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It_Was_Typed wrote:Bobcats get: Kevin Martin
Kings get: Raymond Felton, Raja Bell and a future pick.

Just something I thought of.

Felton has no where near the value of Martin. And I think it is laughable to have him as the center piece for a Martin deal.

Felton is a sub-40% scorer. He is terribly inefficient. I don't want that from my backcourt.

Nox 1st off i disagree in the sense that i feel PEJA was a great shooter but he really & royally sucked as a defender & he had no toughness about him !

That said i want to be clear to you & everyone else i am not saying you trade or i would trade k-mart for the sake of dumping him but i believe very firmly all things considered his lack of defense , his lack of toughness & himself being injury prone when he starts playing really well again you move him if the right deal comes along .
If you dont you run a very high risk of being stuck with a guy with roughly 4 or more years who wont be able to do a thing for usa if he is seriously injured riding the bench !

The knicks a few years ago had several players at making many millions each riding the bech seiously injured marbury , a houston both making more than 20 million each along with a few other players i am not saying that would happen here however we are not the Knicks of old willing to spend over 100 - 120 million in salary if a guy like martin gets paid 12 million per year for the next several of years not only will we not have free agents wanting to play here but then we are stuck financially for several of more years then you will for sure spell lottery the next several of years to come .

I want a Kings team that will have a chance in the very near future to win it all or if nothing else give us a team to be really excited about again the truly healthy k-mart could give us that to a certain degree the severly injured k-mart can't give us squat !

bdgking wrote:Nox 1st off i disagree in the sense that i feel PEJA was a great shooter but he really & royally sucked as a defender & he had no toughness about him !

There's probably a better article out there somewhere but this is from Hollinger from 2003.

He's joined on the wings by the vastly underrated Peja Stojakovic, who has the size and tenacity to defend power forwards, but is quick enough to stay with most forwards on the perimeter.

Kevin Martin could be a great n.2 in a contender (like Cleveland), problem is.....he thinks he's Kobe, he think he's a superstar so he tends to play like a Ballhog in a team like Sacramento without a "clear" n.1

All of this commotion is the classic "knee-jerk" reaction again.

I swear, I don't know how people are so conclusive and definite with the situation now. It is still completely early to say something and still a small sample to conclude anything.

We still need a large sample of games to conclude anything. We are at, what? 6, 7 games into the season? That's still small sample.

RolloTommasi wrote:Kevin Martin could be a great n.2 in a contender (like Cleveland), problem is.....he thinks he's Kobe, he think he's a superstar so he tends to play like a Ballhog in a team like Sacramento without a "clear" n.1

Kevin Martin can be a very good #2 option for a contending team but your notion that Martin is a ball hog, Kobe-like player and etc is ridiculous. He no where near plays that kind of style.

If you are just looking strictly at this year stats for Martin (5 games), your conclusion of Martin will be likely wrong.

Kings don't need to decide anything yet. Tyreke is going to be a good basketball player plain and simple, whether he plays point or shooting guard. Martin and Garcia's injury gives us a chance to evaluate the talents on our roster in Greene and Casspi with one being SF/PF and the other more of a SF/SG.

Martin is put in a tough spot because the Kings are playing better without him, but there is more too that then what it seems. These young players are stepping up in his absense and showing they can be trusted, something that couldn't be said before he was injured. Now when he comes back, we will see if the nice ball movement of the last couple games can continue (If it continues past these past two games any way)

Not sure when Martin became a ballhog. I must have missed this when watching the game. I'm pretty sure he was out there doing what he was suppose to do it. If we have some sort of success going forward, which i hope, when Martin comes back we will see if he will trust his teammates and the ball movement will continue

I want to see how the combo of Evans, Martin and Garcia plays together. Three different players that if gets good chemistry great things could happen

RolloTommasi wrote:Kevin Martin could be a great n.2 in a contender (like Cleveland), problem is.....he thinks he's Kobe, he think he's a superstar so he tends to play like a Ballhog in a team like Sacramento without a "clear" n.1

No he doesn't. Not in any way at all. Some would argue that part of Kevin's problem is that he really doesn't think he's Kobe. He has been a clear number 1 option for us in the last year, because we've had nothing else. Anybody that knows Kevin Martin's game knows that this isn't true.

Martin is put in a tough spot because the Kings are playing better without him, but there is more too that then what it seems. These young players are stepping up in his absense and showing they can be trusted, something that couldn't be said before he was injured. Now when he comes back, we will see if the nice ball movement of the last couple games can continue (If it continues past these past two games any way)

This is what people need to realize. Some people are acting like Kevin has always been this ball-stopping volume scorer, which is really insane. He took on a role scoring more in isolation out of necessity last year and the beginning of this year. We are now seeing that it wasn't a necessity, and that's a great thing. If this keeps up, Kevin can go back to playing the way he was.

mitchweber wrote:

RolloTommasi wrote:Kevin Martin could be a great n.2 in a contender (like Cleveland), problem is.....he thinks he's Kobe, he think he's a superstar so he tends to play like a Ballhog in a team like Sacramento without a "clear" n.1

No he doesn't. Not in any way at all. Some would argue that part of Kevin's problem is that he really doesn't think he's Kobe. He has been a clear number 1 option for us in the last year, because we've had nothing else. Anybody that knows Kevin Martin's game knows that this isn't true.

Martin is put in a tough spot because the Kings are playing better without him, but there is more too that then what it seems. These young players are stepping up in his absense and showing they can be trusted, something that couldn't be said before he was injured. Now when he comes back, we will see if the nice ball movement of the last couple games can continue (If it continues past these past two games any way)

This is what people need to realize. Some people are acting like Kevin has always been this ball-stopping volume scorer, which is really insane. He took on a role scoring more in isolation out of necessity last year and the beginning of this year. We are now seeing that it wasn't a necessity, and that's a great thing. If this keeps up, Kevin can go back to playing the way he was.

Exactly, what consistents on being one the best at moving without the ball

To build off of Mitch-

How can people be so hypocritical. Last year, everyone wanted Martin to shoot more. For Martin to take over games for us and clearly step into the top SG class. Now this year, he's taken that roll...and everyone is calling him a ball hog?

People are stupid.

deNIEd wrote:To build off of Mitch-

How can people be so hypocritical. Last year, everyone wanted Martin to shoot more. For Martin to take over games for us and clearly step into the top SG class. Now this year, he's taken that roll...and everyone is calling him a ball hog?

People are stupid.

I've never said anything close to that. Don't put words into anybody's mouth.

Wolfay wrote:

deNIEd wrote:To build off of Mitch-

How can people be so hypocritical. Last year, everyone wanted Martin to shoot more. For Martin to take over games for us and clearly step into the top SG class. Now this year, he's taken that roll...and everyone is calling him a ball hog?

People are stupid.

I've never said anything close to that. Don't put words into anybody's mouth.

Yes Clearly I singled you out. Especially since my entire post was directed completely at you....

deNIEd wrote:To build off of Mitch-

How can people be so hypocritical. Last year, everyone wanted Martin to shoot more. For Martin to take over games for us and clearly step into the top SG class. Now this year, he's taken that roll...and everyone is calling him a ball hog?

People are stupid.

Only one person said that. I was thrilled to see Martin shooting more. He was playing exactly how I wanted him to play.

No, simple as that.

I knew Evans was going to be good. Solid pick you guys. Anything on of Memphis was usually good.

boogydown wrote:I knew Evans was going to be good. Solid pick you guys. Anything on of Memphis was usually good.

Yeah, thanks for the compliment dude! I'm impressed of Noah's play this year. He seems to took a step forward in terms of development. Hope he maintains that through out the year.

Here is my take on Martin's role with the kings & why we should keep him barring a very good trade scenerio.

As the kings get better and better with the development of our young core, Martin's role will become more valueable. The better the kings become as a team, the better Martin becomes, IMO. (if that makes sense )

I say this because in a potential playoff series, Martin's ability to hit tough shots will be vital. 25 ppg scorers, who can score as efficently as KMart are rare. Not to mention the impact he can have on opposing defenses.

Should we trade him? We shouldn't trade him just to be trading him, like we did with Artest. If the trade makes sense, then sure, but otherwise no.

Is Kevin Martin expandable of a major piece coming back?

By now all of us already know that since Kevin’s departure due to injury the Kings are 2-1. Overall, they are still 3-4, but 1 game under .500 is impressive for such a young team that is just fighting to win some games and trying to make the amazing Arco Arena crowd fall in love with Kings Basketball again. With Tyreke and Beno playing well together, the big question is: "Do we still need Martin around?"

http://kingsforum.net/?p=1036

Interesting article. I tend to be think along the lines of this paragraph...

There is a lot of evidence that supports the Kings playing better without Kevin Martin, but what if they can play even better once he returns? What if Kevin’s presence on the floor intimidated the other Kings players not to shoot as much, or soley rely on Kevin Martin the scoring machine, who on any given night can go off for 50 points!

....if this is the case, which I tend to think it is, its great news for us as kings fans.

darkadun wrote:Interesting article. I tend to be think along the lines of this paragraph...

There is a lot of evidence that supports the Kings playing better without Kevin Martin, but what if they can play even better once he returns? What if Kevin’s presence on the floor intimidated the other Kings players not to shoot as much, or soley rely on Kevin Martin the scoring machine, who on any given night can go off for 50 points!

....if this is the case, which I tend to think it is, its great news for us as kings fans.

thanks, I left it open, so that the reader come up with a conclusion... I really do believe that Kevin's presence intimidated the younger crowd, esp Evans. Once he comes back, Evan's will be in his groove, and then our backcourt will have two deadly scorers who can get to the FT line at will... btw, Evans in the past 3 games has been 28 times to the FT line, 25 of those times it was in the past 2 games. Now combine that with Martin's 8-11 FT attempts per game... you could potentially have 20 FT attempts by just Evans and Martin!!! How crazy is that!