NJ trades: Jamaal Magloire
NJ receives: Rasual Butler
SEA trades: Damien Wilkins + Earl Watson
SEA receives: Marcus Vinicius + Bobby Jackson + Jamaal Magloire
NO trades: Marcus Vinicius + Bobby Jackson + Rasual Butler
NO receives: Earl Watson + Damien Wilkins
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &te=&cash=
it works on the trade machine
I think it seems pretty fair all around, what do you guys think?
We Get Our Shooter. NJN/NOH/SEA
Moderators: NyCeEvO, Rich Rane
We Get Our Shooter. NJN/NOH/SEA
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Pugsley_2491
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Pugsley_2491
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i made this trade because we need a shooter and NO came out and said they need to bolster their bench. at first i thought of a deal of magloire for butler straight up, but realized it doesnt really help NO that much (unless anybody believes NO would do it) so then i figured they could use watson and wilkins which would upgrade their bench. but your right there isn't that much incentive for SEA to do it other than shed some salary.
Feel free to expand on this so we can land a shooter.
Feel free to expand on this so we can land a shooter.
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NetsForce
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I would simplify things by offering New Orleans Magloire for Rasul Butler straight up. NO really doesn't have good frontline depth they have Chandler and West who start which is a solid duo then they bring in the young inexperienced Hilton Armstrong and then... They have no one.
J-Mags had his best years as a Hornet maybe a returning to that team will help him rejuvinate his career.
Once again though even though I think the Nets need another shooter and Magloire isn't playing, I'm still kind of reluctant to part with him...
I guess on the other hand once Krstic comes back even though Magloire gives the Nets a different dimension there will be no room for him playing time wise =\
J-Mags had his best years as a Hornet maybe a returning to that team will help him rejuvinate his career.
Once again though even though I think the Nets need another shooter and Magloire isn't playing, I'm still kind of reluctant to part with him...
I guess on the other hand once Krstic comes back even though Magloire gives the Nets a different dimension there will be no room for him playing time wise =\
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Pugsley_2491
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NetsForce
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Pugsley_2491 wrote:Hey Netsforce. Would NO do rasual + ely for magloire? that way we still have our insurance bigman.
Oh wow I completely forgot that they had Ely... I just checked Yahoo thought and it turns out that he's been out for a while with a fractured eye socket (ouch) with that in mind...
To answer your question though I don't think NO would do that, I'm going to revise my previous assessment actually and say that NO probably wouldn't trade Butler for Magloire straight up.
A big man rotation of Chandler, West, Ely, and Armstrong is serviceable, you still have to question how much Ely and Armstrong can give you since they're two inconsistent players but the Hornets can probably get by with what they have.
Basically here's the thing the Hornets bench sucks; they're last in the league in points per game.
With that in mind and a quick look at their roster it's evident that other than the point guard position the entire Hornets bench is weak, because of that I don't think they'd do the two-for-one trade you proposed (and because you pointed out they already have Ely giving them two legit backups, I don't think they'd trade Rasul for Magloire since that gives them three serviceable backup big men but hurts them at the SG and SF positions).
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Pugsley_2491
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^^ yeah that's where the first trade comes into play, the only problem is seattle. so what would it take for seattle to get the job done because it benefits us and NO but nothing really for seattle. I know some people are skeptical when it comes to giving up magloire but he may force a trade anyways, did anyone else notice that he wasn't at last nights game due to personal reasons. besides we'll still have boone, swat, collins, allen and krstic will be coming back. plus if there's and injury we all know that boki can play a bit of the 4. so in otherwords, magloire will be getting DNP's all throughout the season and into the playoffs so we might as well get something useful for him
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NetsForce
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Hmmm I'll play Devil's Advocate and then ask this though, why wouldn't the Hornets and Sonics just cut the Nets out of the deal and do this:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &te=&cash=
With this deal the Hornets strengthen their bench by adding Wilikins while Watson replaces Jackson (I haven't checked their numbers but I think Watson is playing better than Jackson this year) --> Keeping Rasul is like an added bonus for the Hornets*
The Sonics on the other hand get rid of Wilkin's who they have no need for with Durant and Green already there and they shave off an extra year of salary by trading away Watson for Jackson (this also allows them to play Delonte West and Luke Ridnour more minutes so they can finally determine what they have in those two players).
*The one caveat is I don't know if the Hornets want to keep Rasul Butler and his three year deal. They have Julian Wright waiting in the wings and Butler has registered 3 straight DNP's so I wouldn't be surprised if he's had some sort of fallout with Scott.
**If we assume that the Hornets are willing to move Butler though then the question with your original trade becomes this why do the Sonics take on Magloire's contract? I think something else might have to be included (a second rounder) to entice the Sonics into taking on Magloire's contract.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &te=&cash=
With this deal the Hornets strengthen their bench by adding Wilikins while Watson replaces Jackson (I haven't checked their numbers but I think Watson is playing better than Jackson this year) --> Keeping Rasul is like an added bonus for the Hornets*
The Sonics on the other hand get rid of Wilkin's who they have no need for with Durant and Green already there and they shave off an extra year of salary by trading away Watson for Jackson (this also allows them to play Delonte West and Luke Ridnour more minutes so they can finally determine what they have in those two players).
*The one caveat is I don't know if the Hornets want to keep Rasul Butler and his three year deal. They have Julian Wright waiting in the wings and Butler has registered 3 straight DNP's so I wouldn't be surprised if he's had some sort of fallout with Scott.
**If we assume that the Hornets are willing to move Butler though then the question with your original trade becomes this why do the Sonics take on Magloire's contract? I think something else might have to be included (a second rounder) to entice the Sonics into taking on Magloire's contract.
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vincecarter4pres
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I wouldn't part with Magloire for anyone as a 1 for 1 deal right now.
Only at the deadline.
If you part with him now for a marginal guy like Rasual Butler, you kill any chance of landing a big name guy withought giving up one of the big 3.
And with most teams(the few there are) that have that big time big man that are looking to deal, if they were going to deal with us, or any team for that matter, are probrably not going to want to take on any of the big 3's salaries.
It wouldn't be a talent for talent swap.
It would be more like a expirings, plus Twin if needed, because he saves a team a hell of a lot of money in the long run, plus draft picks (2 1st rounders in all probrability) plus either M Will, S Will, Boone or Krstic, and maybe even a combo of 2 of those guys.
I personally believe the only team that would look to do a talent for talent swap would be the Clippers, with a Brand for RJ and Nenad type of deal, and that would only be if Brand and Krstic come back looking at least 90% by deadline, and the Clipps feel they are not going to be able to resign Brand or Maggette.
That would also be if Rod would want to take the risk, and Brand would sign an extension before the trade was completed.
Maybe you could do a Rj plus filler for JO or Gasol, but there would almost absolutely have to be a 3rd team involved that wanted RJ, had expiring to send to either Indianna or Memphis along with draft icks and prospects that Memphis or Indianna would want.
So, basically to make a long story longer, once again I would not deal Magloire for any marginal player straight up 1 for 1 at this point in the season.
The shame of it is, that even though we are on a 5 or 6 game winning streak, and it looks like S Will and Boone fit nicely, Magloire should at least be getting a steady 20 mpg off the bench, but frank is an idiot.
I still say for such a marginal player as Butler, a good trade for both teams would be Antoine Wright and maybe Malik Allen, although that still rids you of 2 expirings that you might need in a deadline deal for JO or Gasol if those deals ever presented themselves.
I still say if you are going to make a small deal now, go after Villanueva for Malik Allen, Antoine Wright and maybe a 2nd rounder.
I don't know if that gets it done, and I aslo don't know if Frank would play him, or if there are really minutes for him, but I think of him as a poor man's Al Harrington, with a lot of room for growth, and he's probrably if not statistically just as good, if not a better 3 point shooter as Butler, not to mention the fact he is a 6 10 PF.
Only at the deadline.
If you part with him now for a marginal guy like Rasual Butler, you kill any chance of landing a big name guy withought giving up one of the big 3.
And with most teams(the few there are) that have that big time big man that are looking to deal, if they were going to deal with us, or any team for that matter, are probrably not going to want to take on any of the big 3's salaries.
It wouldn't be a talent for talent swap.
It would be more like a expirings, plus Twin if needed, because he saves a team a hell of a lot of money in the long run, plus draft picks (2 1st rounders in all probrability) plus either M Will, S Will, Boone or Krstic, and maybe even a combo of 2 of those guys.
I personally believe the only team that would look to do a talent for talent swap would be the Clippers, with a Brand for RJ and Nenad type of deal, and that would only be if Brand and Krstic come back looking at least 90% by deadline, and the Clipps feel they are not going to be able to resign Brand or Maggette.
That would also be if Rod would want to take the risk, and Brand would sign an extension before the trade was completed.
Maybe you could do a Rj plus filler for JO or Gasol, but there would almost absolutely have to be a 3rd team involved that wanted RJ, had expiring to send to either Indianna or Memphis along with draft icks and prospects that Memphis or Indianna would want.
So, basically to make a long story longer, once again I would not deal Magloire for any marginal player straight up 1 for 1 at this point in the season.
The shame of it is, that even though we are on a 5 or 6 game winning streak, and it looks like S Will and Boone fit nicely, Magloire should at least be getting a steady 20 mpg off the bench, but frank is an idiot.
I still say for such a marginal player as Butler, a good trade for both teams would be Antoine Wright and maybe Malik Allen, although that still rids you of 2 expirings that you might need in a deadline deal for JO or Gasol if those deals ever presented themselves.
I still say if you are going to make a small deal now, go after Villanueva for Malik Allen, Antoine Wright and maybe a 2nd rounder.
I don't know if that gets it done, and I aslo don't know if Frank would play him, or if there are really minutes for him, but I think of him as a poor man's Al Harrington, with a lot of room for growth, and he's probrably if not statistically just as good, if not a better 3 point shooter as Butler, not to mention the fact he is a 6 10 PF.
Rich Rane wrote:I think we're all missing the point here. vc4pres needs to stop watching games.
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vincecarter4pres
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Another move I would absolutely love, but only at the deadline if we don't make a big move would be Magloire, Wright, Allen and maybe a 1st rounder, probrably a 2nd for Quentin Richardson.
I know he is often injured, but he only has 2 years left on his deal after this season, including the 3rd being a player option.
And this guy wouldn't complain coming off the bench if he got 20 something minutes a game.
He is a excellent rebounder for his size, a good defender when he wants to be, explosive when his back isn't acting up, good post up game, hits the 3, especially on the break and he can create his own shot.
He was and is always one of my favorite players, and I think would be the perfect fit as our 6xth man.
Although I highly doubt Isiah would want to deal with us, even if it meant some much needed salary cap relief.
I know he is often injured, but he only has 2 years left on his deal after this season, including the 3rd being a player option.
And this guy wouldn't complain coming off the bench if he got 20 something minutes a game.
He is a excellent rebounder for his size, a good defender when he wants to be, explosive when his back isn't acting up, good post up game, hits the 3, especially on the break and he can create his own shot.
He was and is always one of my favorite players, and I think would be the perfect fit as our 6xth man.
Although I highly doubt Isiah would want to deal with us, even if it meant some much needed salary cap relief.
Rich Rane wrote:I think we're all missing the point here. vc4pres needs to stop watching games.
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ecuhus1981
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You may be confusing Butler with their offseason signee, Morris Peterson. Morris did have a good game for NOH against GS last Friday, and Rasual didn't play. Morris Peterson I would consider swapping for Wright, but not Butler. And anyone can go off against the Warriors. That's how they play; they beat teams 134-119 or something like that. Look at the #'s:
Antoine Wright
Rasual Butler
For all the praise Rasual gets in the defensive departement, Antoine is better than him in that regard as well. If we're swapping out backup swingmen, cool. I'm not in love with Wright by any stretch, but he is clearly better than Butler. And we don't need Butler's contract clogging up our payroll. If anything, we may try to sign Antoine for less than what he would've made in the 4th year of his rookie contract. That'd probably be 1/2 of what Rasual's making.
Antoine Wright
Rasual Butler
For all the praise Rasual gets in the defensive departement, Antoine is better than him in that regard as well. If we're swapping out backup swingmen, cool. I'm not in love with Wright by any stretch, but he is clearly better than Butler. And we don't need Butler's contract clogging up our payroll. If anything, we may try to sign Antoine for less than what he would've made in the 4th year of his rookie contract. That'd probably be 1/2 of what Rasual's making.
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Copperhead
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NetsForce wrote:I would simplify things by offering New Orleans Magloire for Rasul Butler straight up. NO really doesn't have good frontline depth they have Chandler and West who start which is a solid duo then they bring in the young inexperienced Hilton Armstrong and then... They have no one.
J-Mags had his best years as a Hornet maybe a returning to that team will help him rejuvinate his career.
Once again though even though I think the Nets need another shooter and Magloire isn't playing, I'm still kind of reluctant to part with him...
I guess on the other hand once Krstic comes back even though Magloire gives the Nets a different dimension there will be no room for him playing time wise =\
I doubt Magliore will ever be a Hornet again. Unless Scott is coaching elsewhere, Jeff Bower is the GM for another team, and the Hornets have a new owner. Magloire had become disgruntled when he was traded. I don't see him playing for the Hornets under the same staff.