Wheels after Work: Kop going back?

[Billy]

Listening to 955thegame right now, and apparently on Wheels after Work, Wheel's thoughts are the Kop will NOT be kept here. That is after talking with some people close to Peterri and the Blazers. Portland seems more interested in keeping that roster spot open. Batum will be signed. What do you guys think?

[Milkdud]

I guess I'm alittle bummed out, I was really impressed with what we got to see out of the Kid at SL. The fact that we already have 3 PG signed to the roster makes it hard to find him a place on the roster, not to mention he wouldn't get any PT. In a perfect world we could bring him over either next year or 2 season from now and he would be an ideal first guard off the bench or even a possible starter. If he does go back to Europe he doesn't get signed to some iron clad 4 year deal.

[Butter]

I just don't see what the Blazers are going to be able to add with a 15th player? A veteran, maybe. Why not just sign Peterri and let him play in the D-league?

[SabasRevenge!]

It doesn't make sense to me because the roster in current form is already 12 deep with guys who should play at least a little. Who would they add? The open spot would only make sense for a trade. Sitting Lafrentz and sticking Batum and Koponen in the D-League would be a great way to utilize the non-active spots.

[BlackMamba]

how many years would he sign in europe?

[SabasRevenge!]

how many years would he sign in europe?

They were talking about 4-5 years. His agent is one of the people who said that, so it may be a scare tactic, but I'm sure the European clubs would want him to sign for more than two years.

[Billy]

I just can't help but wonder if Portland feels Sergio is the better prospect. Kopo certainly has his pluses--especially from a Nate McMillan stand point. He's tall, he's rather athletic, and he can probably play the two spot as well. But maybe Portland still feels Sergio is nearly there.

Another thought is that you have the 19 year old Bayless, 21 year old Sergio, and also the 23 year old Rudy who all need seasoning. They might think that it's just not possible to get Bayless and Sergio in particular the chances they need to improve with another guy hanging around that needs minutes?

I don't know. Seems like with Sergio or Kop on the roster it would be pretty easy to cut a guy (Ike or Sergio), or throw in an extra guy into a trade (although that's not KP's style) to make room. But this is probably one way of preserving yet another asset for down the road.

[Effigy]

Am I the only one who doesn't get Portland's preference to keep Batum here and not Koponen? Also Koponen has a guaranteed contract. Can't he just say he wants to sign it and the Blazers have to do it? Maybe that's what Batum is doing...

[zzaj]

The reason it doesn't make sense to me is this...why would he want to come over 4-5 years from now?!

Ostensibly, Bayless is the starter next to Roy for the championship window. When Petteri would be eligible to come over (during the prime years of that window) he would be coming as Blake's replacement as a backup. AND he would have to beat out Sergio for a spot he will probably already have established.

We can only assume that Petteri is going to start his life and get firmly established (family, house, etc...) over in Europe if he plays there 4-5 years. By then he will probably be reaching his ceiling and have huge notoriety in Europe. We can also assume that more and more money will be offered up by Euro teams as basketball continues to catch on there. Why on earth would he want to give up on his good life in Europe and take less money to be a 3rd backup on the Blazers, even if they are a championship team?!

What if he feels stung for not getting signed now and as recompense decides "to pass" on his invitation back to portland in 2013?

There is a very good chance that if he doesn't sign now, we won't see the Finnisher in a blazer uniform ever again.

[TBpup]

It doesn't make sense to me because the roster in current form is already 12 deep with guys who should play at least a little. Who would they add? The open spot would only make sense for a trade. Sitting Lafrentz and sticking Batum and Koponen in the D-League would be a great way to utilize the non-active spots.

SabasRevenge...agree completely. Unless it is for a trade, adding someone at the 15th spot isn't going to be much of a veteran. I'd rather have Koponen here in the D-League than locked up overseas where like Joel Freeland, he isn't even able to come over and play in Summer League.

[cucad8]

As mentioned, if Koppo signs a 4 year deal overseas, I don't think we'll see him here. The amount of money he will command in 4-5 years will be much greater than what we are able to offer him with the rookie salary slot of the 30th pick. If this was the plan, I think it makes more sense to try to build off of his good summer league, and explore trade possibilities with him, to a team that might want him here now, because I can't imaginehim coming in 4 -5 years.

I don't want to trade him for the sake of trading him, but might be the on,y chance we ever get a return out of him.

[Wizenheimer]

I've read that European teams would like to start 'locking-up' players to long term contracts with big buyouts. But that doesn't mean they always be able to.

Perhaps KP believes Koponen will be available in 2 to 3 years making him more willing to allow him to return to europe.

And it's true that portland has a crowded backcourt even without PK. And of course it's possible that KP believes he isn't quite as good as we do here.

I'd say this though: If KP wants to keep that roster spot open for a possible trade, going by KP's short history, I'd say a trade is a lot more probable then just "possible".

[SabasRevenge!]

As mentioned, if Koppo signs a 4 year deal overseas, I don't think we'll see him here. The amount of money he will command in 4-5 years will be much greater than what we are able to offer him with the rookie salary slot of the 30th pick. If this was the plan, I think it makes more sense to try to build off of his good summer league, and explore trade possibilities with him, to a team that might want him here now, because I can't imaginehim coming in 4 -5 years.

I don't want to trade him for the sake of trading him, but might be the on,y chance we ever get a return out of him.

That's a good point. If he blows up in Europe it will probably be too late - unless there are some major changes to rookie scale flexibility.

[sketchturntable]

Am I the only one who doesn't get Portland's preference to keep Batum here and not Koponen? Also Koponen has a guaranteed contract. Can't he just say he wants to sign it and the Blazers have to do it? Maybe that's what Batum is doing...

They think that Batum will turn into a lock down defender...and if he goes back to Europe, he will be more offensive-orientated in his development. If they keep Batum here, they can work specifically on his defense against NBA players for the NBA game.

that makes sense, but i also agree that having that roster spot is pretty useless. If we are going to get a vet that will really help this team, we are going to need to give up at least 2 pieces (Webster/Ike) which will then free up a roster spot.

Keeping Playboy in the D-League for a year would be the best plan.

[BballFanAddict]

Webster, Roy, Bayless, Blake, Fernandez and Sergio. = Guards
Outlaw / Batum = SF
Frye, Diogu, LMA = PF
LaFrentz, Pryzbilla, Oden = Center

If we have any need it is at the SF spot. Outlaw has never played SF full time for the Blazers. Webster has and can. Batum is too young.

It is for this reason I believe Batum is being signed and Kopo will be passed up. KP said that we lack a wing defender and he believes Batum could be that guy. The guy has an enormous wing span and moves his feet quite well.

I do agree with a lot of you in that Kopo may be a better prospect than Sergio, just on his defense alone. I was impressed how well Kopo kept his man in front of him and moved his feet.

Lastly, if they are set on leaving an open roster spot, then I expect there could be a trade where we take back an extra player to cover salary.

[NateMustGo]

I don't like this at all, Pet-ko is twice the prospect that Batum is IMO and the lock down defender bull is just that bull! This is the first move that KP has done that I'm not on board with. I would sure like to hear the truth about this, but I guess that is what we wont hear. I just don't understand keeping Batum the kid showed nothing in those five games and even seemed to have a bad attitude.

[jhern87]

I don't like this at all, Pet-ko is twice the prospect that Batum is IMO and the lock down defender bull is just that bull! This is the first move that KP has done that I'm not on board with. I would sure like to hear the truth about this, but I guess that is what we wont hear. I just don't understand keeping Batum the kid showed nothing in those five games and even seemed to have a bad attitude.

I agree. Koponen was clearly the overall better prospect out of the two. IMO, this could mean several different things. Maybe they think, or have an idea that Petteri can get a shorter deal in Europe? Maybe KP is starting to feel like drafting Batum was a mistake and instead of admitting it, he brings him over to show is confidence in him? I have no idea?

Why not trade him if we're not going to bring him over? I would be willing to bet that there are several teams out there that would love the "Finnisher" on their roster. I'm hoping Wheels is wrong about this one

[Village Idiot]

There is a little known loop-hole in the CBA which allows a team and a 1st round pick to not follow the rookie-scale contract if three years or more has passed since since a player was drafted. This means that PetKo can have his cake and eat it too. He can sign a long-term deal in Europe with an opt-out after two years. He can then come here and sign for as much as the MLE is that's what we want.

This quote references the rule.

The rule being discussed says "Except as provided in Section 3 below, a First Round Pick who does not sign with the Team that holds his draft rights for any portion of the three (3) Seasons following the NBA Draft in which he was selected (and who did not play intercollegiate basketball during such period) may enter into either (a) a Rookie Scale Contract in accordance with Section 1 above, or (b) if the Team has Room in excess of the applicable first-year Rookie Scale Amount, a Contract covering no fewer than three (3) Seasons that provides for Salary plus Unlikely Bonuses in the first Salary Cap Year up to the amount of the Team’s Room and increases or decreases in Salary and Unlikely Bonuses in subsequent Salary Cap Years in accordance with Article VII, Section 5(c)(1)."

The CBA in its definitions says:

“Room” means the extent to which: (i) a Team’s then-current Team Salary is less than the Salary Cap; or (ii) a Team is entitled to use one of the Salary Cap Exceptions set forth in Article VII, Section 6(c), (d), (e) and (h) (Disabled Player, Bi-annual, Mid-Level Salary and Traded Player Exceptions).

The 3-year minimum means the BAE exceptions is excluded. Minimum Salary exception would be excluded both due to the amount as well as to the number of years needed.

That apparently leaves the MLE and Disabled Player exceptions as possibilities for this situation, along with cap room.

[SoHo]

I think I heard somewhere that KP was talking about Petteri in a similar fashion to Rudy (last year) contract wise for the future. It wasn't really clear, but I think the basics were that it might benefit Petteri to go the Rudy route and sign on for a year in Europe and then come back. If that is at all possible I like the idea. It's almost as good as letting him play in the d-league for a year (development wise), but it has two advantages (roster wise).

First, KP gets an open roster spot to use in trades that require us to take on more players than we send out. I think that's a relatively undervalued asset in trades because often salary makes it really hard to do exactly what you want, and being able to let the other team add an extra player could really help on the salary end of things.

Second, Petteri won't have any effect on our cap plan for the coming year, granted he's a small contract, but when you look at the big picture it's another piece of salary that makes it hard to sign someone. On top of that if you look at our roster now we will only have one spot opening this summer (for sure) and that's Raef's. That means if we use our first round pick we don't have space to sign a FA and have to give someone up (for nothing or picks). It's likely we do give someone up anyway, but look at how this summer played out, we gave Rudy Wafer's spot, Batum took Jones' spot, Jack swapped for Diogu, and we gave up McBob to make room for Bayless. Next summer we won't have any McBobs left to trade, so opening up roster spots won't be as simple this coming off-season. (unless we renounce Diogu, or dump Sergio, which are possibilities, albeit less attractive ones than dumping McBobs)

Overall it's a move based on roster flexibility. Sure it sucks because I think at this point most of us agree that Petteri has a brighter future than Sergio (on this team) and could at least take over Blake's role in a few years. Hopefully KP knows what he's doing and Petteri wants to come back in a year (or two). On the other hand if he signs a 4-5 year contract, I'll be rather disappointed.

[R11]

The whole Batum thing has seemed more than a little odd and a bit fishy from the beginning to me. First he's drafted and everyone expects he's going to be stashed due to his rawness. KP even said so right after the draft. Then a day or two later KP says something about needing to "talk to his (Batum's) people" to work things out... The next thing we know it's said that Batum will likely be be signed and added to the roster, long before summer league even starts.... Kinda sounds to me like there were some problems with Batum's willingness to be stashed or something. Like maybe they gave the Blazers an ultimatum possibly, saying if they didn't add him now, he'd refuse to come over later. The only thing that doesn't seem to jive with that is I don't believe I've seen an instance where KP allowed himself to be bullied like that. I know he appears to think highly of Batum but still...

Who knows for sure. It's not done till it's done though and maybe we'll find out more about what's really going on later...


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