Isiahs comments make me think hell be here a few years

[DDV]

at least

talking about how he wont stop till he dies and how hell be here when we win a title

and then the postgame today talking about how he always talks to dolan after most games so i imagine theyre really close and i imagine dolans telling him hes safe no matter what..

im starting to think theres no way isiahs not back NEXT YEAR no matter what happens this year...

[Bill Bradley]

I wouldn't feel so bad about it if we weren't giving up an unprotected pick in a couple of years.

[Bill Bradley]

Scratch that. I forgot that Isiah will still make horrible trades and stuff.

[god shammgod]

i'm afriad you might be right. he sure sounds confident for someone who's supposedly on the firing line. he almost seems to be rubbing it in the fans and media's face that he's gonna be here. who knows though, maybe someone else within the knicks organization (mills?) convinces dolan to fire him. thats how layden was fired.

[DDV]

i'm afriad you might be right. he sure sounds confident for someone who's supposedly on the firing line. he almost seems to be rubbing it in the fans and media's face that he's gonna be here. who knows though, maybe someone else within the knicks organization (mills?) convinces dolan to fire him. thats how layden was fired.

thats another problem mills will never do that because hes the one who suggested isiah and if isiah goes he goes so nobody in the garden whos in dolans ear is going to tell him isiah needs to go becasue theyre attatched to the hip with him..

[mjhp911]

I feel you guys' pain. But that's why I look at things the way I do. You have to detach yourselves from the situation and look at it from a different perspective. Maybe not one of the owner's, but something similar. I keep trying analogies to illustrate it. Example, I want longer nights, so I can sleep more (or party more). Am I going to keep screaming about it until it happens? No, it's not going to do me any good. So let's go back to Dolan's situation, is he ever going to allow a full and total rebuild? No. So I'm going to stop trying to 'swim upstream' with this, because I know it's not going to happen. I just try to 'work' things within the parameters we have. I'll keep hoping Zeke gets the balance right one of these days, because I know there's more hope in that, rather than the no hope in wishing for a full and total rebuild. So we go full circle, I think Dolan still likes Zeke, so I'll just keep hoping we'll get the balance right, eventually. The alternative is to root for another team, but I just can't do that...

[mjhp911]

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thats another problem mills will never do that because hes the one who suggested isiah and if isiah goes he goes so nobody in the garden whos in dolans ear is going to tell him isiah needs to go becasue theyre attatched to the hip with him..

Supposedly, there are rumblings about Mills not being pleased with the situation. But Mills can no longer do anything about it because Dolan likes Zeke too much. So much so that if Mills tries to rock the boat too hardly, he might lose that power struggle with Zeke (if you can believe Zeke having even more power than he already does). Though I think it may have been Isola who started this Mills-Zeke tiff rumor, so it's probably bogus...

[Slimpack]

So let's go back to Dolan's situation, is he ever going to allow a full and total rebuild? No.

Really? I thought the official excuse of the season was that Isiah is tanking...

Anyway we don't need a full a total rebuild to be a good team. Just a competent General Manager. I doubt Isiah will figure out how to construct a team anytime soon because there's a lot of things he'd have to learn to do that. Learning that a good team needs balance on offense and defense is just a part of it, and so far Isiah seems not to have even learned that based on his starting lineups.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Serious, I was just thinking this same thing. All of Isiah's quotes seem to suggest that he is not going anywhere...he's like Freddy and will just keep coming back

But on the other hand, all of Isiah's quotes are also BS. None of them really happen. Like I never saw that steam c oming outta the garden. Whatever he says, the opposite usual happens. So maybe these quotes just mean the end is near. We can only hope....

[DDV]

, I think Dolan still likes Zeke.

to hope against hope he did like layden also

[Capn'O]

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Really? I thought the official excuse of the season was that Isiah is tanking...

MJ's not making excuses and they're certainly not new. He's been preaching the same line for years now. We disagree on a number of things but on this he's spot on. Short of actually staging a military coup, the only weapon we really have is apathy.

I cannot in earnest cheer for another team (funny how that's engrained) but my Knick fandom is essentially on hold right now until I see signs of sanity. I enjoy the league - which is back on the up and up imo - and don't really take the Knicks seriously or personally... certainly don't put any money into them.

[mjhp911]

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to hope against hope he did like layden also

Let me tell you the difference here. It's long and winded, but if you want the explanation, here it is. Layden was boring. I can't put it any plainer than that. But let's translate that to 'Dolan terms'. You know why he was really fired? Our waiting list, which had grown to over 5 years in it's heyday (maybe even closer to 7? To put it in perspective, the Giants have a waiting list of over 20 years... that's the time it takes to get your season tickets once you put your name on the waiting list), had dwindled to nothing towards the end of Layden's tenure. We had to start scrambling to sell seats by the time he was fired. Now Zeke hasn't always delivered a full house, but he's diversified our revenue streams. That 'failure of a player on the court' Marb has had his jersey in the top five of NBA sales in the past 3 years. MSG's cable revenue has never been better. There's a 'buzz' in the building, despite the failure in the standings. In short, Zeke hasn't been boring. Now I know that matters little to you, but it matters a lot to the owner. This summer, Zeke is probably going to add another lottery pick, and maybe even a guy like Artest (or whoever he can transform Marb's ending deal into). More buzz. Yes, some fans will be sick of it, so there's a finite life to Zeke's 'snake oil' charms. But still others will buy more season tickets, at least for one more year. After Zeke is gone, the next guy will try his luck. But I suspect the next guy will bring back Layden's formula, because spotting young talent isn't easy (it's easier to trade for brokedown 'names' making big money - a bigger splash). I don't think that's the way to go. I still think finding young talent is the only way we're getting out of this mess. So I continue to hope that we get the balance right one of these days. As I mentioned earlier, I think there's more hope in that, than hoping for a true and full rebuild.

[DDV]

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Let me tell you the difference here. It's long and winded, but if you want the explanation, here it is. Layden was boring. I can't put it any plainer than that. But let's translate that to 'Dolan terms'. You know why he was really fired? Our waiting list, which had grown to over 5 years in it's heyday (maybe even closer to 7? To put it in perspective, the Giants have a waiting list of over 20 years... that's the time it takes to get your season tickets once you put your name on the waiting list), had dwindled to nothing towards the end of Layden's tenure. We had to start scrambling to sell seats by the time he was fired. Now Zeke hasn't always delivered a full house, but he's diversified our revenue streams. That 'failure of a player on the court' Marb has had his jersey in the top five of NBA sales in the past 3 years. MSG's cable revenue has never been better. There's a 'buzz' in the building, despite the failure in the standings. In short, Zeke hasn't been boring. Now I know that matters little to you, but it matters a lot to the owner. This summer, Zeke is probably going to add another lottery pick, and maybe even a guy like Artest (or whoever he can transform Marb's ending deal into). More buzz. Yes, some fans will be sick of it, so there's a finite life to Zeke's 'snake oil' charms. But still others will buy more season tickets, at least for one more year. After Zeke is gone, the next guy will try his luck. But I suspect the next guy will bring back Layden's formula, because spotting young talent isn't easy (it's easier to trade for brokedown 'names' making big money - a bigger splash). I don't think that's the way to go. I still think finding young talent is the only way we're getting out of this mess. So I continue to hope that we get the balance right one of these days. As I mentioned earlier, I think there's more hope in that, than hoping for a true and full rebuild.

i know what youre saying and agree but in reality the knicks are such a small part of dolans profits..

i think it has some to do with what u say but also the fact that dolans a spoiled rich kid who doesnt want to admit hes ever wrong and doesnt wantt o seem like hes givign into fan or media pressure..

[Capn'O]

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Let me tell you the difference here. It's long and winded, but if you want the explanation, here it is. Layden was boring. I can't put it any plainer than that. But let's translate that to 'Dolan terms'. You know why he was really fired? Our waiting list, which had grown to over 5 years in it's heyday (maybe even closer to 7? To put it in perspective, the Giants have a waiting list of over 20 years... that's the time it takes to get your season tickets once you put your name on the waiting list), had dwindled to nothing towards the end of Layden's tenure. We had to start scrambling to sell seats by the time he was fired. Now Zeke hasn't always delivered a full house, but he's diversified our revenue streams. That 'failure of a player on the court' Marb has had his jersey in the top five of NBA sales in the past 3 years. MSG's cable revenue has never been better. There's a 'buzz' in the building, despite the failure in the standings. In short, Zeke hasn't been boring. Now I know that matters little to you, but it matters a lot to the owner. This summer, Zeke is probably going to add another lottery pick, and maybe even a guy like Artest (or whoever he can transform Marb's ending deal into). More buzz. Yes, some fans will be sick of it, so there's a finite life to Zeke's 'snake oil' charms. But still others will buy more season tickets, at least for one more year. After Zeke is gone, the next guy will try his luck. But I suspect the next guy will bring back Layden's formula, because spotting young talent isn't easy (it's easier to trade for brokedown 'names' making big money - a bigger splash). I don't think that's the way to go. I still think finding young talent is the only way we're getting out of this mess. So I continue to hope that we get the balance right one of these days. As I mentioned earlier, I think there's more hope in that, than hoping for a true and full rebuild.

Yup, that's the key to Dolan's "strategy" quote in my sig... I don't have anything to back this up but I suspect the constant media attention has been good for Cablevision as well. I didn't know who Dolan was under Layden. I think most sports fans in the country know about him and his company now...

That and OPPOSING teams' fans have never been more interested in us.

[Slimpack]

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Let me tell you the difference here....

Well, at least part of Layden's boringness was the mandate by Dolan to bring in high character guys, but he's backed off of that since.

But, If what you're saying is true than the Knicks are doomed. At least for a couple of years that is, But I don't think it true as of right now. Based on some of things he's said I think James Dolan seems to care about the Knicks being a good team to at least to some degree. He has talked about the Knick's goal being to eventually be a Championship team.

Unfortunately for me, I don't know how reliable that statement was.

I don't see any reason for Isiah to change his ways very much here in NY, If what you say is true because, if you think about it, Why should he? Win, Lose, or draw, Isiah wins because he still gets paid.

[mjhp911]

Well, at least part of Layden's boringness was the mandate by Dolan to bring in high character guys, but he's backed off of that since.

But, If what you're saying is true than the Knicks are doomed. At least for a couple of years that is, But I don't think it true as of right now. Based on some of things he's said I think James Dolan seems to care about the Knicks being a good team to at least to some degree. He has talked about the Knick's goal being to eventually be a Championship team.

Unfortunately for me, I don't know how reliable that statement was.

I don't see any reason for Isiah to change his ways very much here in NY, If what you say is true because, if you think about it, Why should he? Win, Lose, or draw, Isiah wins because he still gets paid.

Actually, I DO think Dolan wants to win as well. Of course he'd love a championship. But the caveat is, he wants to do it without a full and proper rebuild. It's the 2 to 3 years we'd need to suck to get to that place that he can't deal with. YES, we suck now. But few thought we'd be this bad going in. And I do think Zeke can still turn this thing around. I have no choice but to believe that, I'm a fan of the Knicks. I think there's more hope in believing in that, than there is in hoping Dolan will finally authorize a full and total rebuild.

[StutterStep]

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And I do think Zeke can still turn this thing around. I have no choice but to believe that, I'm a fan of the Knicks. I think there's more hope in believing in that, than there is in hoping Dolan will finally authorize a full and total rebuild.

In college one semester, my game (nickname) was "the stumbler" -- i fk'ed quite a few chicks by simply going to the bar and getting drunk, then stumbled into many episodes with chicks i had no intention of ever getting with...

[Mr. Natural]

Isiah Thomas = Glen Sather in Dolan's eye.

Dolan stuck with Sather through 5 years of losing with a team of underachieving grossly-overpaid "stars". Very similar to the current state of the Knicks today. Dolan expects Thomas to turn things around the same way Sather did, so expect Thomas to stay on for some time to come. Biggest difference though was Sather's teflon status was warranted seeing how he was the GM of arguably the greatest hockey team of all-time.

This is also why Dolan continually approves trades for old stars who had down years or are a cancer to their team and forcing a trade. This reason being is Sather picked up Jagr while he was having a terrible year, he came to the Rangers turned the team around during their forced rebuild year (because of lockout and hard cap being enforced) and won MVP.

[DDV]

Isiah Thomas = Glen Sather in Dolan's eye.

Dolan stuck with Sather through 5 years of losing with a team of underachieving grossly-overpaid "stars". Very similar to the current state of the Knicks today. Dolan expects Thomas to turn things around the same way Sather did, so expect Thomas to stay on for some time to come. Biggest difference though was Sather's teflon status was warranted seeing how he was the GM of arguably the greatest hockey team of all-time.

This is also why Dolan continually approves trades for old stars who had down years or are a cancer to their team and forcing a trade. This reason being is Sather picked up Jagr while he was having a terrible year, he came to the Rangers turned the team around during their forced rebuild year (because of lockout and hard cap being enforced) and won MVP.

the only reason he rangers turned it around was because hockey changed its rules and when to a soft cap

[GONYK]

I also think Isiah is safer than people want to admit. I am convinced that he has convinced Dolan that it's time to start the slow burn with this team, and start building through the draft. That makes his "inactive at the deadline" statement make more sense.

Like I said before, if Isiah's experience as coach has given Isiah the gM a new perspective on what it takes to be a winning team, hopefully he and Grunwald understand that it's time for a full rebuild. That is our only hope.