Sweater Vest Thread #37: Magic 119 - Wizards 109

[Knightro]

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Season Standings (3-2-1 Scale)
Paolo Banchero - 62
Franz Wagner - 49
Jalen Suggs - 27
Cole Anthony - 18
Jonathan Isaac - 16
Moritz Wagner - 15
Goga Bitadze - 8
Wendell Carter - 6
Anthony Black - 6
Joe Ingles - 3
Gary Harris - 2
Caleb Houstan - 2
Chuma Okeke - 1
Markelle Fultz - 1

Vests
Paolo Banchero - 14 (at UTA, v. LAL, v. MIL, at CHI, v. WAS, v. DET, at IND, at DEN, v. ATL, v. MIA, at SAS, v. NYK, v. UTA, v. DET)
Franz Wagner - 8 (v. DEN, v. WAS, at WAS, v. NYK, at DET, v. SAS, v. CHI, v. BKN)
Jalen Suggs - 4 (at IND, v. TOR, v. CLE, at DET)
Cole Anthony - 4 (v. HOU, v. CHA, at NYK, at CHA)
Jonathan Isaac - 3 (at CHI, v. PHX, at MIN)
Moritz Wagner - 3 (at POR, v. BOS, at CLE)

Cummerbunds
Franz Wagner - 11 (at POR, at UTA, at CHI, v. CHA, v. WAS, v. DET, at IND, v. MIA, at SAS, at MIN, v. NYK)
Paolo Banchero - 8 (at IND, v. TOR, v. DEN, v. BOS, at NYK, at DET, v. SAS, at DET)
Jalen Suggs - 5 (v. MIL, v. WAS, v. NYK, at DEN, at UTA)
Anthony Black - 3 (v. LAL, at WAS, at CHA)
Goga Bitadze - 2 (at CHI, v. CLE)
Jonathan Isaac - 2 (v. HOU, v. CHI)
Moritz Wagner - 2 (v. PHX, v. BKN)
Caleb Houstan - 1 (v. ATL)
Cole Anthony - 1 (at CLE)
Wendell Carter Jr. - 1 (v. DET)

Mittens
Jalen Suggs - 5 (at POR, v. WAS, v. ATL, at DET, v. SAS)
Goga Bitadze - 4 (v. LAL, at IND, v. DET, v. NYK)
Cole Anthony - 4 (v. TOR, v. WAS, at DEN, v. CHI)
Wendell Carter Jr - 4 (at UTH, v. MIA, at MIN, v. BKN)
Paolo Banchero - 4 (v. CHA, at WAS, v. PHX, at CHA)
Franz Wagner - 3 (v. HOU, v. MIL, v. BOS)
Jonathan Isaac - 3 (at CHI, at SAS, v. NYK)
Joe Ingles - 3 (v. DEN, v. CLE, at CLE)
Gary Harris - 2 (at CHI, at IND)
Mortiz Wagner - 2 (at DET, v. UTA)
Chuma Okeke - 1 (at NYK)
Markelle Fultz - 1 (v. DET)

[eyriq]

Franz
Paulo
Jalen

[RichCollab]

Franz
Paolo
Suggs

[SOUL]

Paolo (feel like his passing down the stretch was huge)
Franz (broke out of his slump)
Suggs (beast)

Shoutout to Cole, Moe and AB as well.

[Residual-Heat]

Paolo
Franz
Suggs (almost went with Mo)

[msmoore66]

Franz|Paolo
Suggs

[Knightro]

Vest - Franz
Cummerbund - Banchero
Mittens - Suggs

Lollypops for Black, Cole and Moritz.

[dsg2021]

Vest - Paolo
The Point Guard in him is getting insane. He's also, still yet, the one you give the ball to when something needs to happen. When you need something, anything at all, to start happening for the team, Paolo's efficiency is actually much higher in this light. No one can stop this not-so-poor-man's version of LeBron James.

Cummerbund - Franz
I want such insanely efficient nights like these from Franz to the point that he battles Paolo for best player on the team again. We need this kind of, potentially more efficient 2nd Star, alongside Paolo. I want friction. And two max contracts that are underpays still.

Mittens - Suggs
It's insane how much of a 3 PT sniper he's becoming. With his incredible two way defense and energy. Sorry to Mo Wagner for missing it, but I do want Mo here for 6 seasons plus on 20 MPG. The sparkplug big off the bench!

[CocoaFan]

Franz
Paolo
Suggs
Shout out to AB, Cole and Moe too

[drsd]

Banchero for the vest, as he was key not only late, but also he was scoring at will to claw back out of the whole.
F-Wagner for cummerbund, obviously
M-Wagner for the mittens. He was the the shining-light off of the bench this game.

Suggs for a super-sized lollipop. And normal lollipops for Black, Anthony and Bitadze

[magik9113]

Suggs
Paolo
Franz

I voted Suggs. We were down 3 in the 4th around the 8 minute mark when he checked back in. I feel like this changed the entire game... He forced an immediate turnover on an inbound to Poole, then hit a deep contested three with the shot clock winding down to tie the game when we were coming up empty on a few possessions in a row. Then we dominated.

But really all 5 who were in during that stretch were great..Paolo Franz Suggs Cole and Mo

[eyriq]

Shout-out to AB, should have finished the game. 176 offensive rating on 10.4% usage, led the team in box score+- (BPM) at 9.1.

Closing with Cole and Moe is pure politics.

[magik9113]

Shout-out to AB, should have finished the game. 176 offensive rating on 10.4% usage, led the team in box score+- (BPM) at 9.1.

Closing with Cole and Moe is pure politics.

I love AB too but didn't Moe score like 10 points in a row in the 4th? Cole played well also. Hard to argue with coach's decisions after how well the second half of the 4th went

[Knightro]

Shout-out to AB, should have finished the game. 176 offensive rating on 10.4% usage, led the team in box score+- (BPM) at 9.1.

Closing with Cole and Moe is pure politics.

Cole and Moritz played well, so I'm not killing Mosley for that.

[JoshuaPotter]

I vote Franz, begrudgingly.

Paolo assists stateline probably gives him the vest any other day. Just something about scoring when you need to. Probably an argument to why Suggs gets the cummerbund.

Franz
Suggs
Paolo

Paolo also qualify's for lollipops and any other items that AB, Cole receive.

[eyriq]

Shout-out to AB, should have finished the game. 176 offensive rating on 10.4% usage, led the team in box score+- (BPM) at 9.1.

Closing with Cole and Moe is pure politics.

Cole and Moritz played well, so I'm not killing Mosley for that.

Cole didn't earn it even though it worked out. AB earned it and got snubbed.

Mosley has sold Cole and Moe on not getting starting minutes by telling them they are maintaining continuity with the bench and are closers in scenarios where starters are out. He's not handling these rotations on merit.

[SOUL]

Shout-out to AB, should have finished the game. 176 offensive rating on 10.4% usage, led the team in box score+- (BPM) at 9.1.

Closing with Cole and Moe is pure politics.

Please don't be this kind of player fan, eyriq. I like you.

Goga was fine but was getting abused on switches and has no self-starting offense at all. Had stout defense in the 3rd for a bit, but was quiet in the 1st. We needed an offensive punch which Moe brought in the 4th after a bad 1st half from him.

Both him and Cole scored 21 of our 35 points in the 4th, and we needed all of those. I'll take those politics all day. (Also, they're both averaging way lower MPG than last year - so I don't see any favoritism here.)

Sometimes it's literally just archetype of player needed on the floor rather than anything else. When we need a connector/prevent sort of play, I think AB would've played more because of his size and ability to defend and play team ball. When we need more dynamic scoring on the court, Cole plays. When we need to clamp and disrupt, Suggs comes back on the floor. Fultz plays sometimes when everyone else feels like they can't run the team or pace it correctly.

We needed to take advantage of their weak defense and paint protection in the 4th. Cole drives hard and makes stuff happen with aggressive play, Moe is a bully-ball disruptive offensive player. AB's threes are nice and one of the biggest steps forward for his game, but just waiting in the corner for threes was probably going to be pretty low on the "offense we'd love to aim for" in a back and forth game until a few minutes left.

I think you'll see AB really start to blossom without Fultz and Ingles playing next year. getting a lot more trust in the offense. He's showing how trustworthy his shooting has been by working so hard on it, but I do think his on-ball handles and strength is something that will come from another season of strength and conditioning & training. I think some of him being "passive" is just him not being able to take a lot of guys off the dribble yet because he can get pushed around.

[eyriq]

Shout-out to AB, should have finished the game. 176 offensive rating on 10.4% usage, led the team in box score+- (BPM) at 9.1.

Closing with Cole and Moe is pure politics.

Please don't be this kind of player fan, eyriq. I like you.

Goga was fine but was getting abused on switches and has no self-starting offense at all. Had stout defense in the 3rd for a bit, but was quiet in the 1st. We needed an offensive punch which Moe brought in the 4th after a bad 1st half from him.

Both him and Cole scored 21 of our 35 points in the 4th, and we needed all of those. I'll take those politics all day. (Also, they're both averaging way lower MPG than last year - so I don't see any favoritism here.)

Sometimes it's literally just archetype of player needed on the floor rather than anything else. When we need a connector/prevent sort of play, I think AB would've played more because of his size and ability to defend and play team ball. When we need more dynamic scoring on the court, Cole plays. When we need to clamp and disrupt, Suggs comes back on the floor. Fultz plays sometimes when everyone else feels like they can't run the team or pace it correctly.

We needed to take advantage of their weak defense and paint protection in the 4th. Cole drives hard and makes stuff happen with aggressive play, Moe is a bully-ball disruptive offensive player. AB's threes are nice and one of the biggest steps forward for his game, but just waiting in the corner for threes was probably going to be pretty low on the "offense we'd love to aim for" in a back and forth game until a few minutes left.

I don't actually think highlighting the politics involved is a knock on Mosley. I've wondered how he's maintaining chemistry on a team without a salary driven hierarchy to lean on. He's handled it well, but it's resulted in artificial suppression of AB and Jett. They aren't getting a fair shake because Mosley is walking a tightrope.

[Bergmaniac]

Franz gets the vest for me, he was really solid on both ends. Paolo's playmaking was nice but defensively he struggled quite a bit for large portions of the game. Suggs was really good defensively and solid offensively, so Paolo gets dropped to third in my ranking.

[SOUL]

I don't actually think highlighting the politics involved is a knock on Mosley. I've wondered how he's maintaining chemistry on a team without a salary driven hierarchy to lean on. He's handled it well, but it's resulted in artificial suppression of AB and Jett. They aren't getting a fair shake because Mosley is walking a tightrope.

This wasn't really about Mose or a perceived knock, I am just confused because it feels like you are overly invested (to the point that it's secondary to team success, getting playoff experience for our stars) in the immediate success of two rookies that nobody really knew much about until summer league, who had modest/low playing time expectations on a team full of young guys and players who would be playing over them because they were drafted higher, and quite frankly, seem to have higher ceilings. AB can project to be our 3rd/4th best guy probably, Jett who knows.

It would kind of be the equivalent of Pacers fans wanting not wanting to care about winning this season, pushing back any sort of Haliburton-Siakam-Mathurin timeline and winning, but making sure Jarace Walker and Ben Sheppard got as many reps as possible to maybe become the 3rd/4th/5th best players on the team in a few years.

I really do love AB, and it's funny that people call me a "hater" because I am point out the growing pains teams experience that invest fully in youth. In an ideal world, he gets all of Fultz' minutes moving forward, but he's also not always the best option out there on the court, and that's not a knock on his potential or current play. He's simply as hot and cold as most of our guard options when it comes to what coach is looking for in certain moments.

Anyway, this is a discussion more for another thread lol.