New York Knicks Forum Resources - Knicks CBA/Stats/Info/Links

[Knicks_Fan2]

At some point, Kos or suicidedeuce will come here and drop some knowledge.

[Context]

Smart move gonyk...

[moocow007]

TAX PAYER vs. NONE TAX PAYER MID-LEVEL EXCEPTION

When most people think of the mid-level exception (or MLE) they think about some amount starting at around $5-5.5 million. This was the MLE that teams were allowed to spend under the old CBA to sign free agents if they were over the cap.

With the new CBA, that has changed. In an apparent attempt to level the playing ground even more between the big money teams and the small market teams, the new CBA limits the amount a team over the cap can spend on free agents if they also exceed the luxury tax limit.

Teams who's combined team salary exceeds the salary cap but does not exceed the luxury tax threshold can spend the "NONE TAX PAYER" or Full Mid-Level Exception to sign a free agent.

* Max 1st Year Salary -- $5.150 million (for 2013-2014).
* Max length of contract -- 4 years.
* Max annual raise after first year -- 4.5%
* Usage restrictions -- cannot exceed luxury taxy threshold

Teams who's combined team salary exceeds the salary cap AND also exceeds the luxury tax threshold are limited to only using the "TAX PAYER" or Mini-Mid-Level Exception to sign a free agent.

* Max 1st Year Salary -- $3.183 million (for 2013-2014).
* Max length of contract -- 3 years.
* Max raise after first year -- 4.5%.

Can a team split either exception to sign multiple players?

* Yes teams can split either exception up to use to sign multiple players. The combined first year salaries of all players signed cannot exceed to stated max 1st year salary. The contracts for each player signed cannot be greater than the stated length of contracts.

What is the luxury tax?

*The Luxury tax is an amount (often referred to as a threshold) where teams who's total team salary exceeds said amount has to pay a tax (how much that tax is is irrelevant for this discussion).

*For the 1st season after the new CBA was agreed up (2011-2012 season), the luxury tax was set at $70.307 million.

*For the upcoming season (2013-2014) the luxury tax will be based on 53.51% of the (projected BRI - paid player benefits) / the number of teams in the league. BRI = "Basketball Related Income". There is no minimum but, for trends sake, the BRI for the 2012-2013 season INCREASED by 4.5% from the previous season (assuming benefits remaind the same, it would imply that the luxury tax for 2012-2013 would be $73.471 million). The greater the increase (assuming benefits paid remains steady) the higher the luxury tax.

[Thugger HBC]

If some posters can explain JR's situation and why we can't do sign and trades, that would be helpful

Sure.

From Larry Coon’s CBA FAQ: “Starting in 2013-14, teams above the apron cannot receive a player in a sign-and-trade transaction.”

First thing you need to always remember before proceeding is that the Knicks, as currently constructed, are a luxury tax paying team and over the luxury tax apron of $74 million (which is set as $4 million dollars over the luxury tax line). If you add up all the salaries this season, Knicks payroll stands to be around $76.6 million (not including Chris Smith’s contract). Next season, Anthony, Stoudemire, and Chandler will earn a combined 5 million more for the 2013-2014 season.

That means the Knicks are not allowed to acquire players in any sign-and-trade scenario.

As far as JR goes....it's entirely up to JR what the Knicks can do.

1) He picks up his option, and next season becomes unrestricted full bird for three years of service to the Knicks, and the Knicks can give him anything up to a max contract.

2) He opts out, becomes an unrestricted free agent, and can re-sign with the Knicks using early bird rights in which the Knicks can only offer JR a 175% pay increase, which would mean a contract starting at slightly above $5m with 4.5% annual raises and a maximum of four years. also note Early bird deals must be a minimum of two years BEFORE a player can opt out, so he would be with the Knicks 4 years before he could cash in on his bigger payday (full bird), instead of three.

3) He sign with another team, and in that case, he's gone, and Knicks can do nothing about it.

It doesn't matter if he sign a vet min deal or a deal of 10 mil a seaosn for example, the Knicks wouldn't be able to stop him.

[CrazyKnicks]

This is very informative, if someone can list the current Knicks contracts and where we are in terms of the tax it would be great.

[Thugger HBC]

Question and not sure if this is the right place for it: Can we realistically keep Kenyon, JR, Copeland and Prigioni next season?

In a perfect scenario.....

JR takes an early bird contract, or picks up his option (the second option imo is not likely).

K-Mart is swayed into a two year vets min deal.

Copeland accepts his QO, or Knicks use the bi-annual exception to sign him. (Kinda surprised Cope wasn't placed on a two year deal similar to James White)

Pablo takes his QO as well.

I would think the Knicks would hope to not have to use their mini mle on a current member of the Knicks.

edit: Knicks wont have BAE as a taxpayer.

[moocow007]

ROOM MID-LEVEL EXCEPTION & BI-ANNUAL EXCEPTION

The "ROOM MID-LEVEL EXCEPTION" was created for teams that are UNDER the salary cap (who, by default, cannot use the Full or Mini MLE).

* Max 1st year salary -- $2.652 million
* Max contract length -- 2 years
* Max annual raise after 1st year -- 4.5%
* Usage restriction -- teams that use this exception CANNOT use any of the other exceptions.

The "BI-ANNUAL EXCEPTION" is an exception for teams that are below the "apron" (i.e. less than $4 million above the luxury tax). This exception CANNOT be used by teams that have already used the "Tax Payer" (i.e. teams over the luxury tax) OR "Room Exception" (i.e. teams under the salary cap).

* Max 1st year salary -- $2.016 million
* Max contract length -- 2 years
* Max annual rais after 1st year -- 4.5%
* Usage restriction -- cannot be used 2 years in a row

[Pharmcat]

If some posters can explain JR's situation and why we can't do sign and trades, that would be helpful

Sure.

From Larry Coon’s CBA FAQ: “Starting in 2013-14, teams above the apron cannot receive a player in a sign-and-trade transaction.”

First thing you need to always remember before proceeding is that the Knicks, as currently constructed, are a luxury tax paying team and over the luxury tax apron of $74 million (which is set as $4 million dollars over the luxury tax line). If you add up all the salaries this season, Knicks payroll stands to be around $76.6 million (not including Chris Smith’s contract). Next season, Anthony, Stoudemire, and Chandler will earn a combined 5 million more for the 2013-2014 season.

That means the Knicks are not allowed to acquire players in any sign-and-trade scenario.

As far as JR goes....it's entirely up to JR what the Knicks can do.

1) He picks up his option, and next season becomes unrestricted full bird for three years of service to the Knicks, and the Knicks can give him anything up to a max contract.

2) He opts out, becomes an unrestricted free agent, and can re-sign with the Knicks using early bird rights in which the Knicks can only offer JR a 175% pay increase, which would mean a contract starting at slightly above $5m with 4.5% annual raises and a maximum of four years. also note Early bird deals must be a minimum of two years BEFORE a player can opt out, so he would be with the Knicks 4 years before he could cash in on his bigger payday (full bird), instead of three.

3) He sign with another team, and in that case, he's gone, and Knicks can do nothing about it.

It doesn't matter if he sign a vet min deal or a deal of 10 mil a seaosn for example, the Knicks wouldn't be able to stop him.

are you sure #3 is right? NY has his early bird rights, so the only way they cant match the contract is if its greater than that 5 m #.....am I wrong?

[Pharmcat]

Question and not sure if this is the right place for it: Can we realistically keep Kenyon, JR, Copeland and Prigioni next season?

In a perfect scenario.....

JR takes an early bird contract, or picks up his option (the second option imo is not likely).

K-Mart is swayed into a two year vets min deal.

Copeland accepts his QO, or Knicks use the bi-annual exception to sign him. (Kinda surprised Cope wasn't placed on a two year deal similar to James White)

Pablo takes his QO as well.

I would think the Knicks would hope to not have to use their mini mle on a current member of the Knicks.

kmart didnt take vet min this year at beginning not sure why he would next year

[Pharmcat]

Question and not sure if this is the right place for it: Can we realistically keep Kenyon, JR, Copeland and Prigioni next season?

In a perfect scenario.....

JR takes an early bird contract, or picks up his option (the second option imo is not likely).

K-Mart is swayed into a two year vets min deal.

Copeland accepts his QO, or Knicks use the bi-annual exception to sign him. (Kinda surprised Cope wasn't placed on a two year deal similar to James White)

Pablo takes his QO as well.

I would think the Knicks would hope to not have to use their mini mle on a current member of the Knicks.

any1 know the reason copelands contract wasnt structured like whites?

[Thugger HBC]

Pharm, JR wont be restricted in any way for or fashion, they can't "match", JR would have to turn down offers on his own....we have no control over JR once he opts out.

As far as K-mart that is a "best case scenario" post per the question of the poster.

i think K-Mart is hell bent on proving he still has value, and will take it elsewhere if offered.

I'll wait for deuce on Copelands deal, but imo , i think Grunwald dropped the ball on that one.

[moocow007]

If some posters can explain JR's situation and why we can't do sign and trades, that would be helpful

Sure.

From Larry Coon’s CBA FAQ: “Starting in 2013-14, teams above the apron cannot receive a player in a sign-and-trade transaction.”

First thing you need to always remember before proceeding is that the Knicks, as currently constructed, are a luxury tax paying team and over the luxury tax apron of $74 million (which is set as $4 million dollars over the luxury tax line). If you add up all the salaries this season, Knicks payroll stands to be around $76.6 million (not including Chris Smith’s contract). Next season, Anthony, Stoudemire, and Chandler will earn a combined 5 million more for the 2013-2014 season.

That means the Knicks are not allowed to acquire players in any sign-and-trade scenario.

As far as JR goes....it's entirely up to JR what the Knicks can do.

1) He picks up his option, and next season becomes unrestricted full bird for three years of service to the Knicks, and the Knicks can give him anything up to a max contract.

2) He opts out, becomes an unrestricted free agent, and can re-sign with the Knicks using early bird rights in which the Knicks can only offer JR a 175% pay increase, which would mean a contract starting at slightly above $5m with 4.5% annual raises and a maximum of four years. also note Early bird deals must be a minimum of two years BEFORE a player can opt out, so he would be with the Knicks 4 years before he could cash in on his bigger payday (full bird), instead of three.

3) He sign with another team, and in that case, he's gone, and Knicks can do nothing about it.

It doesn't matter if he sign a vet min deal or a deal of 10 mil a seaosn for example, the Knicks wouldn't be able to stop him.

are you sure #3 is right? NY has his early bird rights, so the only way they cant match the contract is if its greater than that 5 m #.....am I wrong?

The Knicks can match an offer sheet IF it's below whatever the Early Bird Excpetion amount is (Early Bird exception is the same amount as the none taxpayers (or full) MLE).

[moocow007]

Pharm, JR wont be restricted in any way for or fashion, they can't "match", JR would have to turn down offers on his own....we have no control over JR once he opts out.

As far as K-mart that is a "best case scenario" post per the question of the poster.

i think K-Mart is hell bent on proving he still has value, and will take it elsewhere if offered.

I'll wait for deuce on Copelands deal, but imo , i think Grunwald dropped the ball on that one.

I'm not sure about that. I'm pretty sure they actually can match as long as the offer sheet doesn't exceed the Early Bird Exception amount (which is the same as the amount of whatever the full MLE would normally be).

[Thugger HBC]

JR is NOT a restricted free agent....once he opts out he becomes UNRESTRICTED, just like last year.

The word "match" is being misused, the Knicks cannot match anything JR sign with another club, if he signs he's gone.

JR has been in the league more than 4 years, he doesn't qualify for Restricted free agent status.

[Context]

JR is NOT a restricted free agent....once he opts out he becomes UNRESTRICTED, just like last year.

The word "match" is being misused, the Knicks cannot match anything JR sign with another club, if he signs he's gone.

JR has been in the league more than 4 years, he doesn't qualify for Restricted free agent status.

Can you list in your original "JR" post what the max another team could offer JR pls?

[NYKMentality85]

Good thread and thanks for creating. I'll be sure to follow especially come the offseason.

Kurt Thomas, Rasheed Wallace, James White, Quentin Richardson and Solomon Jones are all off the books come the offseason. And I'm pretty sure none are returning come 2013-2014.

The 4 players I want back (in order) are...

1.) J.R Smith.
2.) Chris Copeland.
3.) Pablo Prigioni.
4.) Kenyon Martin.

Is it possible we could bring all 4 back?

It was hard deciding between Copeland and Prigioni but due to youth and potential, I'm taking Copeland over the likes of Prigioni and Martin (although I love both). I say we draft a PF to develop in replace of Kenyon Martin. Even if we're able to keep Kenyon Martin I'd still like to draft an up and coming PF to develop behind Stoudemire and Martin.

If we could bring back J.R, Copeland, Prigioni and Martin? That'll be ideal heading into next season. As of right now I'm hoping both of Kidd and Camby retire. Won't save us any cap space but replacing them with younger talent such as J.R's brother (potentially) along with another Grunwald addition would have to be considered as an upgrade over Kidd/Camby (of this season).

[Knicks_Fan2]

Thought the only exception we have is the taxpayers mid level and not any biannual exception.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk 2

[Retired_Doc]

Good thread---very valuable!

[Knick-a-holic]

With recent talks about Kidd potentially calling it quits and retiring at season's end, how does that affect our cap? He will have 2 yrs remaining after this season.

[Knicks_Fan2]

With recent talks about Kidd potentially calling it quits and retiring at season's end, how does that affect our cap? He will have 2 yrs remaining after this season.

From Coon:

There's nothing binding about a player announcing his retirement. The player can still sign a new contract and continue playing (if he's not under contract), or return to his team (if he is still under contract) and resume his career.

The only exception to this is when a player is still under contract, wants to quit, and his team doesn't want to let him out of his contract. Under these circumstances the player can file for retirement with the league. The player is placed on the league's Voluntarily Retired list (see question number 77), forgoes his remaining salary, and cannot return to the league for one year. The latter requirement prevents players from using retirement as an underhanded way to change teams, and can be overridden with unanimous approval from all 30 teams. For example, guard Jason Williams signed with the LA Clippers in August 2008, then changed his mind the following month, announcing his retirement. He applied for reinstatement in early 2009, but his request was denied by a vote of 24-6. Williams later signed with the Orlando Magic once the one-year anniversary of his retirement announcement had passed.

***

Even if we do the latter and get his salary off the books, that's only a few million and will not make a difference in the next two years.