs to a playoff team for a FRP that's probably within 15 slots of whatever they give houston

I think given the current Vegas win totals, they’re fully expecting the Nets to make some kind of improvement trade by the deadline. That is probably our most likely path to saving grace. Maybe a blockbuster, maybe a midrange move on the cheap for a position of weakness.

But I’m expecting 32-40 wins and a pick in the 7-12 range shipped to Houston, barring significant games missed to injury, or a lottery jump from further back.

Although Marks did good in the Kyrie trade and excellent in the KD deal, he went equally opposite polar in the Houston trade.

Crippling trade and it’s not only in hindsight when he’s the guy speaking to the players, their agents, the coaching staff, friends and family of, etc., leading up to the eventual breakup.

He got absolutely bent over a barrel in the Harden trade.

7-12 is a reasonable range if nothing changes. or if they just sell at the deadline because there isnt an adding move to make.

im surprised they didnt do more this summer to be honest. i dont mind it or think they did anything wrong, nobody got moved i can think of that i think they should have been more aggressive on except maybe dame, but i get why they chose not to do that.

i hadnt thought of it, but slotting the nets into the return the bucks gave up is pretty simple. they could easily match the 1 FRP and swaps so it's just valuing Jrue.

dinwiddie and dfs = jrue in terms of $. maybe they need 1 extra FRP to make up the difference with 2 years of jrue? id have pushed for that to be the philly pick but more likely they probably want another unprotected pick but even still they'd have 3 FRP's from other teams to deal with at least 2 of the unprotected (prob Dallas, 1 Pho, Philly). On top of their own.

Lillard / DSJ
Simmons / Walker / Whitehead
Bridges / Royce / Wilson
Cam J / Bazley / Clowney
Claxton / Sharpe / Watford / Giles

that team would have been top 4 in the east with assets left to trade. pretty sure id have pulled the trigger.

I agree, also see why they didn’t get involved. And agree with your logic on paper of what we have to give up to be in it and come out winners, but then you start a bidding war. Who says then Milwaukee doesn’t add a swap and turn a swap into an outright protected pick? Whose to say no one around the league rates Dinwiddie or DFS as anything other then a protected, but likely later pick as a package, instead of one frp each with light to no protections?

And it doesn’t change the fact Dame is old, and Giannis is will be getting there too by the time he hits free agency.

So then it becomes, do you give up this complete control of 4 Phoenix drafts in a row and a Dallas draft, maybe the Philly pick too, just to have a 3 year run at mediocrity, at the sake of chasing bad money and not shipping Houston a likely lotto pick, while giving up the chance at a prime star like Mitchell, Doncic, Ja or maybe Trae? Or someone else no one is expecting to be available?

That’s really it right?

Like the bitching about Marks gifting Houston so much in the Harden deal… it’s valid and impacts things, but what’s done is done.

So now you have to look at it like, do you burn up the high value Suns and Mavs picks and all depth to be a 1st to 2nd round exit for a few years and wind up missing out on other opportunity and a choose your adventure of direction you can go?

Or do you remain patient, see how the current roster responds, survey the NBA landscape league-wide this season, read the tea leaves and act accordingly, and say the ‘24 BK pick is the cost of doing business even if it winds up literally 1st overall?

They seemed to have chosen the latter and Idk I’d argue against that logic at this point.