Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 4.0

[Knightro]

I'd sign Suggs because his cap hold is $27m next season.

In that scenario, we'd sign 1 or 2 players to big 1 year contracts with a team option for year 2. We may even find a trade partner during the season like Indiana did with Pascal. If we didn't find a trade, we'd have cap space again. I just think this FA class is weak.

And what if the players who could help the Magic next season simply say no to signing 1+1 contracts?

[fendilim]

If my math is correct, smart signed a 4/77 when cap was 112 in 2021. 16.9% of the cap.

Equivalent to 23.8m next year as cap is project as 141m.

[Knightro]

If my math is correct, smart signed a 4/77 when cap was 112 in 2021. 16.9% of the cap.

Equivalent to 23.8m next year as cap is project as 141m.

That was Smart's 3rd contract, not his 2nd, but your percentages are correct.

But Suggs' contract would also not begin until the 2025-2026 season, so it would be on a 155M cap.

So 16.9% of the cap on 155M would be $26.2M.

[pepe1991]

If Franz will accept slightly less than his max, that would be great for the Magic. Every dollar saved is ultimately helpful for their pursuit of other players down the road.

But if some of you folks actually think he's gonna take something like $25M, you're setting yourself up for a world of disappointment.

It's not only Marks saying he shouldn't get the max. I heard Simmons and Russilo saying it today. I've also heard it from others. Franz is limited because he only made 28% of all jump shots. He's not going to be a future all-star unless he can get that up to 38-40%. Franz currently isn't a second and maybe not a third option on a championship team. Russilo and Simmons think he's a 4th option.

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People are going to over index value into Paolo now that the narrative has shifted to him being a superstar. They are all wrong, Franz is right there with Paolo in terms of value. I've always said Paolo was better because he can handle high usage and drive an offense, but Franz isn't far behind Paolo offensively and is magnitudes better on defense.

Paolo also gets favorable calls that Franz simply does not.

Franz in layup line is being smacked in a head without call, on other side, they are doing review of Banchero pullup 2 call where Paolo elbows Okoro in hand, makes all the contact, isn't even being touched in air, has clean landing and refs are like " nah, clean foul, he was existing to close to allstar ".


There is also massive disconnect with fans here who should be getting max contracts ( only best players) and who actually gets max contracts ( pretty much vast majority of top 50 players have max contracts or near max contract).

Just some random names and their salary today:
Jeremy Grant $28M
Jordan Poole $27M
Hayward $31M
Cam Johnson $25M
Ayton $32M
Garland $34M
McCullum $35M

Non of them is better than Franz. List goes on ,it's just most obvious examples of playing mediocrities who got payed based on something they did at some point of their careers.


This is why i always b**** about nba setting small market, "organic growth" teams over a hill, small teams know they can't get big time FA, and it forces them into crazy resigns of good players, and after one contract cycle due non existing cap space, it forces them into resign of even worst players because they can't afford anybody else.

Memphis Grizzlies are best example, they have great young core to win 60 games, but they don't have enough talent to win it all. But due contract structure they are paying $96M to Morant, Bane & JJjr. Their desparation mode got them Smart and his $21M, basically whole salary is dried into 4 players, rest of a team is just draft stock resigned or on rookie deals ( and once again, if they gonna keep them ,they need to overpay them ).

[Ducklett]

It's not only Marks saying he shouldn't get the max. I heard Simmons and Russilo saying it today. I've also heard it from others. Franz is limited because he only made 28% of all jump shots. He's not going to be a future all-star unless he can get that up to 38-40%. Franz currently isn't a second and maybe not a third option on a championship team. Russilo and Simmons think he's a 4th option.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM Forums mobile app

People are going to over index value into Paolo now that the narrative has shifted to him being a superstar. They are all wrong, Franz is right there with Paolo in terms of value. I've always said Paolo was better because he can handle high usage and drive an offense, but Franz isn't far behind Paolo offensively and is magnitudes better on defense.

Paolo also gets favorable calls that Franz simply does not.

Franz in layup line is being smacked in a head without call, on other side, they are doing review of Banchero pullup 2 call where Paolo elbows Okoro in hand, makes all the contact, isn't even being touched in air, has clean landing and refs are like " nah, clean foul, he was existing to close to allstar ".


There is also massive disconnect with fans here who should be getting max contracts ( only best players) and who actually gets max contracts ( pretty much vast majority of top 50 players have max contracts or near max contract).

Just some random names and their salary today:
Jeremy Grant $28M
Jordan Poole $27M
Hayward $31M
Cam Johnson $25M
Ayton $32M
Garland $34M
McCullum $35M

Non of them is better than Franz. List goes on ,it's just most obvious examples of playing mediocrities who got payed based on something they did at some point of their careers.


This is why i always b**** about nba setting small market, "organic growth" teams over a hill, small teams know they can't get big time FA, and it forces them into crazy resigns of good players, and after one contract cycle due non existing cap space, it forces them into resign of even worst players because they can't afford anybody else.

Memphis Grizzlies are best example, they have great young core to win 60 games, but they don't have enough talent to win it all. But due contract structure they are paying $96M to Morant, Bane & JJjr. Their desparation mode got them Smart and his $21M, basically whole salary is dried into 4 players, rest of a team is just draft stock resigned or on rookie deals ( and once again, if they gonna keep them ,they need to overpay them ).

Well said on the officiating on Franz.

[fendilim]

It's not only Marks saying he shouldn't get the max. I heard Simmons and Russilo saying it today. I've also heard it from others. Franz is limited because he only made 28% of all jump shots. He's not going to be a future all-star unless he can get that up to 38-40%. Franz currently isn't a second and maybe not a third option on a championship team. Russilo and Simmons think he's a 4th option.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM Forums mobile app

People are going to over index value into Paolo now that the narrative has shifted to him being a superstar. They are all wrong, Franz is right there with Paolo in terms of value. I've always said Paolo was better because he can handle high usage and drive an offense, but Franz isn't far behind Paolo offensively and is magnitudes better on defense.

Paolo also gets favorable calls that Franz simply does not.

Franz in layup line is being smacked in a head without call, on other side, they are doing review of Banchero pullup 2 call where Paolo elbows Okoro in hand, makes all the contact, isn't even being touched in air, has clean landing and refs are like " nah, clean foul, he was existing to close to allstar ".


There is also massive disconnect with fans here who should be getting max contracts ( only best players) and who actually gets max contracts ( pretty much vast majority of top 50 players have max contracts or near max contract).

Just some random names and their salary today:
Jeremy Grant $28M
Jordan Poole $27M
Hayward $31M
Cam Johnson $25M
Ayton $32M
Garland $34M
McCullum $35M

Non of them is better than Franz. List goes on ,it's just most obvious examples of playing mediocrities who got payed based on something they did at some point of their careers.


This is why i always b**** about nba setting small market, "organic growth" teams over a hill, small teams know they can't get big time FA, and it forces them into crazy resigns of good players, and after one contract cycle due non existing cap space, it forces them into resign of even worst players because they can't afford anybody else.

Memphis Grizzlies are best example, they have great young core to win 60 games, but they don't have enough talent to win it all. But due contract structure they are paying $96M to Morant, Bane & JJjr. Their desparation mode got them Smart and his $21M, basically whole salary is dried into 4 players, rest of a team is just draft stock resigned or on rookie deals ( and once again, if they gonna keep them ,they need to overpay them ).

The point really is how much do we pay for him? And does he justifiably desrve the max?

Most of the players you mentioned actually have an albatross of a contract.

[pepe1991]

People are going to over index value into Paolo now that the narrative has shifted to him being a superstar. They are all wrong, Franz is right there with Paolo in terms of value. I've always said Paolo was better because he can handle high usage and drive an offense, but Franz isn't far behind Paolo offensively and is magnitudes better on defense.

Paolo also gets favorable calls that Franz simply does not.

Franz in layup line is being smacked in a head without call, on other side, they are doing review of Banchero pullup 2 call where Paolo elbows Okoro in hand, makes all the contact, isn't even being touched in air, has clean landing and refs are like " nah, clean foul, he was existing to close to allstar ".


There is also massive disconnect with fans here who should be getting max contracts ( only best players) and who actually gets max contracts ( pretty much vast majority of top 50 players have max contracts or near max contract).

Just some random names and their salary today:
Jeremy Grant $28M
Jordan Poole $27M
Hayward $31M
Cam Johnson $25M
Ayton $32M
Garland $34M
McCullum $35M

Non of them is better than Franz. List goes on ,it's just most obvious examples of playing mediocrities who got payed based on something they did at some point of their careers.


This is why i always b**** about nba setting small market, "organic growth" teams over a hill, small teams know they can't get big time FA, and it forces them into crazy resigns of good players, and after one contract cycle due non existing cap space, it forces them into resign of even worst players because they can't afford anybody else.

Memphis Grizzlies are best example, they have great young core to win 60 games, but they don't have enough talent to win it all. But due contract structure they are paying $96M to Morant, Bane & JJjr. Their desparation mode got them Smart and his $21M, basically whole salary is dried into 4 players, rest of a team is just draft stock resigned or on rookie deals ( and once again, if they gonna keep them ,they need to overpay them ).

The point really is how much do we pay for him? And does he justifiably desrve the max?

Most of the players you mentioned actually have an albatross of a contract.

Again, it's not what you "deserve" it's about what somebody else is willing to pay.
You play hardball with him, lowblow offer, he takes qualifing offer , bets on himself and walks for nothing , than what?

Even if he hits restricted FA, nothing stops team like Pistons or Hornets to dump max offer and he'll end up being on Magic, just with worst relationship with front office.

At the end of a day he is 20-5-4 player at age of 22 on 57,5% TS.

He had playoff game 7 stinker. What's there to say? So did Garland, as allstar, so did Suggs.



We didn't lost series just because Franz sucked in game 7. There were several deciding factors, Suggs shot 2-13 in game 7, how many people brought up ? Nobody? Matter of fact Suggs shot 22% for 3 in 6 out of 7 games he played and only in game 6 was actually reliable as shooter ( and knocked down 6-13) cumulative sub 30% for 3 in a series. Goes under a radar that Banchero was not point forward and averaged way more turnovers than assists. Goes under a radar Isaac was mediocre role player as highest payed player, goes under a radar Gary Harris averaged 4 points as starter on 28% FG.
Goes under a radar that Fultz + Isaac + Mortiz combined for 13 assists in 7 games.

Goes to show you that our offense was bad all together and we had no fluidity, nor anybody was making extra passes, and Franz was leading assist man on a Magic, not Banchero, who is being sold as "point forward" but Franz.


It's just what it is. If Franz and his agent belive he is max contract guy, he will get max from Orlando or some other team. Because 6'10 athletic wings who can score 20 a game and are sub age of 25 are always on high demand.

[fendilim]

Paolo also gets favorable calls that Franz simply does not.

Franz in layup line is being smacked in a head without call, on other side, they are doing review of Banchero pullup 2 call where Paolo elbows Okoro in hand, makes all the contact, isn't even being touched in air, has clean landing and refs are like " nah, clean foul, he was existing to close to allstar ".


There is also massive disconnect with fans here who should be getting max contracts ( only best players) and who actually gets max contracts ( pretty much vast majority of top 50 players have max contracts or near max contract).

Just some random names and their salary today:
Jeremy Grant $28M
Jordan Poole $27M
Hayward $31M
Cam Johnson $25M
Ayton $32M
Garland $34M
McCullum $35M

Non of them is better than Franz. List goes on ,it's just most obvious examples of playing mediocrities who got payed based on something they did at some point of their careers.


This is why i always b**** about nba setting small market, "organic growth" teams over a hill, small teams know they can't get big time FA, and it forces them into crazy resigns of good players, and after one contract cycle due non existing cap space, it forces them into resign of even worst players because they can't afford anybody else.

Memphis Grizzlies are best example, they have great young core to win 60 games, but they don't have enough talent to win it all. But due contract structure they are paying $96M to Morant, Bane & JJjr. Their desparation mode got them Smart and his $21M, basically whole salary is dried into 4 players, rest of a team is just draft stock resigned or on rookie deals ( and once again, if they gonna keep them ,they need to overpay them ).

The point really is how much do we pay for him? And does he justifiably desrve the max?

Most of the players you mentioned actually have an albatross of a contract.

Again, it's not what you "deserve" it's about what somebody else is willing to pay.
You play hardball with him, lowblow offer, he takes qualifing offer , bets on himself and walks for nothing , than what?

Even if he hits restricted FA, nothing stops team like Pistons or Hornets to dump max offer and he'll end up being on Magic, just with worst relationship with front office.

At the end of a day he is 20-5-4 player at age of 22 on 57,5% TS.

He had playoff game 7 stinker. What's there to say? So did Garland, as allstar, so did Suggs.



We didn't lost series just because Franz sucked in game 7. There were several deciding factors, Suggs shot 2-13 in game 7, how many people brought up ? Nobody? Matter of fact Suggs shot 22% for 3 in 6 out of 7 games he played and only in game 6 was actually reliable as shooter ( and knocked down 6-13) cumulative sub 30% for 3 in a series. Goes under a radar that Banchero was not point forward and averaged way more turnovers than assists. Goes under a radar Isaac was mediocre role player as highest payed player, goes under a radar Gary Harris averaged 4 points as starter on 28% FG.
Goes under a radar that Fultz + Isaac + Mortiz combined for 13 assists in 7 games.

Goes to show you that our offense was bad all together and we had no fluidity, nor anybody was making extra passes, and Franz was leading assist man on a Magic, not Banchero, who is being sold as "point forward" but Franz.


It's just what it is. If Franz and his agent belive he is max contract guy, he will get max from Orlando or some other team. Because 6'10 athletic wings who can score 20 a game and are sub age of 25 are always on high demand.

lol first and foremost, theres no qualifying offer here cause he is stull under contract until next year.

The Magic will gave to pay to retain Franz, no doubt. They just have to try and avoid paying the max.

[axl_c_cool]

What would the deal be to get Murray?

Is Isaac + 3 FRP (including Denver’s) to little? If not for who?

I saw Black suggested, would much rather keep him


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[Redick07]

What would the deal be to get Murray?

Is Isaac + 3 FRP (including Denver’s) to little? If not for who?

I saw Black suggested, would much rather keep him


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I will package WCJ, Cole, Jett and 3FRPs(24, 25DN and 26) For DJM. Then sign IHart from FA.

[byeganyo]

Paolo also gets favorable calls that Franz simply does not.

Franz in layup line is being smacked in a head without call, on other side, they are doing review of Banchero pullup 2 call where Paolo elbows Okoro in hand, makes all the contact, isn't even being touched in air, has clean landing and refs are like " nah, clean foul, he was existing to close to allstar ".


There is also massive disconnect with fans here who should be getting max contracts ( only best players) and who actually gets max contracts ( pretty much vast majority of top 50 players have max contracts or near max contract).

Just some random names and their salary today:
Jeremy Grant $28M
Jordan Poole $27M
Hayward $31M
Cam Johnson $25M
Ayton $32M
Garland $34M
McCullum $35M

Non of them is better than Franz. List goes on ,it's just most obvious examples of playing mediocrities who got payed based on something they did at some point of their careers.


This is why i always b**** about nba setting small market, "organic growth" teams over a hill, small teams know they can't get big time FA, and it forces them into crazy resigns of good players, and after one contract cycle due non existing cap space, it forces them into resign of even worst players because they can't afford anybody else.

Memphis Grizzlies are best example, they have great young core to win 60 games, but they don't have enough talent to win it all. But due contract structure they are paying $96M to Morant, Bane & JJjr. Their desparation mode got them Smart and his $21M, basically whole salary is dried into 4 players, rest of a team is just draft stock resigned or on rookie deals ( and once again, if they gonna keep them ,they need to overpay them ).

The point really is how much do we pay for him? And does he justifiably desrve the max?

Most of the players you mentioned actually have an albatross of a contract.

Again, it's not what you "deserve" it's about what somebody else is willing to pay.
You play hardball with him, lowblow offer, he takes qualifing offer , bets on himself and walks for nothing , than what?

Even if he hits restricted FA, nothing stops team like Pistons or Hornets to dump max offer and he'll end up being on Magic, just with worst relationship with front office.

At the end of a day he is 20-5-4 player at age of 22 on 57,5% TS.

He had playoff game 7 stinker. What's there to say? So did Garland, as allstar, so did Suggs.



We didn't lost series just because Franz sucked in game 7. There were several deciding factors, Suggs shot 2-13 in game 7, how many people brought up ? Nobody? Matter of fact Suggs shot 22% for 3 in 6 out of 7 games he played and only in game 6 was actually reliable as shooter ( and knocked down 6-13) cumulative sub 30% for 3 in a series. Goes under a radar that Banchero was not point forward and averaged way more turnovers than assists. Goes under a radar Isaac was mediocre role player as highest payed player, goes under a radar Gary Harris averaged 4 points as starter on 28% FG.
Goes under a radar that Fultz + Isaac + Mortiz combined for 13 assists in 7 games.

Goes to show you that our offense was bad all together and we had no fluidity, nor anybody was making extra passes, and Franz was leading assist man on a Magic, not Banchero, who is being sold as "point forward" but Franz.


It's just what it is. If Franz and his agent belive he is max contract guy, he will get max from Orlando or some other team. Because 6'10 athletic wings who can score 20 a game and are sub age of 25 are always on high demand.

It's about the pecking order and that line from spiderman, if we are to treat Franz as a star/2nd option, he'll have to take most of the blame, because this was a historical stinker, i mean McDanields ended up with zero points against Denver, does anyone from Minnesota care - nope, because they won and they won, because their leading players delivered. Knicks got 5 pts total from their bench in game 6 - they won, nobody is discussing if Mcbbride could have helped more.
The blame should start from the top. And Franz had a poor game 5, came back to Cleveland and played even worse, we lost.
So, yep, we could have won even with him sucking, but it was unlikely and its unfair to deflect the blame to the 9th man in the rotation. What is fair is to ask if he isnt given too big of a role.

Of course non of it means Franz is not getting a max or very near max contract.

[SOUL]

1 game is not defining Franz's value, especially in a playoffs series that wasn't even predicted to be probable before the season by our fans, let alone outsiders.

[The-Stallion70]

1 game is not defining Franz's value, especially in a playoffs series that wasn't even predicted to be probable before the season by our fans, let alone outsiders.

Not sure about just the last game but I think the contract extension he gets will be impacted by his horrible showing in the playoffs.

1-15 in a game 7 is not what you want to see from a guy you were considering giving a max contract to.

And going 3-11 and 5-17 is also not what you want to see.

I think Franz will be offered a nine figure contract but I think the Magic will deliberate hard about committing a max contract to a player you question if he can deliver offensively in the playoffs, since his offensive performance is something he is being relied upon to do.

When you go 1-15 in a pivotal game 7 to me that seems like they gameplanned against you and found the correct strategy for defending you that will now will be replicated across the league when defending Franz. A real star player probably can't be game planned against and have the result be that effective.

Of course he is so young and I believe he can improve I do not doubt that but as far as his first contract extension I think it will be impacted by this.

[Bergmaniac]

Franz was a solid 3 point shooter in his first 2 seasons and in his last year of college, chances are his shooting struggles this year are an aberration and he will be much better at this in the future because I can't think of any examples of a player permanently losing his 3 point shot after being solid at it in his first seasons without a significant injury.

[RichCollab]

I’m not playing around with Franz’s contract. I’m treating him as the 2nd piece of this team as that what he currently is. I’m respecting him.

He needs to improve and I have zero doubts he will give his all. He plays like 95% of the games a year.

He had to keep taking shots as there was no one else stepping up to help Paolo. It’s actually a good sign he didn’t just stop.

Franz is out 3rd best defender at least. Given how much he plays his defense may be top 2 impact.

Franz is a complete stand up guy and can perform on the big stage look at FIBA.

[pepe1991]

Franz was a solid 3 point shooter in his first 2 seasons and in his last year of college, chances are his shooting struggles this year are an aberration and he will be much better at this in the future because I can't think of any examples of a player permanently losing his 3 point shot after being solid at it in his first seasons without a significant injury.

Franz will probably cap out being some 34-35% career three point shooter, that's his average for 2 years at college + 2 nba seasons.

Imo this season is outliner. I don't know why he reworked his shot given his shot looks worst now than it looked before.

[axl_c_cool]

What would the deal be to get Murray?

Is Isaac + 3 FRP (including Denver’s) to little? If not for who?

I saw Black suggested, would much rather keep him


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I will package WCJ, Cole, Jett and 3FRPs(24, 25DN and 26) For DJM. Then sign IHart from FA.

Take out Jett, and a second, and I’d do that deal


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[basketballRob]

Franz isn't going to get the max because he couldn't shoot outside the paint this year, and his game was too easy to predict. He hasn't shown that he can be the second best player of a team that can contend.

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[SOUL]

When you go 1-15 in a pivotal game 7 to me that seems like they gameplanned against you and found the correct strategy for defending you that will now will be replicated across the league when defending Franz. A real star player probably can't be game planned against and have the result be that effective.

Of course he is so young and I believe he can improve I do not doubt that but as far as his first contract extension I think it will be impacted by this.

Read on Twitter

If he's not paid that much it's because they're bullish on his play against tougher defenses and three point percentage for an entire season, not a 2/7 game sample size of really bad playoff play on offense. To be clear, I'm arguing the merits of the statement that they're deciding to max him or not based on a few bad shooting nights, versus them completely feeling vindicated if he went... 4-15 or 5-12 or something in those games instead. Not arguing my personal thoughts, because if I'm being "fair", I think very few players deserve "max", or rather, enough cap that it makes it really difficult to flesh out the rest of the team around them.

It's in a similar vein of scouting and drafting or not drafting players because of strong/weak showings in the NCAA tournament. Or overperforming in a playoff series. Cough... Bismack Biyombo. Timofey Mozgov. Jerome James. Luckily, NBA people have learned not to overreact to these very small sample sizes anymore.

And what about guys who aren't even projected to make the playoffs necessarily but their teams need to retain the talent? Detroit should just lose Cade Cunningham, even though he has no playoff series to debate the merits of? Sengun? A rookie year Scottie Barnes that shot 42/16? What happens to these guys in terms of value? You have to go off regular season stuff, so if you're saying Franz doesn't deserve it, that's pretty much implying you think those other guys are better in the regular season stuff. Projecting them for playoff play isn't realistic because they can either be great or suck.. or both like Franz.

I guarantee you that a series that featured both 26 and 34 point showings and 6 and 14 point showings aren't the catalyst for these decisions.

[SOUL]

Franz isn't going to get the max because he couldn't shoot outside the paint this year, and his game was too easy to predict. He hasn't shown that he can be the second best player of a team that can contend.

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I can agree with the premise of maxing or not in terms of it being an entire year decision, not 2-3 playoff games.