Cam Johnson RFA (Update: Re-signed $108 million/4 years)

[Papi_swav]

I would not be surprised if he's the most sought after FA this offseason. He'd be a seamless offensive fit on not only the Pistons but the Pacers who have an offensive hub in Haliburton and need a wing. The Magic too. Like I said before, he's a fifth starter type but a team like the Pacers are in need of that and have ample cap space.

With Cam Johnson you also have to think about Clax because he's a FA next offseason and has even more in demand skillset. From a roster building perspective it might be tough to retain both with what they might get and still maintain the flexibility to go after the star(s) this roster needs. With Clax at least you can see a pathway to DPOY level and possible all star so it makes sense to do what it takes to keep but CJ is a fifth starter without much upside that could easily turn into a contract that weighs you down.

So I agree that a S&T could happen but I am not sure if that's returning any first round picks as some of these teams could simply give him fairly large contracts with the cap space they have and see what the Nets do. Something like Duarte for CJ is the type of S&T that could happen.

All true but, we can match any offer being thrown at him. We just need to unload couple expirings to get enough cap space. ATL calling about DFS, Indy has interers in both CamJ and Collins. We can get 7th pick ( get BPA ) and get Saddiq Bey ( I'd love Hendricks as 7th pick ). So it'll look like this:
BK send-> CamJ, DFS and 21 with 22 pick.
BK get -> Bey and 7th pick

Indy send -> 7th pick
Indy get -> CamJ, Collins and 22 BK

ATL send -> Collins and Bey
ATL get -> DFS and 21 PHX

Trade machine say it works and imo every team gets what they want. Don't get me wrong, I like CamJ and DFS... but I will gladly flip them for Bey and Hendricks ( could be different guy, it's just Hendricks is my preference ) if chance is given. They also good cheap assets that teams will want if disgruntled 1A star becomes available.

this is a fair trade imo. I'll definitely take this Bey can pretty much do what Cam J does

[GTR11]

I would not be surprised if he's the most sought after FA this offseason. He'd be a seamless offensive fit on not only the Pistons but the Pacers who have an offensive hub in Haliburton and need a wing. The Magic too. Like I said before, he's a fifth starter type but a team like the Pacers are in need of that and have ample cap space.

With Cam Johnson you also have to think about Clax because he's a FA next offseason and has even more in demand skillset. From a roster building perspective it might be tough to retain both with what they might get and still maintain the flexibility to go after the star(s) this roster needs. With Clax at least you can see a pathway to DPOY level and possible all star so it makes sense to do what it takes to keep but CJ is a fifth starter without much upside that could easily turn into a contract that weighs you down.

So I agree that a S&T could happen but I am not sure if that's returning any first round picks as some of these teams could simply give him fairly large contracts with the cap space they have and see what the Nets do. Something like Duarte for CJ is the type of S&T that could happen.

All true but, we can match any offer being thrown at him. We just need to unload couple expirings to get enough cap space. ATL calling about DFS, Indy has interers in both CamJ and Collins. We can get 7th pick ( get BPA ) and get Saddiq Bey ( I'd love Hendricks as 7th pick ). So it'll look like this:
BK send-> CamJ, DFS and 21 with 22 pick.
BK get -> Bey and 7th pick

Indy send -> 7th pick
Indy get -> CamJ, Collins and 22 BK

ATL send -> Collins and Bey
ATL get -> DFS and 21 PHX

Trade machine say it works and imo every team gets what they want. Don't get me wrong, I like CamJ and DFS... but I will gladly flip them for Bey and Hendricks ( could be different guy, it's just Hendricks is my preference ) if chance is given. They also good cheap assets that teams will want if disgruntled 1A star becomes available.

this is a fair trade imo. I'll definitely take this Bey can pretty much do what Cam J does

Yeah I like this trade too. I actually have few more with Orlando and Houston instead of Indy, but than we'd probably lose CamJ, DFS and Royce along with 2 picks. Kind of pricey for my liking to get Whitmore. I think Hendricks at 7 with Bey is good enough.

[Papi_swav]

All true but, we can match any offer being thrown at him. We just need to unload couple expirings to get enough cap space. ATL calling about DFS, Indy has interers in both CamJ and Collins. We can get 7th pick ( get BPA ) and get Saddiq Bey ( I'd love Hendricks as 7th pick ). So it'll look like this:
BK send-> CamJ, DFS and 21 with 22 pick.
BK get -> Bey and 7th pick

Indy send -> 7th pick
Indy get -> CamJ, Collins and 22 BK

ATL send -> Collins and Bey
ATL get -> DFS and 21 PHX

Trade machine say it works and imo every team gets what they want. Don't get me wrong, I like CamJ and DFS... but I will gladly flip them for Bey and Hendricks ( could be different guy, it's just Hendricks is my preference ) if chance is given. They also good cheap assets that teams will want if disgruntled 1A star becomes available.

this is a fair trade imo. I'll definitely take this Bey can pretty much do what Cam J does

Yeah I like this trade too. I actually have few more with Orlando and Houston instead of Indy, but than we'd probably lose CamJ, DFS and Royce along with 2 picks. Kind of pricey for my liking to get Whitmore. I think Hendricks at 7 with Bey is good enough.

yea I'd rather try to keep Royce if we can but DFS can go

[aad]

Pistons gonna offer 30 mill a year for Cam 4/120 I wonder if the nets will match

[Tha King]

Pistons gonna offer 30 mill a year for Cam 4/120 I wonder if the nets will match

if so, should be a Piston next year.

[TheNetsFan]

I keep seeing message board comments that Detroit will throw $28+mil at Johnson, but has that been reported anywhere? Sure, they're interested and Monty would love to get him, but are they really going to go that crazy?

[aad]

I keep seeing message board comments that Detroit will throw $28+mil at Johnson, but has that been reported anywhere? Sure, they're interested and Monty would love to get him, but are they really going to go that crazy?

Will the nets go that crazy to Match all offers

[Rastas]

Nope , unless Bridges turns into KD and demands Nets keep his buddy.

[Claud]

30m for Cam is too much.

[Tha King]

30m for Cam is too much.

Anything way above the (overpaid) contract of Harris will look too much.

last season was basically his first year as a starter in this league and before that he couldn't beat out Crowder. He's also yet to play 70 games in a season.

He's a great C&S role player but beyond that what will he give you? Great perimeter defense? Elite rebounding? On ball self creation? At his absolute best he should be your fourth or fifth best player.

I know the cap is rising but w/o the rise I think the Joe contract would have been an overpay. They all have different things they bring to the table but he's on a similar level to Kennard, DFS, etc. He's not twice the player they are.

[sashaturiaf]

Imo you have to match any dollar amount for Cam.

Nobody is untradable in the NBA. Even if you're overpaid always just another season away from becoming a big expiring. With Cams age, size and skillset he's got value even if he is overpaid at 30m a year.

[Netaman]

Imo you have to match any dollar amount for Cam.

Nobody is untradable in the NBA. Even if you're overpaid always just another season away from becoming a big expiring. With Cams age, size and skillset he's got value even if he is overpaid at 30m a year.

it all comes down to money. detroit seems like the most likely threat with monty but they dont have unlimited cap room. they project to have about 30m with a max of 40m.

nets need to talk to detroit and threaten matching anything but telling detroit they are willing to let them negotiate a s&t with cam if he agrees he'd prefer to sign there with whatever they are offering.

detroit already owes the knicks their pick if they make the playoffs, but it is protected from knicks if they make lotto, so they would have to send the nets the other side of the condition of the pick they owe knicks the next 2 years. nets get detroit's lotto pick in 2024 if it doesn't convey to knicks, if it does convey to knicks it flips unprotected in 2025. and nets get a 25m+ TPE to go along with the 18m KD TPE. that's 1 extra pick to use for Lillard and 2 extra good players they can trade for afterwards to go with bridges, claxton, dame.

love cam but id do that trade.

[Snakebites]

Imo you have to match any dollar amount for Cam.

Nobody is untradable in the NBA. Even if you're overpaid always just another season away from becoming a big expiring. With Cams age, size and skillset he's got value even if he is overpaid at 30m a year.

it all comes down to money. detroit seems like the most likely threat with monty but they dont have unlimited cap room. they project to have about 30m with a max of 40m.

nets need to talk to detroit and threaten matching anything but telling detroit they are willing to let them negotiate a s&t with cam if he agrees he'd prefer to sign there with whatever they are offering.

detroit already owes the knicks their pick if they make the playoffs, but it is protected from knicks if they make lotto, so they would have to send the nets the other side of the condition of the pick they owe knicks the next 2 years. nets get detroit's lotto pick in 2024 if it doesn't convey to knicks, if it does convey to knicks it flips unprotected in 2025. and nets get a 25m+ TPE to go along with the 18m KD TPE. that's 1 extra pick to use for Lillard and 2 extra good players they can trade for afterwards to go with bridges, claxton, dame.

love cam but id do that trade.

I doubt the Pistons give up an asset that valuable in addition to overpaying Cam Johnson. I could see us paying the money but not that much team value for the privilege. If that means we don't get Cam, I think we live with that.

But hey, I'm not Weaver. I agree that if the Nets really do have a limit to what they're willing to pay Cam, they should try to extract some value from us. That's the right play. But I don't see Weaver blinking on that particular demand. I imagine he calls the bluff and takes his chances.

[Netaman]

Imo you have to match any dollar amount for Cam.

Nobody is untradable in the NBA. Even if you're overpaid always just another season away from becoming a big expiring. With Cams age, size and skillset he's got value even if he is overpaid at 30m a year.

it all comes down to money. detroit seems like the most likely threat with monty but they dont have unlimited cap room. they project to have about 30m with a max of 40m.

nets need to talk to detroit and threaten matching anything but telling detroit they are willing to let them negotiate a s&t with cam if he agrees he'd prefer to sign there with whatever they are offering.

detroit already owes the knicks their pick if they make the playoffs, but it is protected from knicks if they make lotto, so they would have to send the nets the other side of the condition of the pick they owe knicks the next 2 years. nets get detroit's lotto pick in 2024 if it doesn't convey to knicks, if it does convey to knicks it flips unprotected in 2025. and nets get a 25m+ TPE to go along with the 18m KD TPE. that's 1 extra pick to use for Lillard and 2 extra good players they can trade for afterwards to go with bridges, claxton, dame.

love cam but id do that trade.

I doubt the Pistons give up an asset that valuable in addition to overpaying Cam Johnson. I could see us paying the money but not that much team value for the privilege. If that means we don't get Cam, I think we live with that.

But hey, I'm not Weaver. I agree that if the Nets really do have a limit to what they're willing to pay Cam, they should try to extract some value from us. That's the right play. But I don't see Weaver blinking on that particular demand. I imagine he calls the bluff and takes his chances.

i think the point would be if you give up the asset instead of having to overpay by as much and possibly not get him. or at least that's how id try to frame things if i was the nets. whatever you are willing to offer sheet, we may match it just to not lose an asset for nothing. but here is the contract we are willing to go to, if you are willing to go to a higher number then talk to cam and see if that's where he wants to go, not on an offer sheet, and if so here's the comp we'd want for a s&t.

so instead of putting out an offer sheet of 120m where you have an uncertain outcome, maybe you trade for him at 105m and actually ensure you get him.

[Snakebites]

it all comes down to money. detroit seems like the most likely threat with monty but they dont have unlimited cap room. they project to have about 30m with a max of 40m.

nets need to talk to detroit and threaten matching anything but telling detroit they are willing to let them negotiate a s&t with cam if he agrees he'd prefer to sign there with whatever they are offering.

detroit already owes the knicks their pick if they make the playoffs, but it is protected from knicks if they make lotto, so they would have to send the nets the other side of the condition of the pick they owe knicks the next 2 years. nets get detroit's lotto pick in 2024 if it doesn't convey to knicks, if it does convey to knicks it flips unprotected in 2025. and nets get a 25m+ TPE to go along with the 18m KD TPE. that's 1 extra pick to use for Lillard and 2 extra good players they can trade for afterwards to go with bridges, claxton, dame.

love cam but id do that trade.

I doubt the Pistons give up an asset that valuable in addition to overpaying Cam Johnson. I could see us paying the money but not that much team value for the privilege. If that means we don't get Cam, I think we live with that.

But hey, I'm not Weaver. I agree that if the Nets really do have a limit to what they're willing to pay Cam, they should try to extract some value from us. That's the right play. But I don't see Weaver blinking on that particular demand. I imagine he calls the bluff and takes his chances.

i think the point would be if you give up the asset instead of having to overpay by as much and possibly not get him. or at least that's how id try to frame things if i was the nets. whatever you are willing to offer sheet, we may match it just to not lose an asset for nothing. but here is the contract we are willing to go to, if you are willing to go to a higher number then talk to cam and see if that's where he wants to go, not on an offer sheet, and if so here's the comp we'd want for a s&t.

so instead of putting out an offer sheet of 120m where you have an uncertain outcome, maybe you trade for him at 105m and actually ensure you get him.

Well you’re the one who mentioned a 25 Mill TPE. I responded to that.

[Netaman]

I doubt the Pistons give up an asset that valuable in addition to overpaying Cam Johnson. I could see us paying the money but not that much team value for the privilege. If that means we don't get Cam, I think we live with that.

But hey, I'm not Weaver. I agree that if the Nets really do have a limit to what they're willing to pay Cam, they should try to extract some value from us. That's the right play. But I don't see Weaver blinking on that particular demand. I imagine he calls the bluff and takes his chances.

i think the point would be if you give up the asset instead of having to overpay by as much and possibly not get him. or at least that's how id try to frame things if i was the nets. whatever you are willing to offer sheet, we may match it just to not lose an asset for nothing. but here is the contract we are willing to go to, if you are willing to go to a higher number then talk to cam and see if that's where he wants to go, not on an offer sheet, and if so here's the comp we'd want for a s&t.

so instead of putting out an offer sheet of 120m where you have an uncertain outcome, maybe you trade for him at 105m and actually ensure you get him.

Well you’re the one who mentioned a 25 Mill TPE. I responded to that.

right but my point is him calling the bluff still probably means having to go in with a potentially higher offer sheet because now you are literally trying to win by making an offer so bad the nets wont accept it. the nets issue isn't luxury tax or how much money, it's purely just based on if the asset gets so overpaid it's stupid. and honestly whatever it is they may still match it. tsai seems to have no issues paying lux tax and it wont push them to the 2nd apron or anything. it just turns into a deal that's impossible to move, which i guess doesnt matter if they like the player enough.

end of the day there are a lot of different strategies and they will choose one. they can roll the dice and go big on cash. or they can try to talk to the nets and work something out. both paths have their downsides and neither is a lock.

[Snakebites]

i think the point would be if you give up the asset instead of having to overpay by as much and possibly not get him. or at least that's how id try to frame things if i was the nets. whatever you are willing to offer sheet, we may match it just to not lose an asset for nothing. but here is the contract we are willing to go to, if you are willing to go to a higher number then talk to cam and see if that's where he wants to go, not on an offer sheet, and if so here's the comp we'd want for a s&t.

so instead of putting out an offer sheet of 120m where you have an uncertain outcome, maybe you trade for him at 105m and actually ensure you get him.

Well you’re the one who mentioned a 25 Mill TPE. I responded to that.

right but my point is him calling the bluff still probably means having to go in with a potentially higher offer sheet because now you are literally trying to win by making an offer so bad the nets wont accept it. the nets issue isn't luxury tax or how much money, it's purely just based on if the asset gets so overpaid it's stupid. and honestly whatever it is they may still match it. tsai seems to have no issues paying lux tax and it wont push them to the 2nd apron or anything. it just turns into a deal that's impossible to move, which i guess doesnt matter if they like the player enough.

end of the day there are a lot of different strategies and they will choose one. they can roll the dice and go big on cash. or they can try to talk to the nets and work something out. both paths have their downsides and neither is a lock.

Yeah, I just respectfully think getting a first rounder with little to no upper protection out of the situation is wishful thinking on your end.

Most likely you’ll either end up overpaying to keep him or you’ll lose him for marginal or no return.

And most likely we’ll either get a Pyrrhic victory by landing him at a silly price or we’ll walk away with nothing.

That’s the RFA game. Cam Johnson is the textbook example of a guy who will benefit from it- not a max level guy but a guy with a valuable skill set who fits lots of teams. For the record push comes to shove I agree with you. Betting odds are he remains a Net, though it’s probably going to be at a number higher than the Nets are comfortable with. I don’t see them letting him walk- I just think they’ll view a major overpay as a better outcome than a marginal overpay AND the loss of a first rounder without the protection.

[Godaddycurse]

fyi there wouldnt be a 25M TPE. Cam is BYC so its 50% of that only (ie 12.5M TPE at 25M starting salary). See Grant's S&T from denver to Detroit for reference (10M TPE for a 20M/yr contract)

[Netaman]

Well you’re the one who mentioned a 25 Mill TPE. I responded to that.

right but my point is him calling the bluff still probably means having to go in with a potentially higher offer sheet because now you are literally trying to win by making an offer so bad the nets wont accept it. the nets issue isn't luxury tax or how much money, it's purely just based on if the asset gets so overpaid it's stupid. and honestly whatever it is they may still match it. tsai seems to have no issues paying lux tax and it wont push them to the 2nd apron or anything. it just turns into a deal that's impossible to move, which i guess doesnt matter if they like the player enough.

end of the day there are a lot of different strategies and they will choose one. they can roll the dice and go big on cash. or they can try to talk to the nets and work something out. both paths have their downsides and neither is a lock.

Yeah, I just respectfully think getting a first rounder with little to no upper protection out of the situation is wishful thinking on your end.

Most likely you’ll either end up overpaying to keep him or you’ll lose him for marginal or no return.

And most likely we’ll either get a Pyrrhic victory by landing him at a silly price or we’ll walk away with nothing.

That’s the RFA game. Cam Johnson is the textbook example of a guy who will benefit from it- not a max level guy but a guy with a valuable skill set who fits lots of teams. For the record push comes to shove I agree with you. Betting odds are he remains a Net, though it’s probably going to be at a number higher than the Nets are comfortable with. I don’t see them letting him walk- I just think they’ll view a major overpay as a better outcome than a marginal overpay AND the loss of a first rounder without the protection.

100% agree. Ayton is a perfect example from last year of the same thing happening. But before he signed the offer sheet there were a million and 1 sign and trade rumors for Myles Turner/picks. Now the contract is crazy under water and whichever team didn't get him dodged a bullet, which is why i hope the nets have some discipline if Detroit comes in with a crazy offer, but at the same i think both sides would be smart to just not play the RFA game and treat it like a regular S&T. Indiana didn't do anything smart to not end up with that contract on their books except get lucky the Suns matched.

I could definitely be a little off on my value of the Detroit pick but having an RFA is more leverage than a UFA and i dont think a future first of a team trying to make the playoffs is that big of a price. let's say nets wanted FVV who will probably get paid between 25-30m, I wouldnt be shocked if the price of that S&T is a future first. The protections already existing with the Knicks sort of dictate the pick otherwise it's a pick 3 years down the road with protections, which is a very meh and borderline useless pick.

[Netaman]

fyi there wouldnt be a 25M TPE. Cam is BYC so its 50% of that only (ie 12.5M TPE at 25M starting salary). See Grant's S&T from denver to Detroit for reference (10M TPE for a 20M/yr contract)

thank you wasn't sure about that - i think the nets probably match up to 25m (which is the rumor) so more realistically for detroit if they do the offer sheet game i think they'd have to go to 28-30 with the offer so still a pretty big tpe to go with the kd tpe.

on this market nets could probably get 2 good players later in the offseason if they strike out whoever they are targeting in the first waves (or if they decide to do nothing and wait out lillard) from other teams looking to cut salary.