The Official 2024 Offseason Thread

[BobbieL]

Still expecting Durant to be on the roster on season opener, but if this loser really wants out, better trade him now and pretend he's never been a part of this franchise.

Yeah should be easy to pretend that with zero control over our draft picks till 2031 thanks to him.

It was an emotion based trade by Ishbia. Silver pushed through the process, it seems - to allow him owner so the trade would go through. Yes, tin foil hat of conspiracy but I am not sure that Sarver and Jones make that trade for Durant

It was just a short sighted trade - and than because you make the one trade, you make the Beal trade.

Now you are really up against it in a bad way. This could have been avoided. The trade was always just use Crowder for some depth, even the Milwaukee trade of Hill, Ibaka, Nwosu and 5 second rounders - that was fine.

[Saberestar]

TJ McConnell played yesterday another great game. He again looks like the perfect addition as a PG who can be a realistic target and fits our age group.

We tried to get him last summer so we know that James Jones is interested in him for real, the value was too high at that moment but that could change a year later.

He will be on an expiring contract for $9.3M. He is 32 years old.

The Pacers are having a successful season and they probably would love to retain him BUT they have Haliburton and Nembhard as a long-term PGs.

How can we match his salary? What trade package can be fair to get him?

Nope. See...this is what we have been saying all along.

It's taking a while...but you'll soon realize what happened.

Well, there is always a path that can allow us to get a desired player in a trade. Not that difficult lol.

It took me five minutes (literally) to see that we can trade in October Grayson Allen ($15.6M) for McConnell + Jalen Smith ($14.7M).

[Saberestar]

TJ McConnell played yesterday another great game. He again looks like the perfect addition as a PG who can be a realistic target and fits our age group.

We tried to get him last summer so we know that James Jones is interested in him for real, the value was too high at that moment but that could change a year later.

He will be on an expiring contract for $9.3M. He is 32 years old.

The Pacers are having a successful season and they probably would love to retain him BUT they have Haliburton and Nembhard as a long-term PGs.

How can we match his salary? What trade package can be fair to get him?

The problem is unless we're giving up someone like Allen for him OR maybe resign O'neale at a little over 12-13 million and trade him to the pacers for McConnell IF they'd even have interest in either of those two players in a trade! Otherwise man, we just don't have the salaries to get things done.

However, it does blow my mind how the front office has pursued McConnell for so long with Jones having interest in him, low key knowing that they just can't get him, when all the while you obviously have a much cheaper and younger identical archetype to McConnell in Tyler Kolek that can do everything McConnell can do AND can maybe pass better as a bonus. How can they be blind to this? So you just can't get McConnell, but have his exact clone in Kolek easily in our range of #22. Why seek to struggle in such futility when the solution is basically falling in your lap!

What would be funny and pretty sad at the same time would be if the Suns decided to trade BOTH the 22nd pick and the 2031 1st for McConnell who is older, and expiring and could just as easily leave the following summer.

We can work on some 3-team trade with Nurkic going to a third team. The Pacers have some small contracts that can make easier a trade with multiple players.

I think that Kolek is a good option but I doubt our FO is interested in a rookie PG having a big role on the team.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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I'd be cool with trading KD for Ingram/ Nance/ LAL 24' 1st (17th pick)/MIL 27' 1st (no protections)/ 2029' PELS 1st.

I DO understand that Ingram isn't nearly as good as KD, however, I also realize that he's younger and not 35 yrs old and still an all-star-level player which a very similar scoring style to KD. But then that's also the reason that we'd be getting draft picks in the deal too! My interest in this premise would be to extend our window longer around a core of Beal/Booker/Nance/Ingram/ Nurkic and actual draft assets! The 17th pick (which appears to be held by the Pels and not the Flakers) would yield a high-level version of a Clint Capela/ Theo Ratliff-type defensive center option that's very long, very fluid/quick, and explosively athletic with a nonstop relentless motor. I'm talking about Yves Missi here. Then with our 22nd pick, we could select Tyler Kolek to be our backup floor general /playmaker, OR we could choose Ryan Dunn to be our jumbo wing lockdown stopper also with explosive athleticism and length and a nonstop motor!

Really neither choice would be wrong, but I'm leaning more toward the combination of Yves Missi and Ryan Dunn because we could still very easily add Zion Pullin from the undrafted range who is very similar to Malcolm Brogdon which is very solid for our needs at backup guard. I think this sets us up to have ELITE lockdown athleticism around three high-level potent scorers in Beal, Booker, and Ingram while also adding an elite defensive rim protector and an elite lockdown wing/forward, and a very solid backup playmaking guard with good size at 6'4. Additionally, we're also adding significant size, length, and high-end athleticism.

Beal/ Booker/ Nance/ Ingram/ Nurkic.
Paul or Lowry/ Allen/ O'neale/ Muscala/ Missi.
Pullin/ D Lee/ Dunn/ Bol/ Bidatze.

24' Draft
17- Yves Missi.
22- Ryan Dunn.

Undrafted range (two ways- 3 allowed)
Two-way- Zion Pullin. A 6'4 Malcolm Brogdon 2.0
Two-way- Nae'quan Tomlin. A mix of Jalen Mcdaniels/Taylor Hendricks/ Naz Reid.
Two-way- Blake Hinson. A 6'8 ELITE 3PT floor spacing specialist that's a mix of Saddiq Bey and Dell Curry (movement shooter).

Picks
- 27' MIL 1st (no protections).
- 29' Pels 1st (no protections).

[TeamTragic]

We just fired Vogel and hired Bud who hasn't even picked his staff. Yet here we are on Monday morning talking about KD and how he is unhappy on this team.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Still expecting Durant to be on the roster on season opener, but if this loser really wants out, better trade him now and pretend he's never been a part of this franchise.

Yeah should be easy to pretend that with zero control over our draft picks till 2031 thanks to him.

It was an emotion based trade by Ishbia. Silver pushed through the process, it seems - to allow him owner so the trade would go through. Yes, tin foil hat of conspiracy but I am not sure that Sarver and Jones make that trade for Durant

It was just a short sighted trade - and than because you make the one trade, you make the Beal trade.

Now you are really up against it in a bad way. This could have been avoided. The trade was always just use Crowder for some depth, even the Milwaukee trade of Hill, Ibaka, Nwosu and 5 second rounders - that was fine.

Because you make the one trade, you make the Beal trade.

The thing is though was the Beal trade really necessary and the logical trade to make right after the Durant trade?

1- Pascal Siakim was acquired by the Pacers for only 1 decent player in Bruce Brown, 2 mediocre bench players in Kira Lewis and Jordan Nwora, and three future firsts. Now did we not have three average players and future firsts we could've traded for Siakim??

2- OG Anunoby I can kind of understand a bit more because Anunoby was acquired for Rj Barrett, Immanuel Quickley, and a 24' 2nd-round pick.. So again, aside from Barrett as a premium piece, 2 players- 1 good value young prospect and another young intriguing prospect and a freakin' 2nd round pick. This glaringly speaks to the importance of young draft prospects as coveted value assets for higher-end players! BUT still, considering the fact that Toronto couldn't even get a 1st for Anunoby, isn't it possible that the suns could've alternatively given Toronto multiple future firsts to offset a premium piece like Barrett or Quickley? Both were more or less much cheaper than the cost we paid for Beal despite having an absurd amount of leverage in that deal. And I'd think that either Siakim (1st choice) or Anunoby (2nd choice) would've been much better fits between Booker and KD than Beal as a redundant 3rd option.

[Ghost of Kleine]

TJ McConnell played yesterday another great game. He again looks like the perfect addition as a PG who can be a realistic target and fits our age group.

We tried to get him last summer so we know that James Jones is interested in him for real, the value was too high at that moment but that could change a year later.

He will be on an expiring contract for $9.3M. He is 32 years old.

The Pacers are having a successful season and they probably would love to retain him BUT they have Haliburton and Nembhard as a long-term PGs.

How can we match his salary? What trade package can be fair to get him?

Nope. See...this is what we have been saying all along.

It's taking a while...but you'll soon realize what happened.

Well, there is always a path that can allow us to get a desired player in a trade. Not that difficult lol.

It took me five minutes (literally) to see that we can trade in October Grayson Allen ($15.6M) for McConnell + Jalen Smith ($14.7M).

But would the suns really want to trade Allen as much as he's been a critical piece to them? Also, would Indiana have interest in him already having BOTH Hield and Nesmith at that position wherein both are also balling out for them. It seems a bit unlikely that the Pacers would value such redundancy like we do! And adding Allen at that position of redundancy seems unlikely that they'd want a 3rd shooting guard option at 15 million too.

I did laugh however at the thought of getting Smith back again after giving him up so quickly! Perhaps he can be our new Craig??

[Saberestar]

Nope. See...this is what we have been saying all along.

It's taking a while...but you'll soon realize what happened.

Well, there is always a path that can allow us to get a desired player in a trade. Not that difficult lol.

It took me five minutes (literally) to see that we can trade in October Grayson Allen ($15.6M) for McConnell + Jalen Smith ($14.7M).

But would the suns really want to trade Allen as much as he's been a critical piece to them? Also, would Indiana have interest in him already having BOTH Hield and Nesmith at that position wherein both are also balling out for them. It seems a bit unlikely that the Pacers would value such redundancy like we do! And adding Allen at that position of redundancy seems unlikely that they'd want a 3rd shooting guard option at 15 million too.

I did laugh however at the thought of getting Smith back again after giving him up so quickly! Perhaps he can be our new Craig??

Hield was traded to the Sixers.

It's just an example of a potential trade to get McConnell and thinking about it looks pretty fair for both teams. We get some depth ( 2x1) on positions of need (PG and PF).

[Ghost of Kleine]

We just fired Vogel and hired Bud who hasn't even picked his staff. Yet here we are on Monday morning talking about KD and how he is unhappy on this team.

I don't think KD being unhappy is any big news though as I honestly don't think he's ever been happy on any of the teams he was on! But I do think his well-documented history of jumping from team to team given his mercenarial nature is something to consider here! Especially if our front office doesn't quickly offer him an extension this July, and he takes it personally and demands out. I also think that if (but more likely when) we don't make a very deep run next season, he'll get frustrated not wanting to waste the last years of his career on a non-contender, and he'll do what he did in Brooklyn demanding out! I honestly think that we're (delusions aside) really just delaying the inevitable outcome of him demanding out and likely choosing Miami, Boston, New York, or perhaps even Minnesota ironically. All the while his value depreciating further in a lose-lose situation for us. The biggest kicker being that the 25' draft is completely loaded with fairly high-end talent and even some star-level talent too. But the delusionally shortsighted Suns front office would probably still try and wait things out at a significant value loss rather than take accountability!

I also truly believe that Booker himself is quickly picking up on the behavioral traits of KD, and will exhibit very similar mercenarial traits just like KD and finally start asking out after KD advises him on how staying his whole career on a losing team could affect his legacy, and how leaving the Thunder finally helped him win championships with GS which Booker does covet to establish his legacy himself in better reflection.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Well, there is always a path that can allow us to get a desired player in a trade. Not that difficult lol.

It took me five minutes (literally) to see that we can trade in October Grayson Allen ($15.6M) for McConnell + Jalen Smith ($14.7M).

But would the suns really want to trade Allen as much as he's been a critical piece to them? Also, would Indiana have interest in him already having BOTH Hield and Nesmith at that position wherein both are also balling out for them. It seems a bit unlikely that the Pacers would value such redundancy like we do! And adding Allen at that position of redundancy seems unlikely that they'd want a 3rd shooting guard option at 15 million too.

I did laugh however at the thought of getting Smith back again after giving him up so quickly! Perhaps he can be our new Craig??

Hield was traded to the Sixers.

It's just an example of a potential trade to get McConnell and thinking about it looks pretty fair for both teams. We get some depth ( 2x1) on positions of need (PG and PF).

Oh, that's right! My bad man, I can't believe that I forgot that!
Anyways, I like McConnell, but still really don't think the Suns front office would trade Allen after so recently giving him that multi-year contract and considering how very important he was/is to what our scheme is and in terms of critical floor spacing for the big three. I do think they'd overpay and move both our 22nd pick and our 2031 1st in a deal for McConnell and a filler IF the Pacers had any interest in Allen, which I also doubt.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Saberestar]

https://www.reddit.com/r/suns/s/1AQ7OmuTEC

OK, this sounds great. I know that too many fans want him back, he would be nice on a minimum contract.

[Slim Charless]

Read on Twitter

SAS is always trying to get Suns players to NYC it seems.

I've been thinking and I wonder if Ish would be more prone to trade Book, then KD. It's a terrible look for him to sell everything for Durant, then turn around and move him 1yr later.

Booker, while a star...wasn't drafted by Ish and as such, he might not as much of a connection/desire to make it work. That, and we'll get WAY more for him then KD.

Probably end up moving none of them in reality of course.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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SAS is always trying to get Suns players to NYC it seems.

I've been thinking and I wonder if Ish would be more prone to trade Book, then KD. It's a terrible look for him to sell everything for Durant, then turn around and move him 1yr later.

Booker, while a star...wasn't drafted by Ish and as such, he might not as much of a connection/desire to make it work. That, and we'll get WAY more for him then KD.

Probably end up moving none of them in reality of course.

I'd think he'd actually trade KD before Booker because KD is in early decline and no longer in his prime like Booker is, isn't the face of the franchise that the fanbase is heavily tethered to emotionally, and most importantly because they're both from Michigan and he seemingly loves to keep his Michigan people close to him. Having said this, I'm not tethered to Booker or KD and would be cool with either being moved as I think Ishbias' pride is only prolonging the inevitable by not trading any of the big three now that he's decimated our flexibility and assets, and our realistic ceiling going forward is at best a first-round exit, and at worst, missing the playoffs entirely while us fans sit at home and watch other fanbases that hold our picks cash in on our soon to be high lottery picks and those teams turn those young players into stars all while ours continue to age, sit out due to injury and become irrelevant much like our team in the coming 6-8 yrs.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Watch on YouTube

[sunskerr]

I'd do KD for Ingram if KD wants out and Ingram signs his max.

Would give us security for the length of the max contract, allowing us to stay competitive so we can eat away at some of these upcoming years where we don't have our draft picks.

Don't think KD would ever agree to go to NOLA though. If he wants Miami he'll get Miami or he'll stay with us.

Ingram on a max would probably not be worth the money but if we're trying to stay relevant and keep Book happy, maybe it gets the job done.

My concern is that hes so...how do we say it? "Mid", as the kids say these days. I've followed him for years and he hasn't improved since he made a leap in 2020ish. He's a pretty good player for sure but he's exactly that - pretty good - and not more. Still has time on his side though which KD doesn't.

If by some miracle you pawn off Beal maybe there is more flexibility (and time) to put something around Booker/Ingram as an under 30 wing duo. I don't know. Not a cap guy.

[kennydorglas]

I'd do KD for Ingram if KD wants out and Ingram signs his max.

Would give us security for the length of the max contract, allowing us to stay competitive so we can eat away at some of these upcoming years where we don't have our draft picks.

Don't think KD would ever agree to go to NOLA though. If he wants Miami he'll get Miami or he'll stay with us.

Ingram on a max would probably not be worth the money but if we're trying to stay relevant and keep Book happy, maybe it gets the job done.

My concern is that hes so...how do we say it? "Mid", as the kids say these days. I've followed him for years and he hasn't improved since he made a leap in 2020ish. He's a pretty good player for sure but he's exactly that - pretty good - and not more. Still has time on his side though which KD doesn't.

If by some miracle you pawn off Beal maybe there is more flexibility (and time) to put something around Booker/Ingram as an under 30 wing duo. I don't know. Not a cap guy.

I guess cap flexibility is a word we won't hear for kinda while.
This is a **** mess and we just need to pray Bud can fix it.
We can't tank. We can't improve our team.

[TeamTragic]

I have zero interest in Ingram.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

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I'd argue that so far it clearly isn't working as we're obviously very top-heavy with aging stars, and no cap space that we otherwise would have had If we had only balanced our roster with cost-controlled young talent. That same young talent would also bring a level of effort, energy, and "give a fu**! that's clearly missing from our vet trio. Lastly, the vet minutes have by the majority been an abject disaster over the past couple of seasons with our bench being dismal in terms of production and reliability.

The worst part is the insanity of repeating this shortsighted strategy year after year instead of using those picks to develop young talent that could've been used in trades for impact players as teams like the Pacers used as inclusionary pieces for Siakim, and New York used for Anunoby! It's incredibly idiotic to make the choices that our front office has made that have left us in a deep hole with no legitimate way to improve or even change our roster due to carelessly giving away assets. And for all those who think we shouldn't blow this up or at least trade one of our big three to pivot and add legitimate depth beyond garbage bin vet minimums on the fringe!


The definition of insanity is what again???? If you choose to live with your head in the sand not recognizing what's going on around you, then of course things look good until you finally take your head out for a breath only to see everything burnt to ashes around you! I'm not worried about blowing things up because reality will take care of that by next season's trade deadline and cure many delusions of contention for this team.