GM 8: Suns @ Bulls

[lilfishi22]

The mere fact we had to make (and take) that many just to stay in it is a problem. Them losing multiple double digit leads is, too. This isn't an aberration: It's a pattern of defensive ineptitude.

OK but why is taking a lot of 3's a problem?

Because they're not necessary, especially when taking the ball to the basket is often ignored for a longer shot that has a lesser percentage chance to go in. We need to attack the basket, not continue to be a jump shooting team and complaining why we still don't get free throws. The only way that'll change is if we change our plan of attack.

Taking a good, decent percentage three point attempt isn't bad... but most of the looks and takes we get are. And we don't need everyone out there chucking away even if we happen to get a fortunate 40% clip on makes tonight.

We shot 40% on 48 three's, that's not chucking, that's hitting shots at a good clip on high volume. And if EG hit more than ZERO three's tonight, our efficiency would've been even higher. The 48 three's were absolutely an asset for us tonight.

We're also not getting FT's when we're attacking the paint. You saw tonight how often Nurk was getting murked in the paint

[grumpysaddle]

The mere fact we had to make (and take) that many just to stay in it is a problem. Them losing multiple double digit leads is, too. This isn't an aberration: It's a pattern of defensive ineptitude.

OK but why is taking a lot of 3's a problem?

Because they're not necessary, especially when taking the ball to the basket is often ignored for a longer shot that has a lesser percentage chance to go in. We need to attack the basket, not continue to be a jump shooting team and complaining why we still don't get free throws. The only way that'll change is if we change our plan of attack.

Taking a good, decent percentage three point attempt isn't bad... but most of the looks and takes we get are. And we don't need everyone out there chucking away even if we happen to get a fortunate 40% clip on makes tonight.

We still shot 25 FTs tonight with all those 3 point attempts, and likely should have shot at least 10-15 more FTs if the refs actually knew how to blow their whistles against the Bulls obvious karate chops all game.

They don't need to take 50 3 point attempts, but being close to 40 a game opens the lane more. We've been predictable the past few seasons with low 3 point attempts. Teams knew we were going for midrange shots and that shrinks the floor tremendously.

[lilfishi22]

48?

That number needs to be 35 or less. When those shots aren't falling they're bricking teams right back into the game.

They naturally will. We're not gonna averaged 48 a game but I think we should be in the top 10 in 3PA which will be about 37 a game.

I'd also prefer trading extra 3's and potential bricks among them than TO's from dumb passes

Aren't some of them basically the same as a turnover when they're chucking early into the shot clock though?

No because we have the opportunity to get a rebound, a turnover means the ball is already firmly in the opposing team's possession.

Obviously I don't want us to be firing off 3's just to fire off 3's. They have to be decent looks but I mean, the volume of 3's in rarely an issue unless you have a team full of non-shooters, which we don't.

[darealjuice]

Awful reffing, extremely sloppy basketball, and we couldn't hit water if we fell out of a boat in the fourth quarter. We did everything we could to lose that one. Frustrating watching the offense turn into everyone standing and watching the KD show, especially when it clearly wasn't working. Booker should help with that, but a PG off the bench would help keep the offense running too. Hopefully we can find more stretches like the first 6 minutes, the ball movement was great.

The Ayton tradees came up big todays. Nurkic had his gaffes, but he played a monster game overall. Grayson was huge for us. Beal obviously wasn't in game shape, you could see he was gassed at a few moments in the game.

[handsome salary]

Still trying to get back to back home losses to a middling Spurs out of my head. I'll take it.

Nurk looked very good. Gordon looked really bad.

Nice to see the center dribble it up court instead of waiting for the pg.

[garrick]

We don't have anyone that can really attack the paint besides Beal so it's a real problem when teams take away the 3 or we just aren't hitting our shots during stretches of the game.

We need a slasher like Oubre or someone who can get free throws to get us in the bonus because the weakness of last season hasn't been fixed coming in to this season. We are entirely too reliant on jump shots for the offense.

[sashaturiaf]

The mere fact we had to make (and take) that many just to stay in it is a problem. Them losing multiple double digit leads is, too. This isn't an aberration: It's a pattern of defensive ineptitude.

OK but why is taking a lot of 3's a problem?

48?

That number needs to be 35 or less. When those shots aren't falling they're bricking teams right back into the game.

With the refs calling the game they were tonight, I have zero qualms about taking 48 3s. Playing inside just means getting hacked and Bulls getting a runout the other way

[lilfishi22]

OK but why is taking a lot of 3's a problem?

Because they're not necessary, especially when taking the ball to the basket is often ignored for a longer shot that has a lesser percentage chance to go in. We need to attack the basket, not continue to be a jump shooting team and complaining why we still don't get free throws. The only way that'll change is if we change our plan of attack.

Taking a good, decent percentage three point attempt isn't bad... but most of the looks and takes we get are. And we don't need everyone out there chucking away even if we happen to get a fortunate 40% clip on makes tonight.

We still shot 25 FTs tonight with all those 3 point attempts, and likely should have shot at least 10-15 more FTs if the refs actually knew how to blow their whistles against the Bulls obvious karate chops all game.

They don't need to take 50 3 point attempts, but being close to 40 a game opens the lane more. We've been predictable the past few seasons with low 3 point attempts. Teams knew we were going for midrange shots and that shrinks the floor tremendously.

That was our issue under Monty. We shot the 3 ball well but we were always in the bottom half of the league in attempts.

Historically, we've just never been a team that's benefited from a decent whistle so to forgo 3's to go down the lane for maybe 2pts doesn't seem like a great gamble. Not to say we shouldn't attack the paint, like Beal was doing so well today, but shooting a good amount of 3's is far from a problem

[enigmatics]

We don't have anyone that can really attack the paint besides Beal so it's a real problem when teams take away the 3 or we just aren't hitting our shots during stretches of the game.

We need a slasher like Oubre or someone who can get free throws to get us in the bonus because the weakness of last season hasn't been fixed coming in to this season. We are entirely too reliant on jump shots for the offense.

They will though.

It's where Nurk factors in from the high post when they can't double everyone. Guys will be cutting/slashing and hit with dimes - Book, Beal, and I'm telling you eventually KBD.

Their ball movement can be elite and we've seen it at times already.

[grumpysaddle]

Because they're not necessary, especially when taking the ball to the basket is often ignored for a longer shot that has a lesser percentage chance to go in. We need to attack the basket, not continue to be a jump shooting team and complaining why we still don't get free throws. The only way that'll change is if we change our plan of attack.

Taking a good, decent percentage three point attempt isn't bad... but most of the looks and takes we get are. And we don't need everyone out there chucking away even if we happen to get a fortunate 40% clip on makes tonight.

We still shot 25 FTs tonight with all those 3 point attempts, and likely should have shot at least 10-15 more FTs if the refs actually knew how to blow their whistles against the Bulls obvious karate chops all game.

They don't need to take 50 3 point attempts, but being close to 40 a game opens the lane more. We've been predictable the past few seasons with low 3 point attempts. Teams knew we were going for midrange shots and that shrinks the floor tremendously.

That was our issue under Monty. We shot the 3 ball well but we were always in the bottom half of the league in attempts.

Historically, we've just never been a team that's benefited from a decent whistle so to forgo 3's to go down the lane for maybe 2pts doesn't seem like a great gamble. Not to say we shouldn't attack the paint, like Beal was doing so well today, but shooting a good amount of 3's is far from a problem

Agreed. GA should have taken like... 5 more attempts tonight. He had some open looks he passed up when he was absolutely on fire. I understand wanting to be unselfish, but sometimes you have to be selfish when you can't seem to miss.

[lilfishi22]

We still shot 25 FTs tonight with all those 3 point attempts, and likely should have shot at least 10-15 more FTs if the refs actually knew how to blow their whistles against the Bulls obvious karate chops all game.

They don't need to take 50 3 point attempts, but being close to 40 a game opens the lane more. We've been predictable the past few seasons with low 3 point attempts. Teams knew we were going for midrange shots and that shrinks the floor tremendously.

That was our issue under Monty. We shot the 3 ball well but we were always in the bottom half of the league in attempts.

Historically, we've just never been a team that's benefited from a decent whistle so to forgo 3's to go down the lane for maybe 2pts doesn't seem like a great gamble. Not to say we shouldn't attack the paint, like Beal was doing so well today, but shooting a good amount of 3's is far from a problem

Agreed. GA should have taken like... 5 more attempts tonight. He had some open looks he passed up when he was absolutely on fire. I understand wanting to be unselfish, but sometimes you have to be selfish when you can't seem to miss.

Could've taken a few more off EG

[lonea]

DOMINURKICCCCC

[Revived]

Those 8 3s from Allen were monstrous....no chance without those.

He has a few very low IQ players every now and then (like the foul and-1 on Vucevic) but overall he’s the only role player the Suns have that’s really worth a damn.

KBD was pretty good, the boxscore doesn't show it, but he was a difference maker.

Who was he primarily defending, Lavine or Derozan? I had some things to do during the game so I was kinda in and out till late in the 4th qtr.

[Revived]

I don't think we can afford to play Okogie AND Goodwin in games, especially at the same time. It's just too anemic on offense.

Goodwin gives more positives, but Okogie has his moments in games. I think if Okogie doesn't show that he's making a huge swing on defensive momentum in the first few minutes he plays, he should probably just be on the bench the rest of that game.

Okogie should play over Goodwin if this is the case. Goodwin may be slightly more skilled than Okogie but what JO brings with hustle is unmatched by rest of the roster. And I say this as someone that hates watching Okogie drop brick after brick after brick.

Goodwin was supposed to be this stud role player when we got him from Washington, I don’t understand how he’s been so ass here.

[Jdiddy701]

Boy oh boy, that game was ugly. The Suns should have lost. The turnovers are really killing us this season. Is Book really going to fix that? He’s also turnover prone. The Suns have to do everything they can to get Malcom Brogdon. I’m not sure they have the pieces to do it but he’s perfect for this team.

I’m not as high on KBD as you guys are. He did have some solid defense on Derozan in the game and hit a huge 3 in OT but just like Okogie, I don’t trust him to make the open shot.. especially not in the playoffs.

Grayson Allen saved our ass today. The ball movement was good, just got sloppy. In the end, it’s a win so I’ll take it. Looking forward to the upcoming games with our big 3. I think it’s our time to make a mini push early in the season. You guys are down on this team, I am not. Good things ahead.


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[Revived]

The Suns have to do everything they can to get Malcom Brogdon. I’m not sure they have the pieces to do it but he’s perfect for this team.

We have nothing to trade for anyone anymore. It’s done, there’s no trades the Suns can make for several years because we have no trade assets.

Out of all 30 teams in the league, the Suns have the least amount of trade assets available for trade for any player. And honestly that’s understating it, we basically have jack ***** to trade anyone for anything.

[enigmatics]

Boy oh boy, that game was ugly. The Suns should have lost. The turnovers are really killing us this season. Is Book really going to fix that? He’s also turnover prone. The Suns have to do everything they can to get Malcom Brogdon. I’m not sure they have the pieces to do it but he’s perfect for this team.

I’m not as high on KBD as you guys are. He did have some solid defense on Derozan in the game and hit a huge 3 in OT but just like Okogie, I don’t trust him to make the open shot.. especially not in the playoffs.

Grayson Allen saved our ass today. The ball movement was good, just got sloppy. In the end, it’s a win so I’ll take it. Looking forward to the upcoming games with our big 3. I think it’s our time to make a mini push early in the season. You guys are down on this team, I am not. Good things ahead.

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Brogdon is a black hole.

In regards to KBD his shot will start falling (dude shot like 38% last year) and he was largely responsible for Lavine going 6-for-20. Also stepped up to make that last shot by DeRozan extremely difficult.

The team's defense has improved immensely since he's started over Okogie.

[DirtyDez]

KBD!

[Jdiddy701]

The Suns have to do everything they can to get Malcom Brogdon. I’m not sure they have the pieces to do it but he’s perfect for this team.

We have nothing to trade for anyone anymore. It’s done, there’s no trades the Suns can make for several years because we have no trade assets.

Out of all 30 teams in the league, the Suns have the least amount of trade assets available for trade for any player. And honestly that’s understating it, we basically have jack ***** to trade anyone for anything.

I think our guys on vet minimums are actually good players. The problem is.. I did not know Brogdon makes 22 million a year. Yeah, no way they can match up contracts for him. You’re absolutely right.


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[Jdiddy701]

Just realized Nurk has two game winning shots for us this season.


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