Game 21: Suns @ Lakers - IST Quarters

[dremill24]

wasnt a bad play he wanted to get a shot off before they fouled him.

If he was going to get fouled it would have already happened, he was at the point where he could get up a shot at any moment. He was really good tonight (on offense, anyway) but that wasnt a good look.

Lebron even said they wanted to foul him, maybe you have some inside info i dont?

Neither of us is privy to their brains. Im making informed assumptions based on context, same as you. If it takes 'inside info' to come to my conclusion then it takes the same for yours.

They talked about fouling but they didnt do it. The time to foul in that situation is when the player is dribbling and not a threat to shoot. They got the rebound and dribbled half the court and nobody fouled. Once you get to a certain point (dribbler can easily get a shot up), you dont generally foul for the risk of fouling a 3pt shooter.

Doesnt matter, I think he could've found a better look but at the end of the day they lost because they couldnt dribble or pass the whole game and couldnt do anything with LeBron/AD when they decided they wanted to get to the basket.

[sunsbum]

If he was going to get fouled it would have already happened, he was at the point where he could get up a shot at any moment. He was really good tonight (on offense, anyway) but that wasnt a good look.

Lebron even said they wanted to foul him, maybe you have some inside info i dont?

If Lebron said he wanted to jump off a roof would you believe him?

I would WANT to believe him.

[Mulhollanddrive]

If Durant and Booker had the worst support and team they'd still be 12-9 and we are 12-9. Vogel looks out of his depth as he is not making the team better.

[Jdiddy701]

I counted twice Frank should have used a challenge that probably would have resulted in the Suns ball. He played Okogie in the 2nd half then pulled him..I have no idea why he plays period (same with KBD), took the offense out of KD’s hands after he got us back in it, he’s okay with Book not being aggressive… I’m usually willing to give coaches a chance but he’s been terrible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Frank Lee]

That +11 turnovers is the story.

End of story

[sunsbum]

If he was going to get fouled it would have already happened, he was at the point where he could get up a shot at any moment. He was really good tonight (on offense, anyway) but that wasnt a good look.

Lebron even said they wanted to foul him, maybe you have some inside info i dont?

Neither of us is privy to their brains. Im making informed assumptions based on context, same as you. If it takes 'inside info' to come to my conclusion then it takes the same for yours.

They talked about fouling but they didnt do it. The time to foul in that situation is when the player is dribbling and not a threat to shoot. They got the rebound and dribbled half the court and nobody fouled. Once you get to a certain point (dribbler can easily get a shot up), you dont generally foul for the risk of fouling a 3pt shooter.

Doesnt matter, I think he could've found a better look but at the end of the day they lost because they couldnt dribble or pass the whole game and couldnt do anything with LeBron/AD when they decided they wanted to get to the basket.

What are you talking about lol. Lebron said at the after game interview, a minute after the game was over they wanted to foul. There's no assumption there.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Booker is shooting worse from 2 since 2018.

There are obvious reasons for that but Jones and Vogel don't seem to mind.

[Maze]

Nba and the networks salivating at lebron and the Lakers winning thisn1st tournament

Soon as I heard about the new tournament, I knew the Lakers/LeBron would be the biggest beneficiaries .They always seem to benefit the most from these new little perk rules.Just like the play in tournament.The refs either send the Lakers to the FT line, give them every important call/non call down the stretch, or all of the above.The bias is real.In fact it's stronger because they have the most prestigious main character in their bs marking narratives:LeBron James.

[dremill24]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

[AtheJ415]

If Durant and Booker had the worst support and team they'd still be 12-9 and we are 12-9. Vogel looks out of his depth as he is not making the team better.

Yeah that's the thing. The Suns will win and will do well on the season because we have overwhelming talent, but everybody here pretending the house isn't on fire just because people are hurt are missing the boat.

Fans shouldn't have to watch basketball of this poor of quality. The Suns are underachieving relative to the players we have had available and are losing in the same way over and over again. It's turnovers and effort plays and I find that inexcusable. Effort, for a team with the entire world to play for, should be the BARE MINIMUM expectation for this team. I have been happy with Nurkic and Gordon at least attempting to play defense the past couple of weeks compared to the 0% effort they had the rest of the year, but we have a lot of guys who are too cool to rebound or come back to the ball or what have you.

Goodwin needs more minutes. So does Little. They consistently play hard. We need the rest of the team to do so, and we need the coaches to stop trying to be fully balanced when we have an unbalanced roster. Removing the ball from KD down the stretch was INEXCUSABLE

[SunsRback4Good]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

Let’s give this team another 2-3 months to figure it out. Remember Rome was not build in one day.

[AtheJ415]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

Lack of focus. I think he just didn't expect him to shoot.

That's the thing though. We make so many mental and efort related errors and I don't see it actually getting better. We're 25% of the way through the year. This stuff should be improving and it shouldn't be the case that we have to wait for the entire team to be fully healthy to see the improvement.

We have this year and maybe next to win. If we aren't showing actual tangible improvement soon I would fire Vogel.

[Hitachi77]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

It was actually a ballsy 3 by Reaves. If he missed he would be getting killed for not running more clock.

I still feel pretty good about this team. Road wins against good teams are tough to get period, and they have been in every game basically, regardless of injuries. And 0-3 vs the Lakers is meaningless to me when you consider the circumstances of each. We owned the Mavs in the regular season too a couple years ago.

Both Book and KD got dinged this game. At least they can rest now.

[SunsRback4Good]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

Lack of focus. I think he just didn't expect him to shoot.

That's the thing though. We make so many mental and efort related errors and I don't see it actually getting better. We're 25% of the way through the year. This stuff should be improving and it shouldn't be the case that we have to wait for the entire team to be fully healthy to see the improvement.

We have this year and maybe next to win. If we aren't showing actual tangible improvement soon I would fire Vogel.

Agreed! If things don’t work out we should fire Vogel and bring back Monty.

[AtheJ415]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

Lack of focus. I think he just didn't expect him to shoot.

That's the thing though. We make so many mental and efort related errors and I don't see it actually getting better. We're 25% of the way through the year. This stuff should be improving and it shouldn't be the case that we have to wait for the entire team to be fully healthy to see the improvement.

We have this year and maybe next to win. If we aren't showing actual tangible improvement soon I would fire Vogel.

Agreed! If things don’t work out we should fire Vogel and bring back Monty.

**** Monty. Get a coach with a clue. If we're middle of the pack with 2 of the top 7 players in basketball he has to go. We cannot waste this year when KD is getting old.

[dremill24]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

It was actually a ballsy 3 by Reaves. If he missed he would be getting killed for not running more clock.

They were going to be giving the ball back for another possession no matter how much time they used up. Sure its ballsy but he went for the one scenario that would ice the game and Allen didnt prevent the one scenario that would do that.

[AtheJ415]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

It was actually a ballsy 3 by Reaves. If he missed he would be getting killed for not running more clock.

I still feel pretty good about this team. Road wins against good teams are tough to get period, and they have been in every game basically, regardless of injuries. And 0-3 vs the Lakers is meaningless to me when you consider the circumstances of each. We owned the Mavs in the regular season too a couple years ago.

Both Book and KD got dinged this game. At least they can rest now.

It was ballsy but reality is what is Allen doing to risk it? The game is on the line and we're daring a good shooter to shoot? And maybe the only good shooter on that Laker team?

[garrick]

Lack of focus. I think he just didn't expect him to shoot.

That's the thing though. We make so many mental and efort related errors and I don't see it actually getting better. We're 25% of the way through the year. This stuff should be improving and it shouldn't be the case that we have to wait for the entire team to be fully healthy to see the improvement.

We have this year and maybe next to win. If we aren't showing actual tangible improvement soon I would fire Vogel.

Agreed! If things don’t work out we should fire Vogel and bring back Monty.

**** Monty. Get a coach with a clue. If we're middle of the pack with 2 of the top 7 players in basketball he has to go. We cannot waste this year when KD is getting old.

The odds of winning decrease each year just due to KD's age so really we have to win THIS season while KD is still playing a high level of basketball before age just really strips him of his skills.

If we are expecting KD to perform at this level at age 37 or 38 we are in for a rude awakening as KD unlike LBJ isn't built like that where he can still impact the game in their late 30's.

[mikea7]

That's the thing though. We make so many mental and efort related errors and I don't see it actually getting better. We're 25% of the way through the year. This stuff should be improving and it shouldn't be the case that we have to wait for the entire team to be fully healthy to see the improvement.

This.

[AtheJ415]

Biggest play at the end for me is Allen giving up that 3 to Reaves. Down 1 on defense with time to get one more possession...the ONLY things that ices the game is giving up a 3. Just not smart.

It was actually a ballsy 3 by Reaves. If he missed he would be getting killed for not running more clock.

They were going to be giving the ball back for another possession no matter how much time they used up. Sure its ballsy but he went for the one scenario that would ice the game and Allen didnt prevent the one scenario that would do that.

Also, with Reeves you are much more worried about the jumper than the drive. Allen relaxed and then was surprised when he faked the drive and flew back allowing the open 3. If he was just focused and defending the entire time because the game is on the line he is up on him. It was a mental error / lazy play and yes it killed us just like all the turnovers.

We just play stupid basketball way too much of the game.