2023-24 NY Knicks trade ideas, Part 4

[Chanel Bomber]

have you been drinking today?

No

Have you

I'm not the one that is making no sense

You



Me

[NoDopeOnSundays]

have you been drinking today?

No

Have you

I'm not the one that is making no sense

ChaHell is delirious at the thought of getting Burks back, it's not his fault today.

[god shammgod]

the finances don't work for trading for a star max player, which is what their whole plan is, and keeping all 3 of brunson, randle and og on max or near max deals. there seems to be one guy here who is talking about this besides me. teams really can't have 3 max guys without being a 2nd apron team in the new rules and somehow the knicks are gonna have 4 ? it aint gonna work. they can't just keep everyone. so either we have our big 3 right now or one of those 3 is gonna have to go in the eventual "star" trade. in that case, holding onto fournier's deal doesn't matter as much as people think it does.

who is saying they wont trade randle with that other salary to get that star? Randle changed agents not sure he is in there long term plans beyond this season.


randle still makes less than most stars so yes Fournier or another 20ish MM salary will be important to be in that 40ish range.

Knicks clearly have prioritized on keeping Fournier deal for a while now

I agree with Sham. I think Fournier goes away if we don't trade him now.

If we're looking to re-sign iHart, Precious, and OG this offseason that likely adds 30-35 mil to the payroll if we keep Fournier. Once the lux tax is accounted for that's a huge salary commitment caused by a guy who isn't playing.

yeah, they can't just carry that dead weight another season. and they have to pay brunson/randle the summer after. their total salary number is gonna be crazy. they might have to drop some of these role players.

[mpharris36]

the finances don't work for trading for a star max player, which is what their whole plan is, and keeping all 3 of brunson, randle and og on max or near max deals. there seems to be one guy here who is talking about this besides me. teams really can't have 3 max guys without being a 2nd apron team in the new rules and somehow the knicks are gonna have 4 ? it aint gonna work. they can't just keep everyone. so either we have our big 3 right now or one of those 3 is gonna have to go in the eventual "star" trade. in that case, holding onto fournier's deal doesn't matter as much as people think it does.

who is saying they wont trade randle with that other salary to get that star? Randle changed agents not sure he is in there long term plans beyond this season.


randle still makes less than most stars so yes Fournier or another 20ish MM salary will be important to be in that 40ish range.

randle makes 30 next year . donovan mitchell makes 34. do you need evan's deal for that ?

kat you will but if the knicks are willing to spend 50 mill a year on him they have more serious problems than matching contracts.

I just think they want to keep there options open and moving Fournier closes some more options where then you have to trade a Randle or Mitch contract. I'm just saying you might as well prolong that salary for another year just in case. Burks doesn't even make us marginally better to give up the extra tradable salary for the following year.

[mpharris36]

No

Have you

I'm not the one that is making no sense

You



Me

All I see is Burks inbounding the ball late in games to the other team.

[stuporman]

Brunson is that guy who will sign for less than he could just so the Knicks can fit in another star player, plus he's even such a great Knicks culture guy he'll recruit those stars to come for less money to be part of making history and becoming a legend in NY...and you will like it...no wait, you will love it!

I will not be taking questions or comments on this opinion at this time since it is the story I'm sticking with and will not be dissuaded from it until something actually happens to falsify it. You're welcome.

[mpharris36]

the finances don't work for trading for a star max player, which is what their whole plan is, and keeping all 3 of brunson, randle and og on max or near max deals. there seems to be one guy here who is talking about this besides me. teams really can't have 3 max guys without being a 2nd apron team in the new rules and somehow the knicks are gonna have 4 ? it aint gonna work. they can't just keep everyone. so either we have our big 3 right now or one of those 3 is gonna have to go in the eventual "star" trade. in that case, holding onto fournier's deal doesn't matter as much as people think it does.

who is saying they wont trade randle with that other salary to get that star? Randle changed agents not sure he is in there long term plans beyond this season.


randle still makes less than most stars so yes Fournier or another 20ish MM salary will be important to be in that 40ish range.

Knicks clearly have prioritized on keeping Fournier deal for a while now

I agree with Sham. I think Fournier goes away if we don't trade him now.

If we're looking to re-sign iHart, Precious, and OG this offseason that likely adds 30-35 mil to the payroll if we keep Fournier. Once the lux tax is accounted for that's a huge salary commitment caused by a guy who isn't playing.

Fournier is just being considered tradable salary. Thats all...they actually don't want him on the team. They just want to aggregate his salary in a deal because they don't want to trade guys like Hart or DD ect...they want to keep them in a trade so they want to use Fournier or turn Fournier into more tradable salary.

[sol537]

Brown seems the most realistic target. 2024 NYK 1st and Fournier probably gets it done.

I wouldn’t hate it. Brown makes us better.

[mpharris36]

who is saying they wont trade randle with that other salary to get that star? Randle changed agents not sure he is in there long term plans beyond this season.


randle still makes less than most stars so yes Fournier or another 20ish MM salary will be important to be in that 40ish range.

Knicks clearly have prioritized on keeping Fournier deal for a while now

I agree with Sham. I think Fournier goes away if we don't trade him now.

If we're looking to re-sign iHart, Precious, and OG this offseason that likely adds 30-35 mil to the payroll if we keep Fournier. Once the lux tax is accounted for that's a huge salary commitment caused by a guy who isn't playing.

yeah, they can't just carry that dead weight another season. and they have to pay brunson/randle the summer after. their total salary number is gonna be crazy. they might have to drop some of these role players.

they are a team operating over the cap. With an owner that has never cared about paying the tax. I don't think they are penny pinching.

[spree2kawhi]

the finances don't work for trading for a star max player, which is what their whole plan is, and keeping all 3 of brunson, randle and og on max or near max deals. there seems to be one guy here who is talking about this besides me. teams really can't have 3 max guys without being a 2nd apron team in the new rules and somehow the knicks are gonna have 4 next summer ? it aint gonna work. they can't just keep everyone. so either we have our big 3 right now or one of those 3 is gonna have to go in the eventual "star" trade. in that case, holding onto fournier's deal doesn't matter as much as people think it does.

I THINK that if OG takes less than the complete max, there's a window to add another star while Brunson and Randle's salaries aren't maxed. Like, a window of this offseason. Also, someone stated that Brunson probably wouldn't extend, but hit FA, since he'd get more money in that scenario. I don't know if that buys a year or not.

It seems like the Knicks are still planning on using Fournier (resigned) or someone to replace his $, as part of a bigger trade in the offseason. Of course, Mitch and his $17 million will be part of the trade as well.

OG is one of the most impactful players in the league. The fact that he (very rightfully) calls himself a “defensive playmaker” should tell you enough about his future bargaining approach.

[god shammgod]

I agree with Sham. I think Fournier goes away if we don't trade him now.

If we're looking to re-sign iHart, Precious, and OG this offseason that likely adds 30-35 mil to the payroll if we keep Fournier. Once the lux tax is accounted for that's a huge salary commitment caused by a guy who isn't playing.

yeah, they can't just carry that dead weight another season. and they have to pay brunson/randle the summer after. their total salary number is gonna be crazy. they might have to drop some of these role players.

they are a team operating over the cap. With an owner that has never cared about paying the tax. I don't think they are penny pinching.

it's not about penny pinching. the new cap rules basically make it that once you reach the 2nd apron you can't do much of anything. you're kind of stuck.

What are the penalties for the first apron?

The first apron hits when a team's payroll exceeds $172 million. At this point, the following restrictions are triggered:

Teams cannot acquire a player in a sign-and-trade if that player keeps them above the apron
Teams cannot sign a player waived during the regular season whose salary was over the $12.2 million midlevel exception
Salary matching in trades must be within 110 percent, rather than 125 percent for teams not above the apron

What are the penalties for the second apron?

All of the penalties for the first apron apply to the second apron as well, which is triggered when a team's salary exceeds $182.5 million. For the 2023-24 season, one additional penalty is added when crossing the second apron:

No access to the $5 million taxpayer midlevel exception

Starting at the end of the 2023-24 season, even more restrictions will be added to the second apron. These include:

Teams cannot use a trade exception generated by aggregating the salaries of multiple players
Teams cannot include cash in a trade
Teams cannot use a trade exception generated in a prior year
First-round picks seven years out are frozen (unable to be traded)
A team's first-round pick is moved to the end of the first round if they remain in the second apron for three out of five seasons

These penalties are much more stringent than under the old CBA. Previously, owners with deep pockets could go well into the luxury tax as long as they were willing to pay. Now, teams who enter the second apron will have difficulty adding any sort of new talent via trades or free agent acquisitions.

[cgf]

You can't escape destiny

finances don't work...sorry

We'll make it work

Watch on YouTube

Flynn + cash for Mills. Mills + SRP for MJ

[stuporman]

This trade deadline with Brown reference for relevancy...

[cgf]

yeah, they can't just carry that dead weight another season. and they have to pay brunson/randle the summer after. their total salary number is gonna be crazy. they might have to drop some of these role players.

they are a team operating over the cap. With an owner that has never cared about paying the tax. I don't think they are penny pinching.

it's not about penny pinching. the new cap rules basically make it that once you reach the 2nd apron you can't do much of anything. you can no longer even put two players together to trade for one player. i'm serious. look it up.

FWIW we should have around 75M under the 2nd apron with which to pay Anunoby, Hartenstein, Achiuwa, our picks, and whatever we do with the Fournier contract. So yes the 2nd apron restrictions are draconian, but avoiding the 2nd apron shouldn't be too tricky for us this summer.

Next summer we're probably gunna be ****.

[Deeeez Knicks]

the finances don't work for trading for a star max player, which is what their whole plan is, and keeping all 3 of brunson, randle and og on max or near max deals. there seems to be one guy here who is talking about this besides me. teams really can't have 3 max guys without being a 2nd apron team in the new rules and somehow the knicks are gonna have 4 ? it aint gonna work. they can't just keep everyone. so either we have our big 3 right now or one of those 3 is gonna have to go in the eventual "star" trade. in that case, holding onto fournier's deal doesn't matter as much as people think it does.

who is saying they wont trade randle with that other salary to get that star? Randle changed agents not sure he is in there long term plans beyond this season.


randle still makes less than most stars so yes Fournier or another 20ish MM salary will be important to be in that 40ish range.

Knicks clearly have prioritized on keeping Fournier deal for a while now

I agree with Sham. I think Fournier goes away if we don't trade him now.

If we're looking to re-sign iHart, Precious, and OG this offseason that likely adds 30-35 mil to the payroll if we keep Fournier. Once the lux tax is accounted for that's a huge salary commitment caused by a guy who isn't playing.

Per Katz they are likely to keep Fournier if they don't trade him.

Based on all the rumors it sounds like they are ok with going over Apron #1 but want to stay under Apron #2. That $18-$22mil contract can fit in there and sounds like what the Knicks are looking for.

The Knicks are still eyeing the upcoming summer for a big-star trade, league sources said. And they’d prefer to deal as little out of today’s rotation as they can to make that happen. Exchanging Fournier for expiring veterans could force them to include at least two of Robinson, Hart and Donte DiVincenzo along with Grimes in a deal this summer. That’s not what they want.

It’s why a buyout of Fournier, if the Knicks don’t trade him by Thursday, is unlikely. If he’s still on the roster past the deadline, picking up his $19 million 2024-25 team option is on the table, according to league sources, even though Fournier rarely ever plays — even when the group is missing nearly half of its rotation.

Fournier would provide the vehicle to bring in someone on the salary the Knicks prefer: eight figures and into $20 million. But based on the way New York has operated, it would be shocking if it dealt Fournier for an upcoming free agent. The Knicks want that new player to be under contract for next season, ensuring that they could include him in a larger trade for a star four or five months from now. Fournier earns $18.8 million this season and has a team option for 2024-25.

For an example of what not to look out for, let’s go back to the Detroit situation.

Dealing Fournier and a couple of second-round picks for Burks and Monté Morris could make some basketball sense for both teams, considering the money changing hands is similar. The Pistons receive future assets and the Knicks bring back a competent, no-nonsense point guard along with a known quantity in Burks. But contractually, it’s a no-no, considering both of those Pistons are on expiring deals.

[jvsimonetti0514]

Knicks pick and Evan for Bruce Brown just feels like destined to happen

[Chanel Bomber]

I'm not the one that is making no sense

You



Me

All I see is Burks inbounding the ball late in games to the other team.

You need better glasses

Spoiler:

Try these

[Jalen Bluntson]

yeah, they can't just carry that dead weight another season. and they have to pay brunson/randle the summer after. their total salary number is gonna be crazy. they might have to drop some of these role players.

they are a team operating over the cap. With an owner that has never cared about paying the tax. I don't think they are penny pinching.

it's not about penny pinching. the new cap rules basically make it that once you reach the 2nd apron you can't do much of anything.

What are the penalties for the first apron?

The first apron hits when a team's payroll exceeds $172 million. At this point, the following restrictions are triggered:

Teams cannot acquire a player in a sign-and-trade if that player keeps them above the apron
Teams cannot sign a player waived during the regular season whose salary was over the $12.2 million midlevel exception
Salary matching in trades must be within 110 percent, rather than 125 percent for teams not above the apron

What are the penalties for the second apron?

All of the penalties for the first apron apply to the second apron as well, which is triggered when a team's salary exceeds $182.5 million. For the 2023-24 season, one additional penalty is added when crossing the second apron:

No access to the $5 million taxpayer midlevel exception

Starting at the end of the 2023-24 season, even more restrictions will be added to the second apron. These include:

Teams cannot use a trade exception generated by aggregating the salaries of multiple players
Teams cannot include cash in a trade
Teams cannot use a trade exception generated in a prior year
First-round picks seven years out are frozen (unable to be traded)
A team's first-round pick is moved to the end of the first round if they remain in the second apron for three out of five seasons

These penalties are much more stringent than under the old CBA. Previously, owners with deep pockets could go well into the luxury tax as long as they were willing to pay. Now, teams who enter the second apron will have difficulty adding any sort of new talent via trades or free agent acquisitions.

I'm sure they will make sound cap decisions. They have been getting some really favorable team deals for the most part. Mid season trades have been solid. I think they will figure it out.

[spree2kawhi]

I'm not the one that is making no sense

You



Me

All I see is Burks inbounding the ball late in games to the other team.

Fournier is twice the player Burks is.

[god shammgod]

they are a team operating over the cap. With an owner that has never cared about paying the tax. I don't think they are penny pinching.

it's not about penny pinching. the new cap rules basically make it that once you reach the 2nd apron you can't do much of anything. you can no longer even put two players together to trade for one player. i'm serious. look it up.

FWIW we should have around 75M under the 2nd apron with which to pay Anunoby, Hartenstein, Achiuwa, our picks, and whatever we do with the Fournier contract. So yes the 2nd apron restrictions are draconian, but avoiding the 2nd apron shouldn't be too tricky for us this summer.

Next summer we're probably gunna be ****.

but you have to plan for next summer now. you know brunson is getting a max and if randle is still here he is too. he's now a 3 time all-star, 2 time all nba player. if pascal is a max player, he's a max player.