RealGM

I'm going to be honest even with the 'nice' regular season and #5 seed, I question the long term ceiling of this bunch if this franz/paolo/suggs/JI group is the 'core'.

A lot of times fans have a tendency to assume a progression that....well, just doesn't always happen.

To me this 2023/24 Magic team always felt like a pretty young team that was having a nice season but just doesn't have a real high ceiling.

Just because you have a season with improvement doesn't mean it's the start of continued upward trajectory. Sometimes that 'nice' season is just the best you're going to do. That's very much how the Toronto raptors felt in 2021 for example when they got that #5 seed too. The upward progression didn't happen....instead that was "as good as it sas going to get".

And then these two really abysmal games to open the playoffs cement that feeling. And let's face it this is a nothing special cavs team. The difference between them and a team like this years celtics may as well be the difference between 1993 michael jordan and wizards michael jordan.

And it's not so much that they are losing badly in these games....it's *how* they are losing. This just doesn't look like a team with much of a ceiling. Even with some of their key guys being relatively early in their careers.

The problem for the magic right now is they are probably going to go 'all in' long term on this core. And knowing that they are going all in and committing several years into the future on a core that I don't believe has enough ceiling to get *anywhere near* being elite would be depressing. You can rationalize it by saying "well if we won this many games this year and paolo is just in year 2 and if he progresses and we improve by this much each of the next two years, maybe we can win this many games in......" No, just stop. That's fantasy. Forget the win total and just look at the roster, and the ceiling of those guys going forward, and then look at what we've seen on the court these two games........

this is *not* a team with any ceiling at all going forward.

I'd rather be 20-62 without any core and able to dream about a fantasy future with a bunch of players to dream about than a situation like this- where you know you aren't going to likely suck but also are setting yourself up to not be good enough for many years in the future. To in fact never be good enough with this bunch.

People who make fun of fans who fawn over the limitless future potential of blank slate rebuilds have a point......but the other side of the coin is this going forward, and thats no place to be either.

Brah, did you have this take ready to go? We have 2 guys that couldn't drink last year, leading us. Relax a little.

We dreamed of a future for 10+ years after Dwight...

We just found out who our core is... it's on the FO to fill out the roster with winning players around them now.

tacosman wrote:I'm going to be honest even with the 'nice' regular season and #5 seed, I question the long term ceiling of this bunch if this franz/paolo/suggs/JI group is the 'core'.

A lot of times fans have a tendency to assume a progression that....well, just doesn't always happen.

To me this 2023/24 Magic team always felt like a pretty young team that was having a nice season but just doesn't have a real high ceiling.

Just because you have a season with improvement doesn't mean it's the start of continued upward trajectory. Sometimes that 'nice' season is just the best you're going to do. That's very much how the Toronto raptors felt in 2021 for example when they got that #5 seed too. The upward progression didn't happen....instead that was "as good as it sas going to get".

And then these two really abysmal games to open the playoffs cement that feeling. And let's face it this is a nothing special cavs team. The difference between them and a team like this years celtics may as well be the difference between 1993 michael jordan and wizards michael jordan.

And it's not so much that they are losing badly in these games....it's *how* they are losing. This just doesn't look like a team with much of a ceiling. Even with some of their key guys being relatively early in their careers.

The problem for the magic right now is they are probably going to go 'all in' long term on this core. And knowing that they are going all in and committing several years into the future on a core that I don't believe has enough ceiling to get *anywhere near* being elite would be depressing. You can rationalize it by saying "well if we won this many games this year and paolo is just in year 2 and if he progresses and we improve by this much each of the next two years, maybe we can win this many games in......" No, just stop. That's fantasy. Forget the win total and just look at the roster, and the ceiling of those guys going forward, and then look at what we've seen on the court these two games........

this is *not* a team with any ceiling at all going forward.

I'd rather be 20-62 without any core and able to dream about a fantasy future with a bunch of players to dream about than a situation like this- where you know you aren't going to likely suck but also are setting yourself up to not be good enough for many years in the future. To in fact never be good enough with this bunch.

People who make fun of fans who fawn over the limitless future potential of blank slate rebuilds have a point......but the other side of the coin is this going forward, and thats no place to be either.

btw this Cavs team when healthy is one of the top teams in the Eastern Conference

However, I agree with you. That is why I made the posts about "how we are going to contend in the future"

Paolo is inefficient so far and he can not finish around the rim with paint presence of Mobley and Allen. That is the part I am worried about how good we could be. It is on our Star players.

To me, we are one or two moves away from being one of the top teams in the East. And this season is just not it.

Also, we have to make the right move. One bad move like Ibaka trade can ruin this rebuild. I am hoping for the right player to target on this summer. The window is closing before Franz and Paolo extension. But we have a lot of "internal improvement" to do.

I get the questioning a bit but I truly think Franz and Paolo are the real deal but it's the team you build around them. The pieces that add are what is gonna make or break how this roster performances moving forward.

They just don't have anything reliable to alleviate the pressure they see night in and night out.

This roster needs a massive over haul around them 2 ( and maybe Suggs) but I'm just not sure I trust this front office/ ownership to make the necessary moves to be elite.

This off season is key. If we don't see some significant roster improvement ( since rookie scale contracts kick in for paolo, franz and sugg soon), I'm just not sure how serious we can take this organization in regards to winning a championship.

tacosman wrote:I'm going to be honest even with the 'nice' regular season and #5 seed, I question the long term ceiling of this bunch if this franz/paolo/suggs/JI group is the 'core'.

A lot of times fans have a tendency to assume a progression that....well, just doesn't always happen.

To me this 2023/24 Magic team always felt like a pretty young team that was having a nice season but just doesn't have a real high ceiling.

Just because you have a season with improvement doesn't mean it's the start of continued upward trajectory. Sometimes that 'nice' season is just the best you're going to do. That's very much how the Toronto raptors felt in 2021 for example when they got that #5 seed too. The upward progression didn't happen....instead that was "as good as it sas going to get".

And then these two really abysmal games to open the playoffs cement that feeling. And let's face it this is a nothing special cavs team. The difference between them and a team like this years celtics may as well be the difference between 1993 michael jordan and wizards michael jordan.

And it's not so much that they are losing badly in these games....it's *how* they are losing. This just doesn't look like a team with much of a ceiling. Even with some of their key guys being relatively early in their careers.

The problem for the magic right now is they are probably going to go 'all in' long term on this core. And knowing that they are going all in and committing several years into the future on a core that I don't believe has enough ceiling to get *anywhere near* being elite would be depressing. You can rationalize it by saying "well if we won this many games this year and paolo is just in year 2 and if he progresses and we improve by this much each of the next two years, maybe we can win this many games in......" No, just stop. That's fantasy. Forget the win total and just look at the roster, and the ceiling of those guys going forward, and then look at what we've seen on the court these two games........

this is *not* a team with any ceiling at all going forward.

I'd rather be 20-62 without any core and able to dream about a fantasy future with a bunch of players to dream about than a situation like this- where you know you aren't going to likely suck but also are setting yourself up to not be good enough for many years in the future. To in fact never be good enough with this bunch.

People who make fun of fans who fawn over the limitless future potential of blank slate rebuilds have a point......but the other side of the coin is this going forward, and thats no place to be either.

LOL. Did you check the ages of the core? Way premature to talk ceiling. We are incomplete.

JI and Moe are solid bench core players.

I really want to lock this but I feel bad you typed a lot, but I've also never seen you post about the Magic in your post history so this feels like one huge bait.

This is insane.

SOUL wrote:I really want to lock this but I feel bad you typed a lot, but I've also never seen you post about the Magic in your post history so this feels like one huge bait.

Man, lock it. No one cares about his feelings hahaha.