NBA Playoffs Thread (non-Magic games discussion)

[The-Stallion70]

Ant is 22
KAT is 28
Gobert is 31

They'll never all align at the peak of their powers. It's a suboptimal build. They'll contend because Ant is a superstar, but they'll always be leaving something on the table because their core's prime windows don't overlap.

This is why adding talent through trades and free agency for talents sake isn't always the right strategy. If possible, it's better to develop your core and align the windows when your core players will be in their primes, to maximize the build.

It's a luxury but if you can take it, take it.

Edit: another approach though is being a big market and building your core through free agency and trades. The John Gabriel approach, aka the skybox approach.

Ant is entering his prime already, this is his 4th season. And they are contending now, going toe to toe with the best team in the world after 20 years of insignificance. It's amazing that what you deduct is that they are doing something wrong. Maybe you go and tell Riley that adding an old Shaq to Wade was wrong. Or adding 30y old Jrue to the core of 25y old Giannis was mistake.

When Ant is in his prime years (25+), KAT will be 31 and Gobert 34. KAT isn't good enough now, how's he going to play at 31? Maybe Minny becomes Miami and allows them to re-tool around Ant on the fly?

Minnesota gave the max to Wiggins and not Jimmy Butler because of age. Butler stayed an all star and Wiggins didn't really get any better.

The concept of prime years isn't an exact science.

[eyriq]

Ant is entering his prime already, this is his 4th season. And they are contending now, going toe to toe with the best team in the world after 20 years of insignificance. It's amazing that what you deduct is that they are doing something wrong. Maybe you go and tell Riley that adding an old Shaq to Wade was wrong. Or adding 30y old Jrue to the core of 25y old Giannis was mistake.

When Ant is in his prime years (25+), KAT will be 31 and Gobert 34. KAT isn't good enough now, how's he going to play at 31? Maybe Minny becomes Miami and allows them to re-tool around Ant on the fly?

Minnesota gave the max to Wiggins and not Jimmy Butler because of age. Butler stayed an all star and Wiggins didn't really get any better.

The concept of prime years isn't an exact science.

Yeah, that's fair. It's hard to build through the draft, and markets like Minny don't have the tools to compete in free agency. If I was a Wolves fan I'd prefer the Weltman approach over Tim Connelly's. It's fair to say the Wolves have succeeded by going all in on Gobert and building the offense around KAT and Ant. It's just a suboptimal build.

[Knightro]

The whole "the windows of Minnesota's three best players don't line up and that's suboptimal!" thing is kind of goes out the window because they're capable of competing for the NBA title right now.

Like yeah it might be ugly/look a lot different when Ant is 25/26, but if they're a title contender for the next 3-4 years, who cares?

I think people get lost in this idea of having a 8-10 year window and generally speaking that's just not close to reality. You get like a 2-4 year window and then when that one is done you retool and try and create another 2-4 year window.

[eyriq]

The whole "the windows of Minnesota's three best players don't line up and that's suboptimal!" thing is kind of goes out the window because they're capable of competing for the NBA title right now.

Like yeah it might be ugly/look a lot different when Ant is 25/26, but if they're a title contender for the next 3-4 years, who cares?

I think people get lost in this idea of having a 8-10 year window and generally speaking that's just not close to reality. You get like a 2-4 year window and then when that one is done you retool and try and create another 2-4 year window.

Counterpoint 1: he's 25/26 and it's ugly. Does he request a trade?
Counterpoint 2: he's 22-24, are they ever favorites?

The point about windows is really getting at the heuristic that you need top 10, 20, and 50 players in your core to contend. Aligning primes of good players improves the odds of hitting this sweet spot.

[byeganyo]

Ant is 22
KAT is 28
Gobert is 31

They'll never all align at the peak of their powers. It's a suboptimal build. They'll contend because Ant is a superstar, but they'll always be leaving something on the table because their core's prime windows don't overlap.

This is why adding talent through trades and free agency for talents sake isn't always the right strategy. If possible, it's better to develop your core and align the windows when your core players will be in their primes, to maximize the build.

It's a luxury but if you can take it, take it.

Edit: another approach though is being a big market and building your core through free agency and trades. The John Gabriel approach, aka the skybox approach.

Ant is entering his prime already, this is his 4th season. And they are contending now, going toe to toe with the best team in the world after 20 years of insignificance. It's amazing that what you deduct is that they are doing something wrong. Maybe you go and tell Riley that adding an old Shaq to Wade was wrong. Or adding 30y old Jrue to the core of 25y old Giannis was mistake.

When Ant is in his prime years (25+), KAT will be 31 and Gobert 34. KAT isn't good enough now, how's he going to play at 31? Maybe Minny becomes Miami and allows them to re-tool around Ant on the fly?

Edit: another way of thinking about this is considering if we'd rather have Paolo and 4 other lotto talents on their rookie scale contracts or Paolo and a 27 year old all-star and a 30 year old defensive player of the year? Put the All-Star and DPOY wherever you want.

So, lets say Bamba, Paolo, Isaac, Herzonja, Fultz
VS
Gobert, Paolo, X, Donovan Mitchell, X

I dunno man, really...

[eyriq]

So, lets say Bamba, Paolo, Isaac, Herzonja, Fultz

LOL that's disgusting

[Optimus_Steel]

Man if Minny losses this series they will think all summer about the last 20 secs of the first half of game 4. That was disastrous.

[pepe1991]

The whole "the windows of Minnesota's three best players don't line up and that's suboptimal!" thing is kind of goes out the window because they're capable of competing for the NBA title right now.

Like yeah it might be ugly/look a lot different when Ant is 25/26, but if they're a title contender for the next 3-4 years, who cares?

I think people get lost in this idea of having a 8-10 year window and generally speaking that's just not close to reality. You get like a 2-4 year window and then when that one is done you retool and try and create another 2-4 year window.

Counterpoint 1: he's 25/26 and it's ugly. Does he request a trade?
Counterpoint 2: he's 22-24, are they ever favorites?

The point about windows is really getting at the heuristic that you need top 10, 20, and 50 players in your core to contend. Aligning primes of good players improves the odds of hitting this sweet spot.

Hypotetical.

You drafted top 3 pick and that guy is best player on a taem that makes playoffs and passes first round of playoffs.

Your leading scorer in playoffs is 24 years old guy ( former top 5 pick) .

Would you consider trading leading scorer at age of 24 for superstar who is 32 and on clear decline?

Spoiler:

It's not that hypotetical

[eyriq]

The whole "the windows of Minnesota's three best players don't line up and that's suboptimal!" thing is kind of goes out the window because they're capable of competing for the NBA title right now.

Like yeah it might be ugly/look a lot different when Ant is 25/26, but if they're a title contender for the next 3-4 years, who cares?

I think people get lost in this idea of having a 8-10 year window and generally speaking that's just not close to reality. You get like a 2-4 year window and then when that one is done you retool and try and create another 2-4 year window.

Counterpoint 1: he's 25/26 and it's ugly. Does he request a trade?
Counterpoint 2: he's 22-24, are they ever favorites?

The point about windows is really getting at the heuristic that you need top 10, 20, and 50 players in your core to contend. Aligning primes of good players improves the odds of hitting this sweet spot.

Hypotetical.

You drafted top 3 pick and that guy is best player on a taem that makes playoffs and passes first round of playoffs.

Your leading scorer in playoffs is 24 years old guy ( former top 5 pick) .

Would you consider trading leading scorer at age of 24 for superstar who is 32 and on clear decline?

Spoiler:

It's not that hypotetical

I wouldn't. *Opens spoiler*

Edit: I'm dying to know who you are alluding to

[eyriq]

Read on Twitter

?t=dOnTdwVy9EzA5_KabCo-6Q&s=19

[pepe1991]

Counterpoint 1: he's 25/26 and it's ugly. Does he request a trade?
Counterpoint 2: he's 22-24, are they ever favorites?

The point about windows is really getting at the heuristic that you need top 10, 20, and 50 players in your core to contend. Aligning primes of good players improves the odds of hitting this sweet spot.

Hypotetical.

You drafted top 3 pick and that guy is best player on a taem that makes playoffs and passes first round of playoffs.

Your leading scorer in playoffs is 24 years old guy ( former top 5 pick) .

Would you consider trading leading scorer at age of 24 for superstar who is 32 and on clear decline?

Spoiler:

It's not that hypotetical

I wouldn't. *Opens spoiler*

Edit: I'm dying to know who you are alluding to

Miami Heat 2004 summer.

Lost in second round with Wade as a rookie.
During that summer traded Odom ( 4th pick, finishing 5th year)
Caron Butler - 10th pick finishing second year
future first round pick ( turned into Jordan Farmer)

for Shaq.

2005 - Heat goes to ECF.
2005- Heat wins championship.

If we are being 100% honest, in past two years, Wolves are only team that actually challenged Nuggets. Last year Nuggets blew by everybody, this year they blew by Lakers, and here we are. Series still isn't over. Whoever survives West probably will be favorite to win championship. Especially if Celtics continue to play hot-cold and Porzingis isn't ready or 100% fit.

[eyriq]

Hypotetical.

You drafted top 3 pick and that guy is best player on a taem that makes playoffs and passes first round of playoffs.

Your leading scorer in playoffs is 24 years old guy ( former top 5 pick) .

Would you consider trading leading scorer at age of 24 for superstar who is 32 and on clear decline?

Spoiler:

It's not that hypotetical

I wouldn't. *Opens spoiler*

Edit: I'm dying to know who you are alluding to

Miami Heat 2004 summer.

Lost in second round with Wade as a rookie.
During that summer traded Odom ( 4th pick, finishing 5th year)
Caron Butler - 10th pick finishing second year
future first round pick ( turned into Jordan Farmer)

for Shaq.

2005 - Heat goes to ECF.
2005- Heat wins championship.

If we are being 100% honest, in past two years, Wolves are only team that actually challenged Nuggets. Last year Nuggets blew by everybody, this year they blew by Lakers, and here we are. Series still isn't over. Whoever survives West probably will be favorite to win championship. Especially if Celtics continue to play hot-cold and Porzingis isn't ready or 100% fit.

That's a nice counter example. It definitely shows that you can violate the "aligned primes" rule under special conditions.

1. A big market that allows you to re-tool on the fly
2. A trade target like Shaq that had been a league MVP with multiple championships already

Not for nothing, Odom was part of two titles himself.

[RookieStar]

Read on Twitter

?t=dOnTdwVy9EzA5_KabCo-6Q&s=19

Rudy slipped and hit KAT's crown jewels? Accidents do happen

[Optimus_Steel]

Boaton reminds me of the Booker/Paul/Ayton Suns that flamed out. They are sooooo beatable.

[Optimus_Steel]

Read on Twitter

?t=dOnTdwVy9EzA5_KabCo-6Q&s=19

Rudy slipped and hit KAT's crown jewels? Accidents do happen

Clown music. Also those last 20 secs of the 1st half….

[RookieStar]

Boaton reminds me of the Booker/Paul/Ayton Suns that flamed out. They are sooooo beatable.

Imagine if it was us rather than CLE facing them...

[RookieStar]

I forgot that OKC signed/traded for Hayward. Why????

[Optimus_Steel]

I forgot that OKC signed/traded for Hayward. Why????

Some veteran presence. They could at least try to get him involved.

[RookieStar]

I forgot that OKC signed/traded for Hayward. Why????

Some veteran presence. They could at least try to get him involved.

Does he even step foot on the floor?

[basketballRob]

OKC cleared a bunch of cap room by trading for Hayward. I think they have like $23m in space this summer, and they weren't going to have any before the trade.

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