OT: Pacquiao... he deserves this on a basketball forum.

[Infinite Llamas]

Had to google this guy honestly, though I vaguely remember seeing his name on the ticker at the bottom of the screen sometimes on espn. Looks like he had one hell of a career.

[gorz]

I'm a licensed professional fight judge. I have pics with all of these guys. I grew up a boxing fan but put my daughter in MMA MMA. She turns 7 in September and just won 1st place in the last 2 tournaments that she was in against older girls and boys and these are the same tournaments the top ufc fighters came up in.

P4P, Mayweather is the most skilled fighter I have ever seen. He literally could do it all. Most casual fans didn't see him until he was old and fighting bigger guys. He was already a hof fighter in his 1st weight class before he ever moved up. In fact I tell people that we never saw the best Mayweather because he moved up to chase money. He could have stayed lower, knock guys his size and smaller out. Then have better names like Barrera and Morales on his resume. They were legends who stood no chance if floyd didn't move up to chase money.

Floyd is small and after his 1st division, he was the smaller guy in nearly every fight. Most times way smaller.. He's basically the only guy in history who took long breaks when he was older, came back, was held to the same standards, and dominanted. Mayweather would take 2 years off while others would get credit if they lost after 6 months off because they weren't active.

Im a boxing fan. Manny is a legend. I've watched him from the jump but even the haters on boxing will tell you that Floyd is arguably the best they have ever seen. No one else can throw a stiff jab, a pull counter, a leeping left, can throw short hard punches in the inside the most beautiful boxer on the outside, high iq, top notch defense, elite chin, etc. Most of you are casuals. I literally know guys at the top of the fight game who don't like Floyd at all and say that he's the best they ever seen

Floyd is a more skilled boxer than manny arguably the most skilled and high fight iq boxer ever. He really mastered the art of hit and not get hit to a tee that being said he isn't a better fighter or "greater" than Manny Pacquiao. Floyd and his camp ducked and cherrypicked many of his opponents for a more opportune time. Whereas Manny fought anyone and everyone they put in front of him in their prime some to his own detriment. 8 weight class divisions champion in boxing is unbelievable. Manny could technically be a 10 weight class champion had he not skipped two divisions. If I have to make a basketball analogy kd is more skilled than lebron yet lebron is unanimously considered the better player.

[heezyo2o]

I'm a licensed professional fight judge. I have pics with all of these guys. I grew up a boxing fan but put my daughter in MMA MMA. She turns 7 in September and just won 1st place in the last 2 tournaments that she was in against older girls and boys and these are the same tournaments the top ufc fighters came up in.

P4P, Mayweather is the most skilled fighter I have ever seen. He literally could do it all. Most casual fans didn't see him until he was old and fighting bigger guys. He was already a hof fighter in his 1st weight class before he ever moved up. In fact I tell people that we never saw the best Mayweather because he moved up to chase money. He could have stayed lower, knock guys his size and smaller out. Then have better names like Barrera and Morales on his resume. They were legends who stood no chance if floyd didn't move up to chase money.

Floyd is small and after his 1st division, he was the smaller guy in nearly every fight. Most times way smaller.. He's basically the only guy in history who took long breaks when he was older, came back, was held to the same standards, and dominanted. Mayweather would take 2 years off while others would get credit if they lost after 6 months off because they weren't active.

Im a boxing fan. Manny is a legend. I've watched him from the jump but even the haters on boxing will tell you that Floyd is arguably the best they have ever seen. No one else can throw a stiff jab, a pull counter, a leeping left, can throw short hard punches in the inside the most beautiful boxer on the outside, high iq, top notch defense, elite chin, etc. Most of you are casuals. I literally know guys at the top of the fight game who don't like Floyd at all and say that he's the best they ever seen

You don't think Mayweather got hit more and had some closer fights when he was younger? He was almost un-hittable as he got older.

And what do you make of prime Manny dominating guys that Floyd had some what close fights with?

[Noctilux]

If that's the last we see of the Pac-Man and it's likely it is what a great champion we witnessed. 12 time champ in 8 weight divisions he has as strong of case as anybody to be considered the G.O.A.T. What a warrior! Manny took on anybody and everybody multiple times and even captured the welterweight strap at age 40!!! Even in his advanced age he had current title holders shook signing Contracts with both Spence/Crawford before the fights fell apart due to them ducking and faking injuries. I just wanted to take a moment to acknowledge Manny "Pac-Man" Pacquiao for setting an awesome example to all future generations he is truly a gladiator.

Great fighter, epic legend but no way in hell he's Goat or even top 10 of all time. At best he's top 20 all time which is still an impressive feat.

[DCasey91]

If that's the last we see of the Pac-Man and it's likely it is what a great champion we witnessed. 12 time champ in 8 weight divisions he has as strong of case as anybody to be considered the G.O.A.T. What a warrior! Manny took on anybody and everybody multiple times and even captured the welterweight strap at age 40!!! Even in his advanced age he had current title holders shook signing Contracts with both Spence/Crawford before the fights fell apart due to them ducking and faking injuries. I just wanted to take a moment to acknowledge Manny "Pac-Man" Pacquiao for setting an awesome example to all future generations he is truly a gladiator.

Great fighter, epic legend but no way in hell he's Goat or even top 10 of all time. At best he's top 20 all time which is still an impressive feat.

Pound for Pound Manny has an iron proof resume for top 5-10 all time easily no doubt about it. Feats alone he’s a lock.

I mean at the weight he started from it’s amazing he did what he actually and was very active vsing quality up until the end.

I mean he’s was going to fight Prime Errol Spence ffs.

Even Canelo in his prime now is cherry picking fights (for legacy not difficulty) when there’s obviously better quality opponents around now.

[Pelon chingon]

If that's the last we see of the Pac-Man and it's likely it is what a great champion we witnessed. 12 time champ in 8 weight divisions he has as strong of case as anybody to be considered the G.O.A.T. What a warrior! Manny took on anybody and everybody multiple times and even captured the welterweight strap at age 40!!! Even in his advanced age he had current title holders shook signing Contracts with both Spence/Crawford before the fights fell apart due to them ducking and faking injuries. I just wanted to take a moment to acknowledge Manny "Pac-Man" Pacquiao for setting an awesome example to all future generations he is truly a gladiator.

Great fighter, epic legend but no way in hell he's Goat or even top 10 of all time. At best he's top 20 all time which is still an impressive feat.

Pound for Pound Manny has an iron proof resume for top 5-10 all time easily no doubt about it. Feats alone he’s a lock.

I mean at the weight he started from it’s amazing he did what he actually and was very active vsing quality up until the end.

I mean he’s was going to fight Prime Errol Spence ffs.

Even Canelo in his prime now is cherry picking fights (for legacy not difficulty) when there’s obviously better quality opponents around now.

Really? Who are these better quality opponents?

[Noctilux]

I would favor Sugar Ray Leonard, Duran, Hearns (would kill Manny), and Aaron Pryor (pure violence), over Manny every time. We already know Floyd easily outboxed Manny while Marquez got the best of Manny during their four epic fights.

[DCasey91]

Great fighter, epic legend but no way in hell he's Goat or even top 10 of all time. At best he's top 20 all time which is still an impressive feat.

Pound for Pound Manny has an iron proof resume for top 5-10 all time easily no doubt about it. Feats alone he’s a lock.

I mean at the weight he started from it’s amazing he did what he actually and was very active vsing quality up until the end.

I mean he’s was going to fight Prime Errol Spence ffs.

Even Canelo in his prime now is cherry picking fights (for legacy not difficulty) when there’s obviously better quality opponents around now.

Really? Who are these better quality opponents?

Boxing fans would know Canelo is chasing legacy status at SMW and a never been done before. But that definitely doesn’t mean they are the best opponents for him.

- Crawford JR is the one that the world needs to see but they are doing separate things atm.

- Benavidez obviously

- Charlo or Castano. Banger of a fight recently

- Beterbiev but that would be on the lower end of priorities and a big step up in weight class quality imo

- Andrade

- And of course triple GGG for the fans as a much better ticket seller.

That’s 7 boxers off the top of my head and would be better than Plant imo. You can add Spence too if he wants to make the jump and add to his career legacy because he’s special in his own right.

[DCasey91]

I would favor Sugar Ray Leonard, Duran, Hearns (would kill Manny), and Aaron Pryor (pure violence), over Manny every time. We already know Floyd easily outboxed Manny while Marquez got the best of Manny during their four epic fights.

I would too remember Manny is smaller of the two boxers obviously.

It’d be the same for Mayweather to me. Duran 50-50 or slightly favored (we are talking about the goat LW and younger Mayweather so two and two together it’s a long long night at any point in time respective of their careers). SRL favored, Hearns non fight, Hagler hell no lol.

[Pelon chingon]

Pound for Pound Manny has an iron proof resume for top 5-10 all time easily no doubt about it. Feats alone he’s a lock.

I mean at the weight he started from it’s amazing he did what he actually and was very active vsing quality up until the end.

I mean he’s was going to fight Prime Errol Spence ffs.

Even Canelo in his prime now is cherry picking fights (for legacy not difficulty) when there’s obviously better quality opponents around now.

Really? Who are these better quality opponents?

Boxing fans would know Canelo is chasing legacy status at SMW and a never been done before. But that definitely doesn’t mean they are the best opponents for him.

- Crawford JR is the one that the world needs to see but they are doing separate things atm.

- Benavidez obviously

- Charlo

- Beterbiev but that would be on the lower end of priorities and a big step up in weight class quality imo

- Andrade

- And of course triple GGG for the fans as a much better ticket seller.

That’s off the top of my head and would be better than Plant imo.

Wait did you just say Charlo give me a break. Benavidez would be nice sure but Canelo already took his strap. Andrade is the definition of obscurity. GGG is practically retired if you haven't noticed. Beterbiev WOW that would be a heck of a mountain to climb but he also could be tailor made to get K.O'd by Canelo. Remarkable how Canelo has to do all these things but none of the names mentioned "have to" do anything not even one unification fight between all the names combined.

[DCasey91]

Really? Who are these better quality opponents?

Boxing fans would know Canelo is chasing legacy status at SMW and a never been done before. But that definitely doesn’t mean they are the best opponents for him.

- Crawford JR is the one that the world needs to see but they are doing separate things atm.

- Benavidez obviously

- Charlo

- Beterbiev but that would be on the lower end of priorities and a big step up in weight class quality imo

- Andrade

- And of course triple GGG for the fans as a much better ticket seller.

That’s off the top of my head and would be better than Plant imo.

Wait did you just say Charlo give me a break. Benavidez would be nice sure but Canelo already took his strap. Andrade is the definition of obscurity. GGG is practically retired if you haven't noticed. Beterbiev WOW that would be a heck of a mountain to climb but he also could be tailor made to get K.O'd by Canelo. Remarkable how Canelo has to do all these things but none of the names mentioned "have to" do anything not even one unification fight between all the names combined.

Umm it’s speaking on quality of opponents to verse no what they have to do. Plant, seriously? Cmon that’s not Canelo’s toughest opponent let’s be honest here.

Canelo is cherry picking atm which makes common sense when your at the top. I mean a lot of ATG’s did it no water of a ducks back. When you’re the man you get to pick your opponents. Doesn’t mean they are the best for you at all.

It’s not like UFC because of strict weight Divs and the cycle of activity. Only fight that didn’t happen was T Ferg vs Khabib but that fight was cursed with injuries that’s about it from recent memory.

As a threat Plant wouldn’t be top 5 imo. Like Saunders was a tougher fight objectively and Canelo did it comfortably.

[Pelon chingon]

Boxing fans would know Canelo is chasing legacy status at SMW and a never been done before. But that definitely doesn’t mean they are the best opponents for him.

- Crawford JR is the one that the world needs to see but they are doing separate things atm.

- Benavidez obviously

- Charlo

- Beterbiev but that would be on the lower end of priorities and a big step up in weight class quality imo

- Andrade

- And of course triple GGG for the fans as a much better ticket seller.

That’s off the top of my head and would be better than Plant imo.

Wait did you just say Charlo give me a break. Benavidez would be nice sure but Canelo already took his strap. Andrade is the definition of obscurity. GGG is practically retired if you haven't noticed. Beterbiev WOW that would be a heck of a mountain to climb but he also could be tailor made to get K.O'd by Canelo. Remarkable how Canelo has to do all these things but none of the names mentioned "have to" do anything not even one unification fight between all the names combined.

Umm it’s speaking on quality of opponents to verse no what they have to do. Plant, seriously? Cmon that’s not Canelo’s toughest opponent let’s be honest here.

Canelo is cherry picking atm which makes common sense when your at the top. I mean a lot of ATG’s did it no water of a ducks back. When you’re the man you get to pick your opponents. Doesn’t mean they are the best for you at all.

It’s not like UFC because of strict weight Divs and the cycle of activity. Only fight that didn’t happen was T Ferg vs Khabib but that fight was cursed with injuries that’s about it from recent memory.

As a threat Plant wouldn’t be top 5 imo.

Plant is only getting the fight because he has the IBF title. Canelo isn't to blame b/c the rest of the field isn't carrying their own weight but calling Canelo who is consistently fighting title holders a cherry picker is disingenuous.

[DCasey91]

Wait did you just say Charlo give me a break. Benavidez would be nice sure but Canelo already took his strap. Andrade is the definition of obscurity. GGG is practically retired if you haven't noticed. Beterbiev WOW that would be a heck of a mountain to climb but he also could be tailor made to get K.O'd by Canelo. Remarkable how Canelo has to do all these things but none of the names mentioned "have to" do anything not even one unification fight between all the names combined.

Umm it’s speaking on quality of opponents to verse no what they have to do. Plant, seriously? Cmon that’s not Canelo’s toughest opponent let’s be honest here.

Canelo is cherry picking atm which makes common sense when your at the top. I mean a lot of ATG’s did it no water of a ducks back. When you’re the man you get to pick your opponents. Doesn’t mean they are the best for you at all.

It’s not like UFC because of strict weight Divs and the cycle of activity. Only fight that didn’t happen was T Ferg vs Khabib but that fight was cursed with injuries that’s about it from recent memory.

As a threat Plant wouldn’t be top 5 imo.

Plant is only getting the fight because he has the IBF title. Canelo isn't to blame b/c the rest of the field isn't carrying their own weight but calling Canelo who is consistently fighting title holders a cherry picker is disingenuous.

Do you watch boxing having a belt doesn’t make you anyone near another far superior boxer at all.

It’s boxing, both UFC and boxers have inflated resumes as tune ups, easier opponents, out of primes, ducking, politics etc etc. it’s just less so for UFC because it’s very linear. One belt that’s it.

As match races go this isn’t exactly a hard one for Canelo.

It’s a legacy fight. There’ll be bigger fish to fry in the coming years no doubt about it.

[Frank Dux]

Remember when Pacquiao said “gay people are worse than animals”?

good riddance.

[SunsLyf3]

Umm it’s speaking on quality of opponents to verse no what they have to do. Plant, seriously? Cmon that’s not Canelo’s toughest opponent let’s be honest here.

Canelo is cherry picking atm which makes common sense when your at the top. I mean a lot of ATG’s did it no water of a ducks back. When you’re the man you get to pick your opponents. Doesn’t mean they are the best for you at all.

It’s not like UFC because of strict weight Divs and the cycle of activity. Only fight that didn’t happen was T Ferg vs Khabib but that fight was cursed with injuries that’s about it from recent memory.

As a threat Plant wouldn’t be top 5 imo.

Plant is only getting the fight because he has the IBF title. Canelo isn't to blame b/c the rest of the field isn't carrying their own weight but calling Canelo who is consistently fighting title holders a cherry picker is disingenuous.

Do you watch boxing having a belt doesn’t make you anyone near another far superior boxer at all.

It’s boxing, both UFC and boxers have inflated resumes as tune ups, easier opponents, out of primes, ducking, politics etc etc. it’s just less so for UFC because it’s very linear. One belt that’s it.

As match races go this isn’t exactly a hard one for Canelo.

It’s a legacy fight. There’ll be bigger fish to fry in the coming years no doubt about it.

But at the end of the day it is about the belts and Canelo is adding to his resume by fighting the champions. Maybe these so called "higher quality opponents" should get some belts to be taken seriously. Of course Canelo is fighting for his legacy. Who isn't?

[walk with me]

Strong a case as anybody? Not as strong as Floyd...and Floyd put Pacman in his place.

Great fighter nonetheless. Nothing wrong with being top 5.

I respectfully disagree even as a Pretty Boy Floyd fan.

PBF could've been the greatest but Mayweather hasn't been PBF in a long, long time.

Sure an arguement can be made for both but give me the warrior who doesn't run, delay due to injury and can get back up after being KO'd.

He lost the fight and you could see the age but it was still a close one and if you watched the fight, he was obviously not prepared for the match. Dude had 11 days notice and probably only had 4 days to prepare.

I still feel he was set up.

He absolutely was.

Why would you think pacman was set up?

1. He had the option to call the fight off and didn’t because he’s bad ass
2. Sean gibbons, buboy Fernandez and Freddie roach all predicted pacman would ko ugas
3. Ugas isn’t a big star… he’s pretty much unknown compared to Pacquaio who’s a huge ppv seller
4. Pacquaio has another option for a ppv fight


There’s absolutely no benefit to pbc “setting up” Pacquaio to lose.

[Pelon chingon]

I respectfully disagree even as a Pretty Boy Floyd fan.

PBF could've been the greatest but Mayweather hasn't been PBF in a long, long time.

Sure an arguement can be made for both but give me the warrior who doesn't run, delay due to injury and can get back up after being KO'd.

He lost the fight and you could see the age but it was still a close one and if you watched the fight, he was obviously not prepared for the match. Dude had 11 days notice and probably only had 4 days to prepare.

I still feel he was set up.

He absolutely was.

Why would you think pacman was set up?

1. He had the option to call the fight off and didn’t because he’s bad ass
2. Sean gibbons, buboy Fernandez and Freddie roach all predicted pacman would ko ugas
3. Ugas isn’t a big star… he’s pretty much unknown compared to Pacquaio who’s a huge ppv seller
4. Pacquaio has another option for a ppv fight


There’s absolutely no benefit to pbc “setting up” Pacquaio to lose.

Pacquiao trains for Spence for months and gets the rug pulled from under him with another opponent with a completely different style. Time isn't on Manny's side he cant just jump into another camp and prepare for Spence again he needs to rest. By then he'll be 43YO no that's done. Now instead of Manny beating Spence which IMO he would have those belts stay comfortably in PBC'S hands. Now Spence will have a speedy "recovery" and be back just in time to take on Ugas how convenient.

[Papi_swav]

Definitely a top 10 fighter of all time IMO. The true people's champ. 8 division champs is insane. I hope he retires, he don't have nothing to prove. But I think Spence would of killed Pac man honestly.

[duppyy]

I don’t really see why it’s deserving being in a basketball forum.

[heezyo2o]

We already know Floyd easily outboxed Manny while Marquez got the best of Manny during their four epic fights.

A lot of it has to do with style of the fighters. Manny got knocked out because he was too aggressive. Floyd would not have been trying to knock him out.

Can also look out how Pacquiao destroyed De la Hoya and Hatton while Mayweather had a tougher time with both. Many even think De La Hoya won that fight against Mayweather.

Mayweather still probably wins, but if he fought Pacquiao about 5 years earlier then it would have been a closer fight