Welcome Royce O’Neale

[sunsbg]

Has led the team in +/- in all three games played though first one with only +4. Beal will probably miss Mavs game so a good opportunity to see him defend top scorers like Luka and Kyrie for extended time in next game.

[lilfishi22]

Something I didn't realise until now but RON is pretty damn close to an iron man. OK, he's not exactly Mikal Bridges but these are the number of games missed per season since entering the NBA:

2017-2018: 13 games (most were from the start of the season where it may be DNP-CDs)
2018-2019: 0 games
2019-2020: 1 game (near end of season so may be DNP-rest)
2020-2021: 1 game
2021-2022: 5 games
2022-2023: 6 games
2023-2024: 2 games (1 was being held out prior to the trade)

[SunsRback4Good]

Something I didn't realise until now but RON is pretty damn close to an iron man. OK, he's not exactly Mikal Bridges but these are the number of games missed per season since entering the NBA:

2017-2018: 13 games (most were from the start of the season where it may be DNP-CDs)
2018-2019: 0 games
2019-2020: 1 game (near end of season so may be DNP-rest)
2020-2021: 1 game
2021-2022: 5 games
2022-2023: 6 games
2023-2024: 2 games (1 was being held out prior to the trade)

Pretty impressive to miss just 15 games in the last 6 seasons not counting 17-18 season where Royce missed 13 games. Any chance we can keep him for next season?

[lilfishi22]

Something I didn't realise until now but RON is pretty damn close to an iron man. OK, he's not exactly Mikal Bridges but these are the number of games missed per season since entering the NBA:

2017-2018: 13 games (most were from the start of the season where it may be DNP-CDs)
2018-2019: 0 games
2019-2020: 1 game (near end of season so may be DNP-rest)
2020-2021: 1 game
2021-2022: 5 games
2022-2023: 6 games
2023-2024: 2 games (1 was being held out prior to the trade)

Pretty impressive to miss just 15 games in the last 6 seasons not counting 17-18 season where Royce missed 13 games. Any chance we can keep him for next season?

Short answer: yes, we have his Bird rights. Longer answer: depends entirely on how deep into the tax Ishbia wants to go.

I do think it will depend on how the playoffs go as well because I don't think (not my money but it's a lot of money) we can afford to pay to keep both Grayson and RON and given they do very similar things out there, I kinda think they'll need to choose one or the other. Grayson would be the logical one to keep since he's younger

[WeekapaugGroove]

Something I didn't realise until now but RON is pretty damn close to an iron man. OK, he's not exactly Mikal Bridges but these are the number of games missed per season since entering the NBA:

2017-2018: 13 games (most were from the start of the season where it may be DNP-CDs)
2018-2019: 0 games
2019-2020: 1 game (near end of season so may be DNP-rest)
2020-2021: 1 game
2021-2022: 5 games
2022-2023: 6 games
2023-2024: 2 games (1 was being held out prior to the trade)

Pretty impressive to miss just 15 games in the last 6 seasons not counting 17-18 season where Royce missed 13 games. Any chance we can keep him for next season?

Short answer: yes, we have his Bird rights. Longer answer: depends entirely on how deep into the tax Ishbia wants to go.

I do think it will depend on how the playoffs go as well because I don't think (not my money but it's a lot of money) we can afford to pay to keep both Grayson and RON and given they do very similar things out there, I kinda think they'll need to choose one or the other. Grayson would be the logical one to keep since he's younger

We'll see how things play out but I might lean RON over Grayson if I can only sign one this summer. The window is now so to me age doesn't matter as much and I think RON being bigger and a better defender makes him a better guy to close in a lineup with Beal Booker KD and Nurk.

But I might change my opinion because Grayson has been very good here, like the best he's ever played. If he's truly upped his game a level you could make an argument that you want him on a long term deal as a core player with Booker and Beal.

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[Frank Lee]

Cant claim all in if you don’t ink up both

[lilfishi22]

Pretty impressive to miss just 15 games in the last 6 seasons not counting 17-18 season where Royce missed 13 games. Any chance we can keep him for next season?

Short answer: yes, we have his Bird rights. Longer answer: depends entirely on how deep into the tax Ishbia wants to go.

I do think it will depend on how the playoffs go as well because I don't think (not my money but it's a lot of money) we can afford to pay to keep both Grayson and RON and given they do very similar things out there, I kinda think they'll need to choose one or the other. Grayson would be the logical one to keep since he's younger

We'll see how things play out but I might lean RON over Grayson if I can only sign one this summer. The window is now so to me age doesn't matter as much and I think RON being bigger and a better defender makes him a better guy to close in a lineup with Beal Booker KD and Nurk.

But I might change my opinion because Grayson has been very good here, like the best he's ever played. If he's truly upped his game a level you could make an argument that you want him on a long term deal as a core player with Booker and Beal.

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There's also a very good chance Grayson could cost a fair bit more than RON so that would have to be taken into consideration.

[sashaturiaf]

3 games in I think I was wrong on Royce. I didn't think he'd make a difference since he didn't have the athleticism and the ability to lock down big wings 1v1 that we needed.

However he's such an upgrade on the minimum guys we were throwing out there it's night and day. I'd almost say he might be our 4th most trustworthy guy if the playoffs started today, now that isn't a good sign for the Suns from a team building perspective but we're better now than pre Royce.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Cant claim all in if you don’t ink up both

Agreed on a basic level, although there's some shite actual draft and roster penalties for being over the second apron for 3+ years in any 5 year period that do come into play. So it's not just a big cash bill that may factor into their decision.

But it should also be noted that the tax/apron levels should rise 10% year over year so that should help Phoenix.

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[Saberestar]

First six games on the Suns:

8.7 points
6.2 rebounds
2.7 assists
1.8 steals

40% from three on 5.8 attempts per game in 25 minutes.

[SunsRback4Good]

Royce is our new Tim Thomas. Will hit a huge shot come playoff time.

[Bogyo]

First six games on the Suns:

8.7 points
6.2 rebounds
2.7 assists
1.8 steals

40% from three on 5.8 attempts per game in 25 minutes.

Per36 that looks something like:
11.3 points
8.1 rebounds
3.5 assists
2.3 steals

While Graysons averages are roughly the same per 36 as he is playing more than 33 minutes now. So all in all, pretty safe to say that while Allen is the better player by some, especially this stages of their respective carreer, the stuff that RON brings to the starting lineup are much more valuable there (6+ rebounds and almost 2 steals?!?!) - while Graysons playmaking, scoring would be a godsend in the struggling bench lineups.

(just for the record, no I'm not saying that RON should be playing 36 minutes and/or that he should take the minutes of Allen. But he should be starting, playing roughly these 25ish minutes, while Allen also should play around these 30ish amount of minutes, but more with the bench, sprinkled in with the staggered big2 or big1 minutes. Balance is the key)

[sunsbg]

JO is losing all his minutes once Beal is back. Royce is just the more versatile defender. Seen him defend Kyrie, Lebron and Washington now having same size as PJ. Add a better 3PT shot and there is no contest.

[lilfishi22]

First six games on the Suns:

8.7 points
6.2 rebounds
2.7 assists
1.8 steals

40% from three on 5.8 attempts per game in 25 minutes.

Per36 that looks something like:
11.3 points
8.1 rebounds
3.5 assists
2.3 steals

While Graysons averages are roughly the same per 36 as he is playing more than 33 minutes now. So all in all, pretty safe to say that while Allen is the better player by some, especially this stages of their respective carreer, the stuff that RON brings to the starting lineup are much more valuable there (6+ rebounds and almost 2 steals?!?!) - while Graysons playmaking, scoring would be a godsend in the struggling bench lineups.

(just for the record, no I'm not saying that RON should be playing 36 minutes and/or that he should take the minutes of Allen. But he should be starting, playing roughly these 25ish minutes, while Allen also should play around these 30ish amount of minutes, but more with the bench, sprinkled in with the staggered big2 or big1 minutes. Balance is the key)

Yeah this was something I was going to post last night when there was a discussion about starting RON over Beal in the Laker GT and I thought perhaps the discussion should be whether we should start RON over Grayson. He helps a lot on the rebounding end, the defensive end, he still brings shooting but importantly, I think he just brings more size to our starting lineup. When we're health, Book is basically the default 3 and he's 6-5, 6-6 which is a little undersized. Now RON is a bit shorter but he's strong AF and he's used to defending wings and even bigs so just having that bigger defensive presence would go a long way I believe.

And I agree, I still think Grayson is the better player overall, especially being younger too but I could certainly see good reasons to start RON

[lilfishi22]

JO is losing all his minutes once Beal is back. Royce is just the more versatile defender. Seen him defend Kyrie, Lebron and Washington now having same size as PJ. Add a better 3PT shot and there is no contest.

With RON's trade, that basically shut the door for JO playing meaningful minutes

[Saberestar]

Read on Twitter

[garrick]

3 games in I think I was wrong on Royce. I didn't think he'd make a difference since he didn't have the athleticism and the ability to lock down big wings 1v1 that we needed.

However he's such an upgrade on the minimum guys we were throwing out there it's night and day. I'd almost say he might be our 4th most trustworthy guy if the playoffs started today, now that isn't a good sign for the Suns from a team building perspective but we're better now than pre Royce.

It's also a bit of bad news for us because this season it's been proven that minimum signing players generally aren't able to step up consistently and we need at best MLE level players that are proven contributors.

Next season we will need to resign Grayson and O'neale and see if there are proven vets that can help for the minimum, a few project type players will be needed to fill the end of the bench but they can't be counted on to be consistent contributors in the way we expected players like Metu, KBD, Yuta and Eubanks to contribute this season.

[Saberestar]

3 games in I think I was wrong on Royce. I didn't think he'd make a difference since he didn't have the athleticism and the ability to lock down big wings 1v1 that we needed.

However he's such an upgrade on the minimum guys we were throwing out there it's night and day. I'd almost say he might be our 4th most trustworthy guy if the playoffs started today, now that isn't a good sign for the Suns from a team building perspective but we're better now than pre Royce.

It's also a bit of bad news for us because this season it's been proven that minimum signing players generally aren't able to step up consistently and we need at best MLE level players that are proven contributors.

Next season we will need to resign Grayson and O'neale and see if there are proven vets that can help for the minimum, a few project type players will be needed to fill the end of the bench but they can't be counted on to be consistent contributors in the way we expected players like Metu, KBD, Yuta and Eubanks to contribute this season.

Eric Gordon and Bol Bol are on minimum deals and they are contributing nicely.

[garrick]

3 games in I think I was wrong on Royce. I didn't think he'd make a difference since he didn't have the athleticism and the ability to lock down big wings 1v1 that we needed.

However he's such an upgrade on the minimum guys we were throwing out there it's night and day. I'd almost say he might be our 4th most trustworthy guy if the playoffs started today, now that isn't a good sign for the Suns from a team building perspective but we're better now than pre Royce.

It's also a bit of bad news for us because this season it's been proven that minimum signing players generally aren't able to step up consistently and we need at best MLE level players that are proven contributors.

Next season we will need to resign Grayson and O'neale and see if there are proven vets that can help for the minimum, a few project type players will be needed to fill the end of the bench but they can't be counted on to be consistent contributors in the way we expected players like Metu, KBD, Yuta and Eubanks to contribute this season.

Eric Gordon and Bol Bol are on minimum deals and they are contributing nicely.

Bol Bol looks promising but we haven't yet seen he can do it for long stretches because Vogel seems to only be trusting him now, earlier in the season he looked terrible and completely lost on both sides of the court.

EG yes I agree but he's a proven player and he's only on the minimum because of his age, he's been really streaky though and when he's not hitting his shots he's a complete liability on defense.