Ayton - Disappointment

[HoopsFanAZ]

I had hoped for a trade with PHX involving Simons+ but they traded with Brooklyn!
I hoped to trade Nurkic+ to PHX get Ayton AND THEN parlay him to Indiana for Myles Turner and his less expensive contract and shot blocking.
I still hope the same to Brooklyn in a mega meal deal.

It’s not that I hate Ayton. He’s overpriced for what he’s been BUT he has to be put near the hoop if you want dunks and boards.

[KdoubleDees23]

Dudes not playing tonight because Ice on the road ……

I can’t believe I backed him up for years.

Y’all need to trade him for WCJ and anything else

[lilfishi22]

I really hoped DA would take this opportunity to be a leader and also be more productive as well given he's now a "vet" amongst the Blazers roster. There was so many narratives during his in PHX like that Monty, CP3 or Scapegoat X held him back by not passing to him or didn't et him involved enough but I've always felt he was used exactly as he should be and that's as an elite finisher almost anywhere on the court and focused on defense.

The more time that passed the more chatter we heard about him not being happy with his touches and that there was seemingly a direct connection between the touches/shots he was getting and the amount of effort he was putting in the game. That to me was already a red flag and when it came down to doing stuff with the ball once he had the ball, that was also pretty limited because he doesn't have any ball handling skills so he could only shoot from where he caught the ball and more often than not, it's a middy. Granted, his middy has always been solid but you could just imagine how much better he could be if he could spread the floor out to the 3PT line and/or dribble the ball a little bit to get closer to the basket. He just never developed those skills.

I don't think there's any major reasons why Portland fans should be too disappointed given the team didn't give up much to acquire him and by the sounds of things, most fans have set a relatively low bar for him. But from a basketball fan perspective, it's hard not to be frustrated with a guy that has so much potential, has all the physical gifts, he's not a bad locker room guy and we've seen what he could be when he's on (ie the 2021 playoffs).

[PDXKnight]

I really hoped DA would take this opportunity to be a leader and also be more productive as well given he's now a "vet" amongst the Blazers roster. There was so many narratives during his in PHX like that Monty, CP3 or Scapegoat X held him back by not passing to him or didn't et him involved enough but I've always felt he was used exactly as he should be and that's as an elite finisher almost anywhere on the court and focused on defense.

The more time that passed the more chatter we heard about him not being happy with his touches and that there was seemingly a direct connection between the touches/shots he was getting and the amount of effort he was putting in the game. That to me was already a red flag and when it came down to doing stuff with the ball once he had the ball, that was also pretty limited because he doesn't have any ball handling skills so he could only shoot from where he caught the ball and more often than not, it's a middy. Granted, his middy has always been solid but you could just imagine how much better he could be if he could spread the floor out to the 3PT line and/or dribble the ball a little bit to get closer to the basket. He just never developed those skills.

I don't think there's any major reasons why Portland fans should be too disappointed given the team didn't give up much to acquire him and by the sounds of things, most fans have set a relatively low bar for him. But from a basketball fan perspective, it's hard not to be frustrated with a guy that has so much potential, has all the physical gifts, he's not a bad locker room guy and we've seen what he could be when he's on (ie the 2021 playoffs).

Camara was a nice returning piece that made this trade easier to swallow along with losing one year off nassirs deal.

[Norm2953]

Shades of Dale Davis who played with the Blazers 20 years ago, who missed a game when he
could not get his car out of the driveway during a Portland ice storm.

Ayton is missing tonight's game due to the ice storm.

[lilfishi22]

I really hoped DA would take this opportunity to be a leader and also be more productive as well given he's now a "vet" amongst the Blazers roster. There was so many narratives during his in PHX like that Monty, CP3 or Scapegoat X held him back by not passing to him or didn't et him involved enough but I've always felt he was used exactly as he should be and that's as an elite finisher almost anywhere on the court and focused on defense.

The more time that passed the more chatter we heard about him not being happy with his touches and that there was seemingly a direct connection between the touches/shots he was getting and the amount of effort he was putting in the game. That to me was already a red flag and when it came down to doing stuff with the ball once he had the ball, that was also pretty limited because he doesn't have any ball handling skills so he could only shoot from where he caught the ball and more often than not, it's a middy. Granted, his middy has always been solid but you could just imagine how much better he could be if he could spread the floor out to the 3PT line and/or dribble the ball a little bit to get closer to the basket. He just never developed those skills.

I don't think there's any major reasons why Portland fans should be too disappointed given the team didn't give up much to acquire him and by the sounds of things, most fans have set a relatively low bar for him. But from a basketball fan perspective, it's hard not to be frustrated with a guy that has so much potential, has all the physical gifts, he's not a bad locker room guy and we've seen what he could be when he's on (ie the 2021 playoffs).

Camara was a nice returning piece that made this trade easier to swallow along with losing one year off nassirs deal.

I'm still a bit salty we had to include Camara. The guy is just a solid solid player.

[BlazersBroncos]

Shades of Dale Davis who played with the Blazers 20 years ago, who missed a game when he
could not get his car out of the driveway during a Portland ice storm.

Ayton is missing tonight's game due to the ice storm.

He plays alot like Dale as well - albeit not nearly as tough.

But Davis relied on mid ranged jumpers and eating rebounds.

We are playing a less tough Dale Davis 32M per year.

[zzaj]

Shades of Dale Davis who played with the Blazers 20 years ago, who missed a game when he
could not get his car out of the driveway during a Portland ice storm.

Ayton is missing tonight's game due to the ice storm.

He plays alot like Dale as well - albeit not nearly as tough.

But Davis relied on mid ranged jumpers and eating rebounds.

We are playing a less tough Dale Davis 32M per year.

Hard to believe that of the 16 years Double D played in the NBA, 12 of those he was paid 6M or less.

[JRoy]

Would love DD on this team. A tough screen setter and rebounder would be great.

[spanishninja]

I really hoped DA would take this opportunity to be a leader and also be more productive as well given he's now a "vet" amongst the Blazers roster. There was so many narratives during his in PHX like that Monty, CP3 or Scapegoat X held him back by not passing to him or didn't et him involved enough but I've always felt he was used exactly as he should be and that's as an elite finisher almost anywhere on the court and focused on defense.

The more time that passed the more chatter we heard about him not being happy with his touches and that there was seemingly a direct connection between the touches/shots he was getting and the amount of effort he was putting in the game. That to me was already a red flag and when it came down to doing stuff with the ball once he had the ball, that was also pretty limited because he doesn't have any ball handling skills so he could only shoot from where he caught the ball and more often than not, it's a middy. Granted, his middy has always been solid but you could just imagine how much better he could be if he could spread the floor out to the 3PT line and/or dribble the ball a little bit to get closer to the basket. He just never developed those skills.

I don't think there's any major reasons why Portland fans should be too disappointed given the team didn't give up much to acquire him and by the sounds of things, most fans have set a relatively low bar for him. But from a basketball fan perspective, it's hard not to be frustrated with a guy that has so much potential, has all the physical gifts, he's not a bad locker room guy and we've seen what he could be when he's on (ie the 2021 playoffs).

Camara was a nice returning piece that made this trade easier to swallow along with losing one year off nassirs deal.

the trade has quickly become the Camara for Nurk+Grayson trade lol

[spanishninja]

Shades of Dale Davis who played with the Blazers 20 years ago, who missed a game when he
could not get his car out of the driveway during a Portland ice storm.

Ayton is missing tonight's game due to the ice storm.

He plays alot like Dale as well - albeit not nearly as tough.

But Davis relied on mid ranged jumpers and eating rebounds.

We are playing a less tough Dale Davis 32M per year.

having watched Dale Davis play as a kid (era of the two PF Davises along with Antonio) Ayton is nothing like him. shot selection is one thing but toughness was in DD's DNA. If Ayton had that type of attitude he would be the new David Robinson right now.

[Norm2953]

Shades of Dale Davis who played with the Blazers 20 years ago, who missed a game when he
could not get his car out of the driveway during a Portland ice storm.

Ayton is missing tonight's game due to the ice storm.

He plays alot like Dale as well - albeit not nearly as tough.

But Davis relied on mid ranged jumpers and eating rebounds.

We are playing a less tough Dale Davis 32M per year.

Didn't Antonio Harvey label DD as one of his fake tough guys?

[zzaj]

Shades of Dale Davis who played with the Blazers 20 years ago, who missed a game when he
could not get his car out of the driveway during a Portland ice storm.

Ayton is missing tonight's game due to the ice storm.

He plays alot like Dale as well - albeit not nearly as tough.

But Davis relied on mid ranged jumpers and eating rebounds.

We are playing a less tough Dale Davis 32M per year.

Didn't Antonio Harvey label DD as one of his fake tough guys?

Lol, like Antonio Harvey has ANY kind of compass to know if somebody is "tough" or not.

All I remember about Davis is the story that during his draft workouts they tried to push him to exhaustion and he wouldn't quit but kept throwing up in a trash can.

[monopoman]

I really hoped DA would take this opportunity to be a leader and also be more productive as well given he's now a "vet" amongst the Blazers roster. There was so many narratives during his in PHX like that Monty, CP3 or Scapegoat X held him back by not passing to him or didn't et him involved enough but I've always felt he was used exactly as he should be and that's as an elite finisher almost anywhere on the court and focused on defense.

The more time that passed the more chatter we heard about him not being happy with his touches and that there was seemingly a direct connection between the touches/shots he was getting and the amount of effort he was putting in the game. That to me was already a red flag and when it came down to doing stuff with the ball once he had the ball, that was also pretty limited because he doesn't have any ball handling skills so he could only shoot from where he caught the ball and more often than not, it's a middy. Granted, his middy has always been solid but you could just imagine how much better he could be if he could spread the floor out to the 3PT line and/or dribble the ball a little bit to get closer to the basket. He just never developed those skills.

I don't think there's any major reasons why Portland fans should be too disappointed given the team didn't give up much to acquire him and by the sounds of things, most fans have set a relatively low bar for him. But from a basketball fan perspective, it's hard not to be frustrated with a guy that has so much potential, has all the physical gifts, he's not a bad locker room guy and we've seen what he could be when he's on (ie the 2021 playoffs).

Camara was a nice returning piece that made this trade easier to swallow along with losing one year off nassirs deal.

the trade has quickly become the Camara for Nurk+Grayson trade lol

Portland really wasn't upset to lose Nurk he might be slightly better than Ayton but it wasn't a huge difference many were rough on Nurk last season.

He also has had some rough injury woes the past few seasons so you never know when he is going to be out for like 10 games. If Nurk was 2-3 years younger we might have held onto him, but that is not the case.

[Wizenheimer]

Portland really wasn't upset to lose Nurk he might be slightly better than Ayton but it wasn't a huge difference many were rough on Nurk last season.

He also has had some rough injury woes the past few seasons so you never know when he is going to be out for like 10 games. If Nurk was 2-3 years younger we might have held onto him, but that is not the case.

Nurkic is definitely better at screen-setting and defense than Ayton. Other than health, the only real advantage Ayton has over Nurk is shooting efficiency. Trouble is with Simons and Grant chucking up a storm, Ayton doesn't get a lot of shots

obviously though, Blazer management thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. That really erodes my confidence in the Cronin/Schmits partnership; every time I heard the Blazers were really really interested in Ayton I hated it. I think Ayton was seriously overrated and I'm convinced the Suns are lauging about selling Portland a rusty musket with Ayton. 34M/year for Ayton is just dumb

[zzaj]

Portland really wasn't upset to lose Nurk he might be slightly better than Ayton but it wasn't a huge difference many were rough on Nurk last season.

He also has had some rough injury woes the past few seasons so you never know when he is going to be out for like 10 games. If Nurk was 2-3 years younger we might have held onto him, but that is not the case.

Nurkic is definitely better at screen-setting and defense than Ayton. Other than health, the only real advantage Ayton has over Nurk is shooting efficiency. Trouble is with Simons and Grant chucking up a storm, Ayton doesn't get a lot of shots

obviously though, Blazer management thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. That really erodes my confidence in the Cronin/Schmits partnership; every time I heard the Blazers were really really interested in Ayton I hated it. I think Ayton was seriously overrated and I'm convinced the Suns are lauging about selling Portland a rusty musket with Ayton. 34M/year for Ayton is just dumb

I'm no Blazer brass aplogist, but I won't go as far as to say that the Blazers "obviously" thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. Maybe they did, I don't know.

It DID seem obvious that Nurkic didn't seem like he fit with what was left over post-Lillard both in age and..."new beginning" culture, for lack of a better term. So Maybe Blazer brass felt they needed to make a change to really make it a "new beginning", and we'll never really know what conversations were had from the Nurkic camp once it was obvious the Blazers were going to be a lot worse--not that he had a ton of leverage.

It also seemed obvious that Ayton was low man on the totem in Phoenix (and rightfully so with that roster) and that he's the type of player that needs the ball, in order to appear effective.

Was it wise to take on a ridiculously overpaid player who has a history of "motor" issues? Not in my opinion. But I don't know if it can be said that Blazer brass were expecting to obviously get a good player back in that trade. My sense of it was always "about equal, but different and younger". But I could certainly be wrong...

[Dame Lizard]

Portland really wasn't upset to lose Nurk he might be slightly better than Ayton but it wasn't a huge difference many were rough on Nurk last season.

He also has had some rough injury woes the past few seasons so you never know when he is going to be out for like 10 games. If Nurk was 2-3 years younger we might have held onto him, but that is not the case.

Nurkic is definitely better at screen-setting and defense than Ayton. Other than health, the only real advantage Ayton has over Nurk is shooting efficiency. Trouble is with Simons and Grant chucking up a storm, Ayton doesn't get a lot of shots

obviously though, Blazer management thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. That really erodes my confidence in the Cronin/Schmits partnership; every time I heard the Blazers were really really interested in Ayton I hated it. I think Ayton was seriously overrated and I'm convinced the Suns are lauging about selling Portland a rusty musket with Ayton. 34M/year for Ayton is just dumb

Or Blazers management figured rolling the dice on Ayton in the hope of him adjusting to a change of scenery positively (ala RJ Barrett) was a better decision than accepting Nurkic's current ok form.

Noting that these next few years were always going to be a rebuilding phase, I fully support their decision.

After this season he has 2 years left on his contract. No big deal for a team who is rebuilding.

[KdoubleDees23]

Portland really wasn't upset to lose Nurk he might be slightly better than Ayton but it wasn't a huge difference many were rough on Nurk last season.

He also has had some rough injury woes the past few seasons so you never know when he is going to be out for like 10 games. If Nurk was 2-3 years younger we might have held onto him, but that is not the case.

Nurkic is definitely better at screen-setting and defense than Ayton. Other than health, the only real advantage Ayton has over Nurk is shooting efficiency. Trouble is with Simons and Grant chucking up a storm, Ayton doesn't get a lot of shots

obviously though, Blazer management thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. That really erodes my confidence in the Cronin/Schmits partnership; every time I heard the Blazers were really really interested in Ayton I hated it. I think Ayton was seriously overrated and I'm convinced the Suns are lauging about selling Portland a rusty musket with Ayton. 34M/year for Ayton is just dumb

TBH Ayton is better than Nurkic on Defense. Ill defend him on that.

[JRoy]

Portland really wasn't upset to lose Nurk he might be slightly better than Ayton but it wasn't a huge difference many were rough on Nurk last season.

He also has had some rough injury woes the past few seasons so you never know when he is going to be out for like 10 games. If Nurk was 2-3 years younger we might have held onto him, but that is not the case.

Nurkic is definitely better at screen-setting and defense than Ayton. Other than health, the only real advantage Ayton has over Nurk is shooting efficiency. Trouble is with Simons and Grant chucking up a storm, Ayton doesn't get a lot of shots

obviously though, Blazer management thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. That really erodes my confidence in the Cronin/Schmits partnership; every time I heard the Blazers were really really interested in Ayton I hated it. I think Ayton was seriously overrated and I'm convinced the Suns are lauging about selling Portland a rusty musket with Ayton. 34M/year for Ayton is just dumb

TBH Ayton is better than Nurkic on Defense. Ill defend him on that.

He’s more mobile than Nurkic. Wouldn’t say he’s better.

[Wizenheimer]

I'm no Blazer brass aplogist, but I won't go as far as to say that the Blazers "obviously" thought they were getting something good when they traded for Ayton. Maybe they did, I don't know.

I'm basing the 'Blazer management wanted Ayton' thing on about 2 years of hearing rumors about management coveting Ayton.

personally, I think the NBA has evolved to the point that C's are the least important position, generically. Obviously, if you have a generational talent at C like Jokic or Embiid, that's a different matter. But if you don't have that kind of talent I think paying about 25% of the cap for a marginal C like Ayton is foolish and counter-productive. It's a waste of cap IMO, and I'll double-down on the idea that Portland trading Nurkic for Ayton was a poor choice

Portland is spending 44M this year on Ayton and Timelord. At the same time they are spending about 5M (or less) on Reath, Badji, and Brown. Looking at winshares and BPM leaves little doubt where the most effective spending is among that quintet