Building around a SUPERSTAR. Can we do it?

[Smills91]

Everyone knows that the most conventional and historically best way to build a championship contender is to build around a bonafide SUPERSTAR. One of those top 10-15 best players in the entire league.

My question is this: Can the Kings do this with any one of our core group of young players. I include our core group of young players as:
1) Tyreke Evans
2) Spencer Hawes
3) Jason Thompson
4) Donte Greene
5) Omri Casspi

Let's get started in evaluating the potential that each one of these players has and see if any of them have "SUPERSTAR" potential, the bona fide kind.

1) Tyreke Evans - This guy is the consensus pick amongst 'conventional wisdom' to become a bona fide superstar. He has the ability to CREATE for himself as well as teammates, perhaps not in the traditional sense. His strengths are attacking the basket, his physical size(both offensive and defensively he should have an advantage against smaller guards) and his ball handling skills. His weaknesses are shooting, shooting and shooting.

The good news: Shooting can be improved with time. It's the most easily correctable weakness, especially when you have Pete Carrill on your staff. Also, his ability to finish and take advantage of the opposition with his physical attributes won't go away.

The bad news: He's only 19 and probably years away from realizing his potential. For a franchise starving for success, this could be a long-term fix for us.

Conclusion: Evans definitely has superstar potential. He may be a good player, sooner-than-later and I'm a big fan, I think SUPERSTAR status is at least 4-5 years away for this kid. I don't see him being LeBron-eque or even Wade-esque in the sense that he brings team success to his franchise at a rather young age. But the kid WILL, IMO be at worst a perennial all-star caliber player by the time he's 24 years old.

Spencer Hawes - The ENIGMA. He has all the skill in the world. He even has some favorable physical attributes. The key is harnessing those skills and attributes to maximize himself as a player.

The Good: He's smart, crafty and better on defense than anyone gives him credit for. I think for Spencer the sky's the limit. The key is for him to elevate the CEREBRAL game. If he becomes half as crafty as Vlade was, then Hawes has All-Star written all over him.

The Bad: The same thing that may be his virtue, may also be his vice. Just because you CAN hit the three, doesn't mean you SHOULD hit the three. I think that statement is critical for Hawes, development as a player, and not just in the realm of shot selection.

Conclusion: I think THIS roster, may NEED him to hit the three to be successful overall, but what I mean is that Hawes needs to operate within a system. With Evans' lack of shooting ability, it may be necessary for Hawes to pull the opposing Center AWAY from the basket for Evans to be effective at getting to the rim. Hawes CAN be a star in this league, however, this year will determine if a team can be built AROUND him as a player.

Jason Thompson - What's not to like? The kid is skilled, athletic and hustles like Michael Smith of old. He's got two-way potential. When I say two-way potential, I mean he could go either way in terms of making an all-NBA team (probably 3rd team) on either offense or defense.

The good: He hustles, he's passionate and he's versatile. Thompson can play inside, he can play outside. He can play defense, he can play offense. He can play the PF position or the Center position effectively. He's VERSATILE. The key is to figure out, what is he BEST at, and what is he BEST at to COMPLEMENT this roster. I think he needs to focus on the defensive end. He has more potential defensively than Hawes does IMO. He's already got a fairly polished offensive game for a young big man. He can shoot, he gets lots of put-backs and tip-ins and he rebounds well(especially on the offensive side of the ball.

The bad: He out-paces the game. I think that's the MAJOR trait he needs to improve on. Pacing himself. This is the reason I think he makes silly fouls and gets himself out of the game. He needs to understand when he's beat and let it go. We can't have him sitting the bench in foul trouble each game. This is why I think his DEFENSE should be his focal point. His offense will come. He can hit the 18 footer, get a couple put back, hit some free throws, out-run his opponent on a fast-break finish, nail a shot with the clock winding down. He'll get his 15 points a game. But the CRITICAL aspect for Shock is to SHUT DOWN the opposition best BIG MAN. He can guard the shooter(Rasheed's, Mehmets', Dirk's, West's of the league) he has that ABILITY. He can also guard the post-men( Howards, Duncans's etc) he has that ABILITY. The question is, will he put it together.

In conclusion: Thompson has star ability, but I don't think he'll ever be an all-star in this league, but rather a SUPER SOLID big man who helps you win games.

Donte Greene - What trumps an engima? Whatever it is, that's Donte Greene. He OOZES potential. In fact, I wonder if it's border-line institutionalize-me if I say this, "Donte Greene has the MOST potential for superstardom of any one player on our roster". Is that a false statement? I dunno, but my opinion is that while he may have that potential, I also fear he's the least likely to realize that potential of anyone of our core.

The good - He's young. He fun. He's cocky. Pete Carrill is a coach over him.! He's got the POTENTIAL mind-set of a star. Similar to a Ron Artest without the CRAZY. If you move two steps from the 'insanity' that is Ron to the 'Sanity' realm of things, I think you have Donte' Greene's mindset. He's tall, athletic and can 'supposedly shoot;.

The Bad - He can 'supposedly shoot'(as I haven't seen it in the NBA, YET. Is as RAW as they come. And doesn't understand the game of basketball.....yet. I say yet, because I have faith that coach and Westphal will help this kid 'figure it out'.

Conclusion - Donte' may be the biggest CONUNDRUM of any one of our prospects, I think he has the ability to become a SUPERSTAR player. It's mostly cerebral, as I think the tools are there Phsycially, skillfully and emotionally. I think the emotional make-up of a player is what drives the good to greatness in the NBA, i.e Larry Bird, Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson.

Omri Casspi - It's hard to say here. I know so little about him first-hand. So I'll leave it inconclusive. However, with what I have read, he seems to be a typical Petrie-find in a late first. Not a star, not a bust. He could be a VERY important piece to the puzzle, but not the center-stone of that puzzle. I could be wrong, and hope that I am towards the STAR 'spectrum'. But that's what I think. He could be a perfect complement to this roster as his play-making, rebounding and tenacity are sorely needed to complement this roster.

[mobiuseinz]

I agree that Tyreke is our biggest chance of having a star... but dont count out Spence and maybe even Donté... I really do think that Donté can have an All-Star impact on this team in the future.

[deNIEd]

I feel Superstar is a top 5-10 player, but even if you go out to 15, I still think absolutely not.

None of them have enough talent to get to that level. None really have the mentality either.

[Smills91]

I feel Superstar is a top 5-10 player, but even if you go out to 15, I still think absolutely not.

None of them have enough talent to get to that level. None really have the mentality either.

Really, I'd say ALL these guys are 5 years out (age 24-26) to becoming superstars. With that timeframe in mind. Which 14 players in the league do you see becoming SUPERSTARS ahead of our guys. You can pretty much say anyone at 28 or older will be past their primes, maybe 27 in some cases.

So let's take a look at the under 28 players in the league and name me 14 players that will be better than say, Evans, Greene, Hawes, Thompson or Casspi.

Not saying you won't, I just want you to put pen to paper(or fingers to keys here).

[deNIEd]

Anyone that's under 28?

(2003) Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony, Dwanye Wade, Chris Bosh
(2004) Dwight Howard, Al Jefferson
(2005) Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Danny Granger
(2006) Brandon Roy
(2007) Kevin Durant
(2008) Derrick Rose
(Other) Tony Parker, Amare Stoudemire

[ICMTM]

All the current superstars have something in common:

They are athletically superior to their competition at their respective positions. Wade, Lebron, Kobe, CP3, D12 are all physically better than 90% of the league.

I don't think Thompson will ever be there. Greene @ the 3? Maybe but doubtful IMO. Hawes...only because there are only like 6 good centers in the league.

Reke...he's physically imposing, and IMO has the most start potential.

[Smills91]

All the current superstars have something in common:

They are athletically superior to their competition at their respective positions. Wade, Lebron, Kobe, CP3, D12 are all physically better than 90% of the league.

I don't think Thompson will ever be there. Greene @ the 3? Maybe but doubtful IMO. Hawes...only because there are only like 6 good centers in the league.

Reke...he's physically imposing, and IMO has the most start potential.

Pretty much agree with that. Hence why I don't think Thompson will be an all-star, rather a GREAT starter. Evans, Hawes, Greene have the ability to be better than most at their positions. With Greene having the highest 'UPSIDE' with probably the least pan out.

Evans is the most likely to realize his potential and become a star.

Denied. I disagree with both Amare and JEfferson. I think those guys' knee situation will impeded them from being dominant forces to lead their teams.

Also I don't buy Tony Parker being a 'superstar'. He's an all-star caliber player because of Duncan. Without Duncan, he's no more on par with Kevin Martin(and that's being generous.) Granger I think is in the same boat as Martin. Great young player, great second fiddle, but he won't be carrying a team to the promised land. I think Tyreke has higher upside than all 4 of these guys you mention.

Sure, I'm nitpicking, but that's how I see it there.

[pillwenney]

Reke still has a long ways to go. And I would personally be much more worried about his playmaking than his shooting--at least on a consistent level. He shows great ability at times, but I still think this needs a ton of work here to really be able to run a team as a PG.

His shooting is less important to me, because as long as he has the ball in his hands, it won't make a huge difference. He'll likely be able to drive pretty easily despite his lack of an outside shot. This is certainly number two on my list of concerns for him, but he still really has got to improve his PG abilities.


With Spencer, my main concern is size. He just needs to get big enough to where he can't get pushed around so easily, because that is really his main problem right now--offensively, defensively, and on the boards.

Jason - I agree that he's probably not a future superstar, but I think he could be an all-star in the right situation.

Donte - Like others have said, he's a big time boom or bust guy. I think he has potential to be a top 50 player, but so do lots of guys in the league, and I'm certainly not counting on him getting there.

[Nicky Nix Nook]

I still think a lot of people are sleeping on Tyreke. I think he has at least Brandon Roy like potential(Did NNN just say that?!). REMEMBER: When guys like Williams, Paul, Roy, etc. came into the league, no one thought they were going to be superstars. It IS possible and I don't see anything in Tyreke's game that can rule him out as a potential superstar. He has ALL the tools down to his mindset. I am telling you this kid is SPECIAL.

Hawes reminds me A LOT of Gasol. When Gasol came into the league (and I could be wrong on this) he used to shoot 3's fairly regularly. I remember him being a similar player to Dirk. But now he never shoots 3's and he's realized that his team is better off with him under the basket. I really think Hawes can get to Gasol status as long as he keeps a "nasty" mentality. He has got to be fearless and believe that there is no better center in the league. Does he needs to add mass to his frame, yes, but look at Gasol he is probably just as skinny if not more skinny than Hawes.

I think Thompson's evaluation has been pretty well covered and just like Mitch, I wouldn't be surprised to see him in an allstar game or 2.

I think Casspi has tremendous potential as well. IMO opinion I think we will all look back on this time and say "The Kings had both Casspi AND Greene?" A lot like how we say "The Kings had both Hedo AND Wallace?"

[RoyalCourtJestr]

Evans could turn into that star. Maybe not superstar, but I'll agree - that of a Brandon Roy level star.

Hawes, JT - both could be boarderline All Stars.

Green, Casspi - They're youngins. I agree with Green, if he actually could harness that potential he'd be Rashard Lewisisk - but they're to young to tell.

[pillwenney]

There are a couple of problems with the Gasol comparison:
1) Gasol did not shoot many 3's at any point. The most he ever shot in one season was 16 (and that was the year he was traded to the Lakers).
2) Gasol plays a lot of PF. That could be an option for Spencer, but we have nobody else with anything close to center size--much less somebody in the future.
3) Gasol's early (and still to a certain extent, current years), were largely based around a face-up game that Spencer doesn't have. Spencer doesn't have the first step or the finishing ability that Gasol has.

However....
Spencer is a better shooter, he has a more developed back-to-the-basket game (skill wise), and hopefully will be able to put on some more weight (but this, again, is my biggest concern).

But the size concerns make me want our third big to be a full-sized center. That is one of my bigger priorities looking forward.

[Nicky Nix Nook]

There are a couple of problems with the Gasol comparison:
1) Gasol did not shoot many 3's at any point. The most he ever shot in one season was 16 (and that was the year he was traded to the Lakers).
2) Gasol plays a lot of PF. That could be an option for Spencer, but we have nobody else with anything close to center size--much less somebody in the future.
3) Gasol's early (and still to a certain extent, current years), were largely based around a face-up game that Spencer doesn't have. Spencer doesn't have the first step or the finishing ability that Gasol has.

However....
Spencer is a better shooter, he has a more developed back-to-the-basket game (skill wise), and hopefully will be able to put on some more weight (but this, again, is my biggest concern).

But the size concerns make me want our third big to be a full-sized center. That is one of my bigger priorities looking forward.

Ohh weird, I guess I didn't watch that many Grizz games haha.

Anyway Gasol plays much bigger than he is, I think Hawes could be the same way. It wouldn't hurt to add muscle but you can be a finesse player and still be physical/good at defense.

[pillwenney]

Ehh, I think Pau is also considerably longer.

But I think my main point is that since Spencer doesn't have the face-up game of a Gasol or a Bosh, he will only be able to be so effective if he doesn't add more weight. He is hopefully going to be focused on a back to the basket game, and he'll need to add more weight to make that a focus--also to help with his defense and rebounding. Right now, he's just not big enough to hold position.

Gasol appears to have gotten a stronger base over the years, which has helped him improve. He has also gone from being very soft to basically average in that area. Luckily, I certainly wouldn't really consider Spencer to be soft right now at all.

[Wolfay]

Out of our current roster, I think Tyreke has the swagger so to speak to be a superstar. Having that confidence is pretty much as essential as having the skills and athletic ability in my opinion, and this is why Kevin Martin, although a very good player, can't lead a team to a ring. Martin is way too quiet and humble to be a leader. Meanwhile Kobe thinks he's God's gift to basketball, which is in part why he has four rings.

Skill-wise and athletically, like ICMTM said, Tyreke is physically imposing, which bodes well for him. He's hands-down pretty much our best bet right now at a superstar.

[Silver Man]

Based on the list at the beginning of the players here is where I rank them'

Tyreke Evans

Jason Thompson
Spencer Hawes

Donte Green

Omri Casspi

Before you guys get on me it's not a big difference to me between Hawes, and Thompson. I have high hopes for both and think they will be solid contributers someday (key word-Someday)

Not really fair for me to rate Omri because I really don't know much about the kid except for what I have read. Anyways all this player obviously have spots where they need tom improve-

Tyreke Evans-Overall Shooting, but his big is mid to outside is the main problem.

Jason Thompson-As of right now defense is his main concern. His offensive game will come along with growth.

Spencer Hawes-Needs to find his game a bit more and improve overall. Stop shooting outside as much.

[SacKingZZZ]

Yeah, Tyreke is probably our best shot if for nothing more than the fact that he's our only "unknown". That and his potential skillset lends itself more to your typical superstar type. I wouldn't automatically assume Tyreke is so far off from contributing, I mean, he's already there physically. That's usually the thing you have to wait for with guys that young. He's not even completely filled out yet and he's a rock solid 225-230.

[cdt3]

1. Tyreke is a star. This year he will be better than Russel Westbrook 18/5/6 ish. He is a combo between DWade and Chauncey Billups. He has explosion but only uses when necessary. This guy is very knows all the secrets of pacing himself and is very clutch, a dangerous combo. I still don't understand how Rose takes Memphis and Chicago to final 4 and playoffs in his first year at PG at both but Evans can't.

2. Yes most players don't come into their own until they are 24 (CWebb came here at 26) and JT is 24. This guy is a very talented big guy who can draw fouls, shoot with great touch, use post moves or attacks the basket with game like a Duncan, Bosh, Dirk or Gasol. The way he ran circles around Shaq and Amare was crazy last year and makes him our #1 big. Needs to work on his defense but is a very good defender also. Because he does so much well he is not afraid of the big boys he is all star material when the older guys retire. Must stop dumb fouls.

3. Hawes is a very talented scorer. He is the Vlade or Miller for this team to open up the paint for Evans, Martin, and JT who all attack the basket. His scoring ability is better than you think Webber's career numbers were 20pts on 18 touches a game late last year Hawes put up 15pts on 16 touches. He can be an excellent defender when he wants, needs to foul harder sometimes and take the ball to the rack when necessary.

4. Greene is really a more athletic and versatile Hawes but has same weakness (like a Rashard Lewis or Hedo). Will he be a bench guy or ever become a starter??? Depends on how he plays the 3.

5. Casspi is a role player but does have potential to be a bigger Nocioni (like a Kirilenko). He can just bother people defensively and hit open shots.

This team of Evans/Martin/Noci/JT/Hawes/Garcia/Greene/Casspi/Brockman with coach Westphal was built to compete with the Lakers/Denver/Portland/Cleveland for many years to come. It is so very well put together with so many role players fitting so well with the core guys (even Mason and May). This team will have superstars if Evans doesn't go it alone. After Evans and Thompson got comfortable in summer in the last 3 games they put up a 18/5 and 26/10 and looked like superstar star PG and PF (remember Webber/Bibby). This team has explosive offense, great toughness, improving defense, solid vet coaching, everything that it was missing last year.

[ansoncarter]

barely seen Tyreke Evans play but how many 6'5 players without ridiculous speed or shooting end up stars, let alone superstars?

[Smills91]

barely seen Tyreke Evans play but how many 6'5 players without ridiculous speed or shooting end up stars, let alone superstars?

Dwayne Wade comes to mind. But I don't accept your premise. Who says Evans doesn't have speed at 6'5? Who says he doesn't develop into a good shooter?

[deNIEd]

barely seen Tyreke Evans play but how many 6'5 players without ridiculous speed or shooting end up stars, let alone superstars?

Dwayne Wade comes to mind. But I don't accept your premise. Who says Evans doesn't have speed at 6'5? Who says he doesn't develop into a good shooter?

Dwyane Wade is a freak of an athlete. He is definitely in the top 1% in terms of athleticism and a large part of his game was originally built on that. Evan's has no where near the athleticism that Wade does.

I still don't buy the fact that Evans will ever come close to a "superstar" mainly cause in my mind, a superstar is a top 5-6 player. (Kobe, Wade, Lebron, Dwight, CP3, Duncan) Evans could eventually become an allstar, but that is still no where near a "superstar."

As for the rest of the team, none of them will ever come close to a superstar stature either. Look at the greatest players ever (exception Shaq), all of them have a necessity to win and compete. All of them have a killswitch in their personality and will go for the throat every time they sense weakness in an opponent. Based off of last year's play, none of our players have that mentality. Martin's game limits him from being a franchise player. Thompson simply isn't skilled enough IMO. Hawes is too soft and lazy. Donte doesn't seem to have the drive either. They can all become great players but their personality limits their ceiling.